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Old 06-01-2021, 05:10 AM   #31
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Brian reads the top 10 posts to big willie per day 2 this day

You’re fooling yourself if u think this forum isn’t the most heavy presence in big willies daily walk

Which is why, don’t be a dumb boring dick (like me) on here when u post

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 05:32 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by jakobtheliar View Post
What is BUIS?
"burning up in speed"
i think it was another SP messageboard

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 05:34 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Spaldz View Post
Because back in the 90's/00's everyone spoke in h4x0r / hax0r (hacker) language. So anyone who had rare material or information was 1337 / l33t (leet/elite).

Apply this to Billy's name and it would normally be b1lly. However.. because Billy has always said that "I'm your lover. I'm your zero", the joke just writes itself and b1lly becomes b0lly (0/zero)
so it's not from the gish chat? you sure?

"Hey Bolly, what is that heart or symbol on the back of Gish????"
James: "Who the hell is Bolly?"

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 08:37 AM   #34
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B0lly is definitely from the chat.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 10:59 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Cool As Ice Cream View Post
so it's not from the gish chat? you sure?

"Hey Bolly, what is that heart or symbol on the back of Gish????"
James: "Who the hell is Bolly?"
I'm spreading alternative theories. It's from the gishchat

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 11:10 AM   #36
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speed kills but b0lly lasts forever

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 11:31 AM   #37
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I agree Billy initially didn't seem to have any real engagement with the online community, I'm going to generalize but I think most musicians of his age probably didn't dive into the internet and chats, message boards, etc.

Over time Netphoria developed a reputation and then it was easy to shoot from the hip and label any discontent or criticism as coming from the "trolls" at Netphoria. And hell yeah there was some raunchy and trolling behaviour to be sure.

Particularly when the o-board 2.0, which even before Sad Machines, became an overly praise-heavy place where no dissent was tolerated. Sad Machines are just the distilled, pure version of those fans.

Billy's professed spirituality probably had an effect as well - block negative energy, bring in positive vibes. Ironically, he seemed to only get more thin-skinned.

Then yeah, Zwan falling apart, MSOTS leaving off most of the good songs and sounding like trash, TFE release and the advert on the same day saying he wanted the Smashing Pumpkins to come back, lawsuits over pretty much everything. To this day, he doesn't understand fan engagement, what fans want, how to turn leaks into positive press etc.

Plus the Strawberry stuff, Tila Tequila, falling out with Kerry Brown, deciding to put his terrible vocals up front and dropping even more consonants.

GLOW and Feelalol, car commercial, getting a 16 year old to drum for the Pumpkins. Failed promise after failed promise of the Metro show, rarities release, etc.

Tone-deaf interviews, revisionist history, delusions of grandeur. The D'arcy controversy with her "injury" and the reunion tour.

I think as time has gone on, sadly there's been more to mock than to praise, particularly with Billy personally.

When all other social media is filtered to contain only 100% positive commentary, Netphoria also seems even more like a wretched hive of scum and villany.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 12:34 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by dustrocck View Post
I agree Billy initially didn't seem to have any real engagement with the online community, I'm going to generalize but I think most musicians of his age probably didn't dive into the internet and chats, message boards, etc.

Over time Netphoria developed a reputation and then it was easy to shoot from the hip and label any discontent or criticism as coming from the "trolls" at Netphoria. And hell yeah there was some raunchy and trolling behaviour to be sure.

Particularly when the o-board 2.0, which even before Sad Machines, became an overly praise-heavy place where no dissent was tolerated. Sad Machines are just the distilled, pure version of those fans.

Billy's professed spirituality probably had an effect as well - block negative energy, bring in positive vibes. Ironically, he seemed to only get more thin-skinned.

Then yeah, Zwan falling apart, MSOTS leaving off most of the good songs and sounding like trash, TFE release and the advert on the same day saying he wanted the Smashing Pumpkins to come back, lawsuits over pretty much everything. To this day, he doesn't understand fan engagement, what fans want, how to turn leaks into positive press etc.

Plus the Strawberry stuff, Tila Tequila, falling out with Kerry Brown, deciding to put his terrible vocals up front and dropping even more consonants.

GLOW and Feelalol, car commercial, getting a 16 year old to drum for the Pumpkins. Failed promise after failed promise of the Metro show, rarities release, etc.

Tone-deaf interviews, revisionist history, delusions of grandeur. The D'arcy controversy with her "injury" and the reunion tour.

I think as time has gone on, sadly there's been more to mock than to praise, particularly with Billy personally.

When all other social media is filtered to contain only 100% positive commentary, Netphoria also seems even more like a wretched hive of scum and villany.
What's Feelalol?

This should be his Wikipedia entry btw.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 12:51 PM   #39
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He’s also mentioned people on Netphoria made brutal fun of Airplane Mode looking like a teenager and dressing like a boy.


Which is totally not true.












BTW does anyone actually know who that super casually desssed teenage boy b0lly is always hanging around with is? Anyone????

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Old 06-01-2021, 01:24 PM   #40
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Now that I think about it, he did specifically say on one of his Instagram Live videos earlier this year that the Strawtits debacle caused him to completely turn his back on the board.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 02:09 PM   #41
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What's Feelalol?

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 02:24 PM   #42
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I'm never really around here, so WTF do I know, but I vaguely remember him saying somewhere that one forum was making fun of his brother?

Maybe I'm misremembering that, or it wasn't this forum, but I'm sorta sure......

I'm guessing there are a lot of reasons though.....vbulletin boards tend to go negative w/ most things.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 03:16 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
He’s also mentioned people on Netphoria made brutal fun of Airplane Mode looking like a teenager and dressing like a boy.
Omg, poor sensitive souls. The reason people like to make fun of you is the same reason you can sell signed vinyl at a premium of $100 or have your girlfriend do pay-per-view cooking banana bread. it's called fame. Get over it.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 04:23 PM   #44
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I find it odd that people mention post 2007 things for why billy hated Netphoria.
his disdain for this place was obvious before the zeitgeist photo theft, IMO the photo theft really solidified his position into permanence- nothing after that could have changed his opinion about this place.

he must know that albums leak - ALL THE TIME. it's basically standard.
but having "fans" break into your space to leak stuff is pretty low - and to have do it for internet points is as low as it gets.
I can't think of other fan communities where I've seen this happen. It sucks.

===============

the build up of disliking Netphoria was obviously his lack of control/moderation of this place
but I imagine up until 2007 he already had a resigned "can't fight it, I'll always have some haters" opinion about hatephoria.

He knows he's got legit life fans here, and it's also a home to some pure-bred trolls. By 2002 he must have been aware that SP1 created communities of idiotic and immature narcisists. I imagine the poppy/positive zwan was an attempt to swing the pendulum the other way. IT failed. We're still here loving & hating him, but still loveing his music.


=================
I'll always suspect that putting Monte in charge of some PR stuff was his "inside joke" specifically trying to troll back @ Netphoria.
pure speculation
but it's inline with his 'inside jokes' that no one but he himself knows about, or would get even if he explained it. Billy can be dumb like that - it's cute. (he's not a comedian, he's a musician.... has billy EVER landed a joke?)

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Old 06-01-2021, 04:36 PM   #45
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People don’t wake up one day and decide to hate on their idols. It’s just a way to exorcise their genuine disappointment.

Dude went from life changing Bowie-level music to blatantly losing his touch in a glorious way, I believe.

Ffs, his last IG is 11+ min of him in what looks like a bathrobe talking about stuff you can buy. Who’s that guy again?

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 05:16 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by TheAlter View Post
People don’t wake up one day and decide to hate on their idols. It’s just a way to exorcise their genuine disappointment.

Dude went from life changing Bowie-level music to blatantly losing his touch in a glorious way, I believe.

Ffs, his last IG is 11+ min of him in what looks like a bathrobe talking about stuff you can buy. Who’s that guy again?
This is so true. I still remember how obsessed me and my friends were with the Pumpkins. I worshipped Billy and dreamed of meeting him. By the time Adore came out, I started to realize the gig was up. While I absolutely love Adore, at the time it felt like betrayal. The rock god was a hoax. Machina came out an it was the last straw. I still remember going to see them on that tour and at the end of the show I screamed at Billy and gave him the finger. Little did I know just how bad things would get going forward. How much he would betray his sound and his art.

It wasn't just his music. It was mine too.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 06:54 PM   #47
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Old 06-01-2021, 06:55 PM   #48
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i can't imagine getting that angry over MACHINA

was it the CRATE amp? the TEG acapella? what is your "major malfunction," chief?

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 08:14 PM   #49
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Billy also hated the animated Christmastime video and said it made fun of his dead mom.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 08:39 PM   #50
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-lots of fans disliked machina, didn't understand the production or the mystery of it. but that wasn't everyone.

-EVERYONE was way into Machina 2. even suggesting the album was the real album and machina 1 was made intentionally mediocre to piss off the label, while billy gave the real fans the real record for free.

-the breakup saga was a bit too much for a lot of the fans to handle.

-nearly everyone excited about Zwan.

-huge disappointment in mary star.

-billy breaks up swan.

-billy starts to blog. this is where things really get contentious.. with him throwing james and darcy under the bus. fans now feel they have the right and freedom to be critical towards billy.

-the revival of smashing pumpkins is announced. the biggest debate on the bands legacy begins and it gets ugly, and when i say ugly it gets ugly for the next few years.

-fan steals photos from rehearsal space and posts them.. huge legal threats come his way.

-fans are absolutely brutal in their criticisms and bullying and billy has no problem fighting back. it becomes a cycle of hate.

-if all goes wrong comes out and is basically a documentary of the negative reactions from the fan base on all things modern SP.. as is what the fan base wanted vs what the band wanted to do.

-jimmy leaves, and mike byrne joins. this to me was the peak of contention.

-oceania comes out and you see a returned balance of some fans loving it, some fans hating it. ever since then it's more or less been the same, with the occasional personal jab/insult pointed at WPC's way. with the addition of Facebook groups to the realm, different areas of the fanbase go to war with each other. it becomes less about the band and more about the fans and all of their own narcissism/ego's battling it out with one another.

-in conclusion, SP grows up during the invention of the internet and is probably one of the first bands to experience the dividing of the fence between fan and celebrity. some of it is great for everyone involved, some of it is terrible.

as a fan looking back and typing out this whole experience, i realize how this relationship has had a negative impact on how i and probably a lot of other fans perceived the music. for example, there is some really terrific music that came out during the whole 2007-2008 revival, and it all got buried at the fans and billy getting angry with one another. and that had a lasting effect up until recently. there are also some fans out there that are just brutal and mean, and it made me brutal and mean, a side of myself i don't like. watching that gish lifestream for example, i felt happy and nostalgic celebrating the accomplishment with billy and jimmy, but at the same time I'm seeing some of those fans in the audience and reminded of how abusive and non accepting into their circles of the community they can be, and it kind of ruins it for me as a fan.

i honestly admire anyone who never got involved with any of the online communities in the past 20 years. my good friend is one of them, and he's oblivious to all of the fan drama that's been a part of SP's story since the mid 90's.
I pretty much wrote out the exact same thing as this. It is so absolutely cemented in my mind. I really believe the Pumpkins are the first internet band in the sense that outside of a few early years my entire 25+ history as a fan is wrapped up in the internet.

 
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Old 06-01-2021, 08:44 PM   #51
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Yep, this rings true to me.

I was a regular at the first iteration of the oboard from 2000 to 2003. Netphoria was seen as a place where people hated Machina (and to some extent Adore), and Netphorians were considered vicious - not to Billy in particular but to other fans. Tbh, this was not untrue. There were some serious 4chan vibes here back in the day.

I can't remember any animosity between Netphoria and Billy at the time though. He didn't actually favor the Oboard either - he just let it be, and it became a message board that was more about the community than the pumpkins themselves. I don't get the impression he had any strong feelings about the wider online community at all.

Things were really exciting and positive for most of the Zwan era, but the loud at any volume stuff was a huge deal everywhere. I don't think Billy singled Netphoria out because of that.

Chicago songs would have been positive if Billy hadn't started his baby blue blog. That was when his relationship with fans really started to sour. By that time, I think we only had Netphoria, Zomb and BUIS? Maybe Blamo? As far as I remember, Netphoria was the only forum standing where people were actually invested in the band (as opposed to being a community of people who first came together because of the band). Basically, I think Netphoria started attracting people from the wider pumpkins/zwan community who were unhappy with Billy, MSotS, and his treatment of former members of Zwan and SP.

People didn't like TheFutureEmbrace on first listen and many no longer had the openness of heart to give it a chance. It wasn't an amazing album, but there was very little good will to begin with.

Things got even worse with Zeitgeist. The reaction to a 30s snippet of Tarantula was brutal, and Billy's reaction to the stolen photos was probably the moment when he burned all bridges here.
This is another spot on take of events as I remember them too. Hell, I still have the original 30 second Tarantula clip. lol

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 12:15 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by Copperpot5 View Post
I'm never really around here, so WTF do I know, but I vaguely remember him saying somewhere that one forum was making fun of his brother?

Maybe I'm misremembering that, or it wasn't this forum, but I'm sorta sure......

I'm guessing there are a lot of reasons though.....vbulletin boards tend to go negative w/ most things.
It was one person making fun of his brother and everyone else told him to shut the fuck up. They were messaging him on Facebook and pretending to care about him to ask questions about Billy, I believe, and then came on here to "brag" about it and then someone else called him retarded, or something like that. But yeah, he somehow thought we were all making fun of him. But that had to be about 5 years ago or something.

omg it was 10 years ago: http://forums.netphoria.org/showthre...ighlight=jesse

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 12:30 AM   #53
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Yeah I don't recall said incident, but I tapped out completely in 2008/2009. Only came back during the adore reissue and MTAE era. (Lucky me)

The problem with netpho and message boards in general, is that everything is fair game. Even when it shouldn't be.

That said, I think the people here are the truer fans.
Never really asked for that much aside from promises to be delivered.

Metro DVD anyone?
An evening with the smashing pumpkins adore documentary film?

He should be celebrating those things and release them.
Instesd, he holds onto them as their value drifts away.

His guitar tone was great in the adore and the MTAE era fwiw

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 03:58 AM   #54
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This is so true. I still remember how obsessed me and my friends were with the Pumpkins. I worshipped Billy and dreamed of meeting him. By the time Adore came out, I started to realize the gig was up. While I absolutely love Adore, at the time it felt like betrayal. The rock god was a hoax. Machina came out an it was the last straw. I still remember going to see them on that tour and at the end of the show I screamed at Billy and gave him the finger. Little did I know just how bad things would get going forward. How much he would betray his sound and his art.

It wasn't just his music. It was mine too.
Yeah i agree, things started to fall apart around ‘98. I remember seeing them on the Adore tour, they were playing the new album, which wasn’t even out yet, plus like 3-4 songs off MCIS. One was a terrible rendition of Bullet with one of those nu-metal 7-string guitars. And that was it.

It's like he wanted to walk away from a legacy that was only 3-5 years old at that point, absolutely preposterous move.

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 05:34 AM   #55
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It was one person making fun of his brother and everyone else told him to shut the fuck up. They were messaging him on Facebook and pretending to care about him to ask questions about Billy, I believe, and then came on here to "brag" about it and then someone else called him retarded, or something like that. But yeah, he somehow thought we were all making fun of him. But that had to be about 5 years ago or something.

omg it was 10 years ago: http://forums.netphoria.org/showthre...ighlight=jesse
Did not remember it was the 15k lunch with Corgan dude doing that, what is it about SP that attracts such weirdos

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 06:11 AM   #56
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Yeah i agree, things started to fall apart around ‘98. I remember seeing them on the Adore tour, they were playing the new album, which wasn’t even out yet, plus like 3-4 songs off MCIS. One was a terrible rendition of Bullet with one of those nu-metal 7-string guitars. And that was it.

It's like he wanted to walk away from a legacy that was only 3-5 years old at that point, absolutely preposterous move.
yeah man just imagine going on a tour to present your new album and actually playing music of the new album that is like just asking everyone to get pissed off absolutely groundbreaking totally unheard of what were they thinking i remember it very well the papers all put it on their front page and later he would play the timpani in 2008

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 06:21 AM   #57
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Imagine doing an album stylistically different from the previous album which was also stylistically different from the one before that.

I dunno, I like the album, but that's still a betrayal and dick move.

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 08:16 AM   #58
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yeah man just imagine going on a tour to present your new album and actually playing music of the new album that is like just asking everyone to get pissed off absolutely groundbreaking totally unheard of what were they thinking i remember it very well the papers all put it on their front page and later he would play the timpani in 2008
Excellent comprehension skills there mate




 
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Old 06-02-2021, 08:59 AM   #59
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Billy always played the "sorry I'm not your typical rock star" or "sorry I'm not the rock star you wanted". He's been saying that since 1993. He had short hair, he dressed goofy - now he's bald and dresses goofy.

But he's used that as an excuse since then. Any "normal" rock star has understood what legacy means, what fans want, and many (Ride, Slowdive) have come back and given fans what they wanted (original line ups, classic hits) and managed to make well received new albums.

Billy could do that, but he won't. Refer back to earlier point. This, I believe, is what fans and Netphoria has a problem with. Plus his new music does not have the essence of what made people like him in the first place - fuzzy guitar, melody, emotive vocals. Seriously, I'd enjoy the post-2007 material way more if he sang and produced his vocals like he did in the 90s.

But the new music is just way off. It's like if Ride came back and took the cue from Tarantula, instead of Nowhere (in reality, they did neither, and were smart enough to figure out how to make their music sound both new and vintage at the same time).

 
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Old 06-02-2021, 09:51 AM   #60
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You just mentioned one of the smartest guy in the business. Andy Bell was humble enough not to let his ego get in the way and probably made quite a fortune with Oasis. Last year's solo record is brilliant. No petty marketing campaigns, just a bandcamp page.

Imo these days Billy is no longer capable of writing and producing great music, and he seems genuinely more interested in being a businessman/impresario. Whatever floats your boat, B0lly.

Last edited by TheAlter : 06-02-2021 at 10:00 AM.

 
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