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Old 10-01-2019, 12:25 AM   #91
houseofglass11
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Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
The Pajo angle is way overblown on this forum. Sure, Spiderland is something of a cult classic, but not even the biggest Slint fans were hyped up or creating any buzz about the prospects of him playing guitar for Billy Corgan. Hell, the honest to gods truth is that most Slint fans actually expected the band to suck and were wondering what the hell Pajo was thinking.

You guys are rewriting history in order to serve some sorta narrative. Props to AveryLowen for so thoroughly debunking the Zwan sensationalism that you guys are so oddly pushing. It would be like saying Cheap Trick fans were creating an "indie groundswell" over Tinted Windows... No Cheap Trick fans cared.
Agreed. In fact most of the people who like stuff like Slint and Chavez actually actively disliked Billy. I've known a lot of snooty indie types and they almost always say "Gish, Siamese Dream and Pisces were cool but everything else is garbage". If anything, playing with Billy actually tarnished Pajo's and Sweeney's indie cred.

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Old 10-01-2019, 12:31 AM   #92
Mals Marola
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you could maybe even say

the hipsters














united


 
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Old 10-01-2019, 01:28 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by houseofglass11 View Post
Agreed. In fact most of the people who like stuff like Slint and Chavez actually actively disliked Billy. I've know a lot of snooty indie types and they almost always say "Gish, Siamese Dreams and Pisces were cool but everything else is garbage". If anything, playing with Billy actually tarnished Pajo's and Sweeney's indie cred.
Yeah exactly... I'd say it wasn't even until probably the last 10 years that indie fans have been able to give the Pumpkins catalog an honest look and are now able to appreciate the classics. Back in 2003, Billy was pretty much still the epitome of what indie artists didn't want to be... So it wasn't as if there was any indie goodwill going into the project that was lost once Mary Star Of The Sea was released

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 10:59 AM   #94
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Fuzzy has made so much fucking sense in this thread that I’m starting to question reality.

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 11:51 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
The Pajo angle is way overblown on this forum. Sure, Spiderland is something of a cult classic, but not even the biggest Slint fans were hyped up or creating any buzz about the prospects of him playing guitar for Billy Corgan. Hell, the honest to gods truth is that most Slint fans actually expected the band to suck and were wondering what the hell Pajo was thinking.

You guys are rewriting history in order to serve some sorta narrative. Props to AveryLowen for so thoroughly debunking the Zwan sensationalism that you guys are so oddly pushing. It would be like saying Cheap Trick fans were creating an "indie groundswell" over Tinted Windows... No Cheap Trick fans cared.
that's not true debunking, as the main zwan websites are just forever gone. if netphoria had also died the death it deserves, someone could point to the absence of any zwan discussion surviving the internet years as proof that no one has ever talked about them. which is wrong.

you don't even seem to know that Pajo had his own well-established indie fame as Papa M and was not just known as "that guy from Slint".

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 01:29 PM   #96
Mals Marola
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dont quote fonzy ronzers!!!!!!!!

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 01:59 PM   #97
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shallowed neg repped me for quoting fuzzy, lol. sk ck, thnx.

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:04 PM   #98
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Angry

DON'T




TALK




ABOUT




R-P

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:19 PM   #99
Mals Marola
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?

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:22 PM   #100
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sorry didn't mean to i.nclude discussion of r.ep

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:26 PM   #101
Mals Marola
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imagine a man who fearlessly discusses "the r word" and quotes fuzzyro

that man would be a true hero

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:29 PM   #102
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perhaps even the man i aspire to be

i'm of course using man in the "biblical sense" here

but hey, here goes nothing...

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:29 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
Yeah exactly... I'd say it wasn't even until probably the last 10 years that indie fans have been able to give the Pumpkins catalog an honest look and are now able to appreciate the classics. Back in 2003, Billy was pretty much still the epitome of what indie artists didn't want to be... So it wasn't as if there was any indie goodwill going into the project that was lost once Mary Star Of The Sea was released
that's fantastic, but how about re-opening your rep page to the public?

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:36 PM   #104
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dude, i once made a thread about rep. and weathered, like creed before me, the ensuing deluge of neg rep.

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 03:14 PM   #105
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Have you heard this song fuzzy?

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 04:40 PM   #106
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Originally Posted by johncg View Post
Fuzzy has made so much fucking sense in this thread that I’m starting to question reality.
Tell me about it...


 
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:13 PM   #107
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Have you heard this song fuzzy?
Nope, but I have now

Not bad, but a little generically 90's. Sounds like a Sonic Youth impression.

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:17 PM   #108
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aaaaaand now we're back to "the dumb fuzz"

i didn't even need to quote 'im!

 
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Old 10-01-2019, 10:01 PM   #109
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that song sounds nothing like sonic youth

 
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:24 AM   #110
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I think we’re arguing over nothing here. Define groundswell?

The reaction online to Zwan in late ‘01, early ‘02 was generally positive. The reaction on netphoria is not indicative of anything, but I recall Jesus I and Mary Star being very popular live tracks. The Glasshouse set was praised and even got reported in British printed press and many music sites which are conveniently not around now - announcing the formation of an indie supergroup under Corgan. Barely anyone had heard the actual music, but the reviews of the shows were good and they were positioned as having indie cred thanks to Pajo and Sweeney.

All of this was before Paz and the ‘02 shows. These were reported again as the band having written 100 songs to choose from for their debut album or some shit like that. After that it went South.

 
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:33 AM   #111
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It’s difficult to have a groundswell when you haven’t put out any material, the 00’s indie scene rejected the Pumpkins, but there was positive word of mouth around Zwan, and they were in a position to win over that crowd, but instead put out a sugary pop rock album and imploded.

It’s incorrect to suggest they were poorly received and nobody was interested from the start.

 
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Old 10-02-2019, 07:50 PM   #112
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They were poorly received after MSotS was released. You guys were trashing the album on here as bad as pitchfork was.

 
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:31 PM   #113
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it's cos it was a bad fuckin' album

the only thing Mary Star of the Sea has over Teargarden is early 2000s nostalgia. and "Yeah!"

 
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:32 PM   #114
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ok & maybe "Desire"

 
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:58 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
Nope, but I have now

Not bad, but a little generically 90's. Sounds like a Sonic Youth impression.
quoting for Shallowed

 
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Old 10-02-2019, 09:08 PM   #116
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don't clothe furry rompers

 
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Old 10-03-2019, 02:45 AM   #117
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After reading this entire thread I have only one question.
What exactly is “Indie Cred”?


Quote:
Originally Posted by houseofglass11 View Post
shallowed neg repped me for quoting fuzzy, lol. sk ck, thnx.
Me too, wtf.
Is “indie cred” where you neg rep someone for quoting fuzzy talking about Weezer?

 
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Old 10-03-2019, 04:57 AM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mals Marola View Post
it's cos it was a bad fuckin' album

the only thing Mary Star of the Sea has over Teargarden is early 2000s nostalgia. and "Yeah!"
You are insane.

 
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Old 10-03-2019, 08:05 AM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mals Marola View Post
it's cos it was a bad fuckin' album

the only thing Mary Star of the Sea has over Teargarden is early 2000s nostalgia. and "Yeah!"
Mary Star of the Sea is fucking naff album with bad production and a poor tracklist. “Yeah” is one of the worst, most butchered tracks.

It’s still a 3-star record and approx x10000000 times better than Teargarden.

Everyone is still getting their monthly Street Team cheques, right?

 
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Old 10-03-2019, 08:07 AM   #120
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Full disclosure: I once wore a Zwan shirt in public.

 
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