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Old 08-25-2017, 08:18 PM   #151
reprise85
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he sang great live on the plainsong tour.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 08:26 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
Ahhh.... Often times people are easily impressed in a live setting. I've heard a handful of bootlegs and his voice isn't close to the quality that it was 15 years ago.
haven't we had this discussion before? your 15 minutes of youtube investigation does not trump my actual experience. his voice was surprisingly excellent, perhaps the best i've heard it. obviously he can't scream and shit but im talking general strength, tone, being on key, control, etc. it was pretty good in 2007, too. he just sucks on record and when he drops consonants. he only used a little vibrato live.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 08:40 PM   #153
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All the art direction for the posters and stuff is really really well done. Reminds me of MCIS era type stuff. Great turn of the century aesthetic

but the album cover itself is literal figurative garbage

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 08:41 PM   #154
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He ekes out slivers of vibrato among patches of his signature rasp
There wasn't any signature rasp. what the fuck is pitchfork talking about

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 08:42 PM   #155
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It's really not a bad track ...

But this vocal trip he has been on HAS to mercifully end

Bill - shake yourself man

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 08:44 PM   #156
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Anyone remember that one video from a couple years ago, when he came out with Manson and did a song just for fun? He sounded fucking great there - vintage growl

Which is scary -- he really thinks this shit sounds good.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 08:49 PM   #157
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So what's your excuse for the poor vocal showing on the lead single of his long-awaited hyped solo album? Just a bad take used?
no, obviously it sounds good to him for some unknown reason. im positive he can sing better than that. it sounds like he went in a room and turned everything up and sang into the middle of the room. it is recorded like shit and mixed like shit and he sounds like shit. but corgan likes how it sounds, obviously

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 09:28 PM   #158
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Let's face it, reprise85, it's time: you need to just let's face it. Once you just let's face it, you'll see that mr fuzz eros is the ONLY only 1 itt making any kind of sense! Clearly, obviously, let's face it, you've imagined your entire mythical life, but thankfully mr roes is here to set you straight and help you let's face it, which is the 1st step toward healing!

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 09:41 PM   #159
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he sang great live on the plainsong tour.
Idk about that... the videos of him performing with Iha are unlistenable due to Billy's terrible voice.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 09:53 PM   #160
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I dunno... I don't buy the narrative of "Billy just sounds like shit because he likes sounding like that" ...

Think about it, even in the 90's his vocals were a big point of contention..... We're talking like 23 years later now... It's only natural that he's lost the howl, the rasp, the screech... Now we're simply left with the "whine" and he uses the vibrato to overcompensate.
even if that's the best he can sing, which i don't think is true, the recording itself sounds like shit. he absolutely could have added effects to make it not sound as shitty, or just used a better recording procedure. it sounds beyond amateurish. since he didn't even do that, it follows that he likes the way it sounds

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 10:05 PM   #161
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Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
People can use some imagined mythical live performance to rationalize that he's still "as good as ever" but the proof is in the released recorded content.
If anything, a good singer live is gonna sound even better in the studio due to having a controlled environment and the ability to edit/comp vocal performances.

The 'defense' here by reprise85 (and others have tried to give) that Billy sounds bad in the studio but good live is probably the most backasswards argument ever.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 10:15 PM   #162
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Billy likes the way his voice sounds produced super dry and up-front. He has previously said that as he has become a technically better and more accurate singer, he feels driven to showcase his voice up front and he has an inner conflict over whether the guitar or voice should be higher. So. Yeah, he likes how he sounds and records and produces himself like this on purpose.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 10:15 PM   #163
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Originally Posted by amoergosum View Post

congrats, this demand is indeed overwhelming. Bolly sold out three gigs and they had to add a fourth!
the venue holds 150 people.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 10:16 PM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jelly Blossom View Post
If anything, a good singer live is gonna sound even better in the studio due to having a controlled environment and the ability to edit/comp vocal performances.

The 'defense' here by reprise85 (and others have tried to give) that Billy sounds bad in the studio but good live is probably the most backasswards argument ever.
well one big difference is that live his voice reverberates and has "space" to it. In the studio he produces himself so it sounds like he's singing in a closest with pillows on the walls

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 10:20 PM   #165
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congrats, this demand is indeed overwhelming. Bolly sold out three gigs and they had to add a fourth!
the venue holds 150 people.
Wow... he was able to pull 600 ppl from the country's second largest market...

I mean, getting 600 ppl combined to consecutive shows is impressive if you're an amateur, but not so much for a guy who's received as much exposure and publicity as Billy.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 10:23 PM   #166
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well one big difference is that live his voice reverberates and has "space" to it. In the studio he produces himself so it sounds like he's singing in a closest with pillows on the walls
Rick Ruben produced this Ogilala, not Billy.

There's also a thing called echo and reverb that can be added to recordings now. If Billy has indeed been singing in a closest with pillows on the walls subtle effects can be added to color his vocal performances.

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 11:22 PM   #167
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SHIT JELLIES GETTIN "THERES ALSO A THING NOW" SALTY WATCH OUT

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 11:26 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by Jelly Blossom View Post
Rick Ruben produced this Ogilala, not Billy.

There's also a thing called echo and reverb that can be added to recordings now. If Billy has indeed been singing in a closest with pillows on the walls subtle effects can be added to color his vocal performances.
yeah but he didn't add them, showing that he likes how it sounds without it

 
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Old 08-25-2017, 11:26 PM   #169
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Dudes did u know this guy jellie knows fuckton of about music?? Subtle effects even

 
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Old 08-26-2017, 01:24 AM   #170
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Gonna be the milquetoast moderate and suggest it's a mix of a few factors. When I saw him on the Plainsong tour in Toronto he had moments where the old voice crept through here and there, and I remember being kind of pleasantly surprised but there were dropped consonants throughout the night. He can't and won't ever sing the way he used to again.

This is also the guy who's got a history of doing multiple vocal takes, taking preferred snippets of syllables and blending them together to create the sound he wants. I don't doubt that what we hear on LPs is what he wants us to hear.

He could sound a bit closer to what we'd define as the classic voice. But he won't, partly because that's not what he wants to sound like and partially because he can't pull it off anymore.

 
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:36 AM   #171
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This is also the guy who's got a history of doing multiple vocal takes, taking preferred snippets of syllables and blending them together to create the sound he wants. I don't doubt that what we hear on LPs is what he wants us to hear.
Either that or he realizes that you can only polish a turd so much before you realize it's a turd.

 
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Old 08-26-2017, 05:39 AM   #172
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Originally Posted by Shadaloo View Post
When I saw him on the Plainsong tour in Toronto he had moments where the old voice crept through here and there, and I remember being kind of pleasantly surprised but there were dropped consonants throughout the night. He can't and won't ever sing the way he used to again.


This vocal performance was pretty nice:

[best moment: 0:36]






Flashback:



Last edited by amoergosum : 08-26-2017 at 05:47 AM.

 
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Old 08-26-2017, 10:27 AM   #173
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I think James Iha should produce the next album

 
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Old 08-26-2017, 10:48 AM   #174
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LMAO
What's funny is, if you go back and read Corgan's Confessions, he talks about Rubin getting bored with the band doing endless take of "Let Me Give the World to You" and falling asleep on the sofa.

 
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Old 08-26-2017, 06:16 PM   #175
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Let's dissect Billy's vocals on Pennies. Well, just the last line.

"Pennies for sale"

The "Pen-" is forced out of him, showcasing true emotion. Billy then uses his vibrato on "sale", but his voice is coming out harder and it's not so noticeable (plus the vocals are a lot lower in the mix).

This line is repeated and please note the lack of "lover". Billy will never sing like this again.

 
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Old 08-27-2017, 12:04 AM   #176
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He didn't add effects to his voice that would make it sound better. So he was happy without them. I'm not saying he "thinks it sounds great" (although he might), just that he clearly prefers it to be dry like that because he clearly could have made it less dry but decided not to.

I don't know how much clearer I can explain myself

 
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Old 08-27-2017, 01:19 AM   #177
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Good grief Reprise... He doesn't "like" how it sounds.... It's simply the best that he can fucking offer at his age.... Of course Billy Corgan is gonna whine and moan in the media about how he's "trying to sound like that" and that he thinks "it sounds great"...
Billy's been trying to "make peace" with his voice since at least Adore.

Starting @ 5:18, these are Billy's words, not mine:

Quote:
Originally Posted by William Patrick Corgan
I think I'm trying to make peace with a lot of things, you know, one of which is my voice. I don't sing as well as I would like to...


The sad thing is, despite how bad Billy's voice sounded in the 90s it sounded golden then compared to how it sounds now. :/

 
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Old 08-27-2017, 07:40 AM   #178
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It didn't sound bad in the 90s though. Even though it wasn't technically proper, it conveyed tons of emotion, which is really the goal for an alt rock shoegaze band

it's the James Iha of voices

 
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Old 08-27-2017, 12:10 PM   #179
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It didn't sound bad in the 90s though. Even though it wasn't technically proper, it conveyed tons of emotion, which is really the goal for an alt rock shoegaze band

it's the James Iha of voices
The lack of quality of Billy's voice was sticking point in the 90s too. I remember knowing people from that era who felt and/or agreed that the Pumpkins would've been a stronger act if the group had a front man who could sing and Billy focused on just playing guitar/writing music (a la Pete Townshend or Tom Scholz).

Unfortunately his voice has only gotten worse over the years. I'm sure it's from a factor of age, sheer laziness, overconfidence and ego/surrounding himself with yes-men.

Billy and Dave Mustaine are really examples of how a guy doesn't need to be even a decent singer to front an amazingly successful rock band. It's really amazing how much success they've had as singers despite each lacking the ability to sing well.

 
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Old 08-28-2017, 03:42 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by Jelly Blossom View Post
The lack of quality of Billy's voice was sticking point in the 90s too. I remember knowing people from that era who felt and/or agreed that the Pumpkins would've been a stronger act if the group had a front man who could sing and Billy focused on just playing guitar/writing music (a la Pete Townshend or Tom Scholz).
this is fucking stupid, tbh. Billy was the best vocalist for those songs and frankly the only one who should be singing them.

He had a mastery of "swapping roles" on stuff like Bullet or even Soma that few other big names from that period could have done. and even if they could have, they wouldn't have the personally-driven angst that drove those songs when Bill sang them anyway

these days though, i'd be more than happy to hear him write for another (preferrably female) singer. A full album of like, Natalie Imbruglia singing Corgan songs as some 20-years-later follow-up to Identify or something would probably be pretty sweet

 
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