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Old 07-11-2007, 03:56 PM   #1
Jesus_Lizard82
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Default steve albini's take on the smashing pumpkins

from steve albini:


I have had limited dealings with Billy Corgan, and everything I personally dealt with him on, he was totally reasonable and unpretentious. He was also very generous with his time in regards to some charity stuff he was asked to do, and I applaud him for that.

Many people have passed judgment on him based on some public statements and presumptions about how he managed the membership of his bands. Even a micro celebrity like myself is occasionally asked to make statements for public consumption, so I know that things said in haste or without consideration can come back to haunt you. Also, not having been in his bands, I'm not prepared to say what he should or shouldn't have done with the members, and who "counts" as a "real" band member.

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I always heard he was kind of reviled by the 'real underground' Chicago bands for being a sellout...


The first part is true, but not necessarily because of the second part. You are asking about historical perspectives, and I happened to be around while this was underway, so maybe I can shed some light.

In Chicago in the late 1980s, there began to develop a kind of budding professionalism that struck us in the punk/underground scene as distasteful: Bands with managers, publicists and other agents were encroaching on a self-made scene that had previously been by, for and about the bands themselves.

The Smashing Pumpkins personified this creeping professionalism, having a management relationship with a creepy local music business player who was also responsible for booking the biggest venue in town. As a result, any decent touring band that came through town would have the Smashing Pumpkins added to the bill as a support act. This was rightfully seen as an imposition, and patrons learned to arrive at the Metro an hour later than usual in order to miss them. It isn't overstating things to say they were something of a joke in Chicago -- a band imposed on an existing audience by the music business rather than a band building its natural audience through accretion.

Additionally, early on they were associated with the exceptional band the Poster Children, through some shows and a shared label. The Poster Children (and other bands from the same downstate scene, like Hum) were an obvious and direct influence on the Smashing Pumpkins' sound. For anyone familiar with both, it is hard to see how the a lesser derivation of the Poster Children's sound could be hailed as some kind of revolutionary genius, except by rock critics and music business people unaware of anything at the street level.

In some of those public statements I mentioned earlier, Billy Corgan has derided the underground scene of the day, saying it was clique-ish and insular, and that he wanted to rebel against it by going through conventional rock star channels to become a conventional rock star. Well, bully for that kind of thinking, I guess, if you think being a retrograde reactionary and joining the suffocating mainstream culture and business is some kind of rebellion, and if you think the penthouse of the managers and lawyers is somehow more open and inviting than the open field of the DIY scene.

For those of us involved daily in bucking that system, it was gross.

Quote:
(which I think is BS, like they wouldn't sell out for millions if they had a chance).


Especially considering who you're talking to right now, you ought to realize this is pure nonsense.

Quote:
B - What did you think of Siamese Dream. Even if you hate SP and/or Billy, you have to admit that album RAWKED and still does.


Not my cup of tea.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:02 PM   #2
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Steve Albini is ok in my book.....he worked with HUM.....that album You'd Prefer an Astronaut is fucking sweet.....reminds me of Siamese Dream type rock.

Butchie Yost.......I am a heroin junkie....but a damn good surfer

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:03 PM   #3
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i got my eye on YOU

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:05 PM   #4
Lorenzo
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Inneresting.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:06 PM   #5
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i've met albini at tape-op and a couple other conventions...



that dude is weirder than bob clearmountain.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:07 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sickboy59
i got my eye on YOU
haha dude that cracked me up

juicebox ditka

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:07 PM   #7
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i wonder who the creepy management guy was. did billy make d'arcy s his d?

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:08 PM   #8
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Interesting stuff. Just shows you.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:09 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by telex
i wonder who the creepy management guy was. did billy make d'arcy s his d?
Did Billy make D'arcy Siamese his Dream?

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:12 PM   #10
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Source?

I love it when punk/underground hipsters sneer at a really good band's success, and say they were just "imposed on an existing audience by the music business," even tho - you know, they rocked harder, played better, and wrote cooler material than all those shitty acts at the time.

But I do love my In Utero. Albini had a good stride on that.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:16 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy

But I do love my In Utero. Albini had a good stride on that.

...and you know how that was such a non-commercial album. Gimme a break Mr. Albino.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:17 PM   #12
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Is this from that chat Albini's doing on that poker forum?

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:17 PM   #13
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He doesn't even like Siamese Dream? What a loser

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy
I love it when punk/underground hipsters sneer at a really good band's success, and say they were just "imposed on an existing audience by the music business," even tho - you know, they rocked harder, played better, and wrote cooler material than all those shitty acts at the time.
you're right, you probably know more about the late 1980s chicago underground DIY movement than steve FUCKING albini

jesus christ

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:19 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy
Source?

I love it when punk/underground hipsters sneer at a really good band's success, and say they were just "imposed on an existing audience by the music business," even tho - you know, they rocked harder, played better, and wrote cooler material than all those shitty acts at the time.

But I do love my In Utero. Albini had a good stride on that.

The Albini poker forum thread where he has been answering questions for a week now.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:19 PM   #16
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http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...0&fpart=1&vc=1

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:20 PM   #17
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Siamese my Dream lol

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:21 PM   #18
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Did The Poster Children ever put out an album?

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:22 PM   #19
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say what you will about albini, he has recorded and been a part of some of the best records recorded in the past 20 years


rapeman is one of the most underrated bands ever

and yeah HUM kills it, downward is heavenward is so fucking awesome

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:23 PM   #20
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some things i know, some things i don't know

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:23 PM   #21
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Ah yes they did:

http://rateyourmusic.com/artist/poster_children

Interesting they have a girl member too. Did Billy poach this idea as well?

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:24 PM   #22
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yes they did and they rule

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:25 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boycott Graceland
you're right, you probably know more about the late 1980s chicago underground DIY movement than steve FUCKING albini

jesus christ
Show me one band from that era that plays their axe better than Billy Corgan and writes good shit, and maybe I'll cede you a point.

The point is that the Pumpkins didn't get successful because of the music business. They got successful because they were good. There's always going to be some obscure band out there doing amazing stuff that none of us will hear. To play rock snob and stick your nose at me is a cop out.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:26 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy
Show me one band from that era that plays their axe better than Billy Corgan and writes good shit, and maybe I'll cede you a point.

The point is that the Pumpkins didn't get successful because of the music business. They got successful because they were good. There's always going to be some obscure band out there doing amazing stuff that none of us will hear. To play rock snob and stick your nose at me is a cop out.
did you even read the original post?

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:27 PM   #25
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And as famous as he is, and however many great albums he has recorded, You can still hire him for 600$ a day and he would prefer if you did not give him any credit. Kind of the anti-Bolly.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:27 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy
Show me one band from that era that plays their axe better than Billy Corgan and writes good shit, and maybe I'll cede you a point.

The point is that the Pumpkins didn't get successful because of the music business. They got successful because they were good. There's always going to be some obscure band out there doing amazing stuff that none of us will hear. To play rock snob and stick your nose at me is a cop out.
buy a Keiji Haino record

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:28 PM   #27
Rider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy
Show me one band from that era that plays their axe better than Billy Corgan and writes good shit, and maybe I'll cede you a point.

The point is that the Pumpkins didn't get successful because of the music business. They got successful because they were good. There's always going to be some obscure band out there doing amazing stuff that none of us will hear. To play rock snob and stick your nose at me is a cop out.

Albini is far from a rock snob. Really you have no clue what you are talking about.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:30 PM   #28
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Whatever. I was more responding to the 80s underground DIY defender than attacking Albini.

I stand behind my statement. And I will check out Keiji Haino. Thanks.

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:31 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy
Whatever. I was more responding to the 80s underground DIY defender than attacking Albini.

I stand behind my statement. And I will check out Keiji Haino. Thanks.

Umm what the hell are you talking about?

 
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:35 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apetulantfrenzy
Whatever. I was more responding to the 80s underground DIY defender than attacking Albini.

I stand behind my statement. And I will check out Keiji Haino. Thanks.
uh what?

 
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