|
|
Register | Netphoria's Amazon.com Link | Members List | Mark Forums Read |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
01-15-2003, 02:46 AM | #1 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: Charm City
Posts: 1,033
|
So, the new holy grail?
First off, I am VERY grateful that MP was released. So I don't want to hear anyone saying that now that it's released, a thread like this is emerging out of ennui. I haven't even listened to all of it yet, but my ears are very happy.
Nonetheless, out of personal curiousity, what will be declared now as the new holy grail of the community? An obvious first candidate would be the Avalon show, but from what I have heard, it seems like it's circulating slowly and covertly, but at a rate at which it will be beyond preventing a leak sometime in the near future. My nomination would be for the so-called "LoC" tape - mostly for reasons that I just researched and discovered: 1. There are no other known copies confirmed to be in anybody's possession (though Billy, at the least, undoubtedly has one). 2. The tape is in the possession of the Copyright Office not the Library of Congress. This is an important distinction, because although the Copyright Office operates under the LoC, its depository holdings are independent of the LoC stacks. 3. Unlike the rather restrictive provisions of the LoC listening rooms, there are absolutely no standard accessings of Copyright deposits. "Copies of deposits may be obtained upon the request of the owner of the copyright in the deposit, by an attorney in connection with litigation involving the copyrighted work, and through a court order issued by a court having jurisdiction in a case in which the copy is to be submitted as evidence." 4. Security procedures for the entire LoC campus of buildings, as well as penalties for violations are stringent enough to scare away, well, anyone with either or a brain or anything less than secret agent skills. http://www.loc.gov/rr/security/ Yeah, so I think that it's not gonna happen. I know that this conversation has been had many times before, but to my knowledge, I don't think the LoC vs. Copyright Office difference was noted or mentioned. And it changes the chances of it being listened to by any of us, much less a copy coming out of there, from extremely slim to virtually nil. Oh well. |
|
01-15-2003, 03:20 AM | #2 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: dundas, ontario
Posts: 2,536
|
It all sounds really interesting...and I'd love to hear the recording. Although at this point, it seems pretty impossible, unless Billy gives the recording to someone, who then gives it to us Or someone gets a job at the Library of Congress and somehow obtains the recording through the high security...
|
|
01-15-2003, 03:54 AM | #3 |
Moderator
Posts: 892
|
I don't think the SD demos are the next holy grail. I'd rather have 12/2/00, or the "25 Songs O' Pumpkins" video.
But yeah, okay... I guess after those two, the Siamese Dream demos would be my next holy grail (probably tied with Avalon and the "I Fall" demo). But it's silly to even talk about them, because I think they're pretty much out of our hands. It's sorta like that pro-shot Arising Tour footage that the band used for the Untitled video. Yes, it exists... but good luck getting a copy of it. I don't know. Maybe I'm just too pessimistic. |
|
01-15-2003, 04:40 AM | #4 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: Charm City
Posts: 1,033
|
I guess by holy grail status, I mean desireability of the contents of the item combined with the difficulty of obtaining it. I don't see 12/2 being as difficult as this. At least we had a promise (forgotten, perhaps) of a dvd as well as half of the show in good circulation and at least three other recordings in underground circles.
As for the Adore shows...that's nice and all, but to me it's not as cool. First of all, we have many of those shows in nice recordings. Second, most of us don't really watch concert videos more than a handful of times. The allure of the SD demos is both the completely otherwise unknown songs on that tape as well as the possibilities of how the songs we know and love would sound in demo form. That to me brings it up to that level. Is 25 Songs the same as Fruit Bat Salad? |
|
01-15-2003, 04:53 AM | #5 | ||||
Moderator
Posts: 892
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I guess I'm missing 4 of the songs in my little list there, to make the total of 25... can anybody tell me what's on there that I don't know about? |
||||
|
01-15-2003, 06:07 AM | #6 |
Demi-God
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 278
|
Theres a Doors cover song in the 25 songs as well.
|
|
01-15-2003, 06:18 AM | #7 | |
Registered User
Location: ur underpants lol
Posts: 13,208
|
I'm more violent then you.
Quote:
|
|
|
01-15-2003, 06:22 AM | #8 | |
Ownz
Location: O)))
Posts: 532
|
Re: So, the new holy grail?
Quote:
As for the new holy grail, I'd go with Avalon. First one that comes to mind. -AZVD. |
|
|
01-15-2003, 06:28 AM | #9 |
Demi-God
Posts: 400
|
It's the Adore tour documentary they had clips from on the virgin site.
|
|
01-15-2003, 07:01 AM | #10 | ||||||||||||||
Moderator
Posts: 892
|
Re: Re: So, the new holy grail?
Quote:
http://www.copyright.gov/records Here are a few of my favorites, with my comments after each one: Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Now I can go to sleep. Last edited by Smiley : 01-15-2003 at 07:07 AM. |
||||||||||||||
|
01-15-2003, 09:51 AM | #11 |
Demi-God
Location: London, UK
Posts: 301
|
:)
I'd definately go for the full Pistachio medley.
|
|
01-15-2003, 01:41 PM | #12 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: Charm City
Posts: 1,033
|
What we really need to do is get Lawrence Lessig to destroy the copyright laws. The sooner those things go public domain, the sooner they can legally be listened to.
|
|
01-15-2003, 03:30 PM | #13 |
Pledge
Location: US
Posts: 113
|
Many of you have some good things as the "next holy grail" BUT
I usually don't post a lot, but I have an interest now. My heart has been pumping a little quicker lately knowing I will be seeing Zwan play on Sunday (thanks to a good friend). Seeing them on Sunday, and hopefully Monday, will mark the 12th straight year I have seen Billy perform live in person. I guess I am getting a little nostalgic, and reading this post makes me think of a lot things.
I like what a lot of people have put, and all would be great to have. I am not disbuting anything. I would love everything, but I really like video stuff. So, the 25 songs O'pumpkins would be great. Also, if you watch clips in Viewphoria, there are a lot of video shots from the 1988-1990 time period. Somewhere, someone has copies of those entire videos. I remember Dave A. saying he knew of a guy who has about 5 or 6 shows on video from 1989-1990 period. Wow, how about those. What about a complete video of the Pulse Cable Access show? I still don't know all the songs played there? Or, what about the following. 1988 - Billy's father's home studio My Dahlia (Break) There It Goes Under Your Spell Armed to the Teeth Screaming Sun Holiday I Fall About 12 songs were recorded by Billy and James, using a drum machine. My Dahlia was at this time titled Break; Sun was called Death of a Mind and featured an alternate chorus. (Taken from Jesse Miller's recording sessions) Now I am assuming There It Goes and Under Your Spell on MP are from these sessions, but what about getting these other songs. Or, from individual songs, what about Adore version of Let Me Give The World To You or a studio version of She (drool). I am sure I left something out, there is just so much Billy has created and provided us. There are a bunch of things, many of which I believe none of us even know about. I believe Billy has things even he forgot about, and that only he knows about. Anyway, I am in my glory to have MP, as hopefully we all are. Some people have brought some great things to my attention, hopefully I brought a few others to people's attention. We can argue and discuss what could/would/should be the "next holy grail", but in the big picture, it really doesn't matter. It is just something fun to think and dream about getting or hearing. Can you remember how you felt the first time you heard She from RTS, then how you felt when Billy abandoned it. Or the first time you heard Jackboot on Gravity Demos. It was all so great. So many memories and feelings. Either way, we are so lucky to have a proliphic singer/songwriter as Billy Corgan. If he never releases another thing, I feel so fortunate to be able to listen to what he has provided us. Don't ever take for granted what we all have, regardless if it is a common recording of something like 8/14/93 or 1/8/97, or something that at the time was new and fresh like RTS, Gravity Demos, or 10/5/88. Sure, there are things out there we all want like the Pulse Cable Access show, the pyscho video, the Hideout shows, Avalon, Adore tour rehearsal tapes, 88 demos, etc. This is all fun to talk about, but I will be happy, satisfied, and thankful even if nothing ever again gets released (officially or unofficially). Sorry for the ranting, but the idea of Zwan's new album and shows at the Metro get me really excited, like a kid in a candy story. Like the first time I heard I ever heard SP. Brian |
|
01-15-2003, 03:37 PM | #14 | |
Registered User
Location: ur underpants lol
Posts: 13,208
|
2022 is gonna be a good year
Quote:
Last edited by Axis of Action : 01-15-2003 at 03:40 PM. |
|
|
01-15-2003, 06:41 PM | #15 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: Portugal
Posts: 2,805
|
|
|
01-15-2003, 08:46 PM | #16 | |
Deaddy is your daddy!
Location: Veronica Mars played with my Wii.
Posts: 39,173
|
Monte
Quote:
__________________
I like video games, Spider-Man, and long walks on the beach. |
|
|
01-15-2003, 08:52 PM | #17 | |
Deaddy is your daddy!
Location: Veronica Mars played with my Wii.
Posts: 39,173
|
Quote:
http://members.rogers.com/deadster/leet.jpg |
|
|
01-15-2003, 09:02 PM | #18 | |
Deaddy is your daddy!
Location: Veronica Mars played with my Wii.
Posts: 39,173
|
"I kicked rock n roll in the fuckin nuts."
Quote:
|
|
|
01-15-2003, 10:23 PM | #19 | |
oh for fuck's sake
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 2,506
|
Quote:
|
|
|
01-15-2003, 10:44 PM | #20 | |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: Charm City
Posts: 1,033
|
Re: 2022 is gonna be a good year
Quote:
Now, if it was a copyright registered in Europe, then it'd be 50 years from registration, death or not. But being as these tapes are probably sitting in a warehouse somewhere in Northern Virginia, I wouldn't hold my hopes up. Plus, even if they had proper equipment to play cassettes by then, don't you think they'd be in terrible condition regardless? Sorry to be a pessimist about this, but either copyright laws are gonna have to change, or someone's gonna have to be charitable, otherwise we're not going to hear these. It'll be a rock history graduate student 100 years from now who'll be the first to get to hear these, given the current conditions. |
|
|
01-15-2003, 11:18 PM | #21 | ||
Moderator
Posts: 892
|
Quote:
but hey... that pic proves nothing! It could be from vieuphoria or full circle!! nobody believes you! So I guess you have no choice - you'll have to convert the whle thing to VCD and put it on the hub. ok? Quote:
|
||
|
01-16-2003, 02:23 AM | #22 | |
Deaddy is your daddy!
Location: Veronica Mars played with my Wii.
Posts: 39,173
|
Rock n Roll, baby!
Quote:
__________________
I like video games, Spider-Man, and long walks on the beach. |
|
|
01-16-2003, 05:08 AM | #23 | |
Amish Rake Fighter
Posts: 6
|
Re: Many of you have some good things as the "next holy grail" BUT
Quote:
That's about how I felt right at that point. I still like hearing the whole what, minute fifteen or so of the song and it still blows my mind how good it sounds. Oh well. Just my two cents. |
|
|
01-16-2003, 05:39 AM | #24 |
Socialphobic
Location: leprechaun julius
Posts: 10,323
|
the pro shot footage of the 1995 double door shows would be beautiful. uncut. all four.
let's see, they played ugly, speed, meladori magpie, set the ray to jerry, love, towers of rabble, stumbleine... and christ, we don't even know the setlist for 2/20. |
|
01-16-2003, 12:55 PM | #25 | |
deprivations of sleep
Location: The Tdot
Posts: 543
|
Quote:
__________________
i know this room just crumbles like a tomb surrender to the day that i made your stars fall in |
|
|
01-16-2003, 04:06 PM | #26 | |
Deaddy is your daddy!
Location: Veronica Mars played with my Wii.
Posts: 39,173
|
Ain't it funky how we pretend we're still a child?
Quote:
__________________
I like video games, Spider-Man, and long walks on the beach. |
|
|
01-16-2003, 04:40 PM | #27 | |
Moderator
Posts: 892
|
Quote:
|
|
|
01-16-2003, 05:41 PM | #28 | |
Deaddy is your daddy!
Location: Veronica Mars played with my Wii.
Posts: 39,173
|
I will.
Quote:
__________________
I like video games, Spider-Man, and long walks on the beach. |
|
|
01-16-2003, 07:23 PM | #29 | |
Moderator
Posts: 892
|
Re: I will.
Quote:
|
|
|
01-16-2003, 11:35 PM | #30 | |
Amish Rake Fighter
Posts: 1
|
Re: I will.
Quote:
http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL11/8...9/18599892.jpg http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL11/8...9/18599887.jpg |
|
|
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|