William Hattrick Corgan

Oklahoma Sexual · 01-28-2018, 05:20 PM

I cant stand this person anymore. From when I was 14 or so I have looked up to Billy's dysfunctional, hypocritical, angry, and narcissistic image. I always found his early interviews provocative and challenging of the music industry. Now I only hear a 50 year old bitch about how misunderstood he is. He has contradicted everything he's ever said, so there's nothing left that I believe he stands for. He's boring AF now.

I will say he was talented at songwriting once upon a time, but it's been awhile. I'm done caring about someone I realize I don't really respect outside of music. I feel sorry for his bandmates too. He's nothing without his mates, but he doesn't seem to acknowledge this fact.

Been an interesting 20 years of fandom, but I feel I've outgrown this dude. Guess I'm finally on netphoria's side.

run2pee · 01-28-2018, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oklahoma Sexual

I cant stand this person anymore. From when I was 14 or so I have looked up to Billy's dysfunctional, hypocritical, angry, and narcissistic image. I always found his early interviews provocative and challenging of the music industry. Now I only hear a 50 year old bitch about how misunderstood he is. He has contradicted everything he's ever said, so there's nothing left that I believe he stands for. He's boring AF now.

I will say he was talented at songwriting once upon a time, but it's been awhile. I'm done caring about someone I realize I don't really respect outside of music. I feel sorry for his bandmates too. He's nothing without his mates, but he doesn't seem to acknowledge this fact.

Been an interesting 20 years of fandom, but I feel I've outgrown this dude. Guess I'm finally on netphoria's side.

It is happy to see your posting. Yes really informative points. I will tell this information again to my friend thank you?

jakobtheliar · 01-28-2018, 05:36 PM

Once upon a time and once in a while are classics. 20 year old classics. Welcome to fold.

This shit with the "reunion" and screwing d'arcy over really gets to me. Like I'm done with the dude, but it just keeps getting lower. I actually am surprised by that one.

butthurt · 01-28-2018, 05:44 PM

http://cdn-img1.imagechef.com/imgout...3068106f24.gif

Forgotten Child · 01-28-2018, 07:19 PM

Have you tried therapy?

T&T · 01-28-2018, 07:53 PM

While you're quitting netphoria, can you PM me your password so I can post as you from now on? Or just post it here in this thread and everyone will have a ball with it.

fuzzyroes · 01-28-2018, 09:02 PM

I still like Corgan. He's still somewhat interesting to follow. That solo album was a total snore-fest though.

AveryLoren · 01-28-2018, 10:11 PM

I too have reached the point where I actually dislike him. Yeah, I still follow his online presence and will forever continue to do so, but the motivation behind it is different. I used to believe that he would pull it off and make a real come back. In his 40's and now in his 50's I have realized that it was never going to happen. He is a true egotistical narcissist that has outgrown his talent and whatever it was that made him interesting. I still tune in just to see how far he falls and what crazy scheme he brews up next. There was this childlike idealism that he really matured into this grandiose musical body of work and then he collapsed into himself. The shame of it all is I can still feel and hear that spark buried in there but we will never again see it ignite a fire.

fuzzyroes · 01-28-2018, 10:23 PM

Ehhh, dudes 50... I can't blame anyone for giving up hope of Billy returning to some form of glory, but hardly anyone of that age and older ever does. So it's not fair to hold it against Billy. It's just the reality in pop-music/rock and roll.

His legacy is built on Gish/Siamese Dream/Melon Collie... Sure, the hard-core fans will have other stuff they like, but to the general public the books already closed. That's a pretty rad chunk of music though.

fuzzyroes · 01-28-2018, 10:25 PM

A reunion tour is the only glory he has left in the cards to play and it sounds like he might mess that up.

At least a new album with Jimmy being produced by Rubin has an outside shot of being interesting to those of us who still care.

AveryLoren · 01-28-2018, 10:34 PM

I just want something of substance that's not quickly abandoned. I want Billy's songwriting talent reigned in by an actual functioning band. I want a real producer to hone in on Billy and bands strengths. It shouldn't have been too late to accomplish that. Its such a shame Billy wasted all that time and all that music gone unreleased.

fuzzyroes · 10:50 PM

Yeah, well one things certain, there certainly was a ton of wasted years with countless missteps that could have been used for strengthening his legacy... The majority of his artistic output in his 30's and 40's was a bust... That's definitely a shame considering the mans potential.

I just think for anyone holding onto hope for any old rocker to create anything as good as what they did in their 20's is gonna end in disappointment... Instead we gotta embrace the nostalgia of the old music. That's all there is left to do at this point... And sure, maybe we'll hear a few cool new things here and there that reminds us of those glory days but the best is in the past.

fuzzyroes · 01-28-2018, 10:46 PM

Very few bands get a second wind with new music were they have a resurgence that meets or comes anywhere close to their original peak. I mean there's Green Day with American Idiot, Aerosmith with their run in the late 80's/early 90's, Heart in the 80's.... There really aren't many bands or artists who could do it.

The only way a lot of these bands can manage a resurgence is through touring on their old material... That's what Billy should be aiming for.

fuzzyroes · 01-28-2018, 10:48 PM

And I think with those bands, you have within 10 years to try and pull it off, if you can't do it by 10 years, you got no shot.

It's going on 20 years for Corgan now lol... So I hope people aren't holding on hoping for some artistic resurgence.

AveryLoren · 01-28-2018, 10:58 PM

Green Day is the only band in my lifetime to pull off a rock oriented resurgence but Billie Joe was 30 - 31 when he was writing American Idiot. That's not too far away from Corgan's 28 for MCIS. At this point I totally don't expect any type of huge commercial success. Hell I didn't even expect that with Zwan, but I do desire some form of artistic expression that isn't a half-assed attempt at "winning over the kids" that Billy is so desperate for.

fuzzyroes · 01-28-2018, 11:04 PM

Yeah man, I'm definitely on board with that.

I'm not sure why he isn't just playing for the base at this point in his career... Though I guess maybe he was with that solo album. I mean, he couldn't have possibly thought that that would have mainstream appeal. Still a lame album though.

Oklahoma Sexual · 01-29-2018, 02:53 AM

Yeah some artists stay relevant or actually get better. Tom Petty, Tom Waits, Bowie, Lennon. I thought WPC was gonna do it too, but the writing is on the wall. Ogilala was really boring.
I tried to like it, but... Grieving the loss, it's time to let go.

Funbags · 01-29-2018, 05:47 AM

The Smashing Pumpkins should have stayed dead in 2000 and Zwan should have been it's successor for at least the next decade. Their final live shows were beginning to eclipse the Pumpkins themselves and demonstrate how easily this could have turned into Billy's "critically acclaimed mid-period". I mean, if he didn't think Zwan were good enough, what does that make SP2? Zwan wouldn't piss on Teargarden if it was on fire.

The only reason I've continued to follow Billy's career is because of the brief glimpses of potential he occasionally has before the idea is inevitably shat on by his non-artistic aspirations. Case in point: the reunion.

No D'arcy...token James...an album hastily recorded by SP2 (no doubt ahead of festival dates). It's just business as usual for Billy "Gene Simmons" Corgan.

Funbags · 01-29-2018, 06:00 AM

I have strong feelings about Zwan.

T&T · 01-29-2018, 08:05 AM

B0lly likes to imagine he's like the Bowie of our generation....
ya right.

here's Bowie at 50, surrounded by a fleet of young musicians
https://i.imgur.com/CxTVsEX.jpg

Blly at 50 has NO ONE.

billy surrounds himself with hired guns and yesmen. He's been done for 10 years at least. I remember billy talking about the "ADD music that the twitch would listen to had no value", like shut the fuck up, billy you sound old and jaded. Remember when he dissed Animal Collective in the early aughts?... ug... get with the times.

I agree with funbags that zwan was great and had great potential. That wasn't a band of yesmen. The early days they all contributed and it was a fucking GREAT band. They turned to shit as soon as they hit the studio and billy played his "it's my band, we're only putting my songs on the record' BS that turned everyone sour.

run2pee · 01-29-2018, 09:07 AM

Plus can you believe paz would choose pajo to handy off under that Iowa City barroom table? I mean wtf, bill was the rich/powerful one, how could she choose stinky old pajo!!

Corgan's Bluff · 01-29-2018, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Run To Me

Plus can you believe paz would choose pajo to handy off under that Iowa City barroom table? I mean wtf, bill was the rich/powerful one, how could she choose stinky old pajo!!

Him again?! Hang him higher!

via GIPHY

FoolofaTook · 01-29-2018, 11:00 PM

hung pajo

qwerty sp · 01-30-2018, 01:48 AM

Well hung Pajo

bright_doom · 01-30-2018, 02:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AveryLoren

"winning over the kids"

Whir34 · 01-30-2018, 04:50 AM

I loved Ogilala and still listen to it every day.

Guess I don't fit in here!

bright_doom · 01-30-2018, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whir34

I loved Ogilala and still listen to it every day.

Guess I don't fit in here!

I love it too.....

Lets run away and start our own forum together, forever

VoxUpDoc · 01-30-2018, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whir34

I loved Ogilala and still listen to it every day.

Guess I don't fit in here!

Nah Ogilala easily the best album BC has released over the past 15 years.

Shadaloo · 01-30-2018, 11:50 AM

I think it's a solid 6/10 album. It's inoffensive, rainy day housecleaning background music. Not aiming to start any fires, just something to have on while you're doing something else. I don't have any specific urge to go back and replay the whole thing, but Archer's a great fucking song.

As to Bill himself, I just consider him a space-case off in his own little world most of the time who doesn't really understand how his words and actions impact people. He has narcissistic personality disorder which has worsened as he's aged and it's beyond question - the symptoms of which have bled into every aspect of his songwriting. IMO one of the biggest problems with the songs themselves nowadays is that he's so bound and determined to write these grandiose poems with flowery language that he just neglects relatability in lyrics. The most memorable phrases off Oceania are things like "I used to know what a wish was for" and "don't make me suffer" and they're few and far between.

AveryLoren · 01-30-2018, 12:13 PM

I would rate Ogilala a 4/10. It just doesn't sound like a finished product to me. It's like the stuff you send to your band mates to get them interested. It is a far better effort than Monuments which is 2/10 at best. Oceania on the other hand was the last attempt at having something almost there in terms of being a solid piece of art. I would give Oceania the same rating you gave Ogilala.

01-28-2018, 05:20 PM	#1
Oklahoma Sexual Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 1,612	William Hattrick Corgan I cant stand this person anymore. From when I was 14 or so I have looked up to Billy's dysfunctional, hypocritical, angry, and narcissistic image. I always found his early interviews provocative and challenging of the music industry. Now I only hear a 50 year old bitch about how misunderstood he is. He has contradicted everything he's ever said, so there's nothing left that I believe he stands for. He's boring AF now. I will say he was talented at songwriting once upon a time, but it's been awhile. I'm done caring about someone I realize I don't really respect outside of music. I feel sorry for his bandmates too. He's nothing without his mates, but he doesn't seem to acknowledge this fact. Been an interesting 20 years of fandom, but I feel I've outgrown this dude. Guess I'm finally on netphoria's side.

01-28-2018, 10:40 PM	#12
fuzzyroes Banned Posts: 21,169	Yeah, well one things certain, there certainly was a ton of wasted years with countless missteps that could have been used for strengthening his legacy... The majority of his artistic output in his 30's and 40's was a bust... That's definitely a shame considering the mans potential. I just think for anyone holding onto hope for any old rocker to create anything as good as what they did in their 20's is gonna end in disappointment... Instead we gotta embrace the nostalgia of the old music. That's all there is left to do at this point... And sure, maybe we'll hear a few cool new things here and there that reminds us of those glory days but the best is in the past. Last edited by fuzzyroes : 01-28-2018 at 10:50 PM.

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01-28-2018, 05:36 PM	#3
jakobtheliar Demi-God Location: a house in new orleans Posts: 352	Once upon a time and once in a while are classics. 20 year old classics. Welcome to fold. This shit with the "reunion" and screwing d'arcy over really gets to me. Like I'm done with the dude, but it just keeps getting lower. I actually am surprised by that one.

01-28-2018, 05:44 PM	#4
butthurt Apocalyptic Poster Location: on the internet Posts: 1,969	http://cdn-img1.imagechef.com/imgout...3068106f24.gif

01-28-2018, 07:19 PM	#5
Forgotten Child Apocalyptic Poster Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil Posts: 4,876	Have you tried therapy?

01-28-2018, 07:53 PM	#6
T&T Socialphobic Location: montreal Posts: 11,676	While you're quitting netphoria, can you PM me your password so I can post as you from now on? Or just post it here in this thread and everyone will have a ball with it.

01-28-2018, 09:02 PM	#7
fuzzyroes Banned Posts: 21,169	I still like Corgan. He's still somewhat interesting to follow. That solo album was a total snore-fest though.

01-28-2018, 10:11 PM	#8
AveryLoren Apocalyptic Poster Location: Upside Down Narnia Posts: 1,901	I too have reached the point where I actually dislike him. Yeah, I still follow his online presence and will forever continue to do so, but the motivation behind it is different. I used to believe that he would pull it off and make a real come back. In his 40's and now in his 50's I have realized that it was never going to happen. He is a true egotistical narcissist that has outgrown his talent and whatever it was that made him interesting. I still tune in just to see how far he falls and what crazy scheme he brews up next. There was this childlike idealism that he really matured into this grandiose musical body of work and then he collapsed into himself. The shame of it all is I can still feel and hear that spark buried in there but we will never again see it ignite a fire.

01-28-2018, 10:23 PM	#9
fuzzyroes Banned Posts: 21,169	Ehhh, dudes 50... I can't blame anyone for giving up hope of Billy returning to some form of glory, but hardly anyone of that age and older ever does. So it's not fair to hold it against Billy. It's just the reality in pop-music/rock and roll. His legacy is built on Gish/Siamese Dream/Melon Collie... Sure, the hard-core fans will have other stuff they like, but to the general public the books already closed. That's a pretty rad chunk of music though.

01-28-2018, 10:25 PM	#10
fuzzyroes Banned Posts: 21,169	A reunion tour is the only glory he has left in the cards to play and it sounds like he might mess that up. At least a new album with Jimmy being produced by Rubin has an outside shot of being interesting to those of us who still care.

01-28-2018, 10:34 PM	#11
AveryLoren Apocalyptic Poster Location: Upside Down Narnia Posts: 1,901	I just want something of substance that's not quickly abandoned. I want Billy's songwriting talent reigned in by an actual functioning band. I want a real producer to hone in on Billy and bands strengths. It shouldn't have been too late to accomplish that. Its such a shame Billy wasted all that time and all that music gone unreleased.

01-28-2018, 10:46 PM	#13
fuzzyroes Banned Posts: 21,169	Very few bands get a second wind with new music were they have a resurgence that meets or comes anywhere close to their original peak. I mean there's Green Day with American Idiot, Aerosmith with their run in the late 80's/early 90's, Heart in the 80's.... There really aren't many bands or artists who could do it. The only way a lot of these bands can manage a resurgence is through touring on their old material... That's what Billy should be aiming for.

01-28-2018, 10:48 PM	#14
fuzzyroes Banned Posts: 21,169	And I think with those bands, you have within 10 years to try and pull it off, if you can't do it by 10 years, you got no shot. It's going on 20 years for Corgan now lol... So I hope people aren't holding on hoping for some artistic resurgence.

01-28-2018, 10:58 PM	#15
AveryLoren Apocalyptic Poster Location: Upside Down Narnia Posts: 1,901	Green Day is the only band in my lifetime to pull off a rock oriented resurgence but Billie Joe was 30 - 31 when he was writing American Idiot. That's not too far away from Corgan's 28 for MCIS. At this point I totally don't expect any type of huge commercial success. Hell I didn't even expect that with Zwan, but I do desire some form of artistic expression that isn't a half-assed attempt at "winning over the kids" that Billy is so desperate for.

01-28-2018, 11:04 PM	#16
fuzzyroes Banned Posts: 21,169	Yeah man, I'm definitely on board with that. I'm not sure why he isn't just playing for the base at this point in his career... Though I guess maybe he was with that solo album. I mean, he couldn't have possibly thought that that would have mainstream appeal. Still a lame album though.

01-29-2018, 02:53 AM	#17
Oklahoma Sexual Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 1,612	Yeah some artists stay relevant or actually get better. Tom Petty, Tom Waits, Bowie, Lennon. I thought WPC was gonna do it too, but the writing is on the wall. Ogilala was really boring. I tried to like it, but... Grieving the loss, it's time to let go.

01-29-2018, 05:47 AM	#18
Funbags Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 3,425	The Smashing Pumpkins should have stayed dead in 2000 and Zwan should have been it's successor for at least the next decade. Their final live shows were beginning to eclipse the Pumpkins themselves and demonstrate how easily this could have turned into Billy's "critically acclaimed mid-period". I mean, if he didn't think Zwan were good enough, what does that make SP2? Zwan wouldn't piss on Teargarden if it was on fire. The only reason I've continued to follow Billy's career is because of the brief glimpses of potential he occasionally has before the idea is inevitably shat on by his non-artistic aspirations. Case in point: the reunion. No D'arcy...token James...an album hastily recorded by SP2 (no doubt ahead of festival dates). It's just business as usual for Billy "Gene Simmons" Corgan.

01-29-2018, 06:00 AM	#19
Funbags Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 3,425	I have strong feelings about Zwan.

01-29-2018, 08:05 AM	#20
T&T Socialphobic Location: montreal Posts: 11,676	B0lly likes to imagine he's like the Bowie of our generation.... ya right. here's Bowie at 50, surrounded by a fleet of young musicians https://i.imgur.com/CxTVsEX.jpg Blly at 50 has NO ONE. billy surrounds himself with hired guns and yesmen. He's been done for 10 years at least. I remember billy talking about the "ADD music that the twitch would listen to had no value", like shut the fuck up, billy you sound old and jaded. Remember when he dissed Animal Collective in the early aughts?... ug... get with the times. I agree with funbags that zwan was great and had great potential. That wasn't a band of yesmen. The early days they all contributed and it was a fucking GREAT band. They turned to shit as soon as they hit the studio and billy played his "it's my band, we're only putting my songs on the record' BS that turned everyone sour.

01-29-2018, 09:07 AM	#21
run2pee Minion of Satan Location: An oasis of horror in a desert of boredom Posts: 7,747	Plus can you believe paz would choose pajo to handy off under that Iowa City barroom table? I mean wtf, bill was the rich/powerful one, how could she choose stinky old pajo!!

01-29-2018, 11:00 PM	#23
FoolofaTook Just Hook it to My Veins! Location: Donald Trump of Netphoria Posts: 37,218	hung pajo

01-30-2018, 01:48 AM	#24
qwerty sp Apocalyptic Poster Posts: 1,764	Well hung Pajo

01-30-2018, 04:50 AM	#26
Whir34 Pledge Posts: 149	I loved Ogilala and still listen to it every day. Guess I don't fit in here!

01-30-2018, 11:50 AM	#29
Shadaloo Apocalyptic Poster Location: up on the cross you go little fella Posts: 2,676	I think it's a solid 6/10 album. It's inoffensive, rainy day housecleaning background music. Not aiming to start any fires, just something to have on while you're doing something else. I don't have any specific urge to go back and replay the whole thing, but Archer's a great fucking song. As to Bill himself, I just consider him a space-case off in his own little world most of the time who doesn't really understand how his words and actions impact people. He has narcissistic personality disorder which has worsened as he's aged and it's beyond question - the symptoms of which have bled into every aspect of his songwriting. IMO one of the biggest problems with the songs themselves nowadays is that he's so bound and determined to write these grandiose poems with flowery language that he just neglects relatability in lyrics. The most memorable phrases off Oceania are things like "I used to know what a wish was for" and "don't make me suffer" and they're few and far between.

01-30-2018, 12:13 PM	#30
AveryLoren Apocalyptic Poster Location: Upside Down Narnia Posts: 1,901	I would rate Ogilala a 4/10. It just doesn't sound like a finished product to me. It's like the stuff you send to your band mates to get them interested. It is a far better effort than Monuments which is 2/10 at best. Oceania on the other hand was the last attempt at having something almost there in terms of being a solid piece of art. I would give Oceania the same rating you gave Ogilala.