Time to move on?

[eviltimeban]

Originally Posted by Gooch

If SP was a new band I never heard of before, I would not listen to this crap.

Me too. It's the same with U2 really, always hoping for something decent from their next release. I will listen to the new records to see if there's anything I like, but there's usually not. I won't spend any money on the new albums, I'll just stream them.

SP are just going further and further away from what I liked about them in the first place. They aren't even remotely similar sounding to what they were before. At least U2 are trying to get back to their "original" sound, but they are taking anything interesting away in the process.

If SP had something interesting to bring to the table with new material, that'd be fair enough. But they don't. It's just harsh grey synth mush with Billy's worst voice sailing high on top. Not even a good drum sound to enjoy.

[brothahi4L]

I agree eviltimeban

[VoxUpDoc]

Even though I ultimately didn’t like them, I got some residual nostalgia vibes from MTAE, Shiny and eventually even Cyr.

But I get nothing from ATUM. Which puts it on par with, or below Oceania for me. Oceania is a trash album and I don’t understand anyone who connected with it in any way.

I would catch the band if they toured but… at $100+ a ticket…. I don’t wanna?
Like… visiting Netphoria is an unhealthy obsession at this point.

[incubator]

If you're only in it for the music and you don't like the music then sure it's time to move on.

For me modern SP is my favourite soap opera / sitcom and ATUM is the best season so far. I do legitimately enjoy the music but a lot of that enjoyment is down to the context, or the joke with the music as the punchline.

People say it's like watching a car crash but no it's not like that at all. My love and appreciation for the man and this work is sincere. When I call it a joke it's not an insult. As He's said, they're called "Smashing Pumpkins" - they're not serious, they're Playing music.

[LaBelle]

Originally Posted by brothahi4L

Who is prsising the album except foolofatook..?

I didn't say anyone was praising, but take a look at the ratings thread and how many 8s people are giving out to songs for some lols.

[FoolofaTook]

Ok, upon further listening….. this be gone from hating to REALLY liking this album. I freaking KNEW this would happen, but I had to jump the gun and be overly critical. I’d given up, but the songs came on random while I was on treadmill and, man, I’m totally digging it!!! I’m so glad to, because I’m way happier liking new SO music than slamming it and being miserable. Also, I’m now knocking those who still hate it, I feel that is a big part of being passionate about music and your favorite artist

[NovaFritz]

I get serious Styx/Parsons Project vibes from this new music. SP has become the prog rock that wasn't cool when I was getting into 70s music back in the day. Lame tunes, lame lyrics (spoon to the knife), lame synths, lame artwork, etc. Though the song Atum sort of sounds like bad Division Bell?

At least we don't have to pay for any of this any more.

[NovaFritz]

Originally Posted by T&T

you made a thread.... that's a measurement of "grand" and attention seeking.

Other grand, attention-seeking threads dominating netphoria right now:

What is a meh song that is God tire live?
Best ATUM track for sucking dick?
A return to porn???
best ATUM track for eating gash?

[Joey Goldberg]

from here on out i am going to completely ignore the fact that Took is, how do you say, "quoting reddit" & responding to those posts sincerely

happy thanksgiving all!

[Joey Goldberg]

Originally Posted by FoolofaTook

Ok, upon further listening….. this be gone from hating to REALLY liking this album. I freaking KNEW this would happen, but I had to jump the gun and be overly critical. I’d given up, but the songs came on random while I was on treadmill and, man, I’m totally digging it!!! I’m so glad to, because I’m way happier liking new SO music than slamming it and being miserable. Also, I’m now knocking those who still hate it, I feel that is a big part of being passionate about music and your favorite artist

um, don't think you ever hated it

ever since you've gotten back you've done nothing but gush over this shitstorm

have you even stopped to think about which one is best to "eat gash" during?

[dustrocck]

I'd say 90% of bands have 5 years where they are at their peak.

For the Pumpkins, that was 1991-96. I enjoy Adore and Machina, but it was already diminishing returns.

So we're over 25 years since the prime of the band.

I don't think I'll ever move on, I'll listen once to everything Corgan puts out until he dies, and especially after he's dead and his estate will have control.

But now it's listen once and destroy

[AveryLoren]

I have some form of stockholm syndrome regarding SP. I hate the band, the new music (really since TbK era), the music videos are horrifically bad, I hate Billy, I hate Jeff, Jimmy kinda sucks now too, the live shows suck (I still dunno what people are talking about a return to form live), I hate the fans. Yet, I keep returning here. Billy is tone deaf and oblivious. He lives in a bubble of his own little world so to save himself any type of confrontation that he sucks. I can't think of a single thing he's done in the last decade that has been decent or well executed. He's even ruined the only thing I was looking forward to with the archive releases being on fucking vinyl.

[Disco King]

Obviously, I'm still here, just like everyone else. But I'm past the point of feeling "disappointed" or "let down" by new Pumpkins releases. I think maybe ten years ago, I did feel something almost like grief that my favourite band is no longer good, but I eventually got over it. It's not like they're the only band out there to listen to. The fact that Corgan made music I like in the past doesn't mean that he owes it to me to continue making music I like. He's not, like, wronging me personally by releasing crap. By that same token, the fact that I like their old music doesn't mean that I owe it to them to "support" their new output or that criticizing work I think is bad makes me an untroo fan (as some Sad Machines might hold).

It's also worth noting that, ten years ago, I felt actual woe over things like The Simpsons no longer living up to it's former quality and the DC Comics reboot reducing the quality of their stories. Turns out the reason I was emotional about trivial things like "media I like no longer being good" is that I was just a depressed person in general who didn't have a very rich life beyond consuming media (not accusing anyone else of this). It wasn't like I was getting invited to parties, so all there was for me to look forward to was, like, the next issue of that thing I'm following or the next release by this or that band. It's a miracle that I never started collecting Funko Pops during this time or else I might not be here today.

I'm still a depressed person, but I ag least now having my energy invested in things like personal goals and human relationships means I'm less likely to solely derive my pleasure from things I'm a fan of, and the quality of media I enjoy has very little consequence on my mood. When I see people express actual torment over Corgan releasing a terrible track, sincerely feeling as though Corgan is punishing or "testing" them… I do think it's possible that the fact that their hats are totally hung on the actions of a human being they bear no real relationship with means that there is something that they could benefit from adding to their lives.

[thomas_bland]

I don't think I can move on, like the soap opera comment above, they're sort of my team. I've just passed on going to see my other favorite band (that stem from my teenage years) who haven't played for a decade. I wouldn't pass on SP in the UK even though it would be the price of a small holiday now I don't live in London. Liked ATUM on 1 listen, hesitant to go back but might listen to the Podcast to hear the first Act 2 song. Looking forward to the Machina reissue but would rather have a recreated Machina II with original art.

[run2pee]

Originally Posted by Disco King

Obviously, I'm still here, just like everyone else. But I'm past the point of feeling "disappointed" or "let down" by new Pumpkins releases. I think maybe ten years ago, I did feel something almost like grief that my favourite band is no longer good, but I eventually got over it. It's not like they're the only band out there to listen to. The fact that Corgan made music I like in the past doesn't mean that he owes it to me to continue making music I like. He's not, like, wronging me personally by releasing crap. By that same token, the fact that I like their old music doesn't mean that I owe it to them to "support" their new output or that criticizing work I think is bad makes me an untroo fan (as some Sad Machines might hold).

It's also worth noting that, ten years ago, I felt actual woe over things like The Simpsons no longer living up to it's former quality and the DC Comics reboot reducing the quality of their stories. Turns out the reason I was emotional about trivial things like "media I like no longer being good" is that I was just a depressed person in general who didn't have a very rich life beyond consuming media (not accusing anyone else of this). It wasn't like I was getting invited to parties, so all there was for me to look forward to was, like, the next issue of that thing I'm following or the next release by this or that band. It's a miracle that I never started collecting Funko Pops during this time or else I might not be here today.

I'm still a depressed person, but I ag least now having my energy invested in things like personal goals and human relationships means I'm less likely to solely derive my pleasure from things I'm a fan of, and the quality of media I enjoy has very little consequence on my mood. When I see people express actual torment over Corgan releasing a terrible track, sincerely feeling as though Corgan is punishing or "testing" them… I do think it's possible that the fact that their hats are totally hung on the actions of a human being they bear no real relationship with means that there is something that they could benefit from adding to their lives.

Beautiful post

Thanks

[Funbags]

Originally Posted by absof

Machina reissue
Metro video
Zwan box set

Machina Reissue
Zwan Box Set
Billy's autobiography that he's been writing for 10 years
FutureEmbrace reissue?

Those are basically the only SP related things I care about.

I dgaf about their new music, even though I've tried. Each new song sounds like soulless over-processed garbage. Their music actually makes me FEEL empty.

Fuck that Beguilled riff too

Chug chug chug chug chugga chug chug
Chug chug chug chug bippty boo~

Fuck that riff and what this band has become.

[Ram27]

full SBDs from 96

you know once corgan is gone airplane mode is gonna go thru the attic looking for easy money

[paranoid]

Originally Posted by Funbags

Fuck that Beguilled riff too

Chug chug chug chug chugga chug chug
Chug chug chug chug bippty boo~

Fuck that riff and what this band has become.

I’m not into starting a flame war, but how many times do we need to say something sucks before it just turns into a mountain of negative energy that ultimately makes you feel like shit? Like it’s gotta be painful to go on a forum and post the same thoughts on something day in and day out?

I know when I go through spells of posting here day after day it ruins my mood for that whole time period. Usually happens when pumpkins have new music out or a tour happening. Like doesn’t it put y’all in a bad mood beating this dead horse over and over?

I think nova fritz has it right, like move on if it’s giving you this much anger. It’s not worth yelling at a cloud for weeks on end.

Jump down my throat over this but I’m asking an honest question. Even posting this as a question I already feel nauseous and I might shit my pants from the stress of it.

[Funbags]

Unfortunately, Billy's sustainable model has me addicted. His sustainable model of seeming like he's going to release something good, but it turns out to be shittier than ever.

[run2pee]

Originally Posted by paranoid

I’m not into starting a flame war, but how many times do we need to say something sucks before it just turns into a mountain of negative energy that ultimately makes you feel like shit? Like it’s gotta be painful to go on a forum and post the same thoughts on something day in and day out?

I know when I go through spells of posting here day after day it ruins my mood for that whole time period. Usually happens when pumpkins have new music out or a tour happening. Like doesn’t it put y’all in a bad mood beating this dead horse over and over?

I think nova fritz has it right, like move on if it’s giving you this much anger. It’s not worth yelling at a cloud for weeks on end.

Jump down my throat over this but I’m asking an honest question. Even posting this as a question I already feel nauseous and I might shit my pants from the stress of it.

Hmmm i actually tend to post more when im depressed and feel like i get some entertainment or weird connection/camaraderie with similar weirdos, i don’t think netphoria has ever made me feel bad

[run2pee]

That said im not one of these tiresome crybabies moaning about something they can’t change. Listen to “Hooray!” about 10 or 12 times u fucken dummies. See if it don’t make u chuckle. And that’s something, in this world where chuckles are daily dying in droves out there beyond the fried chicken reefs in the boiling chemical oceans etc

[Raskolnikov]

It's funny - back in 2011 I saw SP at this tiny club in Salt Lake City. It was BC, Jeff, Nicole and Bam Bam. I thought to myself that it couldn't possibly get any more diluted than that. But I was still fully devoted.

Then like has been said here, Oceania came out and I had more hope. Then Jimmy returns. Then James returns. You feel like it's got some momentum.

But the weird thing is that I feel like the band is more lost now than even back then which is crazy, given the fact that they have 3/4 of the original folks in there, etc. I just don't feel the direction of where they are going currently. It's strange.

Anyways, at this point, Atum feels lost and weird... but I went to the Hollywood Bowl this past Saturday and I'll be damned if I didn't feel SP vibe from halfway back in an overpriced seat when they went from Starla into SIYL.

So, yeah - I'm on this ship all the way down to the bottom.

[Laundro]

At this point, I'm just morbidly curious for anything regarding new SP. It's never gonna be good, I've long given up hope on the band releasing anything remotely listenable. Once I made peace with that fact, it all became a lot easier to stomach tbh.

The old records are still great. I still want to see them live and it seems that they put on a decent show, so that option is there.

The only thing I'm interested in the band moving forward is the Machina reissue (which I'm slowly coming to terms that it's probably never getting released) and, honestly... this place. Like some of the negativity feels exaggerated and unwarranted, but it's still 10 times better reading y'all's hot takes than going to the reddit/Sad Machines/whatever the modern equivalent of the original SP forum is.

Also, fuck Frank "Rat Bastard" Quinto.

[paranoid]

Originally Posted by Raskolnikov

It's funny - back in 2011 I saw SP at this tiny club in Salt Lake City. It was BC, Jeff, Nicole and Bam Bam. I thought to myself that it couldn't possibly get any more diluted than that. But I was still fully devoted.

Then like has been said here, Oceania came out and I had more hope. Then Jimmy returns. Then James returns. You feel like it's got some momentum.

But the weird thing is that I feel like the band is more lost now than even back then which is crazy, given the fact that they have 3/4 of the original folks in there, etc. I just don't feel the direction of where they are going currently. It's strange.

Anyways, at this point, Atum feels lost and weird... but I went to the Hollywood Bowl this past Saturday and I'll be damned if I didn't feel SP vibe from halfway back in an overpriced seat when they went from Starla into SIYL.

So, yeah - I'm on this ship all the way down to the bottom.

I honestly feel the hatred of this album is overblown. it's not that bad.. and i think it's an improvement on releases from past few years. It's the first time i've liked a decent chunk of what's been released since 2008, when they were starting to write some really top level material.

The general complaints are jimmy's not there.. he is! like people say steps in time is too straight.. but i hear it and think about how his classic ability to make a song sound bigger is still there, and the drum part itself is excellent. he doesn't need to throw in jellybelly style fills. and then James is not there.. he is! James probably has more recorded parts on this record than he does on siamese dream.. lol.. think about that one!

And again there are songs i don't like at all, but i don't think some of these songs warrant the intense criticisms they're getting. yeah it's annoying some album time is taken up by a few songs that are obviously billy solo, but skip function is a nice thing.

maybe i'm just glad they're still doing it, and it's the real OG band, not some hired guns. things could be worse, but for some fans it sounds like it's as bad as it will ever get.

[Squish Squash]

I mean it's not the real OG band though. I'm glad you're able to enjoy it at least.

[paranoid]

Originally Posted by Squish Squash

I mean it's not the real OG band though. I'm glad you're able to enjoy it at least.

it's as close as we will ever get. i don't think i'm the only fan that says i was not surprised at all when it was revealed darcy wasn't coming back. it sucks, she was as important as the other 3, and i like other old school fans miss her, but even if she had managed to do that reunion tour, i don't think she'd be in the band now... and we'd probably have seen a side of darcy we never wanted to see. i.e. it's best she's not part of the current band, and not because some fans deem the music a train wreck.

[GreenDogGlynis]

I'm cool with the synth stuff. I thought Cyr was good and had a vision it followed through on. Maybe James has technically recorded more on Atum than SD. But James' contributions were definitely more on SD as he actually helped form the songs through the endless of hours of band practice. Here, he's probably just throwing a small part in that fits in with the file Billy sent him. Apart from the paycheck it appears that James gets some genuine enjoyment playing live with the band and getting to enjoy what he helped create, but I don't think he or Jimmy care at all about the new music.

While I don't believe a word of what Billy says to the media about the band's mission or anything really, I do believe he is making the music he wants to make for better or worse. SP's sales have tanked big time in relation to the sales of their 90s peers, but I don't think Billy cares all that much, he's just having fun making his 80s synth music. He'll posture about SP breaking new ground and all that but I think in reality he's just enjoying making music on his laptop like a lot of other people do.

[Butt Pope]

Did James play a single note on Atum? I assume at this point he’s just touring.

[houseofglass11]

I haven't seen proof of James playing on Atum, how can we say he's on it with any certainty? It could be Jeff (hired gun) for all we know.

[thomas_bland]

Not sure Jeff counts as a hired gun anymore (or indeed has for a long time)