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Old 10-01-2018, 10:02 PM   #211
fuzzyroes
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Originally Posted by soniclovenoize View Post
Except hip-hop is more mainstream than rock. I would argue that Kendrick is more relevant to popular culture than Billy Corgan. This is even quantifiable:

http://i64.tinypic.com/10zoign.png



Neither is "Give Peace a Chance" or "Power to the People." Why are you discounting these artists? Is there... some reason?
Yeah, I'm pretty ignorant about rap... You have a good point. I suppose I'm referring more to musicians than rappers.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:05 PM   #212
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netphoria has gotten REALLY dumb since I got a job...

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:06 PM   #213
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Lol if you're ruling out Kendrick because he's a rapper then this whole thread is pointless. Of course hip hop is going to be more politically confrontational than fucking straight=up dance and pop music. Why would you even care what those songs are about? Would it really make that much of a difference if Taylor Swift wrote a "Fuck Trump" song? Remember the whole Dixie Chicks debacle in the mid-00s? I realized this was pointless but not quite just how much so until that last round of "tweedle dee" between fuzzmaster flash & ass house up there
Well, a lot of rappers rap about the political problems within their certain cultures and communities as opposed to challenging and fighting the system as a whole.

I'm not trying to discount it, but it's definitely something that a small-town Canadian white boy might not be able to relate with... Or maybe I could, I dunno... I just don't like the way the genre sounds.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:07 PM   #214
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I feel like we're getting off topic though.

I think my original point holds weight and that Billy has paid a big price for being vocal politically... We're just getting off base because of some other opinion I shared... I don't want it to derail the original premise of the thread.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:11 PM   #215
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Black people making art about state violence = parochial concerns limited to a particular culture

White people whining about how they are being censored because private companies like Twitter and YouTube don't want to host their shitty content = broad concerns that really challenge the system and that everybody should pay attention to

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:18 PM   #216
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Making sure that cops are held accountable is a very valid and necessary movement. That's a good cause to take up... But it's a pretty common sense movement that any sane minded person can agree with. It's not a challenging concept.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:20 PM   #217
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You know, you look at performers and everyone knew/knows about the pedophilia and sexual abuse that is prominent in the entertainment industry... But no one dared/dares rally about that. Making a change means putting your ass on the line and few musicians are willing to do that... That's my point.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:20 PM   #218
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Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
Making sure that cops are held accountable is a very valid and necessary movement. That's a good cause to take up... But it's a pretty common sense movement that any sane minded person can agree with. It's not a challenging concept.
If it's not challenging, how come people are losing their minds over some football players acknowledging this problem?

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:22 PM   #219
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If it's not challenging, how come people sre losing their minds over some football players acknowledging this problem?
It's the time and place. What does kneeling down during the national anthem which is sang to honor the troops in the military have to do with police violence?

I think all that shit is dumb though. I'm with Bill Maher and George Carlin, I wish they'd get rid of all that shit in sports games all together. I don't see the point in it.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:25 PM   #220
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Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
You know, you look at performers and everyone knew/knows about the pedophilia and sexual abuse that is prominent in the entertainment industry... But no one dares rally about that. Making a change means putting your ass on the line and few musicians are willing to do that... That's my point.
Have you not fucking heard of #MeToo?

There's literally an international conversation sparked by women coming out and talking about how they've had to be silent about sexual abuse in the entertainment industry for years because of the consequences they'd face for speaking out. They are doing the exact thing you are claiming that nobody is doing. Do you even pay attention to anything beyond a 15 foot radius of your pissed-damaged Nintendo?

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:25 PM   #221
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I mean, maybe they could sing it for certain circumstances.... First game of the season, do it to honor the country... 9/11 would be a good day to sing it, 4th of July, religious holidays, maybe even for the championship series... But every damn game?

What the hell's the point?

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:27 PM   #222
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Originally Posted by Disco King View Post
Have you not fucking heard of #MeToo?

There's literally an international conversation sparked by women coming out and talking about how they've had to be silent about sexual abuse in the entertainment industry for years because of the consequences they'd face for speaking out. They are doing the exact thing you are claiming that nobody is doing. Do you even pay attention to anything beyond a 15 foot radius of your pissed-damaged Nintendo?
I'm talking about musicians buddy. And the movement is great, but it was really exposed by the work of journalists... And it was LONG overdue... You look at employed actors and musicians and nobody SAID SHIT... The only people who came forward were people not in the industry or people who quit participating long ago.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:29 PM   #223
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I think Seth McFarline made a public joke about Weinstein... There was a few other minor occurrences... But no one of influence put their foot down against it...

Why do you think that is?

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:31 PM   #224
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Sigh. Kendrick Lamar sells out arenas and has (iirc) been nominated for album of the year multiple times.

What metrics are you using

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:32 PM   #225
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Originally Posted by fuzzyroes View Post
It's the time and place. What does kneeling down during the national anthem which is sang to honor the troops in the military have to do with police violence?

I think all that shit is dumb though. I'm with Bill Maher and George Carlin, I wish they'd get rid of all that shit in sports games all together. I don't see the point in it.
Calling attention to ignored problems by co-opting platforms with a large reach is pretty much on page one of the protest handbook. Now you're criticising people for drawing attention to problems by using entertainment as a platform in the very thread where you've spent pages claiming that entertainment isn't political enough anymore.

They kneel during the anthem to draw attention to the fact that the promise of equality in the nation that the anthem represents has not been realized, and pretending is has is disingenuous.

And they specifically kneel because those troops you claim to care about specifically recommend kneeling as a way to show this discontent while still paying respect to them. This is why they kneel instead of sit.

You'll invent another flimsy ad hoc excuse to sidestep all of these clarifications, I know.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:34 PM   #226
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It also isn’t sung to honor troops.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:35 PM   #227
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https://media.makeameme.org/created/...ert-59616d.jpg

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:42 PM   #228
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Originally Posted by Disco King View Post
Calling attention to ignored problems by co-opting platforms with a large reach is pretty much on page one of the protest handbook. Now you're criticising people for drawing attention to problems by using entertainment as a platform in the very thread where you've spent pages claiming that entertainment isn't political enough anymore.

They kneel during the anthem to draw attention to the fact that the promise of equality in the nation that the anthem represents has not been realized, and pretending is has is disingenuous.

And they specifically kneel because those troops you claim to care about specifically recommend kneeling as a way to show this discontent while still paying respect to them. This is why they kneel instead of sit.

You'll invent another flimsy ad hoc excuse to sidestep all of these clarifications, I know.
Hey man, I have nothing against players kneeling for the anthem... I think it's great... But if teams disallow it, that's their call. They are the employers after all.

I also think that the NFL is a family event. A lot of families bring their children and when they go to the game they don't want to have to focus on and explain about mature societal issues to their young ones... So I can sorta understand the "keep politics out of sports angle"... With that said, players speaking out on their own time is a totally different ball of wax, but maybe keep it off of the field.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:44 PM   #229
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Why am I even allowing myself to be Fuzzballed? I should have stopped when Fuzzy thought metaphysics is about New Age ghosts and shit.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:47 PM   #230
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Originally Posted by Eulogy View Post
It also isn’t sung to honor troops.
Sure it is

"The Star-Spangled Banner" was played before games throughout the course of the war, and by the time the war was over, the pregame singing of the national anthem had become cemented as a baseball ritual, after which it spread to other sports."

mentalfloss.com/article/22150/why-do-we-sing-national-anthem-sporting-events

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:56 PM   #231
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Why am I even allowing myself to be Fuzzballed? I should have stopped when Fuzzy thought metaphysics is about New Age ghosts and shit.
I'm on your side with this.

I was talking about artists and performers and you're trying to act as if it's a "GOTCHA" moment by talking about professional athletes..

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 11:01 PM   #232
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Originally Posted by Eulogy View Post
Sigh. Kendrick Lamar sells out arenas and has (iirc) been nominated for album of the year multiple times.

What metrics are you using
Why did you ignore this one

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 11:23 PM   #233
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Why did you ignore this one
Isn't it obvious? Are you sincerely trying to reference the Grammy awards as a measure of cultural relevancy

And yeah, I know he has a devoted fan-base.

I don't know much about his work... What sort of political ideas does he offer? I've heard he talks about police violence and stuff like that... That's very noble, but again, nothing new...

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 11:25 PM   #234
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Fuck i just got dumber, i can feel it

Goddamit fuzz, you’re dangerously close to my ignore list

Used to be an amusement i’d gather from your hapless jackassery, also felt sorry for a fellow drunk

But your throwing in for trump and your fucken blind racism and insensitivity and fucken brain-numbingly infuriatingly disingenuous anti-logical squirming to THATS MY POINT, I MEAN SURE, BUT LETS FACE IT is making me hurt in my brains/heart/butt, it’s too much to absorb with all the horrible everything thats going on every shitty day, can’t take it anymore

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 11:26 PM   #235
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This takes balls... Apparently SNL later cut this from the broadcast... I reckon it was too controversial, that or they wanna stifle his political opinion for some reason.

Dude is definitely putting his ass on the line. Whether you agree with him or not, it certainly takes balls of steel and a lot of courage.


Last edited by fuzzyroes : 10-01-2018 at 11:32 PM.

 
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Old 10-01-2018, 11:30 PM   #236
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Originally Posted by Run To Me View Post
Fuck i just got dumber, i can feel it

Goddamit fuzz, you’re dangerously close to my ignore list

Used to be an amusement i’d gather from your hapless jackassery, also felt sorry for a fellow drunk

But your throwing in for trump and your fucken blind racism and insensitivity and fucken brain-numbingly infuriatingly disingenuous anti-logical squirming to THATS MY POINT, I MEAN SURE, BUT LETS FACE IT is making me hurt in my brains/heart/butt, it’s too much to absorb with all the horrible everything thats going on every shitty day, can’t take it anymore
I'm talking about musicians and artists that are standing up and fighting the system. Yes, I conceded that Kendric Lamar is doing that... I'm not arguing it. I simply haven't been exposed to his music. It's also not even the original point that I was trying to discuss, it was merely one thing that BILLY pointed out that I agree with... Are we wrong? I don't think so, but you guys are welcome to your own opinions.

I know I'm outspoken and passionate about music, but it's all in love. It's okay if things get heated and major disagreements take place, but I don't intend for it to be personal.

 
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Old 10-02-2018, 12:07 AM   #237
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I'm on your side with this.

I was talking about artists and performers and you're trying to act as if it's a "GOTCHA" moment by talking about professional athletes..
It only takes the ability to use the page navigation links to see that the reason the conversation came to professional athletes is that you tried to claim that musicians talking about police violence is not very challenging, as everyone agrees with the sentiment. Recent happenings in the NFL were used as evidence that challenging police brutality isn't an uncontroversial stance in the American political discourse.

This undoes your argument, though you are yet to realize it.

 
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Old 10-02-2018, 12:34 AM   #238
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ok, can we all just not reply to this moron?

it's really easy. take that hard stance he's talking about (with your netphorian balls of steel), rally against his thread, and protest with silence.

 
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Old 10-02-2018, 12:34 AM   #239
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Originally Posted by Disco King View Post
It only takes the ability to use the page navigation links to see that the reason the conversation came to professional athletes is that you tried to claim that musicians talking about police violence is not very challenging, as everyone agrees with the sentiment. Recent happenings in the NFL were used as evidence that challenging police brutality isn't an uncontroversial stance in the American political discourse.

This undoes your argument, though you are yet to realize it.
There's a difference between an adult agreeing with an artists political view and using family friendly events as a platform for tacking these issues.

Here's how my friend put it to me: "Think, I pay over a thousand dollars so me and my 4 year old daughter and 6 year old son can spend some family time and go watch a some ball... Then you have your kids asking 'Daddy, Daddy, why are those players all kneeling for the national anthem?', is it really something you'd wanna have to get into and explain to children so young?". It would be an extremely uncomfortable situation.

So for family friendly events, maybe we should just stick to the athletic competition and leave the politics out of it.

 
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Old 10-02-2018, 12:38 AM   #240
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Anyhow, back to the Billy Corgan discussion... I really didn't want this to become divisive... This thread is for discussing the career impact that Billy's views have had... Not whether we agree or disagree with them.

 
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