Voting Fraud

[rolmos]

Post all your articles and comments on voting fraud. This way, once McCain wins, we can save ourselves all the "WHY?WTF?" posts.


http://wvgazette.com/News/200810180251

More W.Va. voters say machines are switching votes
In six cases, Democratic votes flipped to GOP
WINFIELD, W.Va. -- Three Putnam County voters say electronic voting machines changed their votes from Democrats to Republicans when they cast early ballots last week.

This is the second West Virginia county where voters have reported this problem. Last week, three voters in Jackson County told The Charleston Gazette their electronic vote for "Barack Obama" kept flipping to "John McCain".

In both counties, Republicans are responsible for overseeing elections. Both county clerks said the problem is isolated.

They also blamed voters for not being more careful.

"People make mistakes more than machines," said Jackson County Clerk Jeff Waybright.

[...]

[Andrew_Pakula]

Why isn't elections in the U.S. run by an independent non-partisan group/agency?

For example in Canada elections are run by Elections Canada, they are an independent, non-partisan agency that reports directly to Parliament. They oversee the voter list for all Canadian citizens and administer elections in a uniform way so that it is consistent across the whole country.

[Travis Meeks]

it's embarrassing

[ravenguy2000]

Originally Posted by Andrew_Pakula

Why isn't elections in the U.S. run by an independent non-partisan group/agency?

You make it sound like we care about letting everyone vote, letting everyone vote accurately, and then counting their votes accurately.

[redbreegull]

Originally Posted by Andrew_Pakula

Why isn't elections in the U.S. run by an independent non-partisan group/agency?

For example in Canada elections are run by Elections Canada, they are an independent, non-partisan agency that reports directly to Parliament. They oversee the voter list for all Canadian citizens and administer elections in a uniform way so that it is consistent across the whole country.

The power to hold elections is held by the states, not the federal government here.

[redbull]

nimrod to thread

[Andrew_Pakula]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtwZSF7uQLw

[better than new]

Originally Posted by Andrew_Pakula

Why isn't elections in the U.S. run by an independent non-partisan group/agency?

For example in Canada elections are run by Elections Canada, they are an independent, non-partisan agency that reports directly to Parliament. They oversee the voter list for all Canadian citizens and administer elections in a uniform way so that it is consistent across the whole country.

Whoa, whoa buddy. This is America we INVENTED democracy and everyone should do it our way.

[Nimrod's Son]

ACORN says hello

[Caine Walker]

tell them i never got my cigarettes that they promised me. bastards.

[Debaser]

Hey remember this issue? What other thread was this in?

MI Republicans Admit to Illegal Foreclosure Scheme, “Surrender” to Democrats

[Nimrod's Son]

Do you have a link to a real site or just someone's blog? I can't even find any sources linked

[Debaser]

Originally Posted by Nimrod's Son

ACORN says hello

There's a difference between voter fraud and registration fraud. One undermines democracy, the other is a nuisance.


Josh Marshall:
I’ve always had questions about whether this is a good way to do voter registration. And Democratic campaigns usually keep their distance. But here’s the key. This is fraud against ACORN. They end up paying people for more registering people then they eventually signed up. If you register me three times to vote, the registrar will see two new registrations of an already registered person and the ones won’t count. If I successfully register Mickey Mouse to vote, on election day, Mickey Mouse will still be a cartoon character who cannot go to the local voting station and vote. Logically speaking there’s very little way a few phony names on the voting rolls could be used to commit vote fraud. And much more importantly, numerous studies and investigations have shown no evidence of anything more than a handful of isolated casing of actual instances of vote fraud.

[Debaser]

Originally Posted by Nimrod's Son

Do you have a link to a real site or just someone's blog? I can't even find any sources linked

the commenters on the blog asked for another source:

http://michiganmessenger.com/6644/de...-voter-lawsuit

it's a he-said, she-said. The Repubs still flatly deny it. But the fact that the Repubs chose to settle the case instead of fighting it says something.

[Nimrod's Son]

Originally Posted by Debaser

If I successfully register Mickey Mouse to vote, on election day, Mickey Mouse will still be a cartoon character who cannot go to the local voting station and vote. Logically speaking there’s very little way a few phony names on the voting rolls could be used to commit vote fraud.

What the fuck? If I register as Mickey Jones and then show up to vote, I don't have to show ID. I get to vote. Nobody questions me, they cross me off their list. So yes, 'Mickey Mouse' remains fictional, but whomever registered as that can go right down and cast a ballot.

That quote is beyond stupid.

[Nimrod's Son]

Originally Posted by Debaser

the commenters on the blog asked for another source:

http://michiganmessenger.com/6644/de...-voter-lawsuit

it's a he-said, she-said. The Repubs still flatly deny it. But the fact that the Repubs chose to settle the case instead of fighting it says something.

We've been over this before... the Michigan Messenger is still a shitty source. This is about as fair:
http://www.newuniversity.org/main/ar...n_the_magic166

Trouble in the Magic Kingdom
by Patrick Ross
Volume 42, Issue 5 | Oct 20 2008
Voter fraud is an endemic and prolific problem in contested states and predominantly affects Republicans. Democrats use the same, empty rhetorical trick to facilitate it: race baiting. Meanwhile, groups like the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN) generate thousands of fictional voters (among them a Mr. Mickey Mouse) in poor areas, throwing up a smoke screen of “Republican racism” to conceal their tactics.
The first time anything remotely racist surfaced in the primaries was when Hillary Clinton’s supporters accused Barack Obama of being a drug dealer, and Obama himself introduced race into the presidential campaign by claiming, falsely and tautologically, that Republicans were obsessed with race. The same tired, half-century-old rhetoric is still the Democrats’ big philosophical gun, primarily because their redistributive politics simply won’t play to an American audience. They have to cloak their policies in civil rights rhetoric to give them weight. However, Democrats have also mastered the racist charge to such a degree that, among other crimes, it functions as a shield for voter fraud.
Recently, a story in the Michigan Messenger (an arm of The Center for Independent Media, an organization for establishing “progressive” – or more accurately “liberal” – investigative blogs in particular states that employs writers from “The New Republic,” among other leftist outlets) claimed that Republicans were attempting to suppress “black voters” by challenging voter registrations from foreclosed homes in Macomb County.
The Messenger had to emend its article because the author misrepresented a Republican official from Michigan. The official told the author that, with increased foreclosures, some registrations would have to be checked because voters may no longer live in the districts they claim to live in. Under Michigan law, an individual is allowed 60 days to vote in his or her district after losing their home. The official did not state that the Republicans were targeting a particular demographic; rather, they would challenge potentially fraudulent ballots across the board and within the law.
The racist charge magically appeared in the article, and it’s because liberal tort-abusing lawyers (the political equivalents of ambulance chasers) will jump on an accusation of racism like red meat. The paper’s intent, I suspect, was to flood the local courts with lawsuits from lawyers claiming a violation of the Voting Rights Act. In other words, groups like the Michigan Messenger take a mundane attempt to stop fraudulent voting, drum up the racist rhetoric and succeed in tainting the issue, falsely, as a violation of minority voting rights.
So Democrats want people who don’t live in a particular district to count as voters? Apparently so, as their congressmen don’t even have to live in the districts that they represent. For example, Democrat Robert Wexler of Florida’s 19th district resides in a Maryland suburb.
Speaking of Florida, guess who ACORN (which endorsed Obama in the primaries, and whom he once represented in a lawsuit) registered in Orlando? Mickey Mouse. The Magic Kingdom is in that district though, so I’m not sure how Republicans will go about suppressing his vote. ACORN also registered the starting lineup of the Dallas Cowboys in Nevada! Of course, with African-American players Terrell Owens and Marion Barber, the Republicans will be all over this one.
There’s also the issue of having legal identification. For instance, in 2004, Jesse Jackson claimed that Georgia’s anti-fraud laws, which required voters to show identification, were racist. Similar controversy exists in this election. Democrats wouldn’t want a voter to have to prove he’s Mickey Mouse, would they? These incidents are only microcosms of a larger and more virulent issue. In the short term, there are electoral consequences in swing states (1,500 fraudulent ACORN registrants in Philadelphia alone, for instance), but the long-term effects of such shenanigans are more insidious.
Leftist groups engage in guerilla vote-fraud tactics from the ground up. Indeed, the race issue has become a formidable tool for swaying voters toward leftist politics from their early years. It begins in the schools; liberal intellectuals have systematically embraced Marxist criticism as the paramount perspective from which to practice every discipline. Furthermore, they have succeeded in conflating leftism with anti-racism when no such connection is inherent.
From literature to linguistics to environmental science, professors link free market economics to racism. They are, of course, mutually exclusive in principle. While perversions of the constitution and free markets have suppressed minorities, the zeitgeist has shifted since the 1960s (that is the extent to which individuals here and abroad believe one is better or worse because of race). In other words, “racism,” as a pervasive philosophy, has declined. Thus, perversions exist to a much lesser extent, while opportunity and representation grow steadily for minorities.
You won’t hear that in the classroom of course, and that’s because there’s something in it for every liberal. Funding, grants, positions, scholarships, disciplines and entire schools have been manufactured by a movement for redistributive economics. This movement underlies the efforts of ACORN, which seeks to prop up the Democratic Party with fraudulent votes and a mantle of false racial empathy.
The real voter suppression is, in that sense, on the left. Laughably overt and illegal moves like registering Mickey Mouse to vote only scratch the surface. So long as Democrats succeed in labeling free market economics with an inherently racist philosophy, they will be able to suppress conservatism. One can only hope that people will see through the race baiting as it becomes more desperate; maybe then they’ll notice the donkey in the room.

[Nimrod's Son]

See, this is the type of source I would accept. Michigan Messenger put out as an independent source? Really.

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...405/1409/METRO

Monday, October 20, 2008
Dems, GOP settle foreclosure lawsuit

Jim Lynch / The Detroit News

DETROIT -- Democrats have agreed to settle their federal lawsuit alleging Michigan Republicans planned to use foreclosure information to keep some residents from voting Nov. 4, but debate continues over whether such a plan existed.
Several Democratic groups sued state and Macomb County Republicans last month after learning of an alleged plan to contest voters at the polls if their homes have been foreclosed on. A statement released today by representatives of those Democratic groups indicates the two sides have reached a settlement that ends the lawsuit, but the statement indicated Republicans did have a foreclosure plan in place.
On Monday, state Republican officials restated their position that not such program was ever considered or planned.


According to Bill Nowling, spokesman for the Michigan GOP, the settlement reads:
"Obama for America, the Democratic National Committee and individual Macomb County residents have alleged that the Republican National Committee, the Michigan Republican Party and the Macomb County Republican Party were planning to use foreclosure lists to challenge certain voters on Election Day.
"The Republicans have denied the allegations and have stated that they never intended to challenge voters based on any such list. To clarify the matter for all voters, all parties are pleased that they agree that the existence of a person's address on a foreclosure list does not provide a reasonable basis for challenging the person's eligibility to vote and that none of these parties will challenge any voter's eligibility on that basis."
In September, Macomb County Republican Party Chairman James Carabelli was quoted in an online news publication saying conservatives planned to have staffers at the polls armed with foreclosure lists to ensure those no longer living at the correct addresses don't vote. Carabelli has steadfastly denied making the statement or have any such plans to do so.
Members of the state Republican Party backed Carabelli, saying there had never been any plans to use foreclosure lists.
A morning release from the Michigan Democratic Party appears to have been issued in conjunction with Republican groups including the Republican National Committee, the Michigan Republican Party and the Macomb County Republican Party.
"Today's settlement protects the voting rights of all Michigan citizens and guarantees that Republicans cannot use foreclosure lists to deny or challenge anyone's right to vote," said Mark Brewer, Michigan's Democratic Party Chairman, in Monday's statement. "It is no surprise the Republicans back-pedaled when their illegal scheme was revealed, and their surrender today ensures that Republicans cannot take advantage of the economic crisis to deny anyone's voting rights."
Nowling said nothing about the settlement ever included acknowledgment of a foreclosure plan.
"That is completely and utterly false," Nowling said. "They made it up."
Foreclosure could make a voter ineligible in a precinct if he or she has moved to a location outside the area more than 60 days prior. But a list of foreclosures would not necessarily provide poll watchers with all the information they need. Someone who has been foreclosed on may still be living in the home or they might have relocated to another residence inside the same voting district.
You can reach Jim Lynch at (586) 468-0520 or jlynch@detnews.com.

[rolmos]

This isn't voter fraud, but is despicable and fits the general theme of this thread:

GOP using foreclosure list to purge voters

[KrazeeStacee]

Originally Posted by Nimrod's Son

ACORN says hello

Unfortunately ACORN deals with voter REGISTRATION, therefore if there were any fraud it would be considered voter REGISTRATION fraud, not voter fraud...which are two totally different things. If they were to throw out the documents that had the invalid names on them, such as Mickey Mouse or Tony Romo, then it would've been voter fraud.

But you still get an A for effort!

[KrazeeStacee]

Oh, I see I'm not the only one with this incredibly hard to understand piece of information...right on, Debaser.

[Future Boy]

Yeah Nim, its only fraud if votes are actually cast, who cares about all the shoddy registrations, like so:

[Nimrod's Son]

Originally Posted by KrazeeStacee

Unfortunately ACORN deals with voter REGISTRATION, therefore if there were any fraud it would be considered voter REGISTRATION fraud, not voter fraud...which are two totally different things. If they were to throw out the documents that had the invalid names on them, such as Mickey Mouse or Tony Romo, then it would've been voter fraud.

But you still get an A for effort!

Yep, there's no chance any of those multiple-times registered people would vote since you don't need to show ID.

[Nimrod's Son]

Originally Posted by rolmos

This isn't voter fraud, but is despicable and fits the general theme of this thread:

GOP using foreclosure list to purge voters

Super title and spin by CNN, considering the only source is the "online paper" the Michigan Messenger... who is now being sued by the very same people they quoted in the cockamamie story to begin with.

[Nimrod's Son]

Originally Posted by Future Boy

Yeah Nim, its only fraud if votes are actually cast, who cares about all the shoddy registrations, like so:

Funny where is CNN on this

[Nimrod's Son]

Why isn't Debaser all up in arms? I guess it's ok when you agree with the cheaters' candidate?

[Nimrod's Son]

[Starla]

I thought if you had no address to claim, you can still be given a provisional ballot?

[Debaser]

I'm not a legal expert, but so far that's just smoke. Go back and listen to what the prosecutor said: you can't vote in Ohio if you consider yourself to be a temporary resident. That's a caveat that you cannot verify until you actually see the workers that did not withdraw their names move out of state. The ones that did withdraw their names, obviously are planning to move out of the state when the election is over. The ones that did not withdraw -- you don't know what they are going to do. It is an assumption by that reporter that those Obama campaigners are temporary residents -- if after the election, those campaigners stay in Ohio, then they did nothing wrong.

[Debaser]

so this is basically the college version of foxnews huh

[Debaser]

i wonder how much resources did they put in to investigate mccain volunteers for the same thing. and by the way, this has absolutely nothing to do with ACORN.