Countdown to Billy retiring the smashing pumpkins

[slunken]

Margin

[slunken]

Estimates?

[slunken]

I bet this current record deal was only for two albums which is why he started work on both.

[slunken]

The tour for those should be baffling

[slunken]

I bet he wants to get these albums done asap, grab the cash, and get out

[reprise85]

2015 is it. 2016 latest

[T&T]

RIP in peace belly corgan

[Trotskilicious]

after that he'll turn into a recluse and when we see him again he'll be brando fat

[Ram27]

Then still no fucking Metro show

[Raskolnikov]

This thread really does raise a good question: what the hell is next for him? A tour around these two albums that people care about even less than they did Oceania?

Anybody know what Tommy Lee's day planner looks like? Is dude free for a ~3 month world-ish tour? Will the songs sound better than they did with Bam Bam on drums, or does 'T. Lee' trade all this hard hitting talk for ham fists?

Really, though - these albums will be a commercial and a critical failure, then is the name shoved back into the closet again?

[Trotskilicious]

seriously who gives a fuck about the metro show still

[Ugly]

Billy will want to keep the name even if it's just him and a banjo solo because he can sell more tickets at even dive bar venues. At this pace, he'll probably hit that soon enough but he'll get more cash as "The Smashing Pumpkins".

[bye june]

I would go see a billy banjo pumpkins show.

[TuralyonW3]

Originally Posted by slunken

The tour for those should be baffling

Ay caramba

[chucklescrotum]

This year. He will retire the band and never release the Momuments album.

[herzogxyu]

let me be the first to say this is a dick thread. this is why netphoria = hatephoria. if all we do here is root for him to lose, why do we waste time? do we live for 260 years? no.

i hope this album does well and i hope it's good. hopefully matt walker will be the drummer with nicole on bass. this would be ideal. the last 2 reissues plop. a new website where you can download high quality shows, dvds, etc would be great. then if the 'band' part of smashing pumpkins retires, i'm good with that. billy should just go into the light like bob dylan or tom waits. acoustic belly corrigan really is some amazing stuff. not sure with the aspergury attempts at recapturing MCIS era success. every knows the old numbers will never come back. ask eminem, 50 cent, kelly clarkson, et all.
the music business as it was is no longer.
perhaps he still doesn't understand the internet or is deluded beyond recognition about what things are actually worth and where you actually make money.
i commend billy for always attempting something new and not just relying on the greatest hits/casino tours.
i think billy is reeling and tommy lee's interview about how billy was just shows us that a real drummer is what drives billy. ahem. im sure jimmy won't be asked back, but for fuck's sake, at least get matt.

[Butt Pope]

Originally Posted by herzogxyu

let me be the first to say this is a dick thread. this is why netphoria = hatephoria. if all we do here is root for him to lose, why do we waste time? do we live for 260 years? no.

i hope this album does well and i hope it's good. hopefully matt walker will be the drummer with nicole on bass. this would be ideal. the last 2 reissues plop. a new website where you can download high quality shows, dvds, etc would be great. then if the 'band' part of smashing pumpkins retires, i'm good with that. billy should just go into the light like bob dylan or tom waits. acoustic belly corrigan really is some amazing stuff. not sure with the aspergury attempts at recapturing MCIS era success. every knows the old numbers will never come back. ask eminem, 50 cent, kelly clarkson, et all.
the music business as it was is no longer.
perhaps he still doesn't understand the internet or is deluded beyond recognition about what things are actually worth and where you actually make money.
i commend billy for always attempting something new and not just relying on the greatest hits/casino tours.
i think billy is reeling and tommy lee's interview about how billy was just shows us that a real drummer is what drives billy. ahem. im sure jimmy won't be asked back, but for fuck's sake, at least get matt.

Pee pee doo doo

[Trotskilicious]

purple is nearly impossible to read on black, jesus

[herzogxyu]

just the color of your mom's nipples.

[herzogxyu]

Originally Posted by Poots

Yo momma nipples so purple, ___________________

go

she knows every minnesota viking by name.

[herzogxyu]

Originally Posted by Poots

Yo momma nipples so purple, ___________________

go

they the same color as karl malone's lips

[slunken]

Pure speculation:

By looks of things, the 2nd album that billy is working on should be out sometime either before or after the machina reissue release. Both releases will probably free him from any contractual obligations concerning the name "smashing pumpkins."

Then, while the label is on the hook still (or if they're not - to get them on the hook one more time) release the final metro show as a standalone dvd for a final big money cash grab.

Then hang up the cape and cowl until the time is right.

[SPumpkinsUK]

Billy will never give up the Smashing Pumpkins name. Back in the day he was surrounded by people who weren't afraid to say no to him, people who pulled him back and kept him somewhat grounded. I'm not surprised that Jimmy left as he was the only person around after the reunion who had any weight in his voice. I'm sure he got tired of Billy's "War on the fans" in 2008 as he left shortly after.

Now Billy is surrounded by yes men and only interacts with fans who he thinks would kiss his arse if he presented it to them. It's quite strange that Billy proves that the people in the band after Ginger and Jimmy left weren't hired guns by recording an album with them, then after all the touring for the album they're pretty much left out in limbo.

Billy will never give up the name, he'll say how tired he is of it all until someone spoons his ego and he'll pop right back up. He says he is ready to replaced and yet he's recording two more albums with Nicole and Mike out of the team.

I think the real question should be "How long until Tommy Lee says he enjoyed his time recording with Billy, only for Billy to reply that Tommy Lee is a complete cunt?"

[Order 66]

well that wraps it up for corrigan

[SPumpkinsUK]

Originally Posted by Belteshazzar

I'm guessing this thread might be inspired somewhat by the brief interview where Billy said he doesn't think he has many years left to be touring in front of crowds?

If so, it's a legitimate question as to whether or not he will retire the name or just step down, and what timeline that would occur in.

Especially since the band, as a band, seems to be broken and possibly beyond repair. It seems he's placed himself in a position where he can move on with a few loyal soldiers, but that unit may be an ever changing one.

But while it's realistic to consider the final apocalypse of the band down the road, I wouldn't under-estimate Billy. He's also said, with conviction, that he knows there is a lot more Smashing Pumpkins music to be made. In theory, Smashing Pumpkins is kind of who he is. It's the guise he's most comfortable with for his musical outlets, and I think Billy, as a creative mind, will always be putting out music, probably until the day he dies. Doing that is part of who he is and I don't see him giving that up. Ever. It's entirely possible he could carry the name with him to the grave as an old man...just do acoustic stuff, instrumental stuff, whatever. Who knows.

I'm okay with that. The idea of a living "Smashing Pumpkins" is somehow important to me, whatever form it takes, and even if it's something vastly different from the original version of the 90's or after. People age and their music changes with it - and that's fine.

If Billy had any conviction in his beliefs that his time is over then he'd call it a day already. He's recording two new albums under the "Smashing Pumpkins" name and he's at the front of it.

I'd have more respect for the man if he continued on with his "I'm back and fuck everyone who is against it" attitude of 2007. It's well known that Billy didn't ask anyone back apart from Jimmy despite his claims that he did. Zeitgeist was a solid album, it could of been better but so could a lot of albums.

If Billy had any conviction then he'd let the name die, release music under his own name as he is the sole writer, member and musician. With Jimmy it had weight. With Oceania he let his "hired guns" produce a new album then pretty much dropped them after it was over..

I have no issues with Billy continuing onwards with writing music, I just have issues with his motives and integrity about the band.

[SPumpkinsUK]

Originally Posted by Belteshazzar

....regarding this stuff about him taking a back role and having a new "Smashing Pumpkins" with all new members....I think he even mentioned writing music for the band or something. I guess you'd have a new band with totally new members, and they could write their own stuff, but Billy would also throw his material in there as well. It could be rock songs or whatever, but I think the idea is that he'd be too old to be rocking on stage anymore. So it'd be a new band that was capable of doing that, but with his spirit in it.

If that's the case though, I almost feel like it would need to be a kind of hybrid-tribute band....change the name to "The Smashing Pumpkins Cult," write original music but also focus on doing musical re-interpretations of SP songs and allowing Billy to throw in a new song of his own now and then. Also, it would be necessary for them to have a great deal of freedom and ownership for it to be seen as legit. No Billy firing people for this that or the other. I could actually get behind that idea. It sounds like a kind of monarchical succession. The idea of the king abdicating and passing the crown on to the heir, but still being around with an advising role. But it'd have to be a legitimately endorsed successor to take the crown. It must have his blessing. In theory, this would effectively build a new band model in which "The Smashing Pumpkins" would gain immortality through succession, as when "The Smashing Pumpkins Cult" band gets too old or whatever, and Billy has already passed away, the band could then choose another successor to pass the crown down to.

Just let the band die, there's no need for a take-over. It's called leaving a legacy intact, not shitting all over it and then leaving that shit taste in everyone's mouth while you piss all over the initial fans for not dry-humping the resurrection. If the band has run it's course then it's a natural conclusion, it's happened to many a band before. The band achieved immortality through it's initial course and ultimate break-up. All Billy has achieved since 2008 is a lot of broken promises.

[SPumpkinsUK]

Originally Posted by Belteshazzar

Understood, and I can relate in ways. I added to my last post though....What about my theory on the monarchical succession of the band? "The Smashing Pumpkins Cult," so to speak?

Total bollocks, that's my addition!

[SPumpkinsUK]

The Smashing Pumpkins situation isn't Queensryche's situation. Either way both bands have some guy who thinks he owns all the creative rights despite the other members contributing far more than he can ever admit too.

[SPumpkinsUK]

Originally Posted by Belteshazzar

Yeah, but I find the idea of a "Smashing Pumpkins Cult" to be oddly very Smashing Pumpkins-esque. It's strange, it's weird, it's "cultish" in the way fans have always felt about Billy, and also in the kind of art that was expressed in some of the Adore and Machina/GATMOG stuff.....It's totally bizarre and off the wall, and I find it's actually quite fitting. Some bands die and have a legacy....but the idea of Billy having a founding legacy, but then allowing the spirit of the band to live on....I kind of like that. Like I said, the idea of living, breathing version of "Smashing Pumpkins" existing is important to me somehow - because I want the spirit of the band to live in a way that gives artistic expression.

If Billy wanted any form of the original essence of the Smashing Pumpkins to exist he'd of made it.

Melissa and James have at some point expressed an interest if an offer was made. No offer by Billy was made. In recent news James has expressed that he's happier doing his own thing these days. I saw James solo and met him backstage, I was high on meds at the time but he was very chill and stood with me more patiently than most people I know while my friend attempted a photo and failed numerous times.

Only Jimmy was asked to return! I have an interview with Billy and Jimmy where Billy said he'd invited Melissa back to the band. A few weeks after the interview was released Melissa stated in an interview that if she was asked to return she would!

James would later state that he hadn't spoke to Billy for years.

Billy didn't want any of the original essence and it's pretty damn well documented. Billy can say anything he wants and most people will lap it up, but there's no way he wanted anyone other than Jimmy back in the band!

[SPumpkinsUK]

Originally Posted by Belteshazzar

I dunno - Billy's given the other former, original band members quite a bit of credit vocally, in between slandering them. I know there was the lawsuit with James Iha and Billy was apparently rather sore about James still wanting financial compensation for any re-issues or other stuff - even though it was entirely James' right to get compensation for it. I recall Billy saying something like "He wants to get paid for being in the band - but doesn't want to be in the band." I think Billy will probably forever be sore at James over this, unless he reaches some kind of new spiritual/emotional plateau or whatever....

But if Billy were going to attempt to make an all new band work that didn't have him up there on stage, he would pretty much have to do a model that gives the band freedom. And I'm just working off of ideas he himself has put forward. Maybe it's not impossible?

Why is it an issue for someone wanting to be paid for recording music that they were involved in in any capacity? Whether they wrote it or not, if money is to be made from it when they were involved in it then they should receive it!

Billy has said time and again that D'arcy and James couldn't play, yet he still recorded five albums with them and played several hundred live shows together.

Billy: "Yeah they're shit, they're completely untalented, can't play a note without my own instructions, yet I'll tour extensively with them and record several albums with them."