Offical public referendum: Is SAOSBV1NPNFNS the best SP moniker release since 2000? - Page 3

reprise85 · 11-16-2018, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paranoid

As much as I can’t stand seek there will never be songs shittier than pomp or wildflower. Never.

i like pomp. and seek

redbreegull · 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paranoid

As much as I can’t stand seek there will never be songs shittier than pomp or wildflower. Never.

Pomp was ok live but should have been aborted in the studio. Wildflower is just fucking horrendous, on par with the bad teargarden songs. Funny how the final tracks on SP albums used to always be strong, but in the latter days, the final song is pretty likely to be just about the worst on the record

Shadaloo · 11-16-2018, 11:16 PM

Voted yes with the assumption that we're talking about the bare-bones standard ZG. Had that album Stellar, Ma Belle and the ZG title track on instead of a few others I'd say no. I do like it a fair bit more than Oceania - which is admittedly a much more cohesive work - on the whole, which just dragged and could stand to have about 2-3 songs cut.

Personally I find the original band's chemistry is palpable throughout much of this, and it goes a long way, even if just under half the tunes don't really do anything for me and the production is awful.

run2pee · 11-16-2018, 11:34 PM

The drum sound do suck major major fux on this piece of shit, i mean, cmon

Gosh

MonumentsRocks · 11-16-2018, 11:45 PM

Imo Stellar is a solid gem. It's very well executed. I cant conceive of how that song could be any better..

redbreegull · 11-17-2018, 12:00 AM

I like Stellar, and it is better than almost every song on the regular release, but I never felt it was incredible. Ma Belle similarly doesn't do much for me. Z the song felt like old SP though

enthusaroo · 11-17-2018, 12:13 AM

the lyrics on no future. no sun are special

Pure penetration
alienation

she slobs an angry cock

FoolofaTook · 11-17-2018, 12:19 AM

stabs dude. and empty.

stop projecting.

redbreegull · 11-17-2018, 12:19 AM

SHE STABS AN EMPTY

COCK

paranoid · 11-17-2018, 02:55 AM

I’m listening to Oceania, which I had told myself was my favorite post machina release, but Jesus is the musicianship on this scrappy, thanks to the amateur drumming. You think jimmy is lackluster on shiny? He’s playing leagues above mike. His timing is impeccable and mike can’t even play a quarter not without dragging or speeding up.

Pale horse is quite lovely, though.

MonumentsRocks · 11-17-2018, 03:07 AM

I like the slightly loose, tub smashing drumming of Mike Byrne, it sounds raw and human. You can hear the struggle. Jimmy is great, but he makes it seems so effortless that sometimes he comes across as a prodigy who doesn't even know how he's making these drums make all these crazy noises. If Billy returns to being on bad terms with his band mates, I think he should look to younger musicians again.

paranoid · 11-17-2018, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonumentsRocks

I like the slightly loose drumming of Mike Byrne, it sounds raw and human. It imparts struggle. Jimmy is great, but he makes it seems so effortless that sometimes he comes across as a prodigy who doesn't even know how he's making these drums make all these crazy noises.

You’re an idiot.

paranoid · 11-17-2018, 03:09 AM

Like, it’s well know Byrne had to dub in some of his drums separately so the beats would be even. What’s human about that? Jesus dude go away.

MonumentsRocks · 03:28 AM

Yeah what kind of human makes mistakes, fellow robot?

Jimmy had nice thing to say about Mike and his playing, and Billy Corgan alluded to firing him and Nicole because they wouldn't tolerate the work load, not because they lacked skill. Corgan knew what he was getting with Mike, he liked it. I liked it. The hate for Mike is just netphoria circlejerking. He was, probably still is, a fine drummer, especially given his age at the time.

redbreegull · 11-17-2018, 03:45 AM

I mean he's fine in his own music. He was absolutely inadequate for SP and is not 1/5 the drummer Jimmy fucking Chamberlin is

houseofglass11 · 11-17-2018, 04:35 AM

How anyone could think this is better than Zeitgeist is beyond me.

VoxUpDoc · 11-17-2018, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by houseofglass11

How anyone could think this is better than Zeitgeist is beyond me.

Truth. ZG was miles better.

New Art Rioter · 11-17-2018, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redbreegull

I mean he's fine in his own music. He was absolutely inadequate for SP and is not 1/5 the drummer Jimmy fucking Chamberlin is

This so much. This era was such a weird dynamic of a massive fuck-you to Jimmy by hiring a 18 year old, saving a few bucks/getting cheap press by hiring an unknown and trying to fulfill some mid-life crisis of wanting to be a parental figure.

MonumentsRocks · 11-17-2018, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New Art Rioter

This so much. This era was such a weird dynamic of a massive fuck-you to Jimmy by hiring a 18 year old, saving a few bucks/getting cheap press by hiring an unknown and trying to fulfill some mid-life crisis of wanting to be a parental figure.

We don't know what Mike got paid. If Billy was trying to be like a parental figure I don't think he would have slammed Mike on his blog after he was let go, citing "ADD", and implying he didn't have the needed attention span or work ethic to keep up with his complex music. Nicole was relatively young too, it looks like he was just going for new blood.

It would have been a much bigger "fuck you" to Jimmy if he had hired another fusion jazz drummer who was in the same age range, that would be a direct "I'm replacing you", but in hiring a teenager, that's more like saying he's not even going to try replacing him.

redbreegull · 11-17-2018, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New Art Rioter

This so much. This era was such a weird dynamic of a massive fuck-you to Jimmy by hiring a 18 year old, saving a few bucks/getting cheap press by hiring an unknown and trying to fulfill some mid-life crisis of wanting to be a parental figure.

yeah hiring Mike Byrne was probably the most wtf career move Bill has pulled.

myosis · 11-17-2018, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by houseofglass11

How anyone could think this is better than Zeitgeist is beyond me.

the good songs are good and the bad songs are better than the bad songs on Zeitgeist.

redbreegull · 11-17-2018, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonumentsRocks

We don't know what Mike got paid. If Billy was trying to be like a parental figure I don't think he would have slammed Mike on his blog after he was let go, citing "ADD", and implying he didn't have the needed attention span or work ethic to keep up with his complex music. Nicole was relatively young too, it looks like he was just going for new blood.

It would have been a much bigger "fuck you" to Jimmy if he had hired another fusion jazz drummer who was in the same age range, that would be a direct "I'm replacing you", but in hiring a teenager, that's more like saying he's not even going to try replacing him.

the only thing monumental about you is your monumentally bad takes. Bill publicly shit on Jimmy and then brought in a guy to fill his spot who literally was not capable of playing Jimmy's parts correctly. It was an incredible fuck you to the fans and to Jimmy and to the band's legacy. At that time, Corgan was obsessed with proving to the world that SP was really just him

FoolofaTook · 11-17-2018, 12:25 PM

"If Billy was trying to be like a parental figure I don't think he would have slammed Mike on his blog after he was let go, citing "ADD", and implying he didn't have the needed attention span or work ethic to keep up with his complex music"

who said anything about an ideal parental figure?

houseofglass11 · 11-17-2018, 12:28 PM

There’s literally not one song on Zeitgeist worse than a SosB song.

redbreegull · 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myosis

the good songs are good and the bad songs are better than the bad songs on Zeitgeist.

Yup. I think Silvery and Tarantula are about even in terms of quality, which is to say they both are really good. Whether it's because it's a short album, it's the original band, or because of whatever other factor, ShinyV1 simply doesn't get around to hitting the lows that Zeitgeist does. Seek is probably my second least favorite, and it's still better than fucking Stars or Come On (Let's Go). Solara is pretty fucking bad, but I'm not sure it's worse than 7 Shades of Black or For God and Country.

the production on Zeitgeist is also LEAGUES worse, with the exception of the drum sound. Rick Ruin's production sucks in a generic it's too loud and brash kind of modern way, which is bothersome, but by comparison Zeitgeist's production is fucking painful to listen. The Billy voices are so. bad.

run2pee · 11-17-2018, 02:27 PM

I guess the songwriting on z is more adventuresome, exciting, than this sorta old man sorta mature bashin on a theme for a few minutes

But i can’t listen to Z, it friekin hurts man. The production exhausts me after like 1:30 and then i cant even hear the songwritin

run2pee · 11-17-2018, 02:29 PM

Dunno i just feel goats is the first time since parts of machina where i don’t have to fight thru the sounds im hearing to find something to appreciate

Just it communicates straight to my heart/butt, with no cringe barriers

run2pee · 11-17-2018, 02:31 PM

Also all morning been hearing this warm gosh sorta comforting/welcoming

S’WEARRRR AHHHH BELONG
S’WEARRRR AHHHH BELONG
S’WEARRRR AHHHH BELONG

Hits me in those special nameless parts where sp used to hit me, man

MonumentsRocks · 11-17-2018, 02:35 PM

Zeitgeist is the "remaster" I'm looking forward to the most, as there's no way they could make it worse than it was, and I like a lot of the tracks but I get fatigued by the fake loudness of the compression. The same is true of MtaE and SosB, but at least those album's tracks are not constants walls of distorted guitar.

incubator · 11-17-2018, 03:18 PM

I’ve listened to them all recently.

Objectively MTAE is overall the best as its mercifully short, sounds quite nice and was competently performed.

The others all have some combination of being legitimately painful to listen to, having several bad songs, being boring and Mike Byrne.

View Poll Results: Let the people decide
Yes	20	41.67%
No	28	58.33%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll

11-17-2018, 03:13 AM	#74
MonumentsRocks Ownz Posts: 633	Yeah what kind of human makes mistakes, fellow robot? Jimmy had nice thing to say about Mike and his playing, and Billy Corgan alluded to firing him and Nicole because they wouldn't tolerate the work load, not because they lacked skill. Corgan knew what he was getting with Mike, he liked it. I liked it. The hate for Mike is just netphoria circlejerking. He was, probably still is, a fine drummer, especially given his age at the time. Last edited by MonumentsRocks : 11-17-2018 at 03:28 AM.

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11-16-2018, 11:16 PM	#63
Shadaloo Apocalyptic Poster Location: up on the cross you go little fella Posts: 2,676	Voted yes with the assumption that we're talking about the bare-bones standard ZG. Had that album Stellar, Ma Belle and the ZG title track on instead of a few others I'd say no. I do like it a fair bit more than Oceania - which is admittedly a much more cohesive work - on the whole, which just dragged and could stand to have about 2-3 songs cut. Personally I find the original band's chemistry is palpable throughout much of this, and it goes a long way, even if just under half the tunes don't really do anything for me and the production is awful.

11-16-2018, 11:34 PM	#64
run2pee Minion of Satan Location: An oasis of horror in a desert of boredom Posts: 7,746	The drum sound do suck major major fux on this piece of shit, i mean, cmon Gosh

11-16-2018, 11:45 PM	#65
MonumentsRocks Ownz Posts: 633	Imo Stellar is a solid gem. It's very well executed. I cant conceive of how that song could be any better..

11-17-2018, 12:00 AM	#66
redbreegull Just Hook it to My Veins! Location: N3t4Euh Haus Posts: 32,752	I like Stellar, and it is better than almost every song on the regular release, but I never felt it was incredible. Ma Belle similarly doesn't do much for me. Z the song felt like old SP though

11-17-2018, 12:13 AM	#67
enthusaroo Apocalyptic Poster Location: ameriKKKa Posts: 2,747	the lyrics on no future. no sun are special Pure penetration alienation she slobs an angry cock

11-17-2018, 12:19 AM	#68
FoolofaTook Just Hook it to My Veins! Location: Donald Trump of Netphoria Posts: 37,218	stabs dude. and empty. stop projecting.

11-17-2018, 02:55 AM	#70
paranoid Minion of Satan Location: up a tree Posts: 7,521	I’m listening to Oceania, which I had told myself was my favorite post machina release, but Jesus is the musicianship on this scrappy, thanks to the amateur drumming. You think jimmy is lackluster on shiny? He’s playing leagues above mike. His timing is impeccable and mike can’t even play a quarter not without dragging or speeding up. Pale horse is quite lovely, though.

11-17-2018, 03:07 AM	#71
MonumentsRocks Ownz Posts: 633	I like the slightly loose, tub smashing drumming of Mike Byrne, it sounds raw and human. You can hear the struggle. Jimmy is great, but he makes it seems so effortless that sometimes he comes across as a prodigy who doesn't even know how he's making these drums make all these crazy noises. If Billy returns to being on bad terms with his band mates, I think he should look to younger musicians again.

11-17-2018, 03:09 AM	#73
paranoid Minion of Satan Location: up a tree Posts: 7,521	Like, it’s well know Byrne had to dub in some of his drums separately so the beats would be even. What’s human about that? Jesus dude go away.

11-17-2018, 03:45 AM	#75
redbreegull Just Hook it to My Veins! Location: N3t4Euh Haus Posts: 32,752	I mean he's fine in his own music. He was absolutely inadequate for SP and is not 1/5 the drummer Jimmy fucking Chamberlin is

11-17-2018, 04:35 AM	#76
houseofglass11 Minion of Satan Location: sleuthing around like a worm Posts: 5,686	How anyone could think this is better than Zeitgeist is beyond me.

11-17-2018, 12:25 PM	#83
FoolofaTook Just Hook it to My Veins! Location: Donald Trump of Netphoria Posts: 37,218	"If Billy was trying to be like a parental figure I don't think he would have slammed Mike on his blog after he was let go, citing "ADD", and implying he didn't have the needed attention span or work ethic to keep up with his complex music" who said anything about an ideal parental figure?

11-17-2018, 12:28 PM	#84
houseofglass11 Minion of Satan Location: sleuthing around like a worm Posts: 5,686	There’s literally not one song on Zeitgeist worse than a SosB song.

11-17-2018, 02:27 PM	#86
run2pee Minion of Satan Location: An oasis of horror in a desert of boredom Posts: 7,746	I guess the songwriting on z is more adventuresome, exciting, than this sorta old man sorta mature bashin on a theme for a few minutes But i can’t listen to Z, it friekin hurts man. The production exhausts me after like 1:30 and then i cant even hear the songwritin

11-17-2018, 02:29 PM	#87
run2pee Minion of Satan Location: An oasis of horror in a desert of boredom Posts: 7,746	Dunno i just feel goats is the first time since parts of machina where i don’t have to fight thru the sounds im hearing to find something to appreciate Just it communicates straight to my heart/butt, with no cringe barriers

11-17-2018, 02:31 PM	#88
run2pee Minion of Satan Location: An oasis of horror in a desert of boredom Posts: 7,746	Also all morning been hearing this warm gosh sorta comforting/welcoming S’WEARRRR AHHHH BELONG S’WEARRRR AHHHH BELONG S’WEARRRR AHHHH BELONG Hits me in those special nameless parts where sp used to hit me, man

11-17-2018, 02:35 PM	#89
MonumentsRocks Ownz Posts: 633	Zeitgeist is the "remaster" I'm looking forward to the most, as there's no way they could make it worse than it was, and I like a lot of the tracks but I get fatigued by the fake loudness of the compression. The same is true of MtaE and SosB, but at least those album's tracks are not constants walls of distorted guitar.

11-17-2018, 03:18 PM	#90
incubator Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 1,235	I’ve listened to them all recently. Objectively MTAE is overall the best as its mercifully short, sounds quite nice and was competently performed. The others all have some combination of being legitimately painful to listen to, having several bad songs, being boring and Mike Byrne.