Adore Tour version of BWBW-did they pull it off or was it lame?

[Squish Squash]

Personally I think it works, although I do prefer the standard version. The ending here is great though. But I imagine some people see this as more Billy shenanigans.

[ourruseoffools]

fucking rocks... i love how they go "DESPITE AL MY RAGE I AM STILL JUSTT A RAT IN A CAGGGEEEE" and the riff just hits right back in

yea the original is superior but its badass that they did this

[Squish Squash]

Agreed, one of the things I liked about SP album to album in the 90s is how Billy never was satisfied on settling on one style, this is another case of that same method of thinking by him I think. Sometimes it made for songs I wasn't huge on (albeit not very often, I enjoy the vast majority and even the ones I don't are objectively good pieces of music), but I appreciated that he was so creative and eclectic as opposed to just doing the same shit over and over again like most bands do.

[AveryLoren]

Adore is my #3 fave SP album, but the live era absolutely sucked. I think this is the precursor to lame big group of musicians we have currently and in the very recent past. It's not rocking and comes off as overly gimmicky. Should have been dark and brooding with the JC muscle. Those auxiliary percussionist are just so off putting and Arnoff is wildly out of place. Also, the inclusion of Garson is a very telling facet of Billy's inability to properly interpret his own musical styling.

[GLOWer]

sounds like the everlasting gaze. the distortion is amazing

[Squish Squash]

Originally Posted by AveryLoren

Adore is my #3 fave SP album, but the live era absolutely sucked. I think this is the precursor to lame big group of musicians we have currently and in the very recent past. It's not rocking and comes off as overly gimmicky. Should have been dark and brooding with the JC muscle. Those auxiliary percussionist are just so off putting and Arnoff is wildly out of place. Also, the inclusion of Garson is a very telling facet of Billy's inability to properly interpret his own musical styling.

I found Aronoff impossible to take seriously with his goofy mannerisms and being dressed like he was about to enter the Tour de France, but he's certainly a good drummer. Billy never would have had multiple percussionists if Jimmy had been available, he was perhaps overcompensating for losing one of the best drummers ever.

[jimmy drevpile]

Originally Posted by Squish Squash

I found Aronoff impossible to take seriously with his goofy mannerisms and being dressed like he was about to enter the Tour de France, but he's certainly a good drummer. Billy never would have had multiple percussionists if Jimmy had been available, he was perhaps overcompensating for losing one of the best drummers ever.

I don't like what he does, at all.

[slunken]

Originally Posted by AveryLoren

Adore is my #3 fave SP album, but the live era absolutely sucked. I think this is the precursor to lame big group of musicians we have currently and in the very recent past. It's not rocking and comes off as overly gimmicky. Should have been dark and brooding with the JC muscle. Those auxiliary percussionist are just so off putting and Arnoff is wildly out of place. Also, the inclusion of Garson is a very telling facet of Billy's inability to properly interpret his own musical styling.

Wow, I remember getting a video bootleg of the Dublin MTV show shortly after it aired and had the complete opposite reaction. I absolute adored (hehe) the live arrangements. I think having the extra percussion section was a great move and Garson on piano was a great choice. Think of the alternative: just kenny on drums and some random dork on a keyboard? No thanks.

I like the live interpretations from that tour so much better than the record.

Live version of Stumbeline from that era is an all-time favorite too.

edit: oh it was london UK not dublin

[Squish Squash]

Originally Posted by jimmy drevpile

I don't like what he does, at all.

Cameron Diaz did.

[johncg]

It’s dope.

I miss the recklessness of pre-2000’s Billy/SP. He started becoming increasingly calculated post-MCIS, getting more and more trapped in a maze of reacting to his previous work and to his perceptions of his audience. His work has suffered exponentially as time goes on as a result.

Here there is still incredible power in his voice, in the way the band plays, and in the way they are deconstructing and repackaging an old song. It’s mesmerizing.

Also as a side note, it’s interesting to hear Aronoff’s rock steady time feel contrasting with the band’s inherent looseness. And the absence of Jimmy’s push/pull feel driving the band is noticeable. But it still sounds great in a different way.

[Squish Squash]

Originally Posted by johncg

It’s dope.

I miss the recklessness of pre-2000’s Billy/SP. He started becoming increasingly calculated post-MCIS, getting more and more trapped in a maze of reacting to his previous work and to his perceptions of his audience. His work has suffered exponentially as time goes on as a result.

Here there is still incredible power in his voice, in the way the band plays, and in the way they are deconstructing and repackaging an old song. It’s mesmerizing.

Also as a side note, it’s interesting to hear Aronoff’s rock steady time feel contrasting with the band’s inherent looseness. And the absence of Jimmy’s push/pull feel driving the band is noticeable. But it still sounds great in a different way.

Very much agreed. I think a good way to put it would be that Billy used to make music for his own fulfillment, and now he just makes it in an attempt at relevancy.

[inkless]

better than 2000 version

[ourruseoffools]

Originally Posted by Squish Squash

Billy never would have had multiple percussionists if Jimmy had been available, he was perhaps overcompensating for losing one of the best drummers ever.

im not a huge fan of this narrative... im pretty sure they added the percussionists because a lot of adore was a straightforward drum part played acoustically by matt walker or joey warnokerthat were then augmented with samples... i think having two aux percussionists was a way cooler move than having backing tracks doing the electronics

[slunken]

definitely

[slunken]

[slunken]

garson plays tasteful keys that nobody notices for an entire show just let the man go off one time please for the love of god

[slunken]

this is so gnarly

[ourruseoffools]

Originally Posted by AveryLoren

Adore is my #3 fave SP album, but the live era absolutely sucked. I think this is the precursor to lame big group of musicians we have currently and in the very recent past. It's not rocking and comes off as overly gimmicky. Should have been dark and brooding with the JC muscle. Those auxiliary percussionist are just so off putting and Arnoff is wildly out of place. Also, the inclusion of Garson is a very telling facet of Billy's inability to properly interpret his own musical styling.

im holding back from writing multiple paragraphs on how much i hate everything you said here

[slunken]

hahahaha

[Squish Squash]

As long as we're linking Adore era perfomances, this 20ish second clip from Crestfallen in Brussels is maybe the best I've ever heard Billy sing

[ourruseoffools]

Originally Posted by Squish Squash

As long as we're linking Adore era perfomances, this 20ish second clip from Crestfallen in Brussels is maybe the best I've ever heard Billy sing

the live arrangement of crestfallen is so so so so so so fucking good.... awesome song both in the studio and on the stage... keep hating idiots

[slunken]

you idiots pretend mike garson sits there for an entire show and then just plays one crazy solo

comically laughable

[Squish Squash]

Who's hating? Crestfallen is an amazing song. It got me through some really difficult times.

[slunken]

Originally Posted by ourruseoffools

the live arrangement of crestfallen is so so so so so so fucking good.... awesome song both in the studio and on the stage... keep hating idiots

was this his piano debut?

[Squish Squash]

the fashion capital of Illinois lol

[slunken]

imagine the money getting paid to hit a tambourine with a drum stick once every 12 bars by billy corgan in 1998

[slunken]

guy probably retired

[jimmy drevpile]

Originally Posted by Squish Squash

Cameron Diaz did.

eyy!

[TheAlter]

Adore era BWBW is when things really started to go to shit. It's Billy losing his touch chasing whatever the fuck he thought would keep him "successful" after the Adore (sort of) fiasco.

The way he had no problem butchering one of his all time greats with a fucken 7-string guitar just to make it palatable to nu-metal kids is chilling.

[Squish Squash]

ouruseoffools isn't gonna like that one.