so why was jeff mad?

andrewface · 11-12-2008, 01:48 PM

one of the best parts of the DVD is when jeff throws down his guitar and storms off stage "no im not fucking alright"...from the one angle it seems like billys comment "we were once the smashing pumpkins....i dont know what we are now"...seems to have sent jeff off...any other theories?...was it just the equipment failure that pissed him off or was it billy?

TheMilstead · 11-12-2008, 02:00 PM

Wait. So, the "Starla" incident is in there?

Reyngel · 11-12-2008, 02:23 PM

I think the editing is messed up.

From what I remember about that show based on reviews was that the "We used to be the Smashing Pumpkins" wasn't said at the end of Gossamer, it was said after something else. I could be wrong.

I also remember that everyone thought Jeff was just being mad about his amp dying. But according to the documentary, Jeff was pissed off at Billy? That was interesting.

laaazy · 11-12-2008, 02:38 PM

i thot he was pissed cos billy was like, you angry?.. wanna break something?...
obviously taking about the guitar.. and he didnt wanna seem like hes following billys every order.
billy kept persisting, so he tossed it at the end and ran off..

palescales · 11-12-2008, 02:43 PM

Being embarrassed by technical problems is nothing new in the world of music. I'd be fucking pissed too.

Reyngel · 11-12-2008, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laaazy

i thot he was pissed cos billy was like, you angry?.. wanna break something?...
obviously taking about the guitar.. and he didnt wanna seem like hes following billys every order.
billy kept persisting, so he tossed it at the end and ran off..

At first, I sided with Billy. Seemed like Jeff had no reason to be pissed off at Billy. Billy seemed to just be trying to make a tense situation light on stage.

But when Billy asked who Jeff was mad at... seemed like maybe something else had happened that the camera didn't catch? Because at first Billy's like "Wait, you're not mad at me, are you? What did I do?" Then there's some silence. And then Billy tries to change the subject and get everyone back on stage, like he realized what Jeff was so pissed at him for.

T&T · 11-12-2008, 02:49 PM

it's always about billy.
check.

Rickpat12 · 11-12-2008, 03:18 PM

Yeah, it made me feel like he was mad at something Billy did. But I really think that moment, as pointed out in the dvd, was Jeff's defining moment in the band. No longer was he one of Billy's puppets, he did something on his own there. I forgot the wording of it, but someone said that was when Jeff was himself and not just something Billy owned.

slappyspank33 · 11-12-2008, 04:59 PM

to me it seemed as though the amp failure was staged by billy to bring jeff to a breaking point...seems like an odd theory but i got the impression that it was billy's doing and when jeff realized this he was pissed at billy...just a thought.

1100ww · 11-12-2008, 05:12 PM

omg sine machina mystery!1

Cool As Ice Cream · 11-12-2008, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slappyspank33

to me it seemed as though the amp failure was staged by billy to bring jeff to a breaking point...seems like an odd theory but i got the impression that it was billy's doing and when jeff realized this he was pissed at billy...just a thought.

lol check out this guy

*TL* · 11-12-2008, 06:51 PM

actually, was Corgan didn't asked jeff "to be rock 'n roll", to "smash his guitar" before in the show ??

Rickpat12 · 11-12-2008, 07:49 PM

I wish I could understand what you just said.

T&T · 11-12-2008, 07:58 PM

jeff was angry at billy for telling him what to do
so billy told jeff to smash his guitar
and jeff smashed his guitar

billy told jeff to always breath and blink
so jeff stopped blinking and held his breath
poor guy died proving "billy's not gonna tell me what to do"

jeff was later resurrected.

that's rock and roll folks.

markpregen · 11-12-2008, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cool As Ice Cream

lol check out this guy

you should change your username to "lol check out this guy"

douglas78 · 11-12-2008, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewface

one of the best parts of the DVD is when jeff throws down his guitar and storms off stage "no im not fucking alright"...from the one angle it seems like billys comment "we were once the smashing pumpkins....i dont know what we are now"...seems to have sent jeff off...any other theories?...was it just the equipment failure that pissed him off or was it billy?

Jeff is doing good, but he knows that he will never truly replace James and I think he took that comment Billy made to heart. I think it was a low blow. Even if the Bolly was just being angry; hiding it behind a sarcastically funny comment made it worse.

Ugly · 11-13-2008, 12:04 AM

On a DVD Easter Egg, it shows Billy physically taking a shit on Jeff's 50 page Masters Thesis and then Billy turns to the camera and says, "I bet this'll piss the little bastard off! Then I'm gonna go fuck his mom!! In the bum! With my wang!"

It's really hard to find, but totally worth it.

BlissedandGone2 · 11-13-2008, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by *TL*

actually, was Corgan didn't asked jeff "to be rock 'n roll", to "smash his guitar" before in the show ??

post of all time.

IWishIWasBlank · 11-13-2008, 12:39 AM

I think what you meant to say was

"Time of post all, tfw."

Reyngel · 11-13-2008, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by *TL*

actually, was Corgan didn't asked jeff "to be rock 'n roll", to "smash his guitar" before in the show ??

*TL* · 11-13-2008, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rickpat12

I wish I could understand what you just said.

yeah sorry (I'm not fluent in english)

"Corgan asked Jeff to be "rock'n roll" and smash his guitar before in the show , didn't he?"

Is that clear now ?

*TL* · 11-13-2008, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlissedandGone2

post of all time.

what if you speak french ?? It would be funny too

Kahlo · 11-13-2008, 09:57 AM

I just caught that DVD extra. No wonder he was so annoyed!

tcm · 11-13-2008, 10:01 AM

i thought jeff shook his head when asked if he was mad at billy. they were all pretty frustrated with the whole fillmore experience at that point, and maybe he had kept his frustrations bottled up until then (they're not good with feelings, you know). like the guitar smashing was supposed to be a joke, but it became the kind of joke where, once you've said it, you see how true it really is. like that moment of catharsis made him realize how frustrated he was with the whole affair. you know, like that.

but yeah, it had nothing to do with "i don't know what we are now".

mellon_c0llie · 11-13-2008, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcm

but yeah, it had nothing to do with "i don't know what we are now".

I think that was the ignition switch. I think questioning Jeff's importance to the band in front of such a huge crowd in such a flippant way really sent him over the edge. Like "we're screw ups thanks to Jeff...because he's not Iha." Ultimately Jeff feels a responsibility to live up to the name sake of the Pumpkins and to dutifully fill the roll of James, which of course he'll never be. At that moment Jeff takes ownership of his place in the band and defines his roll as supporting musician.

tcm · 11-13-2008, 10:42 AM

i dunno, it never occurred to me that billy's line might have anything to do with jeff or james. the whole show was a mini disaster, so he just felt unsure of what they were doing. maybe jeff did take it that way, but, in any case, they were all laughing about it the next day.

makes a good story, though.

Slurpee · 11-13-2008, 10:43 AM

I should note that Jeff also threw his guitar in disgust on the first night of the NYC shows and walked off before US was over. This prompted many puzzled stares from Billy.

mellon_c0llie · 11-13-2008, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcm

i dunno, it never occurred to me that billy's line might have anything to do with jeff or james. the whole show was a mini disaster, so he just felt unsure of what they were doing. maybe jeff did take it that way, but, in any case, they were all laughing about it the next day.

makes a good story, though.

I don't think billy meant any harm. I think it was a side effect of running off at the mouth.

leena · 11-13-2008, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slurpee

I should note that Jeff also threw his guitar in disgust on the first night of the NYC shows and walked off before US was over. This prompted many puzzled stares from Billy.

Oh really? Did he? I didn't notice that, then again i was sitting pretty far from the stage.

tcm · 11-13-2008, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mellon_c0llie

I don't think billy meant any harm. I think it was a side effect of running off at the mouth.

this just doesn't even begin to make sense though:

Quote:

Originally Posted by mellon_c0llie

Like "we're screw ups thanks to Jeff...because he's not Iha."

in Billy's world, Iha was the one who screwed them up, remember?

11-12-2008, 01:48 PM	#1
andrewface Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 1,018	so why was jeff mad? one of the best parts of the DVD is when jeff throws down his guitar and storms off stage "no im not fucking alright"...from the one angle it seems like billys comment "we were once the smashing pumpkins....i dont know what we are now"...seems to have sent jeff off...any other theories?...was it just the equipment failure that pissed him off or was it billy?

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11-12-2008, 02:00 PM	#2
TheMilstead Minion of Satan Location: Damn fine cup of coffee. Posts: 5,520	Wait. So, the "Starla" incident is in there?

11-12-2008, 02:23 PM	#3
Reyngel Apocalyptic Poster Location: Seattle Posts: 3,682	I think the editing is messed up. From what I remember about that show based on reviews was that the "We used to be the Smashing Pumpkins" wasn't said at the end of Gossamer, it was said after something else. I could be wrong. I also remember that everyone thought Jeff was just being mad about his amp dying. But according to the documentary, Jeff was pissed off at Billy? That was interesting.

11-12-2008, 02:38 PM	#4
laaazy Demi-God Posts: 294	i thot he was pissed cos billy was like, you angry?.. wanna break something?... obviously taking about the guitar.. and he didnt wanna seem like hes following billys every order. billy kept persisting, so he tossed it at the end and ran off..

11-12-2008, 02:43 PM	#5
palescales Demi-God Location: boston the best city ever Posts: 270	Being embarrassed by technical problems is nothing new in the world of music. I'd be fucking pissed too.

11-12-2008, 02:49 PM	#7
T&T Socialphobic Location: montreal Posts: 11,679	it's always about billy. check.

11-12-2008, 03:18 PM	#8
Rickpat12 Apocalyptic Poster Location: GUITAR PICK? Posts: 3,398	Yeah, it made me feel like he was mad at something Billy did. But I really think that moment, as pointed out in the dvd, was Jeff's defining moment in the band. No longer was he one of Billy's puppets, he did something on his own there. I forgot the wording of it, but someone said that was when Jeff was himself and not just something Billy owned.

11-12-2008, 04:59 PM	#9
slappyspank33 Pledge Posts: 71	to me it seemed as though the amp failure was staged by billy to bring jeff to a breaking point...seems like an odd theory but i got the impression that it was billy's doing and when jeff realized this he was pissed at billy...just a thought.

11-12-2008, 05:12 PM	#10
1100ww Ownz Posts: 912	omg sine machina mystery!1

11-12-2008, 06:51 PM	#12
TL Pledge Posts: 118	actually, was Corgan didn't asked jeff "to be rock 'n roll", to "smash his guitar" before in the show ??

11-12-2008, 07:49 PM	#13
Rickpat12 Apocalyptic Poster Location: GUITAR PICK? Posts: 3,398	I wish I could understand what you just said.

11-12-2008, 07:58 PM	#14
T&T Socialphobic Location: montreal Posts: 11,679	jeff was angry at billy for telling him what to do so billy told jeff to smash his guitar and jeff smashed his guitar billy told jeff to always breath and blink so jeff stopped blinking and held his breath poor guy died proving "billy's not gonna tell me what to do" jeff was later resurrected. that's rock and roll folks.

11-13-2008, 12:04 AM	#17
Ugly Immortal Location: Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed Posts: 21,248	On a DVD Easter Egg, it shows Billy physically taking a shit on Jeff's 50 page Masters Thesis and then Billy turns to the camera and says, "I bet this'll piss the little bastard off! Then I'm gonna go fuck his mom!! In the bum! With my wang!" It's really hard to find, but totally worth it.

11-13-2008, 12:39 AM	#19
IWishIWasBlank Apocalyptic Poster Location: Wisconsin Posts: 4,404	I think what you meant to say was "Time of post all, tfw."

11-13-2008, 09:57 AM	#23
Kahlo Registered User Posts: 17,539	I just caught that DVD extra. No wonder he was so annoyed!

11-13-2008, 10:01 AM	#24
tcm Braindead Location: Le look de Corgan Posts: 17,922	i thought jeff shook his head when asked if he was mad at billy. they were all pretty frustrated with the whole fillmore experience at that point, and maybe he had kept his frustrations bottled up until then (they're not good with feelings, you know). like the guitar smashing was supposed to be a joke, but it became the kind of joke where, once you've said it, you see how true it really is. like that moment of catharsis made him realize how frustrated he was with the whole affair. you know, like that. but yeah, it had nothing to do with "i don't know what we are now".

11-13-2008, 10:42 AM	#26
tcm Braindead Location: Le look de Corgan Posts: 17,922	i dunno, it never occurred to me that billy's line might have anything to do with jeff or james. the whole show was a mini disaster, so he just felt unsure of what they were doing. maybe jeff did take it that way, but, in any case, they were all laughing about it the next day. makes a good story, though.

11-13-2008, 10:43 AM	#27
Slurpee Minion of Satan Location: breakfast Posts: 6,174	I should note that Jeff also threw his guitar in disgust on the first night of the NYC shows and walked off before US was over. This prompted many puzzled stares from Billy.