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Old 02-08-2002, 04:32 PM   #31
ava adore 13
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by Smack Me In My Mouth:
I think a lot of people are turned off by the "washed-out" feel of the tracks. When I listen to it, the only distinct instrument I hear are the drums--the guitar and bass parts kind of fade together into an indistinct blur.
well, that's what i love about machina. i find that sound a lot more interesting than the standard rock sound.

 
Old 02-09-2002, 05:04 AM   #32
sarmatianus
 
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I really honestly feel that years down the road Machina will be properly appreciated. Whether that is because people will have had time to digest it, or it will become influential, or whathaveyou...I don't know. But I just have this gut feeling that the real Machina mystery is the album revealing itself over time.

sarmatianus

 
Old 02-09-2002, 04:10 PM   #33
Flebath
 
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally posted by sarmatianus:
I really honestly feel that years down the road Machina will be properly appreciated. Whether that is because people will have had time to digest it, or it will become influential, or whathaveyou...I don't know. But I just have this gut feeling that the real Machina mystery is the album revealing itself over time.

sarmatianus
I agree.

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Old 02-09-2002, 04:36 PM   #34
THRILLHO
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by sarmatianus:
I really honestly feel that years down the road Machina will be properly appreciated. Whether that is because people will have had time to digest it, or it will become influential, or whathaveyou...I don't know. But I just have this gut feeling that the real Machina mystery is the album revealing itself over time.

sarmatianus
B.C. says this shit all the time, and I personally find it hilarious. He said it with Adore multiple times. It's been 4 years - look at the influence on modern rock it's had! Better give it another 10-15.

I just think that's a really silly thing to believe in, that an album will somehow magically reveal itself over time. I really doubt Bolly was capable of writing a intricately patched-together story with so many subtle layers of symbolism and metaphor that it only becomes dechiperable after years of dwelling and interpreting. The Chards of Glass/GATMOC chapters totally prove that. I'd be willing to bet that in 10 or 20 years or whenever mainstream rock music will not have 'evolved' to the point that mythical and symbolic lyrics about crying trees and ages of innocence have replaced 'put yo hands in the air like you just don't care!!!'

The more I listen to the Pumpkins albums nowadays, the more I realize how great they are and how much I love/loved them. Except Machina, which is kind of the opposite.

 
Old 02-09-2002, 04:38 PM   #35
THRILLHO
 
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Post

Quote:
Originally posted by sarmatianus:
I really honestly feel that years down the road Machina will be properly appreciated. Whether that is because people will have had time to digest it, or it will become influential, or whathaveyou...I don't know. But I just have this gut feeling that the real Machina mystery is the album revealing itself over time.

sarmatianus
B.C. says this shit all the time, and I personally find it hilarious. He said it with Adore multiple times. It's been 4 years - look at the influence on modern rock it's had! Better give it another 10-15.

I just think that's a really silly thing to believe in, that an album will somehow magically reveal itself over time. I really doubt Bolly was capable of writing a intricately patched-together story with so many subtle layers of symbolism and metaphor that it only becomes dechiperable after years of dwelling and interpreting. The Chards of Glass/GATMOC chapters totally prove that. I'd be willing to bet that in 10 or 20 years or whenever mainstream rock music will not have 'evolved' to the point that mythical and symbolic lyrics about crying trees and ages of innocence have replaced 'put yo hands in the air like you just don't care!!!'

The more I listen to the Pumpkins albums nowadays, the more I realize how great they are and how much I love/loved them. Except Machina, which is kind of the opposite.

 
Old 02-09-2002, 04:54 PM   #36
sarmatianus
 
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You're misinterpreting. I am not saying that the story and symbolism will suddenly become clear years down the road - I only said that the album would be more clearly accepted and understood as an accomplishment years down the road.

And as for Adore, I don't know if Billy ever said that it (or Machina) would get better with age, but I can say this - whenever I play Adore for my friends who aren't already Pumpkins fans, they always ask me to burn them a copy. Hard evidence? Certainly not, but it is interesting to note.

sarmatianus

 
Old 02-09-2002, 09:47 PM   #37
Spaced
 
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Am I the only one who thinks that Machina is some of the pumpkins greatest stuff. And i really like how it sounds like all the instruments are one, it is so layered that if you want to hear the bass you have to listen specifically for that. It's really amazing.

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Old 02-09-2002, 09:57 PM   #38
Raskolnikov
 
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Yea, with the exception of a few turds, I really like Machina. I didn't start this thread to be a Machina bashing/praising thread, but it's actually cool that it's turned into that.

Cool to see that admist all of the Machina haters on this board, there are a few that enjoy it.

I mean, it's by no means my favorite of the SP catalogue- but it's good stuff nonetheless.

 
Old 02-09-2002, 09:59 PM   #39
THRILLHO
 
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well, i'm not selling it or anything!

like they say, medicore [your favorite band here] is better than the best of [new trendy band that sucks].

 
Old 02-10-2002, 11:08 AM   #40
Irrelevant
 
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let's see. it strives to sound polished, and i think that a lot of the time it just ends up sounding cheesy to me. like they're trying too hard.

the songs that were produced well? i don't have much to complain about when it comes to The Everlasting Gaze, Try to Try, and The Crying Tree of Mercury. i have few complaints about Blue Skies Bring Tears (that electronic voice at the very very end is horrible), Age of Innocence (i wish the second verse would have sounded dirtier, like it did live), or This Time (it feels long and doesn't change much, thus becomes a bit droney). and then there's SIYL, which i don't care for much at all, but that's the song's fault and not the production.

the rest of the songs i feel have significant flaws in the way the studio version was layed down. so you can tack that up to "they don't like it cuz its different!!!" if you wish. whatever. it's the only SP album i have a qualm with, including Adore and Machina II. and my qualm isn't with the songwriting; sure i'd vote SIYL off the island, but there are songs on other albums which people love that i don't care for. like By Starlight, Take Me Down, Farewell and Goodnight, Daydream... oh well. it's just that overall there's something about the sound of Machina that grates on my nerves.

 
Old 02-10-2002, 04:31 PM   #41
The exploding boy
 
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Angry

Quote:
Originally posted by Irrelevant:
and then there's SIYL, which i don't care for much at all, but that's the song's fault and not the production.

sure i'd vote SIYL off the island, but there are songs on other albums which people love that i don't care for.
bes SP song ever (With tonight tonight).

 
Old 02-10-2002, 07:05 PM   #42
Irrelevant
 
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Unhappy

Quote:
Originally posted by The exploding boy:
bes SP song ever (With tonight tonight).
*shakes his head in disappointment*

i expected better, even from you.

 
Old 02-10-2002, 07:08 PM   #43
Flebath
 
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Machina is definitely not my fav., but I still have always liked it. I love having TEG as an opener and finishing w/ Age of Innocence. I think Age of Innocence is one of my favorite songs on the album.

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AIM: flebath

 
Old 02-10-2002, 08:48 PM   #44
The exploding boy
 
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Angry

Quote:
Originally posted by Irrelevant:
*shakes his head in disappointment*

i expected better, even from you.
You must be the kind of person who think soma or thru the eyes or blank page are great.

 
 


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