I have somewhat of an apology to make (or, Calling Sleeper to this thread)

[exactlythesame]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

I don't think in terms of morals

this intrigues me. what would one think in terms of outside of morals when considering right and wrong?

[Trotskilicious]

Originally Posted by JB

when i was first told that by virtue of the fact that i'm a man, i would never understand what it's like to be a woman in this patriarchal society

if that is true, then there's no way to understand what it's like to be a man in the patriarchal society unless you are one.

[exactlythesame]

tl;dr no one can know anything about anyone else's individual circumstances

[john's ego]

but you recognize the power imbalance there.

[Charmbag]

Originally Posted by exactlythesame

this intrigues me. what would one think in terms of outside of morals when considering right and wrong?

Suffering

[Trotskilicious]

Originally Posted by john's ego

but you recognize the power imbalance there.

oh absolutely, but all those reasons i'm oppressed you picked out about me are a product of it as well

i mean i'm not devoted to trying to bring down the biggest salary and bang the most girls so i'm an outlier amongst most men. I mean even in the chat earlier what am i supposed to say to a bunch of dudes saying dames and i need to get my dick wet all this and that. You know I want to date this girl but i'm not thinking about it in terms of getting fucked, and that puts me on the outside of the patriarchal society.

acting like i'm some kind of bro that bros around with other bros and gets promotions because of my maleness is hilarious to me because it never happens, i get picked on repeatedly by male bosses and eventually it leads to conflict because i refuse to roll over. I continually have conflict in social situations with other males because typical male talk about sex and money and stuff has always made me uncomfortable. I used to think it was my problem but now I'm just deciding that I'm just not part of this whole dudebro culture.

sure i could facetiously pretend that fucking girls and getting moneys are important and gay is GROSS but why would i want to

[Charmbag]

Originally Posted by Trotskilicious

most of the black people i've known can differentiate conscious, deliberate racism with the kind of background stuff that you shouldn't judge people harshly for. For example, is casting all the avengers as white people deliberately racist or is it just a product of white culture being thoughtless and self-involved? Is SSS saying all Nepalis are wonderful and nice and caring really "racist" or just a product of some daft kid trying as hard as he can not to be the racist post colonial western tourist and still failing?

it's like how eulogy calls everyone that doesn't like gay marriage a homophobe and thinks it's appropriate to "de-friend" them on facebook. I dunno, maybe you should try and preach the cause to the fence sitters. All people who think banning gay marrage are wrong but they also aren't all evil homophobes that only have hate in their heart.

Sounds like you have a general "reduced harm" mentality when it comes to social justice which has really not worked out well for people of color, gays or women. Also, everything about how white people exist in the world is predicated on all forms of racism, whether or not you as a white person experience them as "background stuff". White people, including you and I, are accountable for all of that shit, at all times. If you're not doing anything about it then you're just sitting on a big pile of stolen money, time and resources and patting yourself on the back cause you don't say the n-word. Nah dude.

Also how is opposing gay marriage in any way not a homophobic thing to do? And in what way does Eulogy owe anyone any kindness or explanation at all? Nah dude.

[Graveflower]

See I'm being yelled at
I can't deal with it

[Trotskilicious]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

Also how is opposing gay marriage in any way not a homophobic thing to do? And in what way does Eulogy owe anyone any kindness or explanation at all? Nah dude.

definitively an inflexible, religious approach

[Charmbag]

And I don't really give a shit if you wanna be my friend when you belittle me and my politics. From a position of power. That you deny.

[Trotskilicious]

i'm right and all of you are wrong and if you don't agree then you're a heathen and i don't even need to be nice to you

[Trotskilicious]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

From a position of power. That you deny.

yeah ok whatever i give up.

[Charmbag]

These oppressed people are so inflexible when it comes to me and my oppression of them. I find it very dogmatic. Even religious, if you will.

[Trotskilicious]

mhm

[john's ego]

if i came across as saying you were some kind of bro, which i know you're not, i'm sorry.

i really want to continue this later. but i have to go to bed.

[Trotskilicious]

western white middle class women have it so bad

they can speak on behalf of all victims of oppression, since they know too what it's like to be oppressed.

[Charmbag]

Let the flailing commence

[Trotskilicious]

you're a middle class white person talking about oppression like you understand it and i don't and can never because i'm in power, it's fucking hysterical

[john's ego]

that's not really productive.

[john's ego]

this isn't a who's more oppressed pissing contest.

[Trotskilicious]

i dunno i'm in a position of power, apparently.

[Charmbag]

Originally Posted by Trotskilicious

you're a middle class white person talking about oppression it's fucking hysterical

Oppression has a particular meaning in this context to describe being on the shit side of a power gradient. It isn't about my other privileges. It's addressing patriarchy and male privilege, specifically. Just like how Eulogy, a white economically privileged male, is oppressed in a homophobic society. In that one regard.

[Trotskilicious]

yet i'm in a position of power, with my entirely misunderstood mental illness and my inability to cooperate/identify with "alpha males" and all

[Charmbag]

Just like how Barack Obama, Harvard-educated, wealthy, straight male and PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, is oppressed by a racist society.

[Trotskilicious]

right but i'm not oppressed by anyone, anywhere, ever

[john's ego]

we already acknowledged that you're oppressed.

the golden rule applies here, you know.

[Trotskilicious]

i'm not oppressing anyone i'm just saying stop being ugly

[Trotskilicious]

I mean how do you think MLK or Gandhi would react to the idea that "if they don't agree with you then they don't even deserve kindness."

[john's ego]

if you try to lessen the magnitude of someone's experience with prejudice or oppression, you are doing so from a perspective of privilege.

[Trotskilicious]

if you try to lessen the magnitude of someone's experience with prejudice or oppression,

but that's exactly what charmbag is doing?