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View Poll Results: Do you think/feel that ATUM is the true sequel to MCIS and Machina as promised?
YES, ATUM is the TRUE SEQUEL AND FOLLOW-UP TO MCIS and MACHINA THAT WAS PROMISED 5 17.86%
NO, it is NOT the TRUE SEQUEL AND WE HAVE BEEN MISLED 21 75.00%
OTHER EXPLAIN IN COMMENTS 2 7.14%
Voters: 28. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-23-2023, 07:30 AM   #31
ourruseoffools
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Originally Posted by enthusaroo View Post
Maybe we can do a class action lawsuit against Billy Corgan and the Smashing Pumpkins brand for fraud and misleading consumers / fans
i sue him for being a little weird man

 
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Old 01-23-2023, 10:43 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Gavvvvvin View Post
Billy doesn't seem to realise that has fans are all in their late 30s/40s and are too old to be giving a fuck about analysing lyrics or stupid concepts albums. There have to be less than 50 people on this entire planet who have been holding out for MCIS part II.
Especially as they're not worth analyzing. They are not deep. The narrative around ATUM is not good or interesting or relatable as the visualisation of Cyr's concept is not good or interesting or relatable... and the crowbarred Machina mystery was not good or interesting or relatable. Certainly way less so than the experience a listener could have forming their own interpretations and projections between themselves and the music.

When Bill was riding high in Siamese Dream... and I guess some of Mellon Collie* although I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of those lyrics were lifted or written by someone else tbh... but Bill talked about degrees of separation to imbue an unrelated word with meaning or just stream of conscious something with a rhyme scheme, and because fans sought deeper meaning, he bought into the idea he was somehow creating art with a deeper meaning, simply because his lyrics were obtuse** ... and THIS led him to think he could be a published poet. Just like he could be a world class producer... and vibrato singer... the arrogance to not realise the actual depth of intellect that goes into decent poetry & prose is staggering given he seemed well-read around the MCIS period... but then I guess wrestling plots or more his level.

*Mellon Collie owes a lot to the aesthetic / influence of Yelena, if I have the timeline right.*
**(difficult to comprehend : not clear or precise in thought or expression)

 
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Old 01-23-2023, 12:56 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Gavvvvvin View Post
Billy doesn't seem to realise ... MCIS part II.
MCIS part III (machina was part II. making Machina II part II.2)





so.... hard to follow, incredibly complex? or just useless complexities?
I think billy assumes that it's some sort of me*ta fractal
billy, the loon. billy, the alien. from space. born of mandrill pet owning tentacle armed aliens.
A million piece jigsaw puzzle with no this, and no that

 
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Old 01-23-2023, 01:39 PM   #34
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Machina being "MCIS II" is just as much bullshit as the concept of this being a sequel to either of them

even in hip hop where this is more commonplace, it's almost always more marketing scheme than a true "artistic premise"

but you know what, we're talking about it in detail, it worked. we are stupid

Last edited by Joey Goldberg : 01-23-2023 at 01:50 PM. Reason: initially wrote "commonplace" as two words like a fucking IDIOT

 
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Old 01-23-2023, 01:43 PM   #35
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on that note though, this is still probably my favorite instance of "yeah nah fuck it, it's a sequel" i've ever seen




 
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Old 01-23-2023, 01:57 PM   #36
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Plus, Machina has been out for over 20 years and only now is he clearly defining that it's supposed to be MCIS II. Because he just made that up in 2022.

 
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Old 01-23-2023, 02:36 PM   #37
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SP fans love sequels. we love the convoluted number games.

I'm surprised Billy never played the "number your releases" like NIN's Halo count... or Jandeck's Corwood

 
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Old 01-23-2023, 03:04 PM   #38
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on that note though, this is still probably my favorite instance of "yeah nah fuck it, it's a sequel" i've ever seen



Dr. Octagon sure went on a journey. Can’t wait to read his story in sporadic blog posts and podcast recordings twenty years from now.

 
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