do you ever watch porn with your significant other?

[Fellatio Mask!]

stop threatening to kill my cat julio

[Fellatio Mask!]

look how white they are julio you stupid fat idiot retard

[Fellatio Mask!]

who even cares you patriarchal dickshitsuck

[null123]

are you accusing me of being julio or is this something else

[Fellatio Mask!]

hi i'm sean and i'm genderqueer and i'm sigining off and goignt o sleep
can't wait until you text me or post some dipshithead reply that i'm going to ignore because haha i just don't get it

[Fellatio Mask!]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

are you accusing me of being julio or is this something else

julio texted me about my replies in this thread and said he was gonna kill my cat and i can't post on hipinion anymore so this was the only way to get his attention since i don't want to go over my text limit

anyway i wanted this to be my last post ITT so here it is again

"hi i'm sean and i'm genderqueer and i'm sigining off and goignt o sleep
can't wait until you text me or post some dipshithead reply that i'm going to ignore because haha i just don't get it "

[null123]

windfucker had a Sasha Grey avatar because he was/is oblivious to his male privilege. he's a Nice Guy choosey choice funfeminist supporter who should take his act to Jezebel

[cocksure]

porn sucks

[Trotskilicious]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

windfucker had a Sasha Grey avatar because he was/is oblivious to his male privilege. he's a Nice Guy choosey choice funfeminist supporter who should take his act to Jezebel

so he's doing it to get laid then

[sickbadthing]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

OK I'm back in this thread. I really wanted to give a full reply because I respect your request for an explanation. My hesitation to "debate" is due to a few things. The main reason is that porn, like many "choice"/"agency" feminist type issues, is about context. In order to discuss these issues, we have to agree about what kind of world we're living in. It's unlikely that at this point in time we see eye-to-eye on this, for one because you seem to deny the terrible rape culture we live in. If you really think a single correlation study (that can be explained away by about a million things) is anything but an outlier in the mountain of data that is daily life on planet earth, then I don't think there's a lot to talk about. So I'm just gonna leave this post here and you can take it or leave it. What you describe as women "having far from a fair shake", I describe as patriarchy, a fundamentally oppressive system that pervades basically everything about public and private and internal emotional life.

You assumed a few things about my opinion on porn that I'd like to clear up. Basically I don't believe that porn directly causes rape. I don't think it is the fundamental cause of objectification or of the reduction of women to a sex-class. Instead it is a reinforcement of this status quo, a reinforcement of the position of women, of rape culture, of men's domination over women. It validates men's preexisting sense of entitlement to the consumption of women's bodies. And it's consumed by most men every day.

Porn reinforces racist ideas too and even though I think that is a separate issue, it somehow seems to clarify the issue for some people. We don't think blackface performance causes racism - it's a symptom not the cause - but we (hopefully) don't want to live in a world where minstrel shows are okay, where people become numb to degradation and injustice.

You brought up the fact that "some women like performing in porn". This is the crux of the most fundamental split between radical feminists and the more typical liberal feminism you might come across today. Choice, especially when it comes to what gets people off, gets held up as the ultimate manifestation of freedom from oppression. To this I say that all choices are made in the context of a fundamentally oppressive and degrading culture. Women aren't born performing femininity. We aren't born pouring for the camera, suppressing our anger, hating our bodies, and having a distaste for science and politics. But many people including many "feminists" hold our ability to "choose" to be these things above all else, as if they are totally natural inborn expressions of who we really are as individual women.

Why is porn like it is? Porn is created for men, and men are its primary consumers. I don't want to talk about the platonic ideal of what porn could be - I'm talking about what turns up if you just go to redtube.com or whatever, the porn men are actually consuming. Why is that porn predicated on dominating women? Why is it that men's fantasies about women seem to be about the reinforcement of rape myths? About violence, humiliation and degradation? Because these ideas about women are alive and well. I could go into more detail here but I think I'll leave it at that.

The fast and furious reaction to vixnix's opposition to porn illustrates the fact that porn = sex in society now. Somehow if you reject porn, an objectifying fantasy of sex that fetishizes coercion, designed entirely by and for men without the involvement of women in our own portrayal, that means you are repressed or have issues with sex.

Whoa brainiac you got me all confused. I was beating off to part of that post but falling asleep to most of it. If it wasn't degrading and racist what good would it be and what guy would want to jack off to a bunch of ugly hags talking about their feelings

GROW UP

[null123]

weird i totally thought sickbadthing would have my back with that post

[reprise85]

good post Charmbag. some things to think about. ty

[lala]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

weird i totally thought sickbadthing would have my back with that post

i respect your opinion but i disagree with most of it.

[redbreegull]

Charmbag, not all porn is like that though. Some is, yes, but there is an increasing amount of "arty" porn that disregards paternalistic, hardcore traditions.

[Fellatio Mask!]

did you guys like in boogie nights where they talk about getting some saturday night beaver

[duovamp]

Originally Posted by Charmbag

Porn is created for men, and men are its primary consumers.

I'd like to think of porn as being more of a capital good.

[Dead Frequency]

Is the desire to be alone sexually healthy

[reprise85]

it can be or it can not be, it depends on why and how you go about avoiding it if you do

[cocksure]

charmbag brings up some good points but ultimately i disagree with her. i think some of her premises are wrong (i guess we don't "agree on the world we're living in") and she's too deductive in her reasoning.
i have nothing against couples filming themselves having sex and somehow getting off on the idea that other people are jacking off to them.
i do think that porn is a waste of time, that it can be addictive and that it just keeps reiterating how important sex is. it's really not. and having sex with an open mind seems much more valuable to me than trying to live up to some unrealistic ideal.

[rottenugly]

Why watch porn when you can be with your "significant other."?

[Fellatio Mask!]

Originally Posted by cocksure

i have nothing against couples filming themselves having sex and somehow getting off on the idea that other people are jacking off to them.

this is amateur porn which if you aren't watching for redbreegull's reasons probably isn't as bad as the creepy gross porn industry
i mean thats how i justify it to myself

i own a cassette by sasha grey's noise group

[Order 66]

porn is all i have left in life

[Order 66]

np: sunny lane at the gloryhole

[redbreegull]

Originally Posted by rottenugly

Why watch porn when you can be with your "significant other."?

masturbation is a natural, healthy activity even when a partner is available. It's like sexual alone time.

Originally Posted by Fellatio Mask!

this is amateur porn which if you aren't watching for redbreegull's reasons probably isn't as bad as the creepy gross porn industry
i mean thats how i justify it to myself

It is appealing to me for the same reasons, despite eulogy's insistence that it must be the thought of watching someone without her knowledge that is satisfying.

[cocksure]

why assume some psychological tendenc y ijn people youve never met whats the point i mean rly

[null123]

Originally Posted by cocksure

charmbag brings up some good points but ultimately i disagree with her. i think some of her premises are wrong (i guess we don't "agree on the world we're living in")

I'm sure we don't

it just keeps reiterating how important sex is. it's really not. and having sex with an open mind seems much more valuable to me than trying to live up to some unrealistic ideal.

this is an important point

[MyOneAndOnly]

charmbag, is Japanese porn (where the woman cries the whole time and whines and says "no no no" in Japanese) just really the same thing as that hardcore Rape Porn (where a couple of duds just pound on a woman while she cries and screams)?

what about Femdom? Seems like objectification of men.

what about gay male porn. is that objectifying men?

[slunken]

Originally Posted by Fellatio Mask!

this is amateur porn which if you aren't watching for redbreegull's reasons probably isn't as bad as the creepy gross porn industry
i mean thats how i justify it to myself

i own a cassette by sasha grey's noise group

on another board i frequent there's this dude that has a couple noise projects (no one major though so i'm not trying to be elusive) and he posted a bunch of mypsace messages from sasha talking about his music and noise music in general idk it's like 3 really long private messages. pretty hilarious i'll see if i can find them in the next couple days.