ATUM's concept is narcicistic bullshit

[Morlock]

Who really connects with it, and who cares?

First of all, I haven't studied all the lyrics, followed all plot points, etc. We know most of the stuff is really opaque and the lyrics are hard to understand, so I am basing my opinion on the very few podcasts I heard and one or two interviews. So, this is about " dangerous" artist who is exiled into space, then comes back, etc.? Where is the dangerous idea?

And the worst thing is knowing that it's sort of autobographical? For at least ten years he has been saying that he is somewhat subversive. The world does not care about Billy, doesn't think he is dangerous. What is he thinking by drawing us into his delusion of what the world thinks about him?

His music connected most when he sang about relatable experiences. Even from the most self-centered, remote experiences (being a rock star) he managed to extract what is relatable ("the world is a vampire, sent to drain"!).

The sad thing is that Billy is a smart person, and he may have interesting things to say. In a recent interview he spoke about seeing the same McDonald's sign, the same ads, but they don't mean what they used to mean because we are deconstructing this world. Why not put that sentiment into the lyrics? Or is it there?

Anyway, since he can't use his voice effectively anyway, all of this may be a moot point.

[Ihaguitar]

20 years ago people may have been interested in this concept. Now, not so much.

[Funbags]

If someone with a boxset could transcribe the story book, that would be great.

[Forgotten Child]

You mean something writing about their own experience, even when through an avatar, is narcissistic? Really?

By the way, you're wrong about the concept as well...

[Forgotten Child]

Originally Posted by Funbags

If someone with a boxset could transcribe the story book, that would be great.

here's a link to ATUM storyline and official lyrics I've been putting together. I've used scottfletcherMOTM's story transcription from Reddit.

Hopefully the embed link will work here as well

https://www.canva.com/design/DAFaSgi...blishsharelink

[LaBelle]

Are you new to Billy Corgan OP?

[paranoid]

Here's how I see the concept-->

Billy shot into space for opening his big mouth. An obsessed fan want to bring him back to earth in an effort from stopping him from disappearing for good. Billy comes back down to earth, decides the current climate is not for him, yeets himself back into space never to be seen again.

It's billy coming to terms with no longer being relevant in the current climate and being happy to just be the person/artist he is.

it's that simple. no less narcicistic than his other work.

[Morlock]

Originally Posted by LaBelle

Are you new to Billy Corgan OP?

Nope, but earlier SP didn't have that problem. It started creeping in with Machina and now we're at a point where I simply don't want to engage.

[Morlock]

Originally Posted by paranoid

Here's how I see the concept-->

Billy shot into space for opening his big mouth. An obsessed fan want to bring him back to earth in an effort from stopping him from disappearing for good. Billy comes back down to earth, decides the current climate is not for him, yeets himself back into space never to be seen again.

It's billy coming to terms with no longer being relevant in the current climate and being happy to just be the person/artist he is.

it's that simple. no less narcicistic than his other work.

But he's not been exiled. He's simply not making great music anymore. That's what I mean by delusional.

[Morlock]

Originally Posted by Forgotten Child

You mean something writing about their own experience, even when through an avatar, is narcissistic? Really?

By the way, you're wrong about the concept as well...

Yes if there is no attempt to connect. "Disarm "is about his own experience of being abused as a child. He wrote a song that spoke to many. Zero is an earlier Avatar, isn't it? Even the song "Zero" does a lot to speak to the audience.

You said I am wrong about the concept. I may well be. Care to enlighten me?

[MyKeyZ]

Billy wasn't sent away, he was ignored because he started making crap music that didn't connect with anyone. And here is returning with more crap music that doesn't connect with people. He opens his mouth and says dumb crap.

Normal people go, "Wow, that guy is insufferable. He really has his head up his own ass." and Billy wonders, "Hey, where did everyone go? Don't you want to hear my thoughts on this?" The world, "We don't." His fanatics, "It's because he's a genius."

[eviltimeban]

I always took Zero as being an extension of the Gen X aesthetic - cynical, nihilistic, jaded, sarcastic, emotionally adrift. That fits in with feeling like "nothing" which fits in with feeling like a "zero".

Also because it rhymes with "hero" but is the opposite.

[enthusaroo]

Spoiler alert: June and Shiny are Billy and Courtney Love

[MyKeyZ]

Zero being some invented character is the absolute biggest load of BS. Listen to the song Zero, and it's pretty obvious. There is no grand story. Just Billy now realizing how cringe and obsessive he was over a certain someone he thought was love at the time and needing the narrative to become something he can control. It has nothing to do with Gen X or any cultural Zeitgeist. Just some sad and awkward dude lusting over a girl and using his music as some grand gesture to express his immature love for her.

[Forgotten Child]

Originally Posted by MyKeyZ

Zero being some invented character is the absolute biggest load of BS. Listen to the song Zero, and it's pretty obvious. There is no grand story. Just Billy now realizing how cringe and obsessive he was over a certain someone he thought was love at the time and needing the narrative to become something he can control. It has nothing to do with Gen X or any cultural Zeitgeist. Just some sad and awkward dude lusting over a girl and using his music as some grand gesture to express his immature love for her.

He never said it was an "invented character", he said it was an avatar he used to express something he felt he couldn't do otherwise.

[TheAlter]

How's this for an avatar eh Billy? Fucking bullshit retcon

[eviltimeban]

Originally Posted by Forgotten Child

here's a link to ATUM storyline and official lyrics I've been putting together. I've used scottfletcherMOTM's story transcription from Reddit.

Hopefully the embed link will work here as well

[url]

I read the intro page. That is some of the most awful prose I've ever read.

[LaBelle]

Originally Posted by Morlock

Nope, but earlier SP didn't have that problem. It started creeping in with Machina and now we're at a point where I simply don't want to engage.

It was always there we just excused it easier cause the music rocked.

[ilikeplanets]

The worst part is the ending, where there's literally no resolve

33 episodes to have Shiny arrive then leave, with no impact whatsoever

[Joey Goldberg]

i always just assumed the ending was WPC laughing @ you and saying "thanks for the numbers, kid"

[TheSultanOfCyr]

I was surprised at the lack of grandeur in Atum to be honest. Mellon Collie doesn't have a story per se but it has lots of big moments and ends pretty cinematically. Machina has God in the radio, drug overdoses, car crashes, antiestablishment spiel, grief, and the gosh dang apocalypse. Atum just kinda has a bunch of people fannying about with robots and chat forums until it goes Kilroy is Here in the middle then Shiny turns up then just kind of leaves.

Where's the space adventures? Why are there Zero references abound yet nothing even suggesting anything from Machina? Where's the crazy robot battles? Where's the Shiny rock god feller defeating the government with the sheer power of rawk n roll?

Just wish there was more space stuff! Anyway at least Zodeon is dope.

[TheSultanOfCyr]

Biggest surprise of my life is hearing the first three seconds of Excelsior and then the song actually ending up being very good!

[LaBelle]

Our boy just pulled a Marvel style "Shiny will return" and you guys are complaining?!?!

[MyKeyZ]

Originally Posted by Forgotten Child

He never said it was an "invented character", he said it was an avatar he used to express something he felt he couldn't do otherwise.

And it's a load of retconning BS to get some headlines and sucker fans into listening to his latest endeavor, because he knows "Atum, The Sequel To Machina" doesn't get the clicks, the attention, nor the headlines like "Atum, The Sequel To Mellon Collie" does. This avatar BS is just another edition of Billy rewriting history after the fact since he is desperate to prove to the world what a genius he thinks he is. He namedropped Mellon Collie the same way he is namedropping Siamese Dream currently to promote the next album he's making because that gets headlines and clicks. And people keep falling for it. Billy already takes all the credit for Gish and especially Siamese Dream. And Mellon Collie is finally the album that showcased the band together as a unit, in the studio, all contributing, and now here comes Billy inventing a way to make it all about him. Notice Billy mentioned none of this nonsense in the Mellon Collie reissue. If Billy had planned it all along, he would've been telling that story over and over for years, not suddenly when he has a new album he desperately wants to sell.

[ilikeplanets]

Yeah, it would be better to have only one album like this, LaBelle

[Joey Goldberg]

Shiny Vol I had its moments and that's only been boosted by this & CYR existing

LONG LIVE SHINY I*


*the 3-4 tracks i like from it**

**information technologogoyoy

[MyKeyZ]

Screw Shiny. Where's The Oh So Bright?

[ilikeplanets]

Yeah, Shiny's bandmates were apparently meaningless in this story. SHOCKER!!

[Joey Goldberg]

Originally Posted by MyKeyZ

Screw Shiny. Where's The Oh So Bright?

i only like a portion of it so i only kept a portion of the title

[MyKeyZ]

I can't wait for Billy's final character/album... Wrinkly And The Machines Of Life Support Vol. 33: Prunes, Birdwatching, And Midday Naps.