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01-30-2018, 02:57 PM | #1 |
Minion of Satan
Location: up a tree
Posts: 7,510
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Had Oceania been released after MCIS
with Jimmy still in band, that'd have been another big hit.
discuss. Also, Adore has NOT aged well. |
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01-30-2018, 03:02 PM | #2 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,846
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if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a bike
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01-30-2018, 03:06 PM | #3 |
**************
Location: I'm a quitter. I come from a long line of quitters. It's amazing I'm here at all.
Posts: 8,661
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01-30-2018, 03:20 PM | #4 |
Just Hook it to My Veins!
Location: Donald Trump of Netphoria
Posts: 37,215
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01-30-2018, 03:23 PM | #5 |
Minion of Satan
Location: up a tree
Posts: 7,510
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actually never mind neither one of those albums should have been released.
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01-30-2018, 05:30 PM | #6 |
Braindead
Location: Ignore List
Posts: 17,229
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i don't especially love either album, tbh. but i think the singing is better on Adore. both would have been a huge shock after MCIS though.
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01-30-2018, 05:45 PM | #7 |
huh
Posts: 62,456
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Actually Oceania is complete butt and Adore has aged really well.
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01-30-2018, 06:21 PM | #8 |
Braindead
Location: Ignore List
Posts: 17,229
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i would say SD has aged well, not Adore. but i never liked it much to start with. it's definitely not something i ever revisit, but all the albums before it are still exciting to hear.
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01-30-2018, 06:28 PM | #9 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: SP, Sao Paulo - Brazil
Posts: 4,846
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Adore is the one album that aged well.
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01-30-2018, 06:30 PM | #10 |
Minion of Satan
Location: Banned
Posts: 8,851
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I feel like people who don't like Adore are the people who are like "wuh where's my rawk?? where are the rats in cages??"
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01-30-2018, 06:33 PM | #11 |
Braindead
Location: Ignore List
Posts: 17,229
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i like plenty of mellow SP tracks, just not a fan of the way Adore sounds as a whole....it's exhausting and repetitive and feels like it's missing something (jimmy, probably)
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01-30-2018, 06:46 PM | #12 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 3,862
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Who the fuck are all these people praising Oceania!?
It was a valiant effort from Billy but the band he put together was shite. It copied the form of an old Pumpkins album but something was missing. It didn’t work. The songs weren’t good enough. |
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01-30-2018, 06:51 PM | #13 |
Minion of Satan
Location: Banned
Posts: 8,851
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Oceania just kinda sounds like Siamese Dream as performed by Ted from accounting's middle-aged cover band that played at that one staff party.
Like, sure, it has fuzzy guitars and "rawk" songs and some psychedelic effects and shit, but it still sounds boring. |
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01-30-2018, 07:28 PM | #14 |
Braindead
Location: Ignore List
Posts: 17,229
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the biggest problem with oceania was the lyrics
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01-30-2018, 07:45 PM | #15 |
Boardcaster
Location: reporting live
Posts: 3,854
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Seriously. It has ~two...*maybe* three good songs. Boring is a good word for it.
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01-30-2018, 07:48 PM | #16 |
Just Hook it to My Veins!
Location: N3t4Euh Haus
Posts: 32,749
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will never understand Adore haters
it's the most artistically mature piece of music Corgan has ever done and in some ways is probably actually the best Pumpkins record |
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01-30-2018, 07:49 PM | #17 |
Just Hook it to My Veins!
Location: N3t4Euh Haus
Posts: 32,749
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Oceania is a sonic rehash of the SD sound but the songs are much more boring, Billy's vocals are not good, the drums are fucking terrible, and the lyrics are embarrassing. Adore is an A album if not A+, Oceania is a C and it struggles to get there because if you subtracted the 3 or 4 truly decent songs the album would be in Monuments to an Elegy territory
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01-30-2018, 07:56 PM | #18 |
Minion of Satan
Location: Gold Lace Sensor
Posts: 5,655
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Oceania doesn't sound anything like Siamese Dream aside from maybe Inkless (probably the best song on the album). The drums weren't the issue. It's just overly proggy and uninspired as a whole. I have a couple of the 2012 official live bootlegs and the band actually sounds pretty good live. That lineup was better than the BC, Jimmy, Jeff, and unknown bass player guy lineup that toured with Manson. Jimmy is not a cure all.
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01-30-2018, 08:08 PM | #19 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 3,419
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I would actually give Oceania another listen if it had Jimmy on board.
Although the fact it's about Billy's breakup with his New Age girlfriend makes the overall sentiment rather unlistenable. |
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01-30-2018, 08:11 PM | #20 |
Just Hook it to My Veins!
Location: Donald Trump of Netphoria
Posts: 37,215
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Oceania blows.
Adore has To Sheila and For Martha. Whole nother universe man. |
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01-30-2018, 08:23 PM | #21 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: A very stable individual
Posts: 1,685
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Adore hasn't age well? What are you smoking? It has only gained more praise since its release. As for Oceania, a bore fest. Maybe a few tracks could have been saved, but as is? Nah. Adore pisses all over Oceania. Adore had heart and emotion. Maybe if you took the best from post-Machina albums and made a single release, you may have a decent album. But each album on their own since Machina have moments of good surrounded by some ehh and lots of bleh. Sorry, Adore was amazing when it first came out and I'm glad more people are realizing that. Even Machina ain't perfect. There's probably an amazing single Machina if you took the best of I and II.
After Machina, Billy went all spiritual and zen and I just have not connected with him in this phase. All sunshines and rainbows. It feels fake... forced. I don't feel the raw passion and an exposed human emotion he had on his earlier work. There's just a depth there that is missing. I just don't connect with what he's trying to say or do now. Last edited by MyKeyZ : 01-30-2018 at 08:30 PM. |
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01-30-2018, 08:52 PM | #22 |
Braindead
Location: Ignore List
Posts: 17,229
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01-30-2018, 09:06 PM | #23 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Posts: 3,419
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and magnets, how do they work?
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01-30-2018, 09:35 PM | #24 |
Immortal
Posts: 25,684
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no. I would have been like "what the fuck happened to billy's vocals"
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01-30-2018, 11:11 PM | #25 |
Socialphobic
Location: montreal
Posts: 11,656
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I don't care that the RAWK is gone, it's the the electronics on Adore that have NOT aged well.
The electronic elements on MCIS all aged well, and even the ones on Machina (there's tons of them burried in the walls of sound, its' fantastic). But Adore is just meh. Billy needed a producer with good taste - not himself. But if Oach had been released in 1998... I dunno. lyrically it's weak, production is flat. MAYbe it could have done better than Adore but SP and alternative music had past it's peak, it was time to let other bands have the spotlight |
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01-30-2018, 11:18 PM | #26 |
Just Hook it to My Veins!
Location: Donald Trump of Netphoria
Posts: 37,215
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Like Boris.
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01-30-2018, 11:57 PM | #27 |
Socialphobic
Location: Your god damn living room
Posts: 10,000
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completely understand this assessment & yet i still love it - prob because for the past 5-10 years i've only listened to their records in parts
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01-31-2018, 12:49 AM | #28 |
Apocalyptic Poster
Location: up on the cross you go little fella
Posts: 2,676
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Oceania has too many songs, inconsistent vocals, lyrics that are mostly so overwrought they convey nothing, and drums that sound like someone farting into a cellophane wrapper. Had it somehow emerged after MCIS it would have been derided as a band not knowing what to do with itself and aping its own sound in an attempt to prove it could manage without Jimmy.
I still find something to enjoy about it whenever I throw it on for what that's worth. |
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01-31-2018, 01:01 AM | #29 | |
Minion of Satan
Location: up a tree
Posts: 7,510
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Quote:
I'm no fan of Oceania but it has the riffs and put jimmy on that and i'm positive it would have sold more than adore had. i'm talking about those general audience numbers the billy has been fore er trying to recapture since MCIS. I know the 5,000 or so fans he has left find that Adore>Oceania. but like BC said, no one wanted a funeral dirge album in 1998. |
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01-31-2018, 01:31 AM | #30 |
Dute of Seven Y's
Location: Mr. C's garage
Posts: 7,764
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The fuck, dude. If Jim was still in the band it might be ok, but it’s rooted to its time, whereas Siamese Dream has a classic sound that could exist in any time zone.
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