When did Netphoria start hating Billy?

[trev]

jimmy leaving sp2 was the final straw for me, so 2009.

but looking back like reviewing a toxic relationship with hindsight, i see all the red flags mounting up for years before then and it makes me think the feeling was there for ages under the surface.

i have pretty much written off anything post 2004.

[wHATcOLOR]

zwan era for me


edit: and to be clear, it was a few things -- saying james was the worst person he had ever met, saying jimmy can go drive around in a white van for the rest of his life, and the music really starting to suck regularly. so i think these things are not so much at the start of the zwan era, more towards the end of it..

[Funbags]

Originally Posted by redbreegull

this is not true. Netphoria didn't begin to become overtly anti-Corgan until after the reunion. There was a lot of shit talking about Machina, MSOTS, and the solo album but it was primarily based in the quality of the music.

James and D'arcy not returning in 2007 sowed a lot of ill-will IIRC, but even at that point most people here were excited. I would say things really turned in the time between Zeitgeist and Jimmy's exit, when Billy's behavior became increasingly unfiltered and obnoxious (especially online), it became clear that Jimmy left because he couldn't work with Billy anymore, Billy started going in hard with the woo woo nonsense, and at that point the music couldn't make up for his personality anymore; in fact it just made it seem worse. So I would say 2008/2009 is when the majority of folks around here felt done with it.

I would say this is most accurate.

Billy was openly hostile to his audience during this period. He also made it clear that you weren't a tr00 fan unless you sucked his cock unquestioningly.

[houseofglass11]

Welcome to Sad Machines 2020! An exciting year awaits us! The arrival of Cotillions vinyl and CDs is right around the corner... Most of us have heard the music and surely can't wait to hold that physical copy in hand! New Machines, you have some surprises to look forward to as well... We have WPCs birthday and we do expect to have a small group celebration with some sort of gift(s). Also, we have our Sad Machines Anniversary Event! A day long festivity with games and prizes and love!!! Everything we do will be announced with plenty of advance notice so be ready...

Good times are coming... The band, the man and all friends and collaborators will be sharing their art with us this year and it is our job to embrace and appreciate it all! We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives! It's a great time for us Sad Machines!!!

Those of you who have been around long enough know what to expect about what it is and what it means to be a Sad Machine, so I'll not bore you with a list of rules... Just one... We are a family, we treat each other like family and we defend each other like family! Those who have been here long enough know what is expected of you... You are ambassadors of the group... You represent Sad Machines in here and out there in the non-virtual world... Not many new members will be joining our family from here on out, but for those who are brought in, it's up to you veteran Machines to be what we were to you when this all started. Lead by example, show the new people how to be Sad Machines... After all, this group is yours as much as it is Laney's, Marie's or mine...

We are Humble Machines... We are LOVE Machines... We are Sad (but not really sad at all) Machines!!!

[houseofglass11]

We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!
We must show our support as all endeavors forthcoming will no doubt enrich our lives!

[incubator]

I strongly believe that he's a cool and nice person in real life. He's got a weird sense of humor and is a bit of a "keyboard warrior" sometimes but I think he's alright. He was obviously in a bad place for a few years but seems to be doing alright now.

I think most of what he says really is this "heel" thing and the subjects of his apparent ire are in on it. Him slagging off James over the years is understandable if you actually consider Mr Corgan to be a human being with feelings and not a cartoon character.

The only things I really take issue with is the Alex Jones stuff and the Devi Ever transphobic name-calling. I don't disagree with his general sentiment re Devi Ever.

[sjpaterra]

Originally Posted by reprise85

Really? Not calling a trans woman a he/she?

lol

[reprise85]

Before he called her a he/she I had no idea Devi was even trans. So he 1) outed her 2) called her a he/she and said other fucked up things 3) threatened physical violence and 4) threatened to financially ruin her by getting

over a little shit talking.

you ugly piece of shit...if i ever run into you, anywhere, at anytime, for as long as i live, i will knock your fucking lights out. don't ever come near me, and if i hear even one more peep out of you in public about me, or the band, or the members of the band, i am gonna sue you for so much you'll never be able to afford so much as to even make a fucking guitar cable. i know plenty about copyright law, so before you run your trap anymore about what you think you know, or your delusional constructs of reality, know that to fight a lawsuit is at least a 30 to 40 thousand dollar endeavor. if you still got enough balls to go there, try me. nice to know you thought so little of me, and of us, but we're still willing to try to take advantage of a generous offer because you are a piece of shit and that is what fake pieces of shit do. at least i am real. unlike you, who is a sad creation. don't you say another word, or you'll be fighting something you can't afford and you'll lose everything. this will be the cost of you running your mouth on me ever again.

Devi Ever is a f**king asshole. His/her pedals suck. He/she sucks. Never associate my name and his/hers ever again. Pig. Ugly pig.

you do what you have to do you pig. but i'm telling you, you think you know what you are doing here with me, but you don't. if you just want to go to war, keep running your mouth. i;d like to see you try to sue me for libel. you don't have two nickels to rub together.you are a fake, a phony, a liar, and now a proven idiot. what artist will ever work with a manufacturer who disses her clients out? you are so fucking stupid. and you didn't even have the courage to deal with it in private. you run to a greek chorus of idiots to ape you on. like i said, one more word out of you in public and i will be suing you for ten times more than you'll make in the next ten years. and don't think i am one to make hollow threats. i've been in many lawsuits through the years, and haven's lost one yet. enjoy your 15 seconds of negative attention. you fucked up, you know it, so eat shit, shut the fuck up and accept you've attacked someone who tried to HELP YOU. but addicts and self-destructive people like you who HATE THEMSELVES must turn their hate out. if this is what you have to do to not kill your unhappy self, well then i'd say it was a wise decision. beyond that, you are fucking lame, dumb, and so so ugly.

Regardless of what you think of Devi Ever as a person in general, this is really fucked up shit.

[FoolofaTook]

jesus christ i didnt realize it was that bad

[Shadaloo]

I'm convinced the old Billy died when he had that nervous breakdown in front of Mary Star Of The Sea church

[smashingjj]

what exactly was that?

[Shadaloo]

This here

This was a turning point. Any personality issues he had were magnified tenfold once he became a born-again Catholic.

[Joey Goldberg]

it blows my mind how many people bypass the idea that Corgan was a different person back when he was actually writing good music. as if he was merely "hiding" all this Alex Jones & Jesus shit just waiting for the right moment to unleash it all on us. i don't know if the breakup of the band was just the first fallen domino to him going from Jekyll to Shitty-music Hyde or what, but the dude who wrote Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie, & donated a tour's worth of profits to charity is for sure not the same guy we know today

[DrHalscott]

Originally Posted by redbreegull

this is not true. Netphoria didn't begin to become overtly anti-Corgan until after the reunion. There was a lot of shit talking about Machina, MSOTS, and the solo album but it was primarily based in the quality of the music.

i think we may have different categorizations of "hate" and "start".

the livejournal era most certainly sowed the seeds for the oncoming disdain of billy and it had very little to do with the music of the time. the religious lean, the james bashing, & the zwan shaming def. rubbed netphoria the wrong way. you may not categorize this as 'hate' per se but if you're trying to determine when the decline of public opinion began it has to be around this time.

i would say that the era you mentioned is when the hate really peaked; or perhaps you're right and that's when the dislike turned into hate.

[Squish Squash]

Originally Posted by Joey Goldberg

it blows my mind how many people bypass the idea that Corgan was a different person back when he was actually writing good music. as if he was merely "hiding" all this Alex Jones & Jesus shit just waiting for the right moment to unleash it all on us. i don't know if the breakup of the band was just the first fallen domino to him going from Jekyll to Shitty-music Hyde or what, but the dude who wrote Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie, & donated a tour's worth of profits to charity is for sure not the same guy we know today

I think most of us realize he’s not the same person anymore. D’Arcy, who obviously was very close to him at one point, seemed shocked at the person he has become, both politically and mentally.

[houseofglass11]

You gotta love the sad machines cult worshipping a guy that would make them cry and tell them to get fucked in a New York minute.

[Squish Squash]

Anyone who calls him WPC is a stan.

[houseofglass11]

“ LOL he blocked me. For a person that says he will sleep fine he sure coward his way out from me. I’m gonna comment this since I know you and your Netphoria buddies are watching me comment. For a person like yourself that talks about how much of a fan you are of SP, you sure like to talk shit so much about the band that you love. Not only WPC, but as well as the other people that play and are involved such as Linda Strawberry. I see you comment about said person you mentioned to me earlier and his significant other, and and go on jealous rants along with the other losers, which you and them are obviously obsessed and jealous of. And obviously afraid of when you sleep since you mistaken me as him lol. It’s obviously you thrive on hatred and negativity and try to disguise yourself and others message board as “intellectuals.” Not to mention that place is filled a bunch of trolls that went out and harassed Linda Strawberry to the point she almost took legal action against one of them. You and those low-lives are nothing but basement dwelling, soy-filled beta males. I’ve had my criticisms of the band, but the difference between you and me is I don’t force my opinions on others. That also applies to you to those who are frequent users of Netphoria.

Bye felcia, I have spoken.”

[Squish Squash]

“Soy-filled beta males”? Was that Fuzzy Lol?

[FoolofaTook]

i dunno but if you change beta to omega you've got me!

[eviltimeban]

Originally Posted by FoolofaTook

If Cotillions and Ogilala sounded like this I'd be listening to those two albums all the time. Great vocals. I wonder is he even capable of singing like this nowadays.

[Joey Goldberg]

Originally Posted by Squish Squash

I think most of us realize he’s not the same person anymore. D’Arcy, who obviously was very close to him at one point, seemed shocked at the person he has become, both politically and mentally.

yeah i'm just kind of surprised & a little put off by comments that act like he was somehow hiding 2010s Billy underneath some 90s ruse. that kind of thinking is practically fuzzy-level

fuzzy logic, if you will

[Joey Goldberg]

[Squish Squash]

Originally Posted by Joey Goldberg

yeah i'm just kind of surprised & a little put off by comments that act like he was somehow hiding 2010s Billy underneath some 90s ruse. that kind of thinking is practically fuzzy-level

fuzzy logic, if you will

Those people know him better than D’Arcy, man. She never REALLY knew him like the experts on here.

[Joey Goldberg]

was D'arcy even a natural blonde? that's the real question - how can we really trust her opinions on WBPC if we don't even know the true color of her lox???

[Squish Squash]

Is Linda Strawberry a natural blonde?

That’s the question the fans are begging to know.

[smashingjj]

Originally Posted by houseofglass11

“ LOL he blocked me. For a person that says he will sleep fine he sure coward his way out from me. I’m gonna comment this since I know you and your Netphoria buddies are watching me comment. For a person like yourself that talks about how much of a fan you are of SP, you sure like to talk shit so much about the band that you love. Not only WPC, but as well as the other people that play and are involved such as Linda Strawberry. I see you comment about said person you mentioned to me earlier and his significant other, and and go on jealous rants along with the other losers, which you and them are obviously obsessed and jealous of. And obviously afraid of when you sleep since you mistaken me as him lol. It’s obviously you thrive on hatred and negativity and try to disguise yourself and others message board as “intellectuals.” Not to mention that place is filled a bunch of trolls that went out and harassed Linda Strawberry to the point she almost took legal action against one of them. You and those low-lives are nothing but basement dwelling, soy-filled beta males. I’ve had my criticisms of the band, but the difference between you and me is I don’t force my opinions on others. That also applies to you to those who are frequent users of Netphoria.

Bye felcia, I have spoken.”

who said this and to whom was it directed?

[Joey Goldberg]

that looks like a clicks cluckett classic to me

[smashingjj]

and who was the one that blocked them? so many questions

[run2pee]

Originally Posted by Joey Goldberg

it blows my mind how many people bypass the idea that Corgan was a different person back when he was actually writing good music. as if he was merely "hiding" all this Alex Jones & Jesus shit just waiting for the right moment to unleash it all on us. i don't know if the breakup of the band was just the first fallen domino to him going from Jekyll to Shitty-music Hyde or what, but the dude who wrote Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie, & donated a tour's worth of profits to charity is for sure not the same guy we know today

Originally Posted by Squish Squash

I think most of us realize he’s not the same person anymore. D’Arcy, who obviously was very close to him at one point, seemed shocked at the person he has become, both politically and mentally.

Originally Posted by Joey Goldberg

yeah i'm just kind of surprised & a little put off by comments that act like he was somehow hiding 2010s Billy underneath some 90s ruse. that kind of thinking is practically fuzzy-level

fuzzy logic, if you will

He was a broke asshole who became a rich asshole

The “crazy transformation” y’all are alluding to is just big willie poppin all glistenin from the chrysalis of wealth, unfurlin them black wings, turning left, lookin right etc