Secret Show, Berlin (6/5/07) - Page 8

tcm · 06-05-2007, 04:43 PM

Gershwin79 said here that Shame was the new version.

Axis of Action · 06-05-2007, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcm

Gershwin79 said here that Shame was the new version.

Thank you sir. I should have read a little closer.

tcm · 06-05-2007, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gershwin79

and here's the official setlist:

http://www.smashingpumpkins.com/gall...lin_060507.jpg

hmm. notice the line at the bottom. the only other setlist they've posted that has one of those separating lines at the bottom is the Paris one, which we know originally had a third encore.

http://www.smashingpumpkins.com/gall...paris22may.jpg

tcm · 06-05-2007, 04:49 PM

then again, this is the only setlist without any encores, so maybe the first line is just there by default... probably shouldn't read anything into it.

RenewRevive · 06-05-2007, 04:50 PM

zeitgeist mystery commencing.

Gershwin79 · 06-05-2007, 04:53 PM

Well, i think for Billy it's his songs and the band is his idea. He wrote all those songs and when I saw him today I had the feeling again that they mean a lot to him, like when he talked about daydream today. You know, it's his music, his lyrics and the sound is just his style and it's actually his music which makes the Pumpkins different from all the other bands, I mean their sound was always a bit different from the mainstream. I can somehow understand him, he probably thought the thing is over and he has to try new stuff but when he had Zwan and TFE he tried to do other things but failed somehow.

Today he said: "When the band broke up in 2000, I mean we already knew it would in 1999 but I couldn't help it..."

We all know about the things with him being the tyrant and the evil bandmembers but somehow I have the feeling it is his music and his feelings (people who write songs themselves might know what I'm talking about) and it's hard to be someone else or make something different if you feel and play in another way.

I don't want to compare myself to BC but I had the same problems. Had a nice band, we went along well. I wrote all of the songs, then one member had to leave and the other just wasn't into it anymore because he wanted to try something different. Ok, got 2 new people, didn't know them as well and sooner or later it gets kinda complicated. You have your songs you wrote and love yourself and you want to play them. so what you do is tell the new ones how the song works and what they have to do. and you already fixed all the details in the years before with the other members who brought in their own input even if it was small, like a break at one point which gives you a new idea or something like that.

and you start to tell them "ok, and when we come to this part you do this, and then you do that." and you already ARE the tyrant. you bring some new songs as well. notice that the others already have the feeling that you try to tell them what to do all the time and it kinda gets really hard to integrate them because in the beginning you hired them, you teach them and they enter a group of people who are friends for years already and feel kinda left out.

This was when I lost my first band years ago. I know it's not the same and I'm not BC neither were we the SP but something like that is a really problematic situation and the more people you have to change the more complicated it gets.

James and D'Arcy were always just playing along, then they dropped Jimmy, he came back, D'Arcy left, then James. I can understand that Billy wants to make HIS music and have HIS band, it's just that people got used to D'Arcy and James and like them but they are not the heart within the songs.

theeggofhope · 06-05-2007, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sppunk

I think the birth and/or resurrection of Jesus Christ overshadows a concert, man.

maybe in your mind...

ordinary apathy · 06-05-2007, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RenewRevive

darcy is the new elvis, except she's alive and not fat.

QFT

bawbageo · 06-05-2007, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlphaCentauri

thank god they left bullet out. thank god.

Not really a fan of that song... but having downloaded the Rock AM Ring gig, that version kinda tickled.

Bursting to hear Crush and Drown from this show.

God Bless.

RenewRevive · 06-05-2007, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gershwin79

Well, i think for Billy it's his songs and the band is his idea. He wrote all those songs and when I saw him today I had the feeling again that they mean a lot to him, like when he talked about daydream today. You know, it's his music, his lyrics and the sound is just his style and it's actually his music which makes the Pumpkins different from all the other bands, I mean their sound was always a bit different from the mainstream.

James and D'Arcy were always just playing along, then they dropped Jimmy, he came back, D'Arcy left, then James. I can understand that Billy wants to make HIS music and have HIS band, it's just that people got used to D'Arcy and James and like them but they are not the heart within the songs.

this was a pretty good post and i edited out your analogy due to its size, but your point was valid.

james' own music, both solo and within the pumpkins was very different to billy's, apparently not at all influenced by him and with his antipathetic persona it was hard to gauge just how into corgan's music he, or darcy actually was. i think people natuarally like to pidgeonhole roles for band members, whether this has any bearing to reality or not. james appeared more laid back and likeable than billy, for sure.

Corganist · 06-05-2007, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axis of Action

I think we've all known this for sometime, there had just been a flicker of hope that maybe Ginger and Jeff would stick around for more than a tour.

I kinda liken Ginger and Jeff to the sort of role Matt Walker played when he was in the band. He was kinda a faceless replacement type at first too, but he was with the band for quite a while, developed great live chemistry with them and even played on most of Adore. By the end I'm pretty sure the drummer job was his to keep if he wanted it (at least until Jimmy wanted to come back), but he left on his own terms before the Adore tour. I imagine if all goes well Ginger and Jeff will probably be able to play with Billy and Jimmy as long as they'd like.

theeggofhope · 06-05-2007, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corganist

I kinda liken Ginger and Jeff to the sort of role Matt Walker played when he was in the band. He was kinda a faceless replacement type at first too, but he was with the band for quite a while, developed great live chemistry with them and even played on most of Adore. By the end I'm pretty sure the drummer job was his to keep if he wanted it (at least until Jimmy wanted to come back), but he left on his own terms before the Adore tour. I imagine if all goes well Ginger and Jeff will probably be able to play with Billy and Jimmy as long as they'd like.

don't forget TheFutureEmbrace tour....Matt was cool as hell he stopped and talked to us for a little before one of the NYC shows, he said standing up and playing the eletric drum kit was fuckin up his back, and at the Boston show I was standing right in front of the stage and rocking out with matt all show, he tried to give me the drums sticks at the end of the concert, but I was getting mobbed by a crowd and he couldn't get them to me, I just laughed it off though and let the other people have em...

tcm · 06-05-2007, 05:33 PM

Billy should of let Matt sit, what a fucking tyrant.

wHATcOLOR · 06-05-2007, 05:40 PM

i need a moment to catch my breath. this uncharacteristically less than impeccable grammar from ted has me flummoxed, unless he's using a schtick

Steve Holt · 06-05-2007, 05:41 PM

i don't really care if Ginger and Jeff are permanent members or not. if they are, great. if they're just touring members, great.

can't fucking believe they pulled Daydream out!

dudehitscar · 06-05-2007, 05:44 PM

CRYING TREE OF MERCURY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!! AWESOME!

CRUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! My 2nd favorite off Gish

Daydream should be interesting without the strings and corgan singing.

Can't wait to hear this bootleg.

million_watts · 06-05-2007, 05:54 PM

listening to show atm. sounds tight. tarantula solo by billy is THE shit. lies have been burnt.

tcm · 06-05-2007, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wHATcOLOR

i need a moment to catch my breath. this uncharacteristically less than impeccable grammar from ted has me flummoxed, unless he's using a schtick

'twas indeed a schtick, sir. no trouble at all.

genia. · 06-05-2007, 05:54 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21_XGaOvrag

A minute of Daydream i recorded. Enjoy

firewoman · 06-05-2007, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by genia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21_XGaOvrag

A minute of Daydream i recorded. Enjoy

wow much thanks for this!

Gossamer · 06-05-2007, 06:06 PM

Wow that was great.

Thanks Genia.

million_watts · 06-05-2007, 06:07 PM

and before i forget, best quote of the night:

"we named taratula in honor of the great german band scorpions" *crowd laughs* "you're laughing, but i'm serious. [...] everytime i listen to 'wind of change' a wall inside of me falls."

Gossamer · 06-05-2007, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by million_watts

listening to show atm. sounds tight. tarantula solo by billy is THE shit. lies have been burnt.

wait did you record it or what?

MisterSquishyHalo · 06-05-2007, 06:16 PM

It sucks, but It still doesnt take away my feeling that they will have a hand in new music at the residencies.

Maybe its still too soon for them to be considered slam dunk pumpkins? Maybe that won't happen until they create music AS pumpkins, that we can officially proclaim it

MisterSquishyHalo · 06-05-2007, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corganist

I kinda liken Ginger and Jeff to the sort of role Matt Walker played when he was in the band. He was kinda a faceless replacement type at first too, but he was with the band for quite a while, developed great live chemistry with them and even played on most of Adore. By the end I'm pretty sure the drummer job was his to keep if he wanted it (at least until Jimmy wanted to come back), but he left on his own terms before the Adore tour. I imagine if all goes well Ginger and Jeff will probably be able to play with Billy and Jimmy as long as they'd like.

In total agreement. I think this might be a trail process, and we will see where they will contribute at the residencies.

Martyr · 06-05-2007, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by genia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21_XGaOvrag

A minute of Daydream i recorded. Enjoy

nice. very very nice.

dudehitscar · 06-05-2007, 06:21 PM

I think it's great that corgan is sticking with his random acoustic concerts idea he's been doing for a while. They always turn out great... Except for the machina era(Storytellers sucked).

His acoustic show in Australia for the TFE tour was great too.

caliphornia · 06-05-2007, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by genia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21_XGaOvrag

A minute of Daydream i recorded. Enjoy

this sounds great.

davin · 06-05-2007, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by somaziro

they are probably just touring musicians

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gossamer

Yeah that's kind of upsetting actually.

give it time. no matter how you label ginger and jeff, it was still just BC and JC on this album.

but next album, who knows...if everyone is happy and getting along....

MisterSquishyHalo · 06-05-2007, 06:48 PM

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06-05-2007, 04:43 PM	#211
tcm Braindead Location: Le look de Corgan Posts: 17,924	Gershwin79 said here that Shame was the new version.

06-05-2007, 04:49 PM	#214
tcm Braindead Location: Le look de Corgan Posts: 17,924	then again, this is the only setlist without any encores, so maybe the first line is just there by default... probably shouldn't read anything into it.

06-05-2007, 04:50 PM	#215
RenewRevive Apocalyptic Poster Location: Ex-Netphoria Legends Football champion Posts: 4,523	zeitgeist mystery commencing.

06-05-2007, 04:53 PM	#216
Gershwin79 Pledge Posts: 60	Well, i think for Billy it's his songs and the band is his idea. He wrote all those songs and when I saw him today I had the feeling again that they mean a lot to him, like when he talked about daydream today. You know, it's his music, his lyrics and the sound is just his style and it's actually his music which makes the Pumpkins different from all the other bands, I mean their sound was always a bit different from the mainstream. I can somehow understand him, he probably thought the thing is over and he has to try new stuff but when he had Zwan and TFE he tried to do other things but failed somehow. Today he said: "When the band broke up in 2000, I mean we already knew it would in 1999 but I couldn't help it..." We all know about the things with him being the tyrant and the evil bandmembers but somehow I have the feeling it is his music and his feelings (people who write songs themselves might know what I'm talking about) and it's hard to be someone else or make something different if you feel and play in another way. I don't want to compare myself to BC but I had the same problems. Had a nice band, we went along well. I wrote all of the songs, then one member had to leave and the other just wasn't into it anymore because he wanted to try something different. Ok, got 2 new people, didn't know them as well and sooner or later it gets kinda complicated. You have your songs you wrote and love yourself and you want to play them. so what you do is tell the new ones how the song works and what they have to do. and you already fixed all the details in the years before with the other members who brought in their own input even if it was small, like a break at one point which gives you a new idea or something like that. and you start to tell them "ok, and when we come to this part you do this, and then you do that." and you already ARE the tyrant. you bring some new songs as well. notice that the others already have the feeling that you try to tell them what to do all the time and it kinda gets really hard to integrate them because in the beginning you hired them, you teach them and they enter a group of people who are friends for years already and feel kinda left out. This was when I lost my first band years ago. I know it's not the same and I'm not BC neither were we the SP but something like that is a really problematic situation and the more people you have to change the more complicated it gets. James and D'Arcy were always just playing along, then they dropped Jimmy, he came back, D'Arcy left, then James. I can understand that Billy wants to make HIS music and have HIS band, it's just that people got used to D'Arcy and James and like them but they are not the heart within the songs.

06-05-2007, 05:33 PM	#223
tcm Braindead Location: Le look de Corgan Posts: 17,924	Billy should of let Matt sit, what a fucking tyrant.

06-05-2007, 05:40 PM	#224
wHATcOLOR THIS IS AWESOME!!!!!!!!!! Location: whip that's for stealing !! whip And that's for getting blood on my whip !!! \|\| MY NAME IS KIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIID ROCK!! Posts: 44,827	i need a moment to catch my breath. this uncharacteristically less than impeccable grammar from ted has me flummoxed, unless he's using a schtick

06-05-2007, 05:41 PM	#225
Steve Holt Demi-God Location: I'm Darth Nihilus Posts: 465	i don't really care if Ginger and Jeff are permanent members or not. if they are, great. if they're just touring members, great. can't fucking believe they pulled Daydream out!

06-05-2007, 05:44 PM	#226
dudehitscar Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 2,652	CRYING TREE OF MERCURY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!! AWESOME! CRUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! My 2nd favorite off Gish Daydream should be interesting without the strings and corgan singing. Can't wait to hear this bootleg.

06-05-2007, 05:54 PM	#227
million_watts Demi-God Posts: 364	listening to show atm. sounds tight. tarantula solo by billy is THE shit. lies have been burnt.

06-05-2007, 05:54 PM	#229
genia. Amish Rake Fighter Location: D-Land Posts: 3	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21_XGaOvrag A minute of Daydream i recorded. Enjoy

06-05-2007, 06:06 PM	#231
Gossamer Apocalyptic Poster Location: We got it like three quarters of the way in whilst on vacation last week. Minor success. Unfortunately she is leaving for England in a couple of days. Posts: 3,787	Wow that was great. Thanks Genia.

06-05-2007, 06:07 PM	#232
million_watts Demi-God Posts: 364	and before i forget, best quote of the night: "we named taratula in honor of the great german band scorpions" crowd laughs "you're laughing, but i'm serious. [...] everytime i listen to 'wind of change' a wall inside of me falls."

06-05-2007, 06:16 PM	#234
MisterSquishyHalo Apocalyptic Poster Location: seattle, wa, usa Posts: 3,955	It sucks, but It still doesnt take away my feeling that they will have a hand in new music at the residencies. Maybe its still too soon for them to be considered slam dunk pumpkins? Maybe that won't happen until they create music AS pumpkins, that we can officially proclaim it

06-05-2007, 06:21 PM	#237
dudehitscar Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 2,652	I think it's great that corgan is sticking with his random acoustic concerts idea he's been doing for a while. They always turn out great... Except for the machina era(Storytellers sucked). His acoustic show in Australia for the TFE tour was great too.

06-05-2007, 06:48 PM	#240
MisterSquishyHalo Apocalyptic Poster Location: seattle, wa, usa Posts: 3,955	..