Richard Dawkins

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Bread Regal

A lot of capitalists i've met cling to their ideology with more religious conviction than most christians theirs.

Pretty sure Omega Concern is irreligious, but that guy's full of poison ideas.

...ok? Does that mean you shouldn't criticize capitalism? Lol

[Bread Regal]

Originally Posted by Eulogy

What's with this conflation with religion in general and the specific bad things advocated by specific religions

"Not every religious person is terrible" is not a defense of religion.

In mathematics we call it "proof by counter example". I'm sure there's some latin equivalent you learned in law school.

[Bread Regal]

Originally Posted by Mooney

guns don't kill people, people kill people. give guns to children.

Mooney, please.

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Bread Regal

In mathematics we call it "proof by counter example". I'm sure there's some latin equivalent you learned in law school.

So you do think "not all religious people are terrible" is a defense of religion?

Don't think we'll get too far if that's the case.

[Bread Regal]

Originally Posted by Eulogy

I would also like answers to these questions.

Go to returnofkings.com and observe the venom they spew at women and gays without the vaguest allusion to god. Catholicism largely appeals to people's sanctimony, and they use that to retain power. It's not exclusive to religion, and it's not inherent to religion.

I've said my piece here. I'm taking a nap.

[Bread Regal]

For mooney: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_absurdum

[Mayfuck]

Originally Posted by Eulogy

I would also like answers to these questions.

****** is the one who brought up the idea that all institutions are subject to corruption and abuse and you responded by saying it's not just the bad apples within a religion that are corrupt, but that religion itself is inherently responsible for corruption.

Now you've moved beyond that by bringing up the Church's principles which is a different argument. You can disagree with their stance on gay marriage but opposing gay marriage itself isn't a form of corruption or abuse.

[Mayfuck]

Also the logical failure you're using comparing religion to capitalism. Capitalism is a specific ideology whereas there are many different types of religions that advocate many different types of things, so that's a totally nonsensical analogy.

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Bread Regal

Go to returnofkings.com and observe the venom they spew at women and gays without the vaguest allusion to god. Catholicism largely appeals to people's sanctimony, and they use that to retain power. It's not exclusive to religion, and it's not inherent to religion.

I've said my piece here. I'm taking a nap.

I didn't say it was exclusive to religion. It is certainly inherent in some religions. To deny that is basically just putting blinders on so you don't hurt religious people's feelings.

The quiverfull movement in Christianity isn't inherently misigynistic? Lol ok.

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Mayfuck

Also the logical failure you're using comparing religion to capitalism. Capitalism is a specific ideology whereas there are many different types of religions that advocate many different types of things, so that's a totally nonsensical analogy.

I didn't make the analogy for fucks sake

[Eulogy]

Why can't we look at religious ideas with the same critical eye we use to look at every other idea

That's my only real question.

[Mayfuck]

Originally Posted by Eulogy

Why can't we look at religious ideas with the same critical eye we use to look at every other idea

That's my only real question.

No one said we can't.

Do you think people have not been arguing religion for thousands of years? These criticisms and discussions happen within religions too.

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Mayfuck

No one said we can't.

Do you think people have not been arguing religion for thousands of years? These criticisms and discussions happen within religions too.

I know they do.

My point is that a lot of people use obviously bad religious ideas to bolster bad policy and opinion. If we eradicated that justification, that would be a good thing. Would people come up with other justifications? Sure. And then we should attack those.

I just don't understand why religion is such a no go for criticism. Every bad influence should be criticized. Religion should not be immune.

[Eulogy]

Recently I've been criticized in real life, very passionately by non religious people, for suggesting that it's offensive to me to identify oneself with a religion that preaches I'm going to hell for not repenting for my same sex relationship because i'm not showing enough respect for people's religious views.

Isn't that obviously insane?

[MyOneAndOnly]

it is insane.

religion should be subject to the same standards and criticism as anything else. liberals especially seem to lose their shit, though, when confronted with that idea. And their timidity when it comes to religion is why religious extremists in the USA are allowed to get away with so much awful shit.

[Bread Regal]

scotty, adults are talking.

[Elphenor]

Important to point out that there are plenty of liberal Christians, Muslims, and Jews

It's kind of all that needs to be said

[Lucky Day Spa]

lubberals lubberals lubberals

[Lucky Day Spa]

really is a dirty word for a lot of folks here huh

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Elphenor

Important to point out that there are plenty of liberal Christians, Muslims, and Jews

It's kind of all that needs to be said

No, that's not all that needs to be said. No one has said otherwise either. Goddamn.

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Bread Regal

scotty, adults are talking.

I mean sort of. At least he says what he thinks. I am kind of disappointed that you just run away when you don't know what to say.

Like "oh everyone thinks scotty is dumb so I don't have to actually defend the positions I take."

No. That is lazy. Don't do that. You're better than that.

[FoolofaTook]

Originally Posted by Disco King

Kosovo and 9/11 because "dem Mudslimes got a backward culture and kill innocents so it's only fair we break international law to kill them while we also kill innocents"

wtf? you are either trolling or dumb as fuck (no other possibilities are possible!)

nato bombed Christians to save Muslims in Kosovo. Serbs=Orthodox Christians. Kosovars: Albanian Muslims.

Fucker.

[FoolofaTook]

this makes me so fucking angrey

GODDAMN!

[MyOneAndOnly]

Originally Posted by Elphenor

Important to point out that there are plenty of liberal Christians, Muslims, and Jews

It's kind of all that needs to be said

what does that have to do with anything?

[FoolofaTook]

it's all that needs to be said, duh (kind of)

[MyOneAndOnly]

Important to point out that there are plenty of liberal [insert obvious here]
It's kind of all that needs to be said

[Elphenor]

Originally Posted by scottytheoneand

what does that have to do with anything?

Obvious point being that religion and liberalism are not mutually exclusive

So it's traditional and conservative ideas that are (mostly) bad and not religion really.

Basically a persons religion tells you nothing about them as two people can read the texts to have completely opposite meanings.

[Elphenor]

I'll take a liberal Christian over a libertarian atheist every day of the week

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Elphenor

I'll take a liberal Christian over a libertarian atheist every day of the week

And for what reason would that be

[Eulogy]

Originally Posted by Elphenor

Obvious point being that religion and liberalism are not mutually exclusive

So it's traditional and conservative ideas that are (mostly) bad and not religion really.

Basically a persons religion tells you nothing about them as two people can read the texts to have completely opposite meanings.

This isn't really true either. There are sects within the big three monotheistic religions that can tell you a lot.