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Old 07-11-2017, 12:20 AM   #3151
TuralyonW3
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Originally Posted by Disco King View Post
It's hard for me to get excited about the third Spider-Man of the past decade, so I probably won't watch it. I dunno, the trailers don't look like they really have an interesting character arc for the Peter Parker, or much of a theme they are exploring. It feels to me that the only thing this movie has to offer is "Spider-Man can hang out with Iron Man now!" Even if it's not an origin story, it looks like the theme of this story is Parker learning, yet again, that with great power, comes great responsibility. I guess it's Tony Stark who imparts that wisdom to him instead of Uncle Ben, though.

I'm a fanboy, so obviously I like shared universes and seeing characters interact. But, like, that is neither sufficient nor even necessary for an interesting movie. I feel like I've seen this movie already, from the 616 unavoidable trailers they released of it, seeming to give a summary of the film, rather than just the premise. Seems to me like the Vulture will be yet another villain with a socio-political motive that is never earnestly explored in the film, and only serves as the reason why he has to do bad things that make him and Spider-Man have to fight.

And also, this is more of a fanboy irritation than anything, but I feel like it really guts the core of the Spider-Man character to make his development as a hero so dependent in the Avengers and Tony Stark. Though Spider-Man, in the real world, is probably Marvel Comics' most celebrated hero, within his own universe, he is kind of the unsung hard-luck hero. Despite exemplifying his capability as a hero time and time again, he isn't held in as high esteem as, say, Iron Man or Captain America, and in fact, much of the public despises him. He's a teen hero who was never anybody's sidekick, never had a mentor, and had to learn how to handle his responsibilities on his own. For most of the character's publication history, he was never a member of The Avengers. In fact, the first time he had an adventure with them ended with him being denied membership. He didn't properly join the Avengers until the 2000s, well after he had established himself as a capable hero.

Having him be part of some Avengers Junior Cadets under the tutelage of Tony Stark as part of his growth into a hero really goes against a lot of what makes Spider-Man the sort of character he is. The whole "I have to show them that I can be a hero, too!" seems more like a storyline for Robin the Boy Wonder than for Spider-Man.

And really? Tony Stark is responsible for making Parker's first non-makeshift costume? That's some real bullshit, Marvel Studios.
you should really just quit whining about all that stuff and pay your 12 bucks and see the damn movie. I'm a spidey purist... I've read the whole original lee/ditko run which sets the standard, and I think the way they position him with Stark works perfectly (you need to see what they do in the movie). Also, the film has a wonderful callout to the "crushed by rubble" scene from Amazing #33.

you are stereotypical "fanboy who hasn't seen the movie whining about things that aren't even wrong with the movie" so hard right now.

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 12:57 AM   #3152
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oh i do love those guys who address nothing in the original argument and just go "just stop being a little whiney pansey and go see the movie"

no offense but except for humble bragging about your comic book buffness this post is pretty vacant

facts are, this is the THIRD Spiderman franchise in the past 10 years or so, and it doesn't seem like it brings anything really new to the table except some novelty Alien vs. Predator type welding of two Marvel characters. facts are, this movie wasn't made and released because there's a great story to be told or a statement to be made, but because some people have a goose that lays golden eggs, and they ride it shamlessly.

for all intents and purposes they could have filmed a guy in a red and blue pajama set going DURR DURR DURR and throwing packs of superglue at the walls for 90 minutes, and release that. they just do more out of common courtesy.

i don't even think it's arguable that the Spiderman franchise needs a rest right now, and while this particular movie might be entertaining or to your liking (personally i dunno and don't care to watch it) it doesn't change the fact that it's ridiculously redundant, and is only there because somebody sought to cash in

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 01:10 AM   #3153
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blah blah blah and yet the movie is a smash hit with critics and fans

It's a completely different approach than either of the last 2 go-rounds. Sony realized they fucked up the Andrew Garfield movies, so they finally brought in Marvel Studios to do it right.

If you don't like superheroes then whatever. But I mainly meant if Disco King is a fan of the connected Marvel Universe movies, as he implied he was, then there's no reason to skip this movie, which is one of the best in the Marvel Universe series, for stuff he's guessing about without even having seen it.

lol I don't give a fuck if you guys see it, your loss.

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 01:51 AM   #3154
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The latest Rihanna album was probably a smash hit with critics and fans, too, let's face it.

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 11:45 AM   #3155
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if Disco King is a fan of the connected Marvel Universe movies, as he implied he was...
Eh, not really. I mean, I don't hate them. None of them I've seen have been terrible. Actually, Iron Man 2 was kinda terrible.

I only watched the movies leading up to the first Avengers film (except I skipped Thor). I dunno, when Iron Man came out in 2008 and everybody was raving about it, it sounded pretty good. I didn't catch it until it came on one of those movie channels (that show films after the home video release, but some time before the network TV premiere). It was... okay. I really didn't see what the fuss was about. I felt that the first couple acts had some charm, but the more interesting ideas that were raised didn't really go anywhere. The third act was a bit generic.

The Incredible Hulk managed to be even more forgettable than Ang Lee's Hulk. At least Lee's Hulk seemed to make some creative choices about how they would present their version of the character, and it had a unique feel to it, even if it was dreadfully boring. The rebooted Hulk film felt like it had little more than fanservice.

Captain America: The First Avenger was my favourite of the first wave of films. Still not an amazing film, but the good-hearted do-gooder hero and some of the comedic bits (Captain America starting off as more of a cheesy mascot than a soldier) gave it that Richard Donner Superman charm. The period sets were nice, especially because I love that 1940s aesthetic. I can't remember anything Red Skull did.

Then I saw the Avengers film and... despite this being the bonanza that everything thus far had been leading up to... I actually much preferred the solo films. At least they actually had some room to develop some character. I just couldn't wrap my head around how The Avengers was considered a spectacular film. In the first act, none of the character conflicts feel authentic, they just felt like the script needed them to bicker so they could do the whole "ragtag group of people with clashing personalities learn to put aside their differences and work together to save the day" thing. The death of Agent Coulson was supposed to be this tragedy that strikes at the hearts of the Avengers and motivates them them to fight together in his memory, but the scene had no emotional impact at all. It just felt cheesy.

The third act just felt very monotonous. Just minutes and minutes of fighting aliens and things falling down. In fact, I fell asleep for part of it. When action scenes just drag on, you kind of become desensitized to the spectacle, so it's not even a "holy fuck!" moment if they blow up a skyscraper or something. Good action scenes are still scenes, and scenes should move the arc forward, explore character, reinforce theme, do something that serves as a narrative brick in the story. With Avengers, just like with Man of Steel, action sequences feel like pausing the plot to show some special effects. In Man of Steel, we get a shit tonne of super people punching each other, with neither of them realizing that the other is not the least bit hurt because they are nearly invulnerable. They seem to think, "okay, that punch didn't really do anything; but maybe it'll work if I do the exact same thing again?" There isn't much at stake between them. Similar thing with The Avengers. It's directionless audio-visual assault.

And also... the cinematography really bothered me throughout the film. It looked more like a prime-time CBS television show than a movie, with all the desaturated greys. So many of the shots were so unnatural, with the Avengers posing in a formation that would look great on a poster or the DVD cover, but is contrived as fuck in the middle of a film.

After sticking with the franchise for a few films and not really being wowed, I kind of just hopped off the MCU train and didn't watch anything past that first Avengers movie. When Captain America: The Winter Soldier came out, people were saying that it was the best of the MCU films. I checked it out when it came on Netflix.

It was my favourite of the films, but still... I guess I was expecting more from the political spy-thriller angle; addressing the security state, the War on Terror, mass surveillance, extrajudicial killings, etc. But it kind of did what a lot of Hollywood movies do. The "good guys" are never implicated in any of the abuses of power. The problem is that a shadowy cabal of malevolent foreigners have infiltrated the machinery. The problem is never the machinery itself. Not a lot of exploration of moral ambiguity or ethical dilemmas.

Though the focus of the film was supposedly Bucky Barnes, I found that they didn't do a lot with the Winter Soldier character or give him much of an arc. He's brainwashed and evil, but then at the very end of the film, Captain America appeals to his heart, and he stops being evil. The much more interesting aspect of the film was the Steve Rogers/Natasha Romanova relationship. Despite being colleagues in both The Avengers and S.H.I.E.L.D., we realize that they don't really know a whole lot about each other. Their relationship is purely professional. Black Widow is a spy/government agent first, it just so happens to be that her interests at times will align with Captain America's, but they are not "friends." It's part of a larger pattern of Captain America realizing that he's has no friends. His whole life is an organization that requires certain secrets to be kept from certain members, so he doesn't really have a genuine relationship with anybody. Through working together as fugitives, we see Rogers and Romanova gradually breaking down the barriers between them and forming a true friendship. I thought that was a really nice arc.

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 11:58 AM   #3156
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Originally Posted by TuralyonW3 View Post
for stuff he's guessing about without even having seen it.
I am guessing, but am I wrong about much of the following:

>Spider-Man is working under Tony Stark, from whom he gets his tricked out costume. However, he isn't taken seriously enough by Stark nor considered ready to join the big leagues

>Adrian Toomes is resentful of the powerful and decides to use technology left behind from all those aliens in the first Avengers movie to even out the scales

>Spider-Man does a bunch of hero stuff, but then he takes on more than he can chew while fighting some formidable bad guys because he wants to prove himself as a hero, and the situation is headed for disaster until Iron Man comes in and saves the day.

>Iron Man gives Parker a lecture on being irresponsible and takes the suit back

>But Vulture is still out there being evil, and Spider-Man knows that somebody has to stop him

>So, without the help of his Stark suit, he takes on Vulture, determined to not let this end in the loss of life, as it almost did last time.

>He beats Vulture

>Stark is all like "you did good, kid... you're more than just the suit... but you still have a lot to learn and aren't ready to be an Avenger. But we'll be in touch."

>Also, all this is interspersed with Peter Parker being a nerdy high-school kid and navigating teenage life, except without the more soap-opera stuff of the last to iterations


Which parts are majorly off the mark? I mean, it could also end with Tony Stark accepting Peter Parker again, but Parker being like, "You know what? I don't want your stinkin' Avengers badge. I'm proud to be the friendly neighbourhood Spider-Man" (but then he'll work with them again in the next Avengers movie anyway because it's the big crossover).

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 11:58 AM   #3157
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Old 07-11-2017, 12:00 PM   #3158
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Oh, I guess Toomes and Parker will also have a personal relationship outside the costume, because there's no reason for Parker to be in the backseat of Toomes' car when he gives him the threatening speech.

It'll be like the first Maguire movie, where Osborn and Parker learn each other's identities at Thanksgiving dinner, creating a tension that nobody else at the table is aware of.

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 12:34 PM   #3159
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This isn't 4chan

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 01:06 PM   #3160
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This isn't 2000 and 5

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 02:00 PM   #3161
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this isn't some kind of metaphor

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 02:04 PM   #3162
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Old 07-11-2017, 02:06 PM   #3163
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No, it's painting of a pipe duuurrrr magritte

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:20 PM   #3164
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yeah i always hated that one too. but magritte was a fucking brilliant genius otherwise.

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:50 PM   #3165
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NSFW?




















 
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:55 PM   #3166
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Which 9th grader drew that

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 10:00 PM   #3167
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magritte's grand-grandson

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 10:02 PM   #3168
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that emperor porn stance of having one hand behind the back and one hand on her head makes me sick

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 10:09 PM   #3169
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I think maybe they didn't want to draw the other hand

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 10:13 PM   #3170
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hands and faces are the worst

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 10:13 PM   #3171
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just ask magritte's grand-grandson

 
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Old 07-11-2017, 10:17 PM   #3172
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personal shopper


so good. no more words

 
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Old 07-12-2017, 01:57 PM   #3173
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I'm willing to stake my reputation as an incessant recommender upon it.
Checks out. I read up on it a lil bit and am intrigued. Will look into it this weekend.

 
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Old 07-12-2017, 08:52 PM   #3174
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For every line past "Philip Seymour Hoffman" that you read before coming to this conclusion, a well-behaved child died in undeserving circumstances.

 
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:28 PM   #3175
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Just got back from Birdman V. Spider-Man: Dawn of Iron Man. Overall, a good time. A few minor gripes here and there (way too much Avengers crap bogging the story down) but Tom Holland is pretty much perfect as Peter Parker/Spider-Man and Michael Keaton as Vulture is the most interesting and threatening villain I've seen in a superhero movie since the Nolan Batmen. The first two Raimi flicks are still definitive Spider-Man in my book, but this was a nice, light take on the character that is certainly welcome after the garbage fire of the Garfield flicks. 8/10

 
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:31 PM   #3176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disco King View Post
I am guessing, but am I wrong about much of the following:

>Spider-Man is working under Tony Stark, from whom he gets his tricked out costume. However, he isn't taken seriously enough by Stark nor considered ready to join the big leagues

>Adrian Toomes is resentful of the powerful and decides to use technology left behind from all those aliens in the first Avengers movie to even out the scales

>Spider-Man does a bunch of hero stuff, but then he takes on more than he can chew while fighting some formidable bad guys because he wants to prove himself as a hero, and the situation is headed for disaster until Iron Man comes in and saves the day.

>Iron Man gives Parker a lecture on being irresponsible and takes the suit back

>But Vulture is still out there being evil, and Spider-Man knows that somebody has to stop him

>So, without the help of his Stark suit, he takes on Vulture, determined to not let this end in the loss of life, as it almost did last time.

>He beats Vulture

>Stark is all like "you did good, kid... you're more than just the suit... but you still have a lot to learn and aren't ready to be an Avenger. But we'll be in touch."

>Also, all this is interspersed with Peter Parker being a nerdy high-school kid and navigating teenage life, except without the more soap-opera stuff of the last to iterations


Which parts are majorly off the mark? I mean, it could also end with Tony Stark accepting Peter Parker again, but Parker being like, "You know what? I don't want your stinkin' Avengers badge. I'm proud to be the friendly neighbourhood Spider-Man" (but then he'll work with them again in the next Avengers movie anyway because it's the big crossover).
Wow, spoiler alert! I don't want to say you nailed it 100%, but you pretty much described the main meat of the story (sans one specific detail). Well played.

 
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Old 07-14-2017, 12:48 AM   #3177
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Valhalla Rising. A-

Weird film. .Almost plotless. Very grim, indeed.

Fulltoke approveth.

 
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Old 07-14-2017, 12:52 AM   #3178
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Valhalla Rising. A-

Weird film. .Almost plotless. Very grim, indeed.

Fulltoke approveth.
yup, powerfull stuff if you get in its rhythm

 
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Old 07-14-2017, 12:52 AM   #3179
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Originally Posted by FlamingGlobes View Post
Wow, spoiler alert! I don't want to say you nailed it 100%, but you pretty much described the main meat of the story (sans one specific detail). Well played.
it's all in the trailer

 
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Old 07-18-2017, 01:41 AM   #3180
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I meant to watch Schindler's List but now I'm watching High School Musical instead

jesus christ

it's the most 2007 thing ever

 
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