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Old 04-07-2020, 01:46 PM   #61
Squish Squash
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We also need to stop ignoring Biden being accused of rape. He shouldn’t even still be running based on the precedent set by the liberal reaction to Al Franken and Kavanaugh

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 02:56 PM   #62
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Something needs to change we can’t let the Democratic establishment keep force feeding us these neoliberal clowns.
That is a great sentence.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 03:18 PM   #63
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•I want the democratic establishment to realize they need to run AOC or someone like her in 2024. I do not support how they and the media treated Bernie, it is bullshit and outright criminal IMO.
•Biden will not win my state (Missouri). I am free to vote my conscience. You would have more of a point if I lived in a swing state. I would have voted for Elizabeth Warren. I wouldn’t have liked it (lost a lot of respect for her over the course of the campaign for various reasons) but I would have done it. Not Biden. The man said he would potentially have a Republican VP for fuck’s sake.
•Biden being elected could lead to another, more competent Trump. Do not underestimate how disgusted people on both sides are with so-called moderates and the status quo.
This is trump supporter logic. If we can’t have what we want, let’s destroy everything! I guess all the suffering the next generation will endure because of 4 more years of trump is abstract to you

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 03:18 PM   #64
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As abstract as a Supreme Court stacked to the far right for the next four decades

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 03:20 PM   #65
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But you know it will all be worth it to get some hypothetical leftist in after trump has destroyed America right?

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 03:20 PM   #66
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I hate Trump. I would never vote for him.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 03:22 PM   #67
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But you know it will all be worth it to get some hypothetical leftist in after trump has destroyed America right?
You’re going to have to tell me how my not voting for Biden in a red state is going to get Trump elected. I am going to encourage people not to vote for Biden if he gets the nomination. I just won’t do it.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:29 PM   #68
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You’re going to have to tell me how my not voting for Biden in a red state is going to get Trump elected. I am going to encourage people not to vote for Biden if he gets the nomination. I just won’t do it.
you didn't start with I live in a red state I can vote my conscience though. You started by telling us how you will never vote for Biden no matter how much worse Trump is because YOU deserve better.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:34 PM   #69
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I do deserve better than Biden, thanks. We all do. I also was responding to you asking me to elaborate as to why I thought Biden was too close to Trump, not you asking me to explain for why my not voting for him wouldn’t make a difference. I think you should be more open to my having a different opinion here as we probably both want similar things for this country and I am not going to help Trump get re-elected. I definitely considered voting for Biden but I just can’t do it. Again, I am planning on switching my party affiliation, I do not like getting attacked for not voting for someone who doesn’t represent my values. I also am almost positive Biden will lose to Trump so I think this is pointless. It was extremely foolish of the DNC and the media to push Biden on us, but I suspect they don’t mind Trump as long as Bernie doesn’t actually start giving people healthcare and attacking corporate overlords.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:38 PM   #70
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Unfortunately I've heard it before and I have no tolerance for the I deserve better so I won't vote against the greater evil schtick.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:39 PM   #71
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also the voters wanted Biden dude. not just the media and the DNC

again, the vast majority of Democrats say they will vote for whoever the nominee is, so I'm not worried about a few loud Bernie stragglers. If Bernie can't win the nomination in a state like Michigan, where Dems need to win, what makes you think his supporters can carry him in the general? He lost to JOE BIDEN.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:43 PM   #72
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also the Biden will surely lose doom and gloom is just a form of magical thinking where people are over-learning the "lessons" of 2016. There is no magic rule that he can't win because he's a moderate or because he doesn't support medicare for all. He's polling a lot higher than Clinton in places he needs. Consider that Trump WON a state like Wisconsin with LESS VOTES than Romney LOST with.

Biden has the advantage.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:48 PM   #73
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Exit polls had margins of errors that would suggest fraud and voters were told over and over again that Biden is “electable” and Bernie is not. That affects how people vote. I volunteered for Bernie in Missouri and when I and a fellow volunteer canvassed multiple people expressed support for Biden because they thought he was more electable not because he they preferred his policies. I HATE that mentality. It is a detriment to progress. And again, I do not want to see a more competent Trump in 4-8 years. A Biden presidency will have a great chance of leading to that. Furthermore, I don’t care about polls. They are unreliable as we saw in many states in the primary. Trump also doesn’t need to win the popular vote to stay in office.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:49 PM   #74
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Wait, I thought Biden was accused of being a creepy old touchy uncle and sniffing hair, not of full-on rape.

*Googling noises*

Oh shit, I guess he might be a rapist, too

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:54 PM   #75
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Wait, I thought Biden was accused of being a creepy old touchy uncle and sniffing hair, not of full-on rape.

*Googling noises*

Oh shit, I guess he might be a rapist, too
I’ve brought this up. If Franken had to resign and liberals wanted to bar Kavanaugh from the SC, Biden shouldn’t get to run. Consistency is important.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 05:06 PM   #76
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Exit polls had margins of errors that would suggest fraud and voters were told over and over again that Biden is “electable” and Bernie is not. That affects how people vote. I volunteered for Bernie in Missouri and when I and a fellow volunteer canvassed multiple people expressed support for Biden because they thought he was more electable not because he they preferred his policies. I HATE that mentality. It is a detriment to progress. And again, I do not want to see a more competent Trump in 4-8 years. A Biden presidency will have a great chance of leading to that. Furthermore, I don’t care about polls. They are unreliable as we saw in many states in the primary. Trump also doesn’t need to win the popular vote to stay in office.
anti-science nonsense. you don't understand polls. Sanders polled ahead in support in lots of places where his loyal army DID NOT VOTE

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 05:09 PM   #77
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also, as someone who consumes center-left mainstream media every single day, the media was NOT telling people Biden was more electable. that's just not true. the majority of media stories about Biden's campaign were how incompetent, underfunded, and disorganized it was. NBC, CNN, WaPo, and NYT were all about the Bernie surge and had thrown in the towel for Biden until he came roaring back. It's not all some media and party conspiracy. More people prefer Biden. A lot more. It's not even close. Progressives make up only 20-30% of people who identify as left of center

The fact that Biden came back after doing so poorly and getting shit on by big outlets like New York Times only shows that his support really is that strong, and people really do see him as more electable.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 06:15 PM   #78
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I'm not sure how anyone can claim Biden is more electable with a straight face. There is so much more Trump can attack him on then Bernie. Dementia and the rape accusation make him completely unelectable. Even if you want to claim he's not suffering from cognitive decline (which would take denying reality IMO), that rape accusation is going to be a killer once more voters learn about it. Sure, Trump is almost certainly a serial rapist as I've said, but people on the left or left leaning are much less willing to vote for someone accused of rape. Trump and his cronies will hammer the Democrats for being hypocrites based on their response to Kavanaugh and Franken, and you know what? They'll be right.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 07:19 PM   #79
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Bernie’s positions are less representative of most Democrats’ views than Biden’s. Thus more electable. I swear Sanders people bend over backwards to not understand anything outside their bubble

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 07:31 PM   #80
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kinda think if yall read pride and prej, and then maybe discussed it a lil after, you'd be able to come to an amicable agreement

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 07:50 PM   #81
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I have nothing against liberal non-politicians (used to be one until pretty recently) but you guys aren’t going to guilt me into voting for Biden. He’s not going to beat Trump and he’s not going to win my state so me writing in Bernie or voting for the Green Party isn’t going to affect anything.
I might have accepted most of that as an argument for not voting at all, but traveling to a venue for the sole purpose of a gesture that will achieve nothing whilst also being completely anonymous is harder to work with.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 07:51 PM   #82
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Bernie’s positions are less representative of most Democrats’ views than Biden’s. Thus more electable. I swear Sanders people bend over backwards to not understand anything outside their bubble
Are we still ignoring Biden being accused of rape and how that makes him unelectable? Again, there is precedent for this with Democrats.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 07:52 PM   #83
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kinda think if yall read pride and prej, and then maybe discussed it a lil after, you'd be able to come to an amicable agreement

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 08:00 PM   #84
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I might have accepted most of that as an argument for not voting at all, but traveling to a venue for the sole purpose of a gesture that will achieve nothing whilst also being completely anonymous is harder to work with.
If the third party gets to 5%, they are eligible for public funding in the next election cycle. The Green Party aligns with my values more closely than the Democratic Party does. Sure there are some Democrats I like (AOC and Ilhan Omar and Bernie if you count him), but the party's values don't align with mine for the most part. The public funding is a great argumen for me and those with similar values to vote third party in states that aren't contested.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 08:02 PM   #85
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Are we still ignoring Biden being accused of rape and how that makes him unelectable? Again, there is precedent for this with Democrats.
So all these people who came out to vote for Biden in the primary, they are next going to stay home for him in the general? Really?

I agree it's hypocritical but polls have shown consistently that Dems are united behind one issue: beat Trump. And polls also show that most supporters of all the candidates also say they will support whoever the nominee is. So if it's a white supremacist who is dismantling the United States from the inside for his own personal benefit versus a guy accused of rape whose policies are at least sane, yes, I will vote for the rapist and so will most people. Trump is the greater evil. The morally correct path is to keep the greater evil out.

Last edited by redbreegull : 04-07-2020 at 08:13 PM.

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 08:03 PM   #86
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The Green Party aligns with my values
now it makes sense

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 08:23 PM   #87
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If the third party gets to 5%, they are eligible for public funding in the next election cycle. The Green Party aligns with my values more closely than the Democratic Party does. Sure there are some Democrats I like (AOC and Ilhan Omar and Bernie if you count him), but the party's values don't align with mine for the most part. The public funding is a great argumen for me and those with similar values to vote third party in states that aren't contested.
If the Green Party were to put that additional funding towards growing their voter base, which of the two major parties stands to benefit most from their success in that regard and how do you think this might conceivably impact subsequent federal elections?

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 08:32 PM   #88
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now it makes sense
What value does the Green Party hold that you don't like lmao

 
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Old 04-07-2020, 08:39 PM   #89
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it's not their espoused values. I agree with the progressive values of Sanders and Warren as well. it's the club members


 
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Old 04-07-2020, 08:40 PM   #90
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also the fact that the third party strategy is a losing strategy, and will always be a losing strategy that only hurts the liberal agenda until the Republicans fragment

 
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