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Old 01-30-2018, 02:57 PM   #1
paranoid
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Default Had Oceania been released after MCIS

with Jimmy still in band, that'd have been another big hit.

discuss.

Also, Adore has NOT aged well.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 03:02 PM   #2
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if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a bike

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 03:06 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paranoid View Post
with Jimmy still in band, that'd have been another big hit.

discuss.

Also, Adore has NOT aged well.
both wrong, happy to help!

1998, the Smashing Pumpkins drop Oceania. that would have gone over just great...

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 03:20 PM   #4
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http://forums.netphoria.org/showthre...68#post4412668

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 03:23 PM   #5
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actually never mind neither one of those albums should have been released.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 05:30 PM   #6
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i don't especially love either album, tbh. but i think the singing is better on Adore. both would have been a huge shock after MCIS though.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 05:45 PM   #7
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Actually Oceania is complete butt and Adore has aged really well.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 06:21 PM   #8
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i would say SD has aged well, not Adore. but i never liked it much to start with. it's definitely not something i ever revisit, but all the albums before it are still exciting to hear.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 06:28 PM   #9
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Adore is the one album that aged well.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 06:30 PM   #10
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I feel like people who don't like Adore are the people who are like "wuh where's my rawk?? where are the rats in cages??"

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 06:33 PM   #11
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i like plenty of mellow SP tracks, just not a fan of the way Adore sounds as a whole....it's exhausting and repetitive and feels like it's missing something (jimmy, probably)

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 06:46 PM   #12
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Who the fuck are all these people praising Oceania!?

It was a valiant effort from Billy but the band he put together was shite. It copied the form of an old Pumpkins album but something was missing. It didn’t work. The songs weren’t good enough.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 06:51 PM   #13
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Oceania just kinda sounds like Siamese Dream as performed by Ted from accounting's middle-aged cover band that played at that one staff party.

Like, sure, it has fuzzy guitars and "rawk" songs and some psychedelic effects and shit, but it still sounds boring.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 07:28 PM   #14
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the biggest problem with oceania was the lyrics

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 07:45 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disco King View Post
Oceania just kinda sounds like Siamese Dream as performed by Ted from accounting's middle-aged cover band that played at that one staff party.

Like, sure, it has fuzzy guitars and "rawk" songs and some psychedelic effects and shit, but it still sounds boring.
Seriously. It has ~two...*maybe* three good songs. Boring is a good word for it.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 07:48 PM   #16
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will never understand Adore haters

it's the most artistically mature piece of music Corgan has ever done and in some ways is probably actually the best Pumpkins record

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 07:49 PM   #17
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Oceania is a sonic rehash of the SD sound but the songs are much more boring, Billy's vocals are not good, the drums are fucking terrible, and the lyrics are embarrassing. Adore is an A album if not A+, Oceania is a C and it struggles to get there because if you subtracted the 3 or 4 truly decent songs the album would be in Monuments to an Elegy territory

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 07:56 PM   #18
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Oceania doesn't sound anything like Siamese Dream aside from maybe Inkless (probably the best song on the album). The drums weren't the issue. It's just overly proggy and uninspired as a whole. I have a couple of the 2012 official live bootlegs and the band actually sounds pretty good live. That lineup was better than the BC, Jimmy, Jeff, and unknown bass player guy lineup that toured with Manson. Jimmy is not a cure all.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 08:08 PM   #19
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I would actually give Oceania another listen if it had Jimmy on board.

Although the fact it's about Billy's breakup with his New Age girlfriend makes the overall sentiment rather unlistenable.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 08:11 PM   #20
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Oceania blows.

Adore has To Sheila and For Martha. Whole nother universe man.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 08:23 PM   #21
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Adore hasn't age well? What are you smoking? It has only gained more praise since its release. As for Oceania, a bore fest. Maybe a few tracks could have been saved, but as is? Nah. Adore pisses all over Oceania. Adore had heart and emotion. Maybe if you took the best from post-Machina albums and made a single release, you may have a decent album. But each album on their own since Machina have moments of good surrounded by some ehh and lots of bleh. Sorry, Adore was amazing when it first came out and I'm glad more people are realizing that. Even Machina ain't perfect. There's probably an amazing single Machina if you took the best of I and II.

After Machina, Billy went all spiritual and zen and I just have not connected with him in this phase. All sunshines and rainbows. It feels fake... forced. I don't feel the raw passion and an exposed human emotion he had on his earlier work. There's just a depth there that is missing. I just don't connect with what he's trying to say or do now.

Last edited by MyKeyZ : 01-30-2018 at 08:30 PM.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 08:52 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redbreegull View Post
will never understand Adore haters
and i will never understand the people that say oceania sounds like siamese dream

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 09:06 PM   #23
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and magnets, how do they work?

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 09:35 PM   #24
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no. I would have been like "what the fuck happened to billy's vocals"

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 11:11 PM   #25
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I don't care that the RAWK is gone, it's the the electronics on Adore that have NOT aged well.

The electronic elements on MCIS all aged well, and even the ones on Machina (there's tons of them burried in the walls of sound, its' fantastic). But Adore is just meh. Billy needed a producer with good taste - not himself.

But if Oach had been released in 1998... I dunno. lyrically it's weak, production is flat. MAYbe it could have done better than Adore but SP and alternative music had past it's peak, it was time to let other bands have the spotlight

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 11:18 PM   #26
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Like Boris.

 
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Old 01-30-2018, 11:57 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilikeplanets View Post
i like plenty of mellow SP tracks, just not a fan of the way Adore sounds as a whole....it's exhausting and repetitive and feels like it's missing something (jimmy, probably)
completely understand this assessment & yet i still love it - prob because for the past 5-10 years i've only listened to their records in parts

 
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Old 01-31-2018, 12:49 AM   #28
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Oceania has too many songs, inconsistent vocals, lyrics that are mostly so overwrought they convey nothing, and drums that sound like someone farting into a cellophane wrapper. Had it somehow emerged after MCIS it would have been derided as a band not knowing what to do with itself and aping its own sound in an attempt to prove it could manage without Jimmy.

I still find something to enjoy about it whenever I throw it on for what that's worth.

 
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Old 01-31-2018, 01:01 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T&T
I don't care that the RAWK is gone, it's the the electronics on Adore that have NOT aged well.
This, exactly. I love adore, was my favorite for a while. To Sheila, Shame, For Martha, all top 10 SP songs imo. but then apples and oranges comes on and it sounds like that small time warp of late 90's electro alternative and just a straight up boring song. same could be said for several of the other more electro tinged songs on that record.

I'm no fan of Oceania but it has the riffs and put jimmy on that and i'm positive it would have sold more than adore had. i'm talking about those general audience numbers the billy has been fore er trying to recapture since MCIS. I know the 5,000 or so fans he has left find that Adore>Oceania.

but like BC said, no one wanted a funeral dirge album in 1998.

 
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Old 01-31-2018, 01:31 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redbreegull View Post
will never understand Adore haters

it's the most artistically mature piece of music Corgan has ever done and in some ways is probably actually the best Pumpkins record
The fuck, dude. If Jim was still in the band it might be ok, but it’s rooted to its time, whereas Siamese Dream has a classic sound that could exist in any time zone.

 
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