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Old 07-25-2014, 03:25 AM   #151
Trotskilicious
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hahaha she's a real left winger cause she's been down south and held peasants in her arms

oh frank, you're so great

there you go, that nailed it.

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 03:26 AM   #152
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ride the tiger down river euphrates

askljrasrrasgghahhshahnngnh!!!!!

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 03:30 AM   #153
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*TYRE/tire

or is it tiger anyway?

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 03:33 AM   #154
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i'm pretty sure it's tiger

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 03:33 AM   #155
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bram you are an untroo fan

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 05:59 AM   #156
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i'm definitely not an untroo fan.
and i'm pretty sure it tyre. mainly because he says "tyre" and not "tiger".

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 06:10 AM   #157
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plus one for tiger

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 06:11 AM   #158
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1:08 tiGER

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 06:19 AM   #159
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JFGI! it's right there "tiger was made official by pixies.com"

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 07:54 AM   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky Day Spa View Post
1:08 tiGER
i think you're right. there (and at the end of the song, at 2:16 and 2:23) it's tiger. everywhere else it's tyre though. so it's both.

and if you listen to the re-recorded version on the gigantic single (also included on complete 'b'-sides, for example), there's no tiger at all. tyre everywhere.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8G77mnuY6_g

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 07:57 AM   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trotskilicious View Post
JFGI! it's right there "tiger was made official by pixies.com"
link?

pixies.com doesn't exist, by the way. the official website is pixiesmusic.com these days. and there it says "tire": http://www.pixiesmusic.com/song/river-euphrates/

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 08:19 AM   #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool As Ice Cream View Post
and if you listen to the re-recorded version on the gigantic single (also included on complete 'b'-sides, for example), there's no tiger at all. tyre everywhere.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8G77mnuY6_g
still sounds like tygre to me

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 09:07 AM   #163
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you're all being silly, he clearly sings 'i went bowling'

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 09:14 AM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redbreegull View Post
I think what happened in Rwanda had the specific goal of murdering/eliminating people of a particular group. I don't personally think that anyone but some real extremists in Israel want to kill Palestinians because they are Palestinians. When I argued about this with someone else the other day, the other party said a lot of things like, "but in effect..."

well I guess you could make that argument although I think the killing of a few hundred or even a few thousand people is kind of a flimsy argument for genocide without the intent to kill them BECAUSE of their nationality. Truthfully, a shit ton of civilians are killed in all wars. Are all wars genocides?

Americans probably killed 100,000+ civilians in Iraq. Was it an Iraqi genocide? I'm not setting up a strawman, just trying to find where the borders of this term are because it seems to mean an increasing number of things


gen·o·cide


/ˈjenəˌsīd/

noun: genocide; plural noun: genocides

the deliberate killing of a large group of people, especially those of a particular ethnic group or nation.

synonyms: mass murder, mass homicide, massacre; annihilation, extermination, elimination, liquidation, eradication, decimation, butchery, bloodletting; pogrom, ethnic cleansing, holocaust

"a tyrant guilty of genocide"

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 09:17 AM   #165
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I would agree that civilian casualties of war would not necessarily warrant the term Genocide if civilians were not the aim or targets of a military. But only to an extent.

It doesn't mean that a mass killing has to approach the scale or organization of the Jewish or Armenian Holocausts to garner the term. The term "Holocaust" was applied to the Jewish genocide specifically because the term genocide was not sufficiently strong or weighty to convey the scale and intent involved.

You can therefore apply the term to other forms of mass killing.

Fire bombing Dresden or Nuking two cities in Japan might be considered Genocide. Since the goal was to kill hundreds of thousands of civilians.

Last edited by MyOneAndOnly : 07-25-2014 at 02:20 PM.

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 09:48 AM   #166
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Would, however, might be

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 10:20 AM   #167
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Aren't most wars against specific nations or countries? Or groups of people? Like always?

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 10:58 AM   #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottytheoneand View Post
Fire bombing Dresden or Nuking two cities in Japan would, however, might be considered Genocide. Since the goal was to kill hundreds of thousands of civilians.
i completely disagree. that's not what genocide is.
and was that even the goal?

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 11:05 AM   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pavementtune View Post
Quote:
The field’s growth came initially through the extension of understandings of the Nazi genocide of the Jews, which by the late 20th century was known as “the Holocaust,” to other cases, both historic (such as the Ottoman extermination of the Armenians) and contemporary (such as the Cambodian and Rwandan genocides). However, it has since expanded to consider phenomena quite different from the Holocaust in scale and form, such as the diverse and long-drawn-out pattern of genocide during European colonization of the non-Western world. At the same time, the transformations of political violence and war in the post–Cold War world have led to new divergences over the applicability of the genocide idea to recent events. Recent cases, such as the former Yugoslavia, have raised questions about the relationships of population removal and sexual violence to genocide. Because of these tensions, the growth of the field has been accompanied by theoretical, paradigm, and political differences.
Doesn't sound like there is a general agreement how to use the term at all.

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 02:29 PM   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool As Ice Cream View Post
i completely disagree. that's not what genocide is.
and was that even the goal?
"deliberate killing of a large group of people"



the goal was to destroy the infrastructure and industry of the city and take out the workers who were employed in heavy equipment plants. The bombing campaigns by both the Axis and Allied forces were designed to weaken the populations of those countries. The allies killed over 200,000 civilians alone just in Dresden. That's a conservative estimate. I've seen some claims that it was closer to 500,000 people.

Based on the definition of genocide, that fits. You don't have to attempt to eradicate every single person on Earth of a particular ethnicity or religion to qualify as committing genocide.

Look at pictures of any German city that sustained heavy bombing. Koln was nothing but rubble. The only thing standing afterwards was the cathedral. Was every apartment house in Koln a military target?

After a war the winners always define the language used to remember it. Which is the only reason we don't refer to Hiroshima or Dresden as genocide.


.

Last edited by MyOneAndOnly : 07-25-2014 at 02:39 PM.

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 02:41 PM   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pavementtune View Post
Doesn't sound like there is a general agreement how to use the term at all.
that's the "problem" with english. it's never static. the use and meaning of much of the language is constantly changing.

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 04:37 PM   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottytheoneand View Post
"deliberate killing of a large group of people"
that's not the definition.

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 05:47 PM   #173
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I posted it above. what the fuck more do you want?

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 06:16 PM   #174
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http://forums.netphoria.org/customav...ar25839_47.gif

 
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Old 07-25-2014, 07:43 PM   #175
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apparently we have a 12-hour ceasefire.

i hate life.

 
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Old 07-27-2014, 12:32 AM   #176
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Just read about this thing that Bibi said in '07 that should put the "is this genocide?" question to rest.

Quote:
In his speech, Netanyahu referred to the cuts in child pensions, saying that since they were implemented “two positive things happened: members of the Haredi public seriously joined the workforce. And on the national level, the unexpected result was the demographic effect on the non-Jewish public, where there was a dramatic drop in the birth rate.
http://972mag.com/when-zionism-is-ra...-record/75515/

 
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Old 07-27-2014, 12:45 AM   #177
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ride my DICK down river euphrates

 
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Old 07-27-2014, 09:26 AM   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottytheoneand View Post
The term "Holocaust" was applied to the Jewish genocide specifically because the term genocide was not sufficiently strong or weighty to convey the scale and intent involved
Quote:
Originally Posted by pavementtune
The field’s growth came initially through the extension of understandings of the Nazi genocide of the Jews, which by the late 20th century was known as “the Holocaust,”

you're an idiot scotty

 
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Old 07-27-2014, 10:26 AM   #179
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ooops, some casualties here and there...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BtjlFKECIAEel6_.jpg:large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Btjm3SfCQAILEhj.jpg:large

 
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Old 07-27-2014, 11:25 AM   #180
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hell of a pinpoint operation.

 
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