Communism, Anarchy, or Socialism

[MyOneAndOnly]

Choose one: Communism, Anarchy, Socialism

[MyOneAndOnly]

[Disco King]

I don't know what this question means.

Socialism is an incredibly broad spectrum, of which anarchism and communism are subtypes.

[Disco King]

Hell, I don't even know what "communism" is taken to mean anymore.

Within Marxist thought, it was the end goal of Marxism. But Marx didn't elaborate on what it would look like or how it would work. It was a theoretical component of his ideology, rather than an ideology itself.

The countries that have been called "communist" were so-called because they were allegedly working toward whatever that end goal was. Except, what ever communism is, it's something that happens after "the withering away of the state," and we all know the last thing these states seemed interested in doing was any withering. But one popular meaning "communism" ended up taking on was "whatever those states like the USSR, Cuba, North Vietnam, or Czechoslovakia are doing," which usually was some form of Marxist-Leninism.

Then you have anarcho-communism… I don't know if this term is redundant, because most anarchism up until post-left anarchism and anarcho-capitalism was classless and stateless. Communism, as described by Marx, is already also classless and stateless. The difference between Marxism and anarchism was that Marx wanted to take over the state for the proletariat and then seque into a stateless, classless society, whereas anarchists thought you have to destroy the state and class structures at once instead of trying to have an interim proletarian state. So, anarcho-communism is a mix of a classless, stateless ideology, and… another classless, stateless ideology? That just sounds like "anarchism" to me. Maybe it had to distinguish itself from newer forms of anarchism like syndicalism or anything that uses socialist markets (which are a thing because you can have markets without private ownership of productive means).

[yo soy el mejor]

a tween has hijacked a net4ian account@

[MyOneAndOnly]

I really hate the "anarco" prefix attached to anything. I think it's a whole lot of nonsense. It's used by leftists to try to flag that they're not institutional communists, and it's used by Libertarians as a moniker to show that they're more radically libertarian than other libertarians.

I also think that the use of the term by both the left and right is akin to the early 20th century where "socialism" got attached to everything. Like "National Socialism". Once that starts happening the meaning is kind of lost. Cause you have a million little groups laying claim to it.

I have never heard a convincing argument from anyone on the left for what ANARCHO means in a practical sense. All it seems to mean is "i hate authority". But in a practical political way what does it mean? This is similar to old school communists who used to propose no real solution to government other than "the revolution". You cannot have a democratic, technological, meritocracy without rule of law and some kind of government. Yeah, you can trash a police station in Seattle, or take over a park in NYC and serve free Kombucha and edibles to your crusty peeps. But you can't ensure basic human rights uniformally in a society, or provide health care, etc without a formal government and constitutional democracy within which everyone acts.

[yo soy el mejor]

the term "antifa" is similarly nonsense

omg and that chant the kids say about show me what democracy looks like and 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,etc

[MyOneAndOnly]

FTR Anti Fascist is a pretty straight forward idea. It doesn't require an elaborate philosophical framework. It just means you're against fascism.

I had 3 grand parents that were Antifa. They all fought in WW2

[Joey Goldberg]

that's a spa ced from me dawg

[run2pee]

i dunno man, this probably isn’t “cool” or whatever but i think whatever the usa is is kinda fine, just gimme more regulations here, less there, etc., everybody hug more, don’t elect anymore cartoon characters from tv land, etc.

[Disco King]

Boring-ass liberal democracy lifted more people out of poverty and has created more stable societies than any other system in existence.

*Drops mic and runs away*

[slunken]

at this point this is an obvious bot/parody account, no?

[duovamp]

Originally Posted by Disco King

Boring-ass liberal democracy lifted more people out of poverty and has created more stable societies than any other system in existence.

*Drops mic and runs away*

Boring? 25,000 Brits had to die for this.

[Squish Squash]

Anarchy, although the actual definiton of communism isn't really different from anarchy.

[ilikeplanets]

Originally Posted by MyOneAndOnly

You cannot have a democratic, technological, meritocracy without rule of law and some kind of government. Yeah, you can trash a police station in Seattle, or take over a park in NYC and serve free Kombucha and edibles to your crusty peeps. But you can't ensure basic human rights uniformally in a society, or provide health care, etc without a formal government and constitutional democracy within which everyone acts.

This is what I think, so does that mean I choose socialism? I'm apparently a fucking idiot, since until today I thought communism and anarchism were close to opposites.

[teh b0lly!!1]

can we maybe please just once have a new thread that's not about politics? or someone dead?

guys?

[vixnix]

Originally Posted by Disco King

Boring-ass liberal democracy lifted more people out of poverty and has created more stable societies than any other system in existence.

*Drops mic and runs away*

Is this true if you take just the last 40 years - I thought China had lifted more people out of poverty than any other political system, in that time. And also in that time living conditions worsened for the poorest in liberal democracies

But I am probably wrong. I should fact check

[MyOneAndOnly]

Originally Posted by teh b0lly!!1

can we maybe please just once have a new thread that's not about politics? or someone dead?

guys?

yes, when the wars stop and nobody dies

[MyOneAndOnly]

Originally Posted by vixnix

Is this true if you take just the last 40 years - I thought China had lifted more people out of poverty than any other political system, in that time. And also in that time living conditions worsened for the poorest in liberal democracies

But I am probably wrong. I should fact check

do you have to subtract the dead in China from those lifted from poverty? 55 million people died in China in the 50s alone due to Mao's agricultural policies.

that's just the factoid i remember off the top of my head.. .i'm sure there's more. Kind of like "who killed more people, Hitler or Stalin?

I get what you're saying, though. In terms of population China is larger than the EU and USA-Canada-Australia combined. China's poverty rate is approximately 15%. The USA is 11%. Canada is 6%. Australia is 13%. The EU is 22%, although I suspect those below poverty line in the EU are better off than those in the USA.

[ilikeplanets]

Originally Posted by ilikeplanets

This is what I think, so does that mean I choose socialism? I'm apparently a fucking idiot, since until today I thought communism and anarchism were close to opposites.

To defend myself, I have noticed that when many people talk about communinusm, they don't consider that "stateless"....which is the main feature of anarchism. Classes, yes. But I'm sure others haven't considered them to be the same thing, either..

[ilikeplanets]

Take the meme at the top, for example

[topleybird]

Originally Posted by teh b0lly!!1

can we maybe please just once have a new thread that's not about politics? or someone dead?

On it, bruh

[yo soy el mejor]

Originally Posted by MyOneAndOnly

FTR Anti Fascist is a pretty straight forward idea. It doesn't require an elaborate philosophical framework. It just means you're against fascism.

I had 3 grand parents that were Antifa. They all fought in WW2

okay but "antifa" instead of just saying both words is a new thing and sounds totally dumb

[TheAlter]

WWII Anti Fascism meant fighting against dictatorial regimes. Antifa in the west today means what, smashing Starbucks during anti-Biden protests? Very different meaning/scenario.

[topleybird]

Yep, we eradicated fascism in the US, so it's all just looting now by these darn millennials who don't want to work for their avocado toast or survive their ectopic pregnancy or w/e

[TheAlter]

Too bad you don't like avocado toasts, they're healthy, enviromentally friendly and most importantly sustainable food.

Btw your tesla breaking down is not fascism, it's just pure capitalism fucking with you.

[yo soy el mejor]

when did avocado/avocado toast become related to the bourgeoisie millennial? i'm mexican and from texas--very close to the avocados. i ate a lot of avocados growing up and we weren't rich--not even close. maybe like working class or upper-lower class. my parents could afford avocados but not vacations. go pick on another food!

now smoothies....whole diff story

[TheAlter]

Originally Posted by yo soy el mejor

i'm mexican and from texas

I'm confused

[ilikeplanets]

Avocado toast is like the new version of cucumber sandwiches, which also have no business being considered high class

[yo soy el mejor]

Originally Posted by TheAlter

I'm confused

Tejano works, too.

The term Tejano, derived from the Spanish adjective tejano or (feminine) tejana (and written in Spanish with a lower-case t), denotes a Texan of Mexican descent, thus a Mexican Texan or a Texas Mexican.