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Old 04-12-2009, 06:41 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by Nimrod's Son View Post
redbreegull is all about higher obligations because he hasn't had to pay taxes yet and his mommy cooks his breakfast
It's not my fault that you are so narrow minded that simply becoming an adult has made you an insufferable, cynical dickhead. But of course, you're right, aspiring to higher level social goals is for 12 year olds.

 
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Old 04-12-2009, 06:54 PM   #92
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Nimrod shouldn't have said that you can get by living in a city without obligating yourself to someone at all. If someone is wanting to be hypercritical about it and take it painfully literally, then sure, that statement is wrong.
uh he did tell me to look it up in the dictionary

I didn't actually become hypercritical or take it "painfully literally" until this. The fact that it continued for a page or so after I looked it up is really pretty amusing to me.

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But on the other hand, everyone else has been shifting freely between specific moral and legal obligations to you and yours (eg. pay your taxes, support your family) and vague, pie-in-the-sky, "everyone's all in this together" BS and treating them as though they're the same concept.
everyone else who? I'm not picking up on their points.

I mean even you sort of get it, though of course you have to argue with me because you're a gigantic tool. But that's the point, nimrod said what he said, told me to look up the definition of obligation in the dictionary, i did, and he still doesn't quite get it and he's still clinging to his original statement. Or he's just trying to argue into the ground because he knows he misspoke and acted like a complete douchebag about it. Far be it for him to actually admit wrongness or an error like he's an actual human being.

I don't understand why you think all the liberals on this board are arguing the exact same thing, like me and redbreedgull are the same person.

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Old 04-12-2009, 07:02 PM   #93
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It's not my fault that you are so narrow minded that simply becoming an adult has made you an insufferable, cynical dickhead. But of course, you're right, aspiring to higher level social goals is for 12 year olds.
No, it's just that you're very quick to give away other people's shit because you're used to having an authority figure provide for all of your needs.

 
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Old 04-12-2009, 07:05 PM   #94
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You really love to fall back on that ad hominem attack don't you.

 
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Old 04-12-2009, 07:07 PM   #95
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When it applies, yes.

 
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Old 04-12-2009, 07:47 PM   #96
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No, it's just that you're very quick to give away other people's shit because you're used to having an authority figure provide for all of your needs.
It must be really useful to be able to see people's motivations without knowing anything about their lives. It's like you have a superpower or something.

Of course, you wouldn't have any idea that my family used to bring in under $20,000 a year, or that my father spent the past 15 years in a corporate nightmare job that he hated going to every day to provide for us, or that my mother had to babysit 6 kids without a daycare license when I was in elementary school so that my family could pay rent. You also wouldn't know anything about how my father was laid off last year and has been out of work for almost 5 months now with no visible prospects in the future, or that the entirety of my personal savings from the last four years of working (saving about 85% of each paycheck) is about to go towards my college tuition when I leave for a four year school next semester and that it won't even cover the whole first semester because there is just no other money for me to go to school.

Wait, I clearly have no idea what I'm talking about. I'm an over-privileged bitch who doesn't know what it is like to have to provide for myself. Watching my parents struggle to put food on the table when I was little definitely didn't teach me anything.

All your arguments are completely selfish and centered entirely on yourself. It's a bad attitude and hopefully one that will go extinct in the future.

 
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Old 04-12-2009, 08:07 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by redbreegull View Post
It must be really useful to be able to see people's motivations without knowing anything about their lives. It's like you have a superpower or something.

Of course, you wouldn't have any idea that my family used to bring in under $20,000 a year, or that my father spent the past 15 years in a corporate nightmare job that he hated going to every day to provide for us, or that my mother had to babysit 6 kids without a daycare license when I was in elementary school so that my family could pay rent. You also wouldn't know anything about how my father was laid off last year and has been out of work for almost 5 months now with no visible prospects in the future, or that the entirety of my personal savings from the last four years of working (saving about 85% of each paycheck) is about to go towards my college tuition when I leave for a four year school next semester and that it won't even cover the whole first semester because there is just no other money for me to go to school.

Wait, I clearly have no idea what I'm talking about. I'm an over-privileged bitch who doesn't know what it is like to have to provide for myself. Watching my parents struggle to put food on the table when I was little definitely didn't teach me anything.

All your arguments are completely selfish and centered entirely on yourself. It's a bad attitude and hopefully one that will go extinct in the future.
Actually your entire argument is based solely on yourself. Because your parents were failures you want the government to step in and provide for everyone, and you want to take from the successful people and give to your parents.

Also just so you know, I didn't grow up in the lap of luxury and I paid for my own schooling, so enough of your "woe is me" blabbering.

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 03:26 AM   #98
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Actually your entire argument is based solely on yourself. Because your parents were failures you want the government to step in and provide for everyone, and you want to take from the successful people and give to your parents.

Also just so you know, I didn't grow up in the lap of luxury and I paid for my own schooling, so enough of your "woe is me" blabbering.
I think the fact that you consider being unable to make enough money a failing characteristic in a person pretty much sums up your attitude towards others.

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 03:35 AM   #99
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Nimrod really how can you base your entire argument against this guy based on half-truths and assumptions of his personal character/family situation?

don't you realize that's like the lowest form of debate

you should be on Fox News. Christalmighty.

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 03:36 AM   #100
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also shame on redbreedgull for feeding the beast with personal information. bad move little dude. you don't have anything to justify to this prick.

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 03:37 AM   #101
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You don't pay a mortgage and provide for your family just by being a good person.

Besides, you're the one who are using your family as an example of needing to take from others.

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 03:38 AM   #102
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nimrod sounds like my father except that my father is actually successful

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 03:53 AM   #103
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i wouldn't be surprised if i make more than your gas station attendant/taxi driver/7-11 clerk father

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 04:05 AM   #104
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Old 04-13-2009, 04:05 AM   #105
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You don't pay a mortgage and provide for your family just by being a good person.

Besides, you're the one who are using your family as an example of needing to take from others.
are joo talking to me?

 
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Old 04-13-2009, 04:12 AM   #106
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i wouldn't be surprised if i make more than your gas station attendant/taxi driver/7-11 clerk father
you will probably never be a millionaire. you failed at life and are a bad person too!

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 04:02 AM   #107
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i don't really think Obama's doing a bad job. if someone would like to explain to me otherwise, i'll happily re-consider.

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 07:30 AM   #108
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you know if the economy comes out of the toilet people are going to be thrilled with him all over again

except for the quarter or so of the population that are hardline republicans

if the economy is still in the shitter well into 2011 he's fucking toast. i still won't really say he did a bad job though, he inherited a big bucket of shit from the worst president in american history

i won't be surprised if he loses re-election because the economy is still bad or something in 2012 and we have another carter/reagan thing

then i'll just leave the country. it'll be completely lost at that point.

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 12:37 PM   #109
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you know if the economy comes out of the toilet people are going to be thrilled with him all over again

except for the quarter or so of the population that are hardline republicans

if the economy is still in the shitter well into 2011 he's fucking toast. i still won't really say he did a bad job though, he inherited a big bucket of shit from the worst president in american history

i won't be surprised if he loses re-election because the economy is still bad or something in 2012 and we have another carter/reagan thing

then i'll just leave the country. it'll be completely lost at that point.
I think that unless the economy gets significantly worse, Obama still has a very good chance of winning in 2012. Obama has done a great deal of good in some other areas and additionally, I think the Democrats will be able to paint the GOP as out of touch, obstructionist ideologues for working against Obama from day 1.

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 07:18 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by Trotskilicious View Post
you know if the economy comes out of the toilet people are going to be thrilled with him all over again

except for the quarter or so of the population that are hardline republicans

if the economy is still in the shitter well into 2011 he's fucking toast. i still won't really say he did a bad job though, he inherited a big bucket of shit from the worst president in american history

i won't be surprised if he loses re-election because the economy is still bad or something in 2012 and we have another carter/reagan thing

then i'll just leave the country. it'll be completely lost at that point.
awesome, you've already given obama a pass no matter what he does

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 07:18 PM   #111
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I think that unless the economy gets significantly worse, Obama still has a very good chance of winning in 2012. Obama has done a great deal of good in some other areas and additionally, I think the Democrats will be able to paint the GOP as out of touch, obstructionist ideologues for working against Obama from day 1.
please explain the areas where Obama has done "a great deal of good" so far

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 08:13 PM   #112
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please explain the areas where Obama has done "a great deal of good" so far
Reversing Bush's executive orders on stem cells and the like, blowing the cover on his torture operation, restoring our ties with our friends and beginning the process of bridge building with our traditional enemies to start with.

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 09:03 PM   #113
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Reversing Bush's executive orders on stem cells and the like, blowing the cover on his torture operation, restoring our ties with our friends and beginning the process of bridge building with our traditional enemies to start with.
So killing babies, being soft on terrorists, and supplicating the US to foreign nations are all "good" things?

Easy now! I kid, I kid! (Mostly.)

Seriously though, I'm not sure that Obama's appeasement of his base would be enough to save him if the economy doesn't really get humming. (If it does pick up, then I agree with Trots. Obama will be able to do no wrong no matter what he does.) The majority of voters aren't going to be wowed by Gitmo being shut down or abortions being funded overseas or Obama bowing to the Saudi king and yukking it up with Hugo Chavez like they're old frat buddies. That all may play well with the lefties, but it wins no points among moderates.

Whether Obama survives the next election or not is going to depend almost entirely on how well the GOP can get their shit together. There's a groundswell right now that they really need to capitalize on and organize into something coherent. If they can't do it (and I don't have much confidence they can), Obama will skate by no matter how badly he does.

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 10:00 PM   #114
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So killing babies, being soft on terrorists, and supplicating the US to foreign nations are all "good" things?

Easy now! I kid, I kid! (Mostly.)

Seriously though, I'm not sure that Obama's appeasement of his base would be enough to save him if the economy doesn't really get humming. (If it does pick up, then I agree with Trots. Obama will be able to do no wrong no matter what he does.) The majority of voters aren't going to be wowed by Gitmo being shut down or abortions being funded overseas or Obama bowing to the Saudi king and yukking it up with Hugo Chavez like they're old frat buddies. That all may play well with the lefties, but it wins no points among moderates.

Whether Obama survives the next election or not is going to depend almost entirely on how well the GOP can get their shit together. There's a groundswell right now that they really need to capitalize on and organize into something coherent. If they can't do it (and I don't have much confidence they can), Obama will skate by no matter how badly he does.
I really don't know what the hell the GOP is going to do if the economy comes back. Bitch about the deficit I guess.. but they lack a lot of credibility there.

The GOP will run on 'trad. values' again and get their asses handed to them if the economy gets better.

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 10:08 PM   #115
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blowing the cover on his torture operation,
Given his refusal to do anything about it Im surprised you list this as an accomplishment.

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Originally Posted by Corganist View Post
Whether Obama survives the next election or not is going to depend almost entirely on how well the GOP can get their shit together. There's a groundswell right now that they really need to capitalize on and organize into something coherent. If they can't do it (and I don't have much confidence they can), Obama will skate by no matter how badly he does.
Yeah its early, but the GOP seems seriously incapable of doing anything. I dont even think they're waiting for failure, they just dont seem to know what to do thats not wedge issue, USA rah rah stuff.

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 10:29 PM   #116
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the GOP doesn't have a fucking clue right now. Of course pretty soon the Democrats message of "Hope! Change! George W. Bush sucks! Change!" is going to become completely irrelevant...

 
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Old 04-20-2009, 10:38 PM   #117
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Hopefully for anyone that cares about the issues it already is. It'll just be another battle for the middle/idiots. But itll be easier to convince them that Obama needs more time than for the GOP to trot out their usual BS.

 
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Old 04-21-2009, 12:39 AM   #118
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awesome, you've already given obama a pass no matter what he does
aside from economic issues which remain to be resolved he's pretty much done everything I wanted him to. including reneg on withdrawing from iraq.

Last edited by Trotskilicious : 04-21-2009 at 12:50 AM.

 
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Old 04-21-2009, 12:41 AM   #119
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So killing babies, being soft on terrorists, and supplicating the US to foreign nations are all "good" things?

Easy now! I kid, I kid! (Mostly.)

Seriously though, I'm not sure that Obama's appeasement of his base would be enough to save him if the economy doesn't really get humming. (If it does pick up, then I agree with Trots. Obama will be able to do no wrong no matter what he does.) The majority of voters aren't going to be wowed by Gitmo being shut down or abortions being funded overseas or Obama bowing to the Saudi king and yukking it up with Hugo Chavez like they're old frat buddies. That all may play well with the lefties, but it wins no points among moderates.
that bowing to the saudi king looks like an awkward trip than a bow. i think it's just inexperience there. however i don't think you can really deny there's always been an implicit bow in america's hypocritical relations with saudi arabia. you know, middle east you guys are dicks to your women and you need democracy but saudi arabia you're ok hehe.

dunno what the chavez stuff is about. good relations with OPEC? I have no idea.

generally i think america has a lot more to gain by selling to its enemies than being jerks to them. it's the ankh-morpork theory of international relations. the barbarian hordes can come sure, but make sure they leave with a sno-globe and a teeshirt (and dependent on us). Cowboypolitik really wasn't working.

gitmo being shut down is a wonderful thing, all we're doing is actually charging these guys with crimes and putting them in maximum security prisons thereby respecting our constitution and reassuming moral high ground. People act like we're just releasing them with a lollypop and an apology. Once convictions start rolling in the people are gonna love it.

and you're the last person that can speak for moderates...

Last edited by Trotskilicious : 04-21-2009 at 12:49 AM.

 
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Old 04-21-2009, 02:16 AM   #120
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that bowing to the saudi king looks like an awkward trip than a bow. i think it's just inexperience there.
Okay...

YouTube - Did Obama bow to Saudi King Abdullah, or was he cleaning the floor?

I'm willing to grant inexperience as an excuse. Maybe he didn't know he's not supposed to bow. But "he tripped?" Come on.

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however i don't think you can really deny there's always been an implicit bow in america's hypocritical relations with saudi arabia.
I don't deny it.

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dunno what the chavez stuff is about. good relations with OPEC? I have no idea.
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/...ez.xlarge1.jpg

They look awfully chummy there. Admittedly, maybe he's just a chummy guy. But still...

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generally i think america has a lot more to gain by selling to its enemies than being jerks to them. it's the ankh-morpork theory of international relations. the barbarian hordes can come sure, but make sure they leave with a sno-globe and a teeshirt (and dependent on us). Cowboypolitik really wasn't working.
There's got to be a middle ground between "Cowboypolitik" and "Let's all sit around and agree about how bad America sucks!" The solution to coming on too strong is not to go the exact opposite route. It's not like it all averages out in the end or something.

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gitmo being shut down is a wonderful thing, all we're doing is actually charging these guys with crimes and putting them in maximum security prisons thereby respecting our constitution and reassuming moral high ground.
Since when does our Constitution speak to the rights of foreigners?

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People act like we're just releasing them with a lollypop and an apology. Once convictions start rolling in the people are gonna love it.
Somehow I doubt that. Even if convictions do somehow "roll in," I doubt that there will be many thrilled about it. Whatever mechanism gets put in place by necessity is going to be less than a full fledged American courtroom trial. Thus, there will always be people who will challenge the validity of any conviction. And at the same time, you're going to have a lot of "not in my back yard" types who won't want these guys in their courts or their prisons.

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and you're the last person that can speak for moderates...
On this board? Hardly. Most republican =/= least moderate.

 
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