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Old 02-23-2014, 04:20 PM   #91
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Rand Paul is a fucking moron who doesn't really think the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was Constitutional (an opinion i imagine he shares with jczeroman).
Do you think President Rand Paul would seek to repeal the civil rights act? Do you even think Senator Rand Paul would vote in favour of such an idea should hell freeze over and it be put to a vote?

Yes? Then you are a complete moron.
No? Then it is irrelevant.

Do you acknowledge that people can be for freedom of speech and private property rights without agreeing with every awful thing that people do with those rights?

While Rand Paul's views on the Civil Rights act are totally fringe - no question - this issue is (and will) be used against him to say that he is racist, which is completely disingenuous and there are much better (legitimate) reasons to be against a Rand Paul presidency.

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He might appeal to the same young idiots that Ron Paul appealed to (yes there were dumb young people that voted for Obama too, no need to point that fact out to me).
Actually Rand Paul has alienated most libertarians and he has especially alienated people who supported his father. Rand Paul is a Tea-Party Republican. Ron Paul was a paleo-libertarian.

 
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Old 02-24-2014, 02:33 AM   #92
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paleo-libertarian.

https://www.lpmn.org/wordpress/wp-co...rateRaptor.bmp

 
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Old 02-24-2014, 03:12 PM   #93
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do you get it. because paleo refers to the prehistoric past. and that's a raptor

 
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Old 02-24-2014, 03:12 PM   #94
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who is commenting on libertarianism

 
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:25 PM   #95
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do you get it. because paleo refers to the prehistoric past. and that's a raptor
HILLARYOUS!

 
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:26 PM   #96
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Will be used in general election by opponent in some way.

 
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Old 02-25-2014, 09:53 PM   #97
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Do you think President Rand Paul would seek to repeal the civil rights act? Do you even think Senator Rand Paul would vote in favour of such an idea should hell freeze over and it be put to a vote?

Yes? Then you are a complete moron.
No? Then it is irrelevant.

Do you acknowledge that people can be for freedom of speech and private property rights without agreeing with every awful thing that people do with those rights?

While Rand Paul's views on the Civil Rights act are totally fringe - no question - this issue is (and will) be used against him to say that he is racist, which is completely disingenuous and there are much better (legitimate) reasons to be against a Rand Paul presidency.



Actually Rand Paul has alienated most libertarians and he has especially alienated people who supported his father. Rand Paul is a Tea-Party Republican. Ron Paul was a paleo-libertarian.
Way to duck my assertion.

And no, fundamental world views are not ever irrelevant.

Well I guess you didn't duck my assertion. Property rights above all else! You're gross.

 
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Old 02-26-2014, 03:38 PM   #98
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i'm a communist and i can counter argue this with libertarian philosophy.

 
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Old 02-26-2014, 03:39 PM   #99
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there is very, very little that gets done in this country without federal money. corporations are the largest beneficiary by a considerable degree.

so you want to know why they don't support libertarianism, paleo or otherwise? refer to the above, if you need more:

essentially the introductory premise of your horrible thoughtful raptor meme is incredibly wrong, even real libertarians -- not the 23 year old dope smoking upper middle class dude that read atlas shrugged once in college -- will tell you that mega-corporations wouldn't even exist without governmental assistance, and that their economic philosophy is actually bad for mega-corps.

i am a socialist and a skeptic, so i don't believe that is true i think they would form naturally especially in an unregulated economy (the goal is to win right?) but shifting to that stage with our economy as it currently is would actually do a great deal to dismantle these mega-corps. Airline industries would go bankrupt, banks would collapse. It would be an economic catastrophe, really.

Last edited by Trotskilicious : 02-26-2014 at 04:59 PM.

 
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Old 02-26-2014, 08:45 PM   #100
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Way to duck my assertion.

And no, fundamental world views are not ever irrelevant.

Well I guess you didn't duck my assertion. Property rights above all else! You're gross.
I don't think "property rights above all else" is what I believe and it is certainly not what Paul believes. I am not sure what you think Paul's "position" (really we are talking about some off the cusp comments which may or may not be indicative of a "fundamental world view") on the 1964 Civil Rights Act actually indicates. You seem to think that whatever it indicates is so obviously bad (or even dangerous?) that it doesn;t actually need to be articulated. I would love to hear you be a bit more explicit about what you are getting at.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 06:22 PM   #101
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I don't think "property rights above all else" is what I believe and it is certainly not what Paul believes. I am not sure what you think Paul's "position" (really we are talking about some off the cusp comments which may or may not be indicative of a "fundamental world view") on the 1964 Civil Rights Act actually indicates. You seem to think that whatever it indicates is so obviously bad (or even dangerous?) that it doesn;t actually need to be articulated. I would love to hear you be a bit more explicit about what you are getting at.
he thinks that businesses should be free to discriminate against people for any reason. he won't say that now, but if you don't think that's what he believes, you're kidding yourself. i assume that's an opinion you share. and it would be a fine one to have if you ignored practical realities of society.

and to hold that view is in fact really fucking racist. nuanced racism, sure. but racism.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 06:25 PM   #102
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He would have to move away from that kind of craziness to make a serious run, but yes, he does believe that.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 06:25 PM   #103
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for christ's sake the guy's name is RAND

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 07:50 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by Eulogy View Post
he thinks that businesses should be free to discriminate against people for any reason. he won't say that now, but if you don't think that's what he believes, you're kidding yourself. i assume that's an opinion you share. and it would be a fine one to have if you ignored practical realities of society.

and to hold that view is in fact really fucking racist. nuanced racism, sure. but racism.
i don't think saying racism is at work is fair

it's definitely short sighted but that's ron paul libertarianism for you

i think they think that if you let businesses do this they'd run themselves out of business and the problem would solve itself

but they're upper middle class white dudes so what do they know

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 07:50 PM   #105
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BUT THEN AGAIN, ron is old and from texas

just sayin

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:01 PM   #106
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i don't think saying racism is at work is fair

it's definitely short sighted but that's ron paul libertarianism for you

i think they think that if you let businesses do this they'd run themselves out of business and the problem would solve itself

but they're upper middle class white dudes so what do they know
it is an acceptance or denial of institutional racism. whether it comes from a place of unbelievable ignorance is irrelevant imo.

bottom line though he's a fucking moron and he will never be president. i really thought christie had the only shot for a non-democrat. maybe he still does.

sanders/warren 2016

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:02 PM   #107
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oh and ron is like absolutely racist. those newsletters? lol

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:09 PM   #108
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no man he like didn't know

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:09 PM   #109
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he didn't know what was being published in his own newsletters

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:16 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by Eulogy View Post
he thinks that businesses should be free to discriminate against people for any reason. he won't say that now, but if you don't think that's what he believes, you're kidding yourself. i assume that's an opinion you share. and it would be a fine one to have if you ignored practical realities of society.

and to hold that view is in fact really fucking racist. nuanced racism, sure. but racism.
So you are saying:

Rand Paul hasn't actually articulated a racist view but you somehow know that he is 'really fucking racist'? I am curious where you got this secret knowledge?

There are plenty of reasons to dislike and disagree with Rand Paul. There are plenty of reasons to disagree with his offhand comments on the civil rights act. It is disingenuous and arrogant to claim that you know that his views 'really are' and then base your opinions of someone based on those unfounded and unsubstantiated 'hunches'.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:25 PM   #111
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i think they think that if you let businesses do this they'd run themselves out of business and the problem would solve itself
I disagree. We're lucky to live in a society which (mostly) abhors (overt) racism. But there are plenty of places in the US where we see customers perfectly willing to pay more money to patronize businesses due to their politics or religious values. It is not a small step to suggest that were our country even just a little more racist and were business free to discriminate, some businesses would be quite successful if they promoted a racist agenda or had racist owners or whatever.

I am not saying this means that the only alternative is the most egregious of anti-discrimination laws, but I also do not buy the idea that a free market will eliminate racism because of capitalism. In fact in a racist society, racism is exactly what the consumer wants and if that society is also racist, the market will supply racism.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:31 PM   #112
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So you are saying:

Rand Paul hasn't actually articulated a racist view but you somehow know that he is 'really fucking racist'? I am curious where you got this secret knowledge?

There are plenty of reasons to dislike and disagree with Rand Paul. There are plenty of reasons to disagree with his offhand comments on the civil rights act. It is disingenuous and arrogant to claim that you know that his views 'really are' and then base your opinions of someone based on those unfounded and unsubstantiated 'hunches'.
it's not a hunch. maybe google something.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:32 PM   #113
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I disagree. We're lucky to live in a society which (mostly) abhors (overt) racism. But there are plenty of places in the US where we see customers perfectly willing to pay more money to patronize businesses due to their politics or religious values. It is not a small step to suggest that were our country even just a little more racist and were business free to discriminate, some businesses would be quite successful if they promoted a racist agenda or had racist owners or whatever.

I am not saying this means that the only alternative is the most egregious of anti-discrimination laws, but I also do not buy the idea that a free market will eliminate racism because of capitalism. In fact in a racist society, racism is exactly what the consumer wants and if that society is also racist, the market will supply racism.
well this is a word salad of nothingness.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:32 PM   #114
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what the fuck is an "egregious anti-discrimination law"

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 09:13 PM   #115
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oh and ron is like absolutely racist. those newsletters? lol
forgot, i've purged a lot of this because of total cynicism

i like trying to argue libertarianism, it helps you counter it

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 09:15 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by jczeroman View Post
I disagree. We're lucky to live in a society which (mostly) abhors (overt) racism. But there are plenty of places in the US where we see customers perfectly willing to pay more money to patronize businesses due to their politics or religious values. It is not a small step to suggest that were our country even just a little more racist and were business free to discriminate, some businesses would be quite successful if they promoted a racist agenda or had racist owners or whatever.

I am not saying this means that the only alternative is the most egregious of anti-discrimination laws, but I also do not buy the idea that a free market will eliminate racism because of capitalism. In fact in a racist society, racism is exactly what the consumer wants and if that society is also racist, the market will supply racism.
well what is the not racist reason against this thing

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 09:16 PM   #117
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Last edited by Trotskilicious : 02-28-2014 at 11:11 AM.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 10:11 PM   #118
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well what is the not racist reason against this thing
FREEDOM (for straight white well off males)

i love how his post is like "i don't think this, but i ALSO don't think this!" well good for you man why don't you tell us what you do think and we can go from there

whenever someone is hesitant to tell you what they actually think it means that what they actually think is fucking dumb. and i encounter this way way way way more than i would have ever expected.

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:20 PM   #119
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hehe,.. speaking of

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/foxs-bern...IGyZNCBLtGHNob

 
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:29 PM   #120
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that deer in the headlights stare

"all the viewpoints uh.. we appreciate.. uh plz don't put this on mediamatters kthnxbye"

 
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