I never bought that “Zero” was originally intended to be a “character”

Reyngel · 03-09-2021, 01:50 AM

I was watching an old interview with Billy before they started doing studio work for Mellon Collie, and he mentions that yes, it was going to be a concept album, but not one with any overarching storyline or characters. He said it wasn’t going to be like The Wall, and that it instead was just “conceptual” by means of it being about a lot of different things in his life, and the band’s life.

“Zero” just seems like it was initially only the name he titled a song that had the line “I’m your lover, I’m your zero.” Which, to give him credit, is kind of a cool lyric I guess—to say you’re worth nothing to someone. But I don’t think it was ever any deeper than that. He probably had the first Zero shirt made as a call-back to that line about feeling worthless, wore it on stage for the first time, and the press or whoever started asking, “So who’s Zero?” And he, as he often does, decided to come up with some bullshit thing about how Zero was some piece of a deep concept storyline.

Kind of like how he totally made up how deep the concept story was for Machina... and then asked fans to send in their best guesses during that essay contest... and then just picked one that sounded the best and pretended it was his idea all along.

Shallowed · 03-09-2021, 01:55 AM

fuckin retcon

Ram27 · 03-09-2021, 02:01 AM

you're probably right

i never ever give a shit or follow the story of records. not folklore, MCIS, machina, anything. fuck that, i don't care. lyrics of songs, yes, they're great. i'll pour over them and think about what they mean or how they relate to my life

fuck glass and zero who gives a fuck. i'd rather think about guitar tone choices or some shit. anything

wHATcOLOR · 03-09-2021, 03:02 AM

i agree with this. retcon

VoxUpDoc · 03-09-2021, 05:01 AM

Yeah completely agree. Zero and Glass were not characters in MCIS and the Machina mystery was a grift.

Cool As Ice Cream · 03-09-2021, 07:16 AM

the whole story had been written before gish.

This is a username crisis. · 03-09-2021, 09:57 AM

He said he cut off his hair to nullify himself in the eye of the media...to become the antihero ZERO!!!

But yeah...

Siamese Dream = songs through the eyes of a child
MCIS = songs through the eyes of a teenager/young adult
Machina = songs through the eyes of a "rock star"

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 10:10 AM

gish = songs through the eyes of boundless and eternal presence/awareness that is the true nondual nature of reality as interpreted through a divided "false" self

AveryLoren · 03-09-2021, 11:01 AM

I actually believe Zero was totally premeditated/created and intended to be a character in appearance only. Superman shirt = 666 shirt = Zero shirt. It was an original idea for his rock star character's costume. Something for Billy to hide behind.

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAlter

took some leftover pants from the Rocket video

you know, i considered this as a possibility until realizing that they're wearing one-piece jumpsuits

https://i.ibb.co/GTPwfyY/JC023-WPC-scaled.jpg

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 01:34 PM

https://i.ibb.co/r089kNy/maxresdefault.jpg

AveryLoren · 03-09-2021, 02:01 PM

There is a "tour worn" Zero shirt at my local hard rock. I have a photo of it somewhere. One thing that I was shocked by was how massive Billy is. I am a medium sized dude, but his shirt was gargantuan. I think he mentions that there were like four ever made, right? Unless the hard rock is a liar, that's pretty odd he would donate one to them.

AveryLoren · 03-09-2021, 03:01 PM

https://i.ibb.co/Sd6DqD2/2012.png

https://i.ibb.co/H7gwtmv/2017.png

Ram27 · 03-09-2021, 03:06 PM

pieces of jimmy's machina kit were at hard rock too

don't know how they get stuff. i've never been but it seems like the shitty dumb hair metal sort of thing [it's a fucking rock and roll restaurant!] that's completely antithetical to everything SP is

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 03:37 PM

i wanna know what that collar tag says

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 03:42 PM

and it better not be "xxl"

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 03:43 PM

"designs by kathy"

Reyngel · 03-09-2021, 03:57 PM

Weird. Maybe that shirt really is 1 of the 4, but it looks slightly different. The sleeves look kind of jank and cheap, like some regular long sleeve T. But Billy’s were made of a custom slightly stretchy material. Also, Billy kept at least the “main” shirt, and another sold at auction. That would mean that Hard Rock one is one of a maximum 2 that could be floating out there.

Unless its a fake.

Also, Billy’s signature on that Strat doesn’t really look like how he normally signs stuff.

AveryLoren · 03-09-2021, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cork_soaker

i wanna know what that collar tag says

I'll stop by there on my way home and snap a picture.

slunken · 03-09-2021, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ram27

but it seems like the shitty dumb hair metal sort of thing [it's a fucking rock and roll restaurant!] that's completely antithetical to everything SP is

lol wut

slunken · 03-09-2021, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cork_soaker

https://i.ibb.co/GTPwfyY/JC023-WPC-scaled.jpg

i love his womanly hips

T&T · 03-09-2021, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cork_soaker

https://i.ibb.co/r089kNy/maxresdefault.jpg

Whoa, d'arcy looks like shit. it's obvious she was on drugs at that time too.

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slunken

i love his womanly hips

"the pear-shaped boy"

--c. love

cork_soaker · 03-09-2021, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AveryLoren

I'll stop by there on my way home and snap a picture.

much obliged

slunken · 03-09-2021, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cork_soaker

"the pear-shaped boy"

--c. love

wHATcOLOR · 03-09-2021, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T&T

Whoa, d'arcy looks like shit. it's obvious she was on drugs at that time too.

i was scrolling down to the bottom of the thread, formulating my d'arcy joke... and found i was too late

cork_soaker · 03-10-2021, 12:43 AM

https://i.ibb.co/SPH1ckd/774286ed0f6...314ab12999.jpg

cork_soaker · 03-10-2021, 01:00 AM

we are really getting somewhere

Ram27 · 03-10-2021, 01:09 AM

https://i.imgur.com/trf0zgB.jpg

Ram27 · 03-10-2021, 01:10 AM

william p. corgan?

03-09-2021, 01:50 AM	#1
Reyngel Apocalyptic Poster Location: Seattle Posts: 3,695	I never bought that “Zero” was originally intended to be a “character” I was watching an old interview with Billy before they started doing studio work for Mellon Collie, and he mentions that yes, it was going to be a concept album, but not one with any overarching storyline or characters. He said it wasn’t going to be like The Wall, and that it instead was just “conceptual” by means of it being about a lot of different things in his life, and the band’s life. “Zero” just seems like it was initially only the name he titled a song that had the line “I’m your lover, I’m your zero.” Which, to give him credit, is kind of a cool lyric I guess—to say you’re worth nothing to someone. But I don’t think it was ever any deeper than that. He probably had the first Zero shirt made as a call-back to that line about feeling worthless, wore it on stage for the first time, and the press or whoever started asking, “So who’s Zero?” And he, as he often does, decided to come up with some bullshit thing about how Zero was some piece of a deep concept storyline. Kind of like how he totally made up how deep the concept story was for Machina... and then asked fans to send in their best guesses during that essay contest... and then just picked one that sounded the best and pretended it was his idea all along.

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03-09-2021, 01:55 AM	#2
Shallowed Braindead Posts: 18,608	fuckin retcon

03-09-2021, 02:01 AM	#3
Ram27 seasonal depression Location: cafe de la danse Posts: 11,815	you're probably right i never ever give a shit or follow the story of records. not folklore, MCIS, machina, anything. fuck that, i don't care. lyrics of songs, yes, they're great. i'll pour over them and think about what they mean or how they relate to my life fuck glass and zero who gives a fuck. i'd rather think about guitar tone choices or some shit. anything

03-09-2021, 03:02 AM	#4
wHATcOLOR THIS IS AWESOME!!!!!!!!!! Location: \|\| MY NAME IS KIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIID ROCK!! Posts: 47,296	i agree with this. retcon

03-09-2021, 05:01 AM	#5
VoxUpDoc Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 4,228	Yeah completely agree. Zero and Glass were not characters in MCIS and the Machina mystery was a grift.

03-09-2021, 07:16 AM	#6
Cool As Ice Cream Just Hook it to My Veins! Location: František! How's the foot of your turtle? Posts: 32,877	the whole story had been written before gish.

03-09-2021, 09:57 AM	#7
This is a username crisis. Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 3,462	He said he cut off his hair to nullify himself in the eye of the media...to become the antihero ZERO!!! But yeah... Siamese Dream = songs through the eyes of a child MCIS = songs through the eyes of a teenager/young adult Machina = songs through the eyes of a "rock star"

03-09-2021, 10:10 AM	#8
cork_soaker full of longing Posts: 11,543	gish = songs through the eyes of boundless and eternal presence/awareness that is the true nondual nature of reality as interpreted through a divided "false" self

03-09-2021, 11:01 AM	#9
AveryLoren Apocalyptic Poster Location: Upside Down Narnia Posts: 1,923	I actually believe Zero was totally premeditated/created and intended to be a character in appearance only. Superman shirt = 666 shirt = Zero shirt. It was an original idea for his rock star character's costume. Something for Billy to hide behind.

03-09-2021, 01:34 PM	#11
cork_soaker full of longing Posts: 11,543	https://i.ibb.co/r089kNy/maxresdefault.jpg

03-09-2021, 02:01 PM	#12
AveryLoren Apocalyptic Poster Location: Upside Down Narnia Posts: 1,923	There is a "tour worn" Zero shirt at my local hard rock. I have a photo of it somewhere. One thing that I was shocked by was how massive Billy is. I am a medium sized dude, but his shirt was gargantuan. I think he mentions that there were like four ever made, right? Unless the hard rock is a liar, that's pretty odd he would donate one to them.

03-09-2021, 03:01 PM	#13
AveryLoren Apocalyptic Poster Location: Upside Down Narnia Posts: 1,923	https://i.ibb.co/Sd6DqD2/2012.png https://i.ibb.co/H7gwtmv/2017.png

03-09-2021, 03:06 PM	#14
Ram27 seasonal depression Location: cafe de la danse Posts: 11,815	pieces of jimmy's machina kit were at hard rock too don't know how they get stuff. i've never been but it seems like the shitty dumb hair metal sort of thing [it's a fucking rock and roll restaurant!] that's completely antithetical to everything SP is

03-09-2021, 03:37 PM	#15
cork_soaker full of longing Posts: 11,543	i wanna know what that collar tag says

03-09-2021, 03:42 PM	#16
cork_soaker full of longing Posts: 11,543	and it better not be "xxl"

03-09-2021, 03:43 PM	#17
cork_soaker full of longing Posts: 11,543	"designs by kathy"

03-09-2021, 03:57 PM	#18
Reyngel Apocalyptic Poster Location: Seattle Posts: 3,695	Weird. Maybe that shirt really is 1 of the 4, but it looks slightly different. The sleeves look kind of jank and cheap, like some regular long sleeve T. But Billy’s were made of a custom slightly stretchy material. Also, Billy kept at least the “main” shirt, and another sold at auction. That would mean that Hard Rock one is one of a maximum 2 that could be floating out there. Unless its a fake. Also, Billy’s signature on that Strat doesn’t really look like how he normally signs stuff.

03-10-2021, 12:43 AM	#27
cork_soaker full of longing Posts: 11,543	https://i.ibb.co/SPH1ckd/774286ed0f6...314ab12999.jpg

03-10-2021, 01:00 AM	#28
cork_soaker full of longing Posts: 11,543	we are really getting somewhere

03-10-2021, 01:09 AM	#29
Ram27 seasonal depression Location: cafe de la danse Posts: 11,815	https://i.imgur.com/trf0zgB.jpg

03-10-2021, 01:10 AM	#30
Ram27 seasonal depression Location: cafe de la danse Posts: 11,815	william p. corgan?