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Old 01-30-2023, 04:46 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by TheAlter View Post
You're exaggerating it just to prove a point. '93-'96 SP were juggernauts, one of only three or maybe four bands of the time to have such a huge cultural impact. But it's been 30 years, how many 60s bands were still kicking it in the 90s?
No, I'm not exaggerating to prove a point. The Pumpkins were popular for a couple years with the kiddies thanks to MTV and then they quickly faded away. They had no cultural impact.

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Originally Posted by eviltimeban View Post
Agreed. For me, whenever I see a reference to them outside of here or Reddit, I become the Leo DiCaprio pointing meme. It's unusual to see them mentioned anywhere to be honest.

And I've seen NOTHING, not one thing, in any media about Atum. I'm not talking about some blog, I mean what they call "mainstream media".
THIS

I constantly see people mention Nirvana or Radiohead, but I rarely ever hear anyone mention Smashing Pumpkins outside of here.

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 04:56 PM   #92
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Dance culture never really existed in North America.


By the way, dub has had its influences in electronic music way before dubstep came along. See Underworld, Leftfield, Fluke, Renegade Soundwave, The Orb, Meat Beat Manifesto in the 90s.

Last edited by MyKeyZ : 01-30-2023 at 05:16 PM.

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 05:17 PM   #93
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wait... i thought this was a two gallants board!!

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 05:31 PM   #94
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Crazy when you think about how SP started with a drum machine. They could’ve invented electronic music years earlier if Jimmy didn’t ruin it.

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 06:38 PM   #95
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I am one was actually a drum machine riff.
billy invented that.

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 07:01 PM   #96
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My uncle was the drum machine. He's still pretty pissed about the whole thing. He tells all kinds of stories when he's drunk (which is all the time). Things aren't going great for him. He doesn't have a lot of options. Billy made him sign a blanket non-compete at a time when he was just too young and new to the industry to understand he could've fought that in court. It's hard to find work when you're not allowed to make music for money any more. Billy Corgan took that from him. He took everything from him.

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 08:57 PM   #97
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I heard billy invented songwriting.

before billy artists didn't write their own songs. Taylor swift stole this idea from him.

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 10:50 PM   #98
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is this a real photo? if so, do we know the context?

 
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Old 01-30-2023, 11:26 PM   #99
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From his thirty days thing. He bathed in some hot spring or something in one episode.

Also whoever said SP had no cultural impact is talking out their ass. MCIS had a huge cultural impact. They were on the cover of every magazine, on every late night show, music videos that were played every hour, sold millions of albums, sold millions of t shirts that every kid was wearing. Uh, like where the fuck were you??

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:19 AM   #100
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Originally Posted by ourruseoffools View Post
The real hurtful truth is that it isn’t entirely socially acceptable as a hobbyist to put the massive effort and monetary investment to make a record that is to the scope of ‘the classics’… your average normie would probably look down on such a decision to prioritize a vanity project over saving for a house, family, etc

Luckily I don’t give a shit about such trivial matters. I will keep making expensive records as well as doing whatever else the fuck I want throughout my life without ever adding the burden of children onto myself. Thank you.
I think, for the most part, people who are different have become the "norm." It's those who would have been traditionally "normal" that are now considered different.

You think children are a burden; that's more than fair to you. No one has the right to judge your opinions, decisions, or desires unless it affects them directly. You make the record you want. I was in a band with a friend who produced pure fire. They struggled to get thirty people together in a bar when releasing a record.

These days - she's got like six-digits worth of listens on one of the streaming services. It still doesn't really matter. But she kept producing the things she cared about - felt passionate about - and pushed herself to grow by doing so. That's the part of the journey that's important as well.

You do you - and best of luck with it. As long as you give it your all - and don't leave anything on the table - there'll be nothing to regret.

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Originally Posted by MyKeyZ View Post


By the way, dub has had its influences in electronic music way before dubstep came along. See Underworld, Leftfield, Fluke, Renegade Soundwave, The Orb, Meat Beat Manifesto in the 90s.
The failure I made in my original posts, and it was my fault, was that I did not differentiate between music existing and music being successful. Successful as in - everyone knows about it.

Music rarely remains isolated. In fact, it just doesn't. Ever heard of Electro Swing? Combining elements of Electro and, well, Swing from the 1930's to 40's. Most people don't know of it and haven't heard of it. It really is amazing. But ... it isn't really successful.

What Dubstep was - and what it became - was an introductory 101 course to electronic music that did enough new - and was original enough in many aspects - to still deserve the electronic classification - while being able to bring in the most lucrative age group to make a worthwhile movement. Young kids/teenagers.

Many of whom would grow up and start expanding electronic music itself to some really interesting, exciting, and beautiful places. And that's the thing; Dubstep was important. A vast chunk of it was Goddamn awful - but it was still important in a way that all of these $2,000 Jeopardy clues of bands never were.

And that's not diminishing their quality. No, their quality is usually something insane. But, often times, in order for something to coalesce into something greater, there needs to be an actual hive-mind of activity. Where a single idea gets shared and spread amongst a great number of people. It's from here that a singular cultural language gets crafted - from which, variations and new ideas can spring forth from it, and find a home of ready listeners that can draw the connections, have the connections, and the established appreciation to make these splinters into the next big thing themselves.

It's for these reasons that Trap and Future music became as pronounced and big as they did. Because they had the vast collection of the Dubstep crowd to draw upon. A singular movement who they could propel forward.

Which is what Rock 'n' Roll lost. After grunge there came ... something, I'm sure, but it never coalesced into this gigantic movement where you had Pearl Jams and Red Hot Chili Peppers and Nirvanas and Smashing Pumpkins blowing minds within a single unified movement. Which explains why radio was piffing out literal Nirvana clones well into the 2010's - until somebody said, "Fuck! Finally! Everybody's listening to the same thing again! Somebody! Quick! Start making some pop music that sounds like that weird electronic shit all the kids are listening to."

Producing, ironically, perhaps one of the most listenable eras of radio that had existed in the late 2010's that had ever existed since actual grunge had it's actual hayday. Now, don't get too excited. I said listenable. I found many of the tracks great - but, they wouldn't be what I put on during my own time.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:40 AM   #101
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But all pop music was basically electronic 2 decades before then

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:40 AM   #102
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There was nothing unknown about electronic sounds leading the song!

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:49 AM   #103
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But all pop music was basically electronic 2 decades before then
Who says it wasn't.

But after rock was officially put in it's grave and had cement poured over it - the electronic pop that then came out reflected the new style - and to be fair, did something "friendly" with it. Roughed out the hard/compressed/grating edges - and trapped some sincere emotion in some surprising places. Almost as if trying less to be a hit song - and being "brave" enough to just share a story - or capture a moment in and of itself.

It's like radio tried to give everyone a breather from all the shittiness that radio was.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 04:04 AM   #104
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I think, for the most part, people who are different have become the "norm." It's those who would have been traditionally "normal" that are now considered different.

You think children are a burden; that's more than fair to you. No one has the right to judge your opinions, decisions, or desires unless it affects them directly. You make the record you want. I was in a band with a friend who produced pure fire. They struggled to get thirty people together in a bar when releasing a record.

These days - she's got like six-digits worth of listens on one of the streaming services. It still doesn't really matter. But she kept producing the things she cared about - felt passionate about - and pushed herself to grow by doing so. That's the part of the journey that's important as well.

You do you - and best of luck with it. As long as you give it your all - and don't leave anything on the table - there'll be nothing to regret.



The failure I made in my original posts, and it was my fault, was that I did not differentiate between music existing and music being successful. Successful as in - everyone knows about it.

Music rarely remains isolated. In fact, it just doesn't. Ever heard of Electro Swing? Combining elements of Electro and, well, Swing from the 1930's to 40's. Most people don't know of it and haven't heard of it. It really is amazing. But ... it isn't really successful.

What Dubstep was - and what it became - was an introductory 101 course to electronic music that did enough new - and was original enough in many aspects - to still deserve the electronic classification - while being able to bring in the most lucrative age group to make a worthwhile movement. Young kids/teenagers.

Many of whom would grow up and start expanding electronic music itself to some really interesting, exciting, and beautiful places. And that's the thing; Dubstep was important. A vast chunk of it was Goddamn awful - but it was still important in a way that all of these $2,000 Jeopardy clues of bands never were.

And that's not diminishing their quality. No, their quality is usually something insane. But, often times, in order for something to coalesce into something greater, there needs to be an actual hive-mind of activity. Where a single idea gets shared and spread amongst a great number of people. It's from here that a singular cultural language gets crafted - from which, variations and new ideas can spring forth from it, and find a home of ready listeners that can draw the connections, have the connections, and the established appreciation to make these splinters into the next big thing themselves.

It's for these reasons that Trap and Future music became as pronounced and big as they did. Because they had the vast collection of the Dubstep crowd to draw upon. A singular movement who they could propel forward.

Which is what Rock 'n' Roll lost. After grunge there came ... something, I'm sure, but it never coalesced into this gigantic movement where you had Pearl Jams and Red Hot Chili Peppers and Nirvanas and Smashing Pumpkins blowing minds within a single unified movement. Which explains why radio was piffing out literal Nirvana clones well into the 2010's - until somebody said, "Fuck! Finally! Everybody's listening to the same thing again! Somebody! Quick! Start making some pop music that sounds like that weird electronic shit all the kids are listening to."

Producing, ironically, perhaps one of the most listenable eras of radio that had existed in the late 2010's that had ever existed since actual grunge had it's actual hayday. Now, don't get too excited. I said listenable. I found many of the tracks great - but, they wouldn't be what I put on during my own time.
Yer basic

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 10:01 AM   #105
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Originally Posted by wHATcOLOR View Post
is this a real photo? if so, do we know the context?
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From his thirty days thing. He bathed in some hot spring or something in one episode.
omg
i assumed it was one of those fake AI things

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 10:54 AM   #106
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omg
i assumed it was one of those fake AI things
lol me too

wasn't this right after his first kid was born? he took a road trip?

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:23 PM   #107
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Yer basic
Basic would be identifying oneself with the music one listens to as if anyone outside of yourself actually cares.

Basic would be needing those identity markers in order to identify others, as well as being unable to like or dislike a song based solely on it's merits.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:29 PM   #108
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& pseudo-intellectual would be writing a series of essays on the internet only concerned with fickle mainstream trends and pretending like entire decades of music didn't happen because not every idiot at your high school knew about it

but even then you're still wrong, lol

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:33 PM   #109
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either way, you get this for your efforts



you'll be walking to receive it with a little-known song by some underground band playing in the background

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 12:48 PM   #110
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Basic would be identifying oneself with the music one listens to as if anyone outside of yourself actually cares.

Basic would be needing those identity markers in order to identify others, as well as being unable to like or dislike a song based solely on it's merits.
You're 17

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 01:16 PM   #111
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I think, for the most part, [the sound of flies buzzing slowly drowns out all sound, all thought, there is only me and the flies and soon there will not even be me]
Buddy, you last posted here in 2005, and it seems like you usually kept things pretty brief back then. Now you're back and blasting out of the gate with multiple 10,000-word essays on why "1979" revolutionized music. Divorce? Death of a parent? Could it be true that, deep down, that's what you'd really like to talk about instead? Let's dig in and really start rooting around in that noggin. This is a place of healing.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 05:23 PM   #112
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Originally Posted by houseofglass11 View Post
From his thirty days thing. He bathed in some hot spring or something in one episode.

Also whoever said SP had no cultural impact is talking out their ass. MCIS had a huge cultural impact. They were on the cover of every magazine, on every late night show, music videos that were played every hour, sold millions of albums, sold millions of t shirts that every kid was wearing. Uh, like where the fuck were you??
All of that, and still no lasting cultural impact. Smashing Pumpkins are the equivalent of when everyone wanted the Tickle Me Elmo doll or Beanie Babies or Pogs. A fad for a couple years, then dropped and forgotten.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 05:51 PM   #113
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Is this the album that was supposed to be the follow up to MCIS and Machina? Holy fuck if so. Why is every release worse than the previous one. Jesus this is so fucking bad. It’s like ever since his announcement that the Smashing Pumpkins were back he’s had to go out of his way to make even more solo synthy Billy albums that sound like shit.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 05:52 PM   #114
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wow, it really has been since 2005 - welcome back Sapphire

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 06:14 PM   #115
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SP had zero long term cultural impact which is why WPC believes he’s been cancelled and is slowly releasing a 33 song rock opera in 3 parts about how he was cancelled for releasing Zeitgeist which was a warning of what They were going to do to us but while he was right not even his dark (too dark for music fans) vision of the future was as dark as the reality we live in now - a reality where Billy Corgan the greatest artist of all time has to fund the production of a 33 song rock opera in 3 parts out of his own pocket because no one wants to buy his records and no one wants to sell them. because he’s been cancelled. Or in his own words they “took away [my] right to endure”. They had a run good enough but it’s not happened.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 06:22 PM   #116
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lol me too

wasn't this right after his first kid was born? he took a road trip?
yes
it's a sign of good parenting. at the sight of a new born, daddy hits the road.

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 06:26 PM   #117
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SP had zero long term cultural impact which is why WPC believes he’s been cancelled and is slowly releasing a 33 song rock opera in 3 parts about how he was cancelled for releasing Zeitgeist which was a warning of what They were going to do to us but while he was right not even his dark (too dark for music fans) vision of the future was as dark as the reality we live in now - a reality where Billy Corgan the greatest artist of all time has to fund the production of a 33 song rock opera in 3 parts out of his own pocket because no one wants to buy his records and no one wants to sell them. because he’s been cancelled. Or in his own words they “took away [my] right to endure”. They had a run good enough but it’s not happened.
That really does make sense. And it explains why, afaik, Shiny has spent the entire album so far going "WELL I GUESS NO ONE LIKES ME SO I'M GOING TO JUMP INTO THE SUN. Yep, just steering right into it... here I go... don't anyone try to stop me... yep, jumping into the sun because no one likes my music... can you guys hear me?... Almost there now, yep, not gonna turn around... heeeeeeere I go... it's a shame no one likes my music any more so I'm just gonna... guys? Guys?"

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 06:27 PM   #118
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Old 01-31-2023, 06:28 PM   #119
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yes
it's a sign of good parenting. at the sight of a new born, daddy hits the road.
This is the painful laugh I needed today

 
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Old 01-31-2023, 06:39 PM   #120
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I mean sometimes it's better for the father to just disappear, really.

 
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