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04-29-2018, 11:05 PM | #1471 |
Socialphobic
Location: montreal
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04-29-2018, 11:37 PM | #1472 | |
Banned
Posts: 21,169
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I dunno. This whole thing feels very slapped together in order to make some easy money. Has James Iha even commented about returning to the band? I don't think he's said a thing. I don't know how to describe it exactly, but it just feels like there's been a weird air around this tour. You usually see these big reunions, and they're always rolled out with big fanfare. Motley Crue comes to mind. They were all together for a press conference when they announced they were back together and embarking on a tour and it was all a big deal. And with STP and Weiland didn't they kick-ass on Kimmel right before announcing that they'd be getting back together and going on tour? I dunno... Just feels kinda off. I guess there's still a little over 2 months to go before the shows so anything can happen, but usually you'd see artists trying to create an excitement before the tickets go on sale |
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04-30-2018, 12:26 AM | #1473 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 1,270
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04-30-2018, 01:16 AM | #1474 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 1,270
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The inherent problem with this is that D'arcy is not there. Take when they released the Billy/James/Jimmy/Jeff photoshoot and behind the scenes video for it, it wasn't really a big deal. I think Alternative Nation is the only site that actually did a story based around the photo/video. Now if that was the first photo of the original lineup together in years, and a VIDEO of them hanging out behind the scenes? Everybody would have been going nuts over it and it would have been viral. The reason why STP and Soundgarden's reunion tours were successful is that the entire lineups were there. I actually think a Pumpkins reunion with the original lineup could have been bigger than either of those due the time that has passed, and the fact that those two bands and others from the 90's are now incapable of trotting out their original lineups. That's what makes this really suck, all four of them could be hailed right now as some of the last survivors of the 90's rising like a phoenix to carry on their generation's sound. It sucks that Billy, James, Jimmy, and D'arcy won't get the celebration together that they deserve for their legacy. My criticism of Billy's handling of this is actually because I'm a huge fan of his, and it's sad that he's not going to get his moment of triumph this year that I thought he'd have and was excited about for the last two years. It still could be a really great tour with some really great music, but he's not going to have the moment he could have if it was the entire original lineup. He could have finally become the well respected voice of a generation he's wanted to be, and deserves to be. |
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04-30-2018, 01:46 AM | #1475 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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I wouldn't be surprised the Steven Adler plan was the idea since ever but again I wouldn't say Billy is wrong about it. What would you do if you were on his shoes planning a reunion with someone who last time you saw was neck deep in drugs, stopped making music since then, disappeared from the public eyes to only make the news again for the mugshots and drink driving incidents. Specially if they did try to meet with her. |
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04-30-2018, 02:36 AM | #1476 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 1,270
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If he has those stories to tell, I'd love to hear them. But if he won't tell them, or doesn't actually have the stories, we are simply playing a guessing game as long as he is silent. That's what makes the situation more frustrating, I'd genuinely like to hear what he has to say without the verbiage he uses to disguise himself on Instagram. Again, just based on what we know (which is not much from him), I would have made every effort to meet in person before ever getting in serious discussions about any sort of major tours. I also wouldn't start planning a reunion until I actually met in person with everybody. If he had met with D'arcy in 2016 and it just didn't click, they could have amicably at that point not reunited on a musical level, before ever even getting into deep discussions about it. It would have saved fans from the year and a half of Billy talking about her in interviews/the full original band reuniting, which ended up leading to blue balls in the end. Billy is in the wrestling business and should understand this analogy: you don't hype a match if you aren't sure you can book it. It'd be like Vince McMahon teasing fans for two years that Steve Austin was going to come out of retirement to face The Rock and Brock Lesnar at WrestleMania, and then at the last minute Vince announces it's just The Rock vs. Brock Lesnar. Billy could have had James rejoin the band without the context of a 'reunion' if he'd had a meeting with D'arcy and hypothetically things didn't work out (and hey, WHAT IF THEY DID WORK OUT if they had met?) and things could have been friendlier than they are now with D'arcy. The big issue is she felt strung along. If James had officially rejoined in 2016 or 2017 without it being hyped as 'the original lineup is back,' and then D'arcy was later invited as a guest in a different context, this would all be way different IMO. Last edited by WeilandFan : 04-30-2018 at 02:46 AM. |
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04-30-2018, 02:45 AM | #1477 | |
Minion of Satan
Posts: 6,014
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Billy never wanted a real reunion. |
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04-30-2018, 02:59 AM | #1478 |
Minion of Satan
Posts: 6,014
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Billy probably thought:
I can't handle D'Arcy being the moral compass of the band again. Jack Bates doesn't question any of my decisions. I need the tour to be succesful so I don't want to take any risks with D'Arcy. She surely needs some money so she'll agree to an Adler role. I don't have to put any energy into re-establishing a musical relationship with D'Arcy so there's no need to meet her. |
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04-30-2018, 04:40 AM | #1479 |
Minion of Satan
Location: Travelling between Ukraine and Russia
Posts: 5,305
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Jimmy Chamberlin was the first talking publicly about tour plans with the Smashing Pumpkins a year ago. Including all four original members.
But has still never been in contact with D'arcy since nineteen years. James Iha has last spoken to D'arcy in 2016 or 2017. Refuses to answer her attempts to get in touch with him since then. Billy Corgan was the only person of the three, D’arcy really ever was in communication with for one and a half year -until January. But only by text messages and some phone calls. Was it only a lack of interest of the others, not to reach out to her? Did they already know about a plan of Corgan, to give her only just a guest role? Last edited by Corgan's Bluff : 04-30-2018 at 05:03 AM. |
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04-30-2018, 05:35 AM | #1480 | ||
Minion of Satan
Posts: 6,014
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>>> June 2017: Quote:
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04-30-2018, 05:59 AM | #1481 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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Actually, I can't see what else Billy or the band could add to this narrative without sharing some nasty stories about her or, as I said before, sharing messages where they clearly invited her over. I agree they didn't know how to manage this whole negotiation. Billy preferred using the low pressure, open door policy with her, for which we can only speculate why - maybe he was really concerned about her, maybe he just didn't want her to be in his way. We also can only speculate about why they didn't meet before - Darcy says she was never invited or that she couldn't be there due to her shoulder, on the other hand the band says she was invited several times but she always deferred. What people is not taking in consideration is that Darcy story doesn't add up. Even if it's true that Billy only wanted her there for 2 songs and sing Daydream, they would still need to meet, to get her on board for rehearsing and see how she's really doing mentally, physically and musically. Or do you think she would just show up for the first gig without going through the process? Over the years I've learned that if things don't make sense they usually aren't true. And by that I'm not saying she's deliberately lying, but maybe whatever she felt was happening wasn't actually happening. |
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04-30-2018, 08:11 AM | #1482 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 3,861
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Corgan made a vague statement and got his mate to smear D’arcy with the Mancow photo. He did that instead of showing us evidence of her declining to meet on multiple occasions. Who would you believe in this situation? Last edited by VoxUpDoc : 04-30-2018 at 08:18 AM. |
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04-30-2018, 08:23 AM | #1483 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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So you're saying he reconnected with her after 19 years of zero communication, told her he got himself "into a bit of a hole", that he borrowed "a LOT of $$$ from someone in the SoundGarden camp" , shared plans about the reunion and the tour that she "HELPED PLAN FOR 1 & 1/2 years" because he was never serious about working with her again? Really?
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04-30-2018, 08:43 AM | #1484 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 3,861
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If he was serious he would have met her prior to discussing the potential of a huge make-or-break tour. |
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04-30-2018, 09:05 AM | #1485 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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Again, we can only speculate why they never met - She will say she was never invited, they will say she declined the invitations. It's a fact Billy would go ahead with the reunion even without her probably because they were never sure if she was able to be part of it (for the circumstances involving her), but that doesn't mean he didn't want her to be part of if she was able to. |
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04-30-2018, 09:17 AM | #1486 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 2,625
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My guess would be that D'arcy, having not been in the music business for 19 years, didn't immediately jump at every opportunity Corgan gave her to meet up with him (e.g. during the solo tour). Corgan probably interpreted this as "deferring" when the reality was, she remained interested in being a part of the band (you can tell she truly felt hurt when she saw Billy, Jimmy, James, and Jeff in the studio without her). It goes back to the main disagreement Corgan admits he had with D'arcy during the band's heyday. He considers the band the end all be all of his professional and personal life, whereas D'arcy puts other priorities above the band.
As for why Jimmy and James didn't reach out... From what I've been told, Jimmy has purposefully taken a "hands off" approach to being in the band since he returned in 2015. Jimmy took a more active approach in handling the band's business affairs from 2006 to 2008, which led to many disagreements since Corgan had final say in the matters (although he apparently took Jimmy's opinion into consideration). Jimmy felt this was one of the biggest factors that led to him and Corgan falling out in 2009, and decided that if he was to re-join, he wanted to focus exclusively on music. He joins the band for rehearsals and shows, and pretty much has no other involvement in the day-to-day matters of the band. I imagine the idea of trying to mediate between Billy and D'arcy was the last thing he wanted to do, particularly when Jimmy has said before that he enjoys playing with other bassists more than D'arcy. As for James, I do not think it could be more obvious this is a financial decision for him. I am not slighting him. The dude just turned 50 and has a wife and two children. He deserves to be able to profit off a band he co-founded and played a vital part in its success; particularly after Corgan spent almost a decade squandering the band's accumulated goodwill. Hey, Iha may even have some fun playing on the tour, but the money probably speaks more to him at this point in his life than staying in touch with a woman he only spoke to sporadically. Last edited by themadcaplaughs : 04-30-2018 at 09:24 AM. |
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04-30-2018, 09:20 AM | #1487 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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04-30-2018, 09:26 AM | #1488 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 2,625
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Or maybe what Corgan considers an "invitation" and what D'arcy considers an "invitation" remain two different things, resulting in a misunderstanding. It may not be as black and white a situation as it appears. D'arcy clarified in the AN regarding the final Metro show and the 2007 reunion that Corgan considered presenting opportunities to join him through third parties an "invitation," whereas D'arcy only wants personal invitations.
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04-30-2018, 09:29 AM | #1489 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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Maybe, but then either she "didn't immediately jump at every opportunity Corgan gave her to meet up with him" or she was never invited. It can't be both.
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04-30-2018, 10:50 AM | #1490 | |
Demi-God
Location: a house in new orleans
Posts: 352
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04-30-2018, 11:45 AM | #1491 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 3,414
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This should have happened. |
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04-30-2018, 11:45 AM | #1492 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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Bc apologist? I'm being very reasonable with darcy and Billy here. Even tho I'm a netphorian, I'm not a hater at all.
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04-30-2018, 11:53 AM | #1493 | ||
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,845
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04-30-2018, 12:07 PM | #1494 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 1,235
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Billy really did try but unfortunately he just hasn't got the required "skill set" for meeting up with old friends. It's heartbreaking really.
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04-30-2018, 12:11 PM | #1495 |
Minion of Satan
Posts: 6,014
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04-30-2018, 12:13 PM | #1496 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 1,235
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My sources say that they DID 100% all meet up in person. Unfortunately Billys artistic vision for the in person meet up was so grandiose that he had no choice but to eat her lunch and do her bits of conversation for her.
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04-30-2018, 12:17 PM | #1497 |
Apocalyptic Poster
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04-30-2018, 12:23 PM | #1498 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 2,625
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04-30-2018, 01:55 PM | #1499 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 1,270
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Just finished writing an article about D'arcy's greatest vocal performances for her 50th birthday tomorrow. Everyone feel free to write her happy birthday wishes in the comments on there once it's up, as I'll send her the piece once it's up.
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04-30-2018, 03:27 PM | #1500 |
Just Hook it to My Veins!
Location: Donald Trump of Netphoria
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