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Old 10-29-2017, 03:22 AM   #31
Jelly Blossom
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Originally Posted by The Omega Concern View Post
Mostly correct, but I always figured Billy was aware of this even past 2000 which is why things were so awkward thereafter.
Unfortunately Billy thinks that he is the spectacle.

The critical and commercial failures of both Monuments and LadeeDaDa prove that isn't the case.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 10:57 AM   #32
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i don't personally agree. SP fans like raw demos. so to say it's not Corgan's presence that allure fans, seems ridiculous. Rubin seems to appreciate raw Corgan as well and he insisted on letting that kind of album come out.

That may be true in the sense that a relatively small portion of overall fans cared about demos when he was writing MCIS era/calibur songs. Does anyone really listen to his music since 2000 hope to get at Corgan's "presence"? Outside of a 5-7 year period in his career, there's not much "there" there at a base level.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 02:06 PM   #33
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Nonsense review. 5.7. This album is an 8. Without reading im sure Foo Fighters latest get's higher. That has nothing to do with quality of music and all to do with the fact that people suck Grohls balls.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 02:46 PM   #34
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Yah it's an 8. 8/100.

BOOYAH SHALAKA!

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 02:50 PM   #35
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Have you guys read pitchfork's review of lateralus?

They really need to die.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 03:02 PM   #36
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Two reviews in the German and Australian ROLLING STONE:

https://www.rollingstone.de/reviews/...organ-ogilala/

William Patrick Corgan - OGILALA

2017.10.26

Arne Willander

2.5 / 5

Billy heißt jetzt William Patrick und hat ganz allein eine Platte mit rührend kitschigen Klavierballaden aufgenommen

Früher, als er sich Billy Corgan nannte und seine Band The Smashing Pumpkins, schichtete er Halden von Bombast aus elektrischen Gitarren und Streichern zu epischen Wut-Songs auf, und dazwischen spielte er auf dem Klavier die zartesten Liebeslieder. Manchmal machte er auch beides zugleich. „Siamese Dream“ und das Großwerk „Mellon Collie And The Infinite Sadness“ hatten das Maßlose, das Verzwei-felte und Erhabene. Die späten Platten der Smashing Pumpkins sind Skizzen und Trümmer zu durchgeknallten, esoterischen Opern, Symphonien und Konzeptwerken, die nie mehr geschrieben werden: „Zeitgeist“, „Oceania 1“.
Jetzt ist er William Patrick Corgan, als solcher wurde er in Chicago getauft, er spielt nur noch Klavier und Plastikorgel, und die künstlichen Streicher dudeln käsigen Sirup. „Ogilala“, das ist exotisch, vielleicht ist Corgan jetzt Indianer oder so, und die bizarren Songtitel gibt es auch noch: „Half-Life Of An Autodidact“, „Amarinthe“, „Mandarynne“, „Zowie“. Bei „Antietam“ und „Shiloh“ ist er Historiker der Sezessionskriegsschlachten. Die Stücke dauern nur jeweils drei oder vier Minuten, Corgans Gesang meckert und quengelt wie je, und William Patrick Corgan klingt zugleich vollkommen wie Billy Corgan, der die alten Melodien singt, und wie ein Stimmenimitator, der in der Fußgängerzone mit seiner akustischen Gitarre, einem Klavier und einem billigen Keyboard-Orchester das Sehnen des Knaben Billy nachahmt. Manchmal glaubt man, dass „Let It Be“ kommt.
Es ist rührender Balladenkitsch, Billy maunzt treuherzig einfache Lieder von der Art „Ich wollte aufs Minimum reduzieren, mich auf mich selbst besinnen, die Songs waren plötzlich da, sie wollten aufgenommen werden, und das hab ich dann gemacht, nur ich und das Studio, das ganze Zeug brauch ich nicht mehr, es war wie eine Gesundung, und jetzt geh ich allein auf Tournee, gleich morgen“. Tropf, tropf, scholler, sülz: „It’s a long way to get back home“ und dergleichen.
Es war aufregender, als Billy Corgan der Hut brannte. Dieser William Patrick Corgan ist eine Schlafmütze, ein Träumerle. Der amerikanische Elton John am Bontempi-Flügel. (BMG)

English translator version:
Now Billy is called William Patrick and has taken up completely alone a record with moving kitschy piano ballads.

Earlier when he was called Billy Corgan and his volume The Smashing Pumpkins, he stacked waste dumps of fustian from electric guitars and string players to epicfury songs, and in between he played onthe piano the most tender love songs. Sometimes he also made both at thesame time. "Siamese Dream" and the great work "Mellon Collie And The Infinite Sadness" had the immoderate, the desperate and elated. The late records of the Smashing Pumpkins are sketches and remains to cracked, esoteric operas, symphonies and draught works which are never again written: "Spirit of the times", "Oceania.
Now he is William Patrick Corgan, as such he was christened in Chicago, he plays only the piano and plastic organ, and the artificial string players humkäsigen syrup. "Ogilala", this is exotic, now maybe Corgan is an Indian or insuch a way, and there are the weird songtitles still: "Half-Life Of An Autodidact", "Amarinthe", "Mandarynne", "Zowie". With "Antietam" and "Shiloh" he is a historian of the Sezession war battles. The pieces last only in each case three or four minutes, Corgans song grumbles and whines like ever, and William Patrick Corgan sounds at the same time perfect like Billy Corgan who sings the oldmelodies, and how a voice imitator who copies the tendons of the boy Billy in the pelican crossing with his acoustic guitar, a piano and a cheap keyboard orchestra. Sometimes one thinks that „Let It of Be“comes.
It is a moving ballad kitsch, Billy miaows guileless easy songs of the kind „I wanted to reduce to the minimum, me on myself consider, the songs were there suddenly, they wanted to be taken up, and then I have made this, only I and the studio, the whole stuff do not need I anymore, it was like a recovery, and now go I alone on tour, exactly tomorrow“. Rogue, let drip, scholler, go on and on: "It's a long way to get back home" and the like.
It was more thrilling than Billy Corgan of the care burnt. This William Patrick Corgan is a sleepy head, a Träumerle. The American Elton John on the Bontempi-grand piano..



https://rollingstoneaus.com/reviews/...ck-corgan/7282

William Patrick Corgan - Ogilala

2017.10.17

Rod Yates

3 / 5

Smashing Pumpkins head honcho strips back with pleasant results.
Billy Corgan is no stranger to self-indulgence – remember that eight-hour live set inspired by Siddhartha? – so seeing him use his full name on this solo offering sets off the ‘pretentious warning’ alert. The truth couldn’t be more different – this is the most straight forward, stripped-back album of Corgan’s career. Accompanied by piano and/or acoustic guitar, the Rick Rubin-helmed Ogilala suffers only from being perfectly pleasant, nothing more, nothing less. “Aeronaut” and “Archer” contain melodies so wistful and beautiful they weaken the knees, but elsewhere Ogilala is notable mainly for hearing Corgan in such raw surroundings, as opposed to its songs.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 03:22 PM   #37
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PINK became immediately Nr. 1 in her first week on the BILLBOARD charts, BECK entered in his first week Nr. 3.
With WILLIAM P. CORGAN landing on position 183 you can already say that his new record will be his greatest commercial failure. MARILYN MANSON started a week earlier with his new record HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN very good on Nr. 8, but fell down this week to 84. Will CORGAN survive in the BILLBOARD 200 next week...?

http://www.billboard.com/charts/billboard-200


In the charts it's a Zero...

Last edited by Corgan's Bluff : 10-29-2017 at 04:24 PM.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 03:48 PM   #38
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Nonsense review. 5.7. This album is an 8. Without reading im sure Foo Fighters latest get's higher. That has nothing to do with quality of music and all to do with the fact that people suck Grohls balls.
Yeah, I'm facinated at how much Grohl has become the media's darling over the past 10-12 years or so.

In the media's eyes Grohl can do no wrong and yet he hasn't made a decent Foo Fighters record since Echoes.

I was so stoked for Wasting Light until I heard it, and since then it's just gotten worse for the Foos... but you wouldn't know it from reading the professional reviews. Going by what's been published you'd think that the last three Foo Fighter albums were amazing when they're anything but...

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 04:02 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by bigoltitties View Post
Nonsense review. 5.7. This album is an 8. Without reading im sure Foo Fighters latest get's higher. That has nothing to do with quality of music and all to do with the fact that people suck Grohls balls.
there's no way it's an 8. adore is an 8. mcis and sd are around 9-9.5. machina is a 6.5-7.

i LIKE the album but it's nothing over a 6. mtae is like a 3.5 and zeitgeist is near ogilala

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 04:08 PM   #40
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there's no way it's an 8. adore is an 8. mcis and sd are around 9-9.5. machina is a 6.5-7.

i LIKE the album but it's nothing over a 6. mtae is like a 3.5 and zeitgeist is near ogilala
MtaE is a 3.5? That's generous...

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 04:50 PM   #41
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i was going to go lower but it has a song i like and i can think of stuff that would be below it (like siddartha)

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 05:56 PM   #42
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Have ya'll like heard of them negative numbers?

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 06:14 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Jelly Blossom View Post
Rubin appreciates things raw in general... it has nothing to do with him specifically appreciating "raw Corgan" as you say.

Rubin is known for dry, reverbless productions and minimal arrangements (see his work with Johnny Cash, among others).

ObladiOblada is a Rubin-by-numbers production.
raw Cash is also good... so whatever. do you think he would like raw Britney Spears?

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 06:17 PM   #44
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raw Cash is also good... so whatever. do you think he would like raw Britney Spears?
I have no idea what Rick Rubin would like. Why don't you ask him instead of asking me?

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 06:19 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Corgan's Bluff View Post
PINK became immediately Nr. 1 in her first week on the BILLBOARD charts, BECK entered in his first week Nr. 3.
With WILLIAM P. CORGAN landing on position 183 you can already say that his new record will be his greatest commercial failure. MARILYN MANSON started a week earlier with his new record HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN very good on Nr. 8, but fell down this week to 84. Will CORGAN survive in the BILLBOARD 200 next week...?

http://www.billboard.com/charts/billboard-200


In the charts it's a Zero...
he shot himself in the foot there because 'WPC' doesn't ring a bell to anybody

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 06:25 PM   #46
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Got new lights, new home, now just need some new music.. hint hint Mr. @Billy #WaitingForSoloAlbum2 7:20 AM - 3 Mar 2017


It rang a bell(y) with this fellah.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 06:26 PM   #47
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MonteLDS @MonteLDS

Mormons, talktive ones. 1:13 AM - 28 Oct 2017

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 07:37 PM   #48
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I've been thinking and I kinda figure that the album is simply a kind of nod to fans to say "see, I can still write thoughtful music". Almost as if the album is a kind of a cathartic reset for him or something. I don't really think he was planning on making a hit or using the album as a comeback... But who knows.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 07:43 PM   #49
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It's also possible that Corgan overvalued the reaction to the plainsong tour. That was a situation were people just wanted to hear their favorite songs in an intimate charming setting, not hearing brand new songs in that format.

That tour also had Jimmy which is a big selling point as far the sound goes. Because keep in mind that the SP also got great reviews once Jimmy was back on the Manson tour.

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 07:51 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by Jelly Blossom View Post
Yeah, I'm facinated at how much Grohl has become the media's darling over the past 10-12 years or so.

In the media's eyes Grohl can do no wrong and yet he hasn't made a decent Foo Fighters record since Echoes.


Eddie Trunk explains this phenomena pretty well here; nothing against the Foo's, but its mainly lazy entertainment hacks thinking too inside the box all the time:




 
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Old 10-29-2017, 09:47 PM   #51
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O i taught maybe dave made a sacrifice to baphomet or something

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 10:21 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Jelly Blossom View Post
Yeah, I'm facinated at how much Grohl has become the media's darling over the past 10-12 years or so.

In the media's eyes Grohl can do no wrong and yet he hasn't made a decent Foo Fighters record since Echoes.

I was so stoked for Wasting Light until I heard it, and since then it's just gotten worse for the Foos... but you wouldn't know it from reading the professional reviews. Going by what's been published you'd think that the last three Foo Fighter albums were amazing when they're anything but...
Excuse me, Wasting Light was fucking AWESOME, except for Walk and I Should've Known, rest is tiiight.

But yeah, Foos records can be a bit hit and miss, but so can Pumpkins records. Concrete & Gold is pretty great

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 10:37 PM   #53
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at least FF is intentionally shitty and mass marketed

honestly, the first three albums + nirvana were so good that dave can do what he wants

 
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Old 10-29-2017, 10:42 PM   #54
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Sorry ram but you are wrong.

someone needs to kill dave grohl asap

 
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Old 10-30-2017, 12:00 AM   #55
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Comparing Billy's discography to Foo Fighters, the Foo's had about the same quality drop off than Billy. Billy was better for longer than Grohl though. Never seen a band get so much worse yet get so much bigger than they were when they were actually releasing decent albums.

Gish - 9/10
SD - 10/10
Pisces - 9/10
MCIS - 9.5/10
Adore - 8/10
Machina - 7/10
Zwan - 5.5/10
TFE - 5/10
Zeitgeist - 5/10
Teargarden - 4/10
Oceania - 4/10
MTAE - 6/10
Ogilala - 5.5/10
--
Foo Fighters - 8/10
Colour & Shape - 9/10
There Is Nothing Left to Lose - 8/10
One By One - 5/10
In Your Honor - 5/10
Echoes - 5/10
Wasting Light - 6/10
Sonic Highways - 4/10
Concrete and Gold - 5/10

 
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Old 10-30-2017, 02:20 AM   #56
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MTAE is a solid 2
Oceania is a 7.5
Zeitgeist is a 6 at least
TFE is a 2
Ogilala also a 2

 
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Old 10-30-2017, 03:33 AM   #57
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MTAE is a solid 2
Oceania is a 7.5
Zeitgeist is a 6 at least
TFE is a 2
Ogilala also a 2
Agree with this.

 
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Old 10-30-2017, 10:59 AM   #58
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Oceania is not even close to a 7.5

 
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Old 10-30-2017, 11:56 AM   #59
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I have listened to Oceania only once.

 
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Old 10-30-2017, 02:27 PM   #60
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How often has JESSICA listened to OCEANIA...?



The arrangements of MY LOVE IS WINTER and PALE HORSE are so terrible that I only want to hear these songs as early live versions.

JESSICA has closed her OCEANIA-chapter with uncle BILL:

"...The music man is Jessica's second performing-arts-loving partner following her two-year romance with The Smashing Pumpkins frontman Billy Corgan, which ended in 2012.
Despite her happy relationship, the Australian songstress has dealt with her fair share of pain recently - quite literally.
Jessica has been undergoing intense laser treatments to remove a tattoo on her arm.
She and her sister Lisa are working on their third studio album for The Veronicas, their first new release in seven years. ..."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...#ixzz4x1CqMqnH

 
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