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Old 06-05-2016, 05:40 PM   #211
slunken
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your cat was totally showing off.

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 05:44 PM   #212
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she was!

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 05:46 PM   #213
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what makes you so sure? that's not a very scientist thing to say.
it's actually very scientist, isn't it? we have very little scientific theory to think it's even possible. without even a basic framework of maybe how it could work with any physics we have any sort of glimpse at now, the most logical answer is that it is not possible or that if it is possible, we could never do it with something meaningful like an object or a person.

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:09 PM   #214
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netphoria is kind of beautiful in a way

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:12 PM   #215
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what makes you so sure? that's not a very scientist thing to say.
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Originally Posted by reprise85 View Post
it's actually very scientist, isn't it? we have very little scientific theory to think it's even possible. without even a basic framework of maybe how it could work with any physics we have any sort of glimpse at now, the most logical answer is that it is not possible or that if it is possible, we could never do it with something meaningful like an object or a person.
there could be time travel, who the fuck knows although it doesn't seem likely that we'll ever figure it out. I was specifically answering a question about a science fiction novel I have been mentally working on while taking shits though, and time travel does not factor in.

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:12 PM   #216
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except for like the normal way we inch forward through it

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:16 PM   #217
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chronos is a fucking joke.

i think a lot of people mistake god for him.


 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:24 PM   #218
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there could be time travel, who the fuck knows although it doesn't seem likely that we'll ever figure it out. I was specifically answering a question about a science fiction novel I have been mentally working on while taking shits though, and time travel does not factor in.
does something actually exist if it's unknowable and unobservable

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:26 PM   #219
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and don't talk about god, god either doesn't exist or is knowable at some point.

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:31 PM   #220
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does something actually exist if it's unknowable and unobservable
a fair point, but technically we do time travel and are all doing so right now. We even know that matter traveling faster in physical space moves slower through time, so we have some theoretical influence over it already. My understanding is that science cannot yet answer why backwards time travel is not possible, i.e. no one knows why we only experience it in one direction.

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:35 PM   #221
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i'm not a philosopher or a physical scientist but if an emergent property of a universe is time, e.g. it just happens because things are related to each other and not exactly the same thing, i don't know why any explanation is really necessary. the past doesn't exist. we can assume the future exists, but that's just probabilistic. if we somehow travel to the 'future' we're really just changing the speed at which we're traveling, no?

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:36 PM   #222
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edit: nvmd I don't think that even made sense.

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:42 PM   #223
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I basically agree with all that although I'm not sure if you are saying the very concept of time travel doesn't really make sense?

I generally view the universe in very deterministic parameters, so I guess intuitively to me it makes sense that the universe is an unfolding equation. the present could not exist without everything in the past having happened the exact way that it did, and perhaps in a sense those things are happening eternally whether we can perceive them or not

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 08:12 PM   #224
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what do you mean by eternally? like the equation doesn't end but gets transformed into different presentations, like logarithms and exponentials? universes are created and then entropy and more universes and entropy?

i guess the question becomes at what point is what anyone does, or any planet does, or any galaxy does, affect the equation - which by definition it can't, if everything is deterministic? at what point is what I do freely up to me, since it doesn't change the nature of how the universe unfolds? can kim jong whoever not bomb the usa because it would lead to the destruction of earth and that would fuck up the equation? or is earth so unimportant that it's like the 100000000000000000000000000th digit of pi? it seems to me like it would be a very large amount of choice for each individual, if you look at it that way. but that's kinda looking at it backwards where you are look at it from it forward

i kinda went off on a different topic there kinda but... yeah i dont think time travel to the future makes sense to be called time travel, unless you can go back in time it's just 'fast travel'. im probably wrong, where's killtrocity when you need him. or luke de spa

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 08:17 PM   #225
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i have no idea what im talking about. totally liberal arts fart sniffing going on

 
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Old 06-05-2016, 08:39 PM   #226
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i have no idea what im talking about. totally liberal arts fart sniffing going on
Nah I got it

Keep going, I think we're on to something

Just think, if we all work together maybe we could build the 1st time machine. Then, armed with a book of sports facts from the future and fuzzy's Vegas connections, we could make killions and retire happy

Let's do this! Ok, sorry gotta go now time2wipe

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 01:18 AM   #227
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there is no free will. choice is real in that we experience it, but every choice we make is ultimately the outcome of every input you have ever experienced, the same way an apple falling from a tree is the product of an unfolding equation. the entire universe had to happen that exact way for that apple to fall from that tree in that spot at that precise time

we're all just falling apples experiencing some kind of cosmic self-awareness trip

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 01:25 AM   #228
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of course there's no free will as in you have some kind of choice outside of what has been input into you, however i think detailed stuff like what i eat for dinner may be so irrelevantly miniscule to the universe that regardless of what i eat (presuming I don't say, stay in the house instead of go out like nature intended), it doesn't matter to the cosmic equation. so in that way, there may be some soft determinism b/c the details just don't matter that much.

am i explaining myself well? you're not important enough for your every movement to matter to the universe. whether you eat pb & j or grilled cheese is none of the universe's concern, and any difference it makes in 'reality' is within the confidence interval/standard error margin, i.e. it's not statistically significant

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 01:44 AM   #229
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Originally Posted by redbreegull View Post
there is no free will. choice is real in that we experience it, but every choice we make is ultimately the outcome of every input you have ever experienced, the same way an apple falling from a tree is the product of an unfolding equation. the entire universe had to happen that exact way for that apple to fall from that tree in that spot at that precise time

we're all just falling apples experiencing some kind of cosmic self-awareness trip
tbh there's nothing here i hadn't thought of myself before in different ways, but i got a nice 'whoa' moment reading this post.

these days i'm watching the nba playoffs, and watching basketball games really makes me go meta on all that universe stuff. every game is so random, there is such a ridiculous amount of variables that could have gone either way, but went only one, thus changing everything to follow. and it continues to branch out and multiply endlessly and i can't help but think how things would fold out if that tiny little thing would happen slightly differently.

a single simple thing like a game of basketball is like a drop of water running across an infinite ridge of dried up, broken ground, and it only trails a single track. i get mental blackouts thinking about this.

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 01:53 AM   #230
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Originally Posted by reprise85 View Post
of course there's no free will as in you have some kind of choice outside of what has been input into you, however i think detailed stuff like what i eat for dinner may be so irrelevantly miniscule to the universe that regardless of what i eat (presuming I don't say, stay in the house instead of go out like nature intended), it doesn't matter to the cosmic equation. so in that way, there may be some soft determinism b/c the details just don't matter that much.

am i explaining myself well? you're not important enough for your every movement to matter to the universe. whether you eat pb & j or grilled cheese is none of the universe's concern, and any difference it makes in 'reality' is within the confidence interval/standard error margin, i.e. it's not statistically significant
that makes sense and of course we don't really know because these kinds of questions exist in the misty grey beyond where the lines between scientific knowledge and philosophy are unclear, but as far as I know, nothing has ever been observed behaving in a non-deterministic manner above the sub-atomic level. Human judgements on what seems significant or statistically nominal probably do not apply to the cause and effect universe. We are so small already that what you eat for dinner and what you do with your entire life are virtually at the same level on a universal scale. probably nothing happens by accident. every moving particle and wave of light in the history of the universe was determined at First Cause

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 01:54 AM   #231
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LDS also believed in the likelihood of a deterministic universe

jus sayin

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 01:55 AM   #232
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tbh there's nothing here i hadn't thought of myself before in different ways, but i got a nice 'whoa' moment reading this post.

these days i'm watching the nba playoffs, and watching basketball games really makes me go meta on all that universe stuff. every game is so random, there is such a ridiculous amount of variables that could have gone either way, but went only one, thus changing everything to follow. and it continues to branch out and multiply endlessly and i can't help but think how things would fold out if that tiny little thing would happen slightly differently.

a single simple thing like a game of basketball is like a drop of water running across an infinite ridge of dried up, broken ground, and it only trails a single track. i get mental blackouts thinking about this.
i mean it's interesting and everything but since none of it actually matters since it's all over when u die, i feel like the existential trip of obsessing over the complexity of life and the infinite paths that every decision you make stops from happening, or if your life would have played out differently if you had done this and not that (big and small things), it's best to just focus on your life and what actually does exist, because what you have is probabalistically extremely rare

what i mean by that is, the fact that the cells in your brain and body have come to exist and that you are thinking thoughts was almost impossible. like. it's basically impossible. yet here you are. and you want to waste it, by thinking about how you almost weren't, or won't be soon, or why it matters or why it doesnt is just, really, time wasted.

it's important because in order to live a thoughtful life you need to have these thoughts. and they will recur throughout your lifetime. that's a good thing. but i think we need not dwell on them longer than it takes to learn whatever lesson we need from it at this particular time, because seriously your life just started and it's almost over and you will never experience it again and this 70 year period out of the infinite that have existed and will exist is your only chance to do anything, so go fucking do it you idiot

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 01:59 AM   #233
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Old 06-06-2016, 02:01 AM   #234
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it's important because in order to live a thoughtful life you need to have these thoughts. and they will recur throughout your lifetime. that's a good thing. but i think we need not dwell on them longer than it takes to learn whatever lesson we need from it at this particular time, because seriously your life just started and it's almost over and you will never experience it again and this 70 year period out of the infinite that have existed and will exist is your only chance to do anything, so go fucking do it you idiot
mean lady


 
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Old 06-06-2016, 02:02 AM   #235
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that makes sense and of course we don't really know because these kinds of questions exist in the misty grey beyond where the lines between scientific knowledge and philosophy are unclear, but as far as I know, nothing has ever been observed behaving in a non-deterministic manner above the sub-atomic level. Human judgements on what seems significant or statistically nominal probably do not apply to the cause and effect universe. We are so small already that what you eat for dinner and what you do with your entire life are virtually at the same level on a universal scale. probably nothing happens by accident. every moving particle and wave of light in the history of the universe was determined at First Cause
i agree they all move at the same level on a universal scale. absolutely, we are that insignificant. what i'm saying is why would the universal equation even need to take into account these things in its original First Cause, if they are so meaningless. if the equation just needs to equal 1, .99999999999999999999 repeating = 1 so it is not necessary for 1 to equal 1, for 1 to equal 1. what i'm saying is that the universe does not need to be strictly deterministic, for it to be for all practice purposes, strictly deterministic.

this doesn't prove that you have any freedom in your mind or choice but i think theoretically, it doesn't prove that you don't. .9999.... = 1. they are the same, but not, but yeah they're the same.

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 02:04 AM   #236
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mean lady

i mean life is meaningless also and what you do means less than shit i'm just saying that's the other way to look at it at least you are experiencing, the alternative was to never experience. which is really the same thing but right at this moment, it's not. but really it is. but not right now. AGAINST ALL ODDS. and i mean, literally all the odds.

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 02:07 AM   #237
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i mean it's interesting and everything but since none of it actually matters since it's all over when u die, i feel like the existential trip of obsessing over the complexity of life and the infinite paths that every decision you make stops from happening, or if your life would have played out differently if you had done this and not that (big and small things), it's best to just focus on your life and what actually does exist, because what you have is probabalistically extremely rare
technically anything existing after crossing so many junctures and ending up at a particular place is very rare - thus rendering any possible outcome rare and unrare at the same time, because if no two outcomes are alike that concept is irrelevant.

btw i didn't mean what i said in a discouraging way - i just marvel at that thought. i feel breathless by it. it doesn't necessarily make me feel negatively or positively, just astounded by the sheer unbelievable complexity of it.

while thinking about the vastness of the universe can make many people feel hopeless or oppressed by insignificance, i feel very liberated by it. whenever shit gets me down i try to remember that we are much, much less than a single grain of sand on an infinite beach, and that i take myself waaaay to seriously to be brought down by that stuff and not enjoy what i can. well i try to anyway.

honestly can't tell if any of this comes off as profound or absolute new age stoner bullshit. gonna hit submit before i change my mind

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 02:08 AM   #238
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i respect these people but the older i get the more i feel like their philosophical awareness is just as stupid as anything else. so we're the universe experiencing itself. cool? that's the answer? let's kill ourselves immediately.

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 02:11 AM   #239
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yeah rep we basically typed out the same thing at the same time

but in different ways

BAM
universe

 
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Old 06-06-2016, 02:12 AM   #240
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technically anything existing after crossing so many junctures and ending up at a particular place is very rare - thus rendering any possible outcome rare and unrare at the same time, because if no two outcomes are alike that concept is irrelevant.

btw i didn't mean what i said in a discouraging way - i just marvel at that thought. i feel breathless by it. it doesn't necessarily make me feel negatively or positively, just astounded by the sheer unbelievable complexity of it.

while thinking about the vastness of the universe can make many people feel hopeless or oppressed by insignificance, i feel very liberated by it. whenever shit gets me down i try to remember that we are much, much less than a single grain of sand on an infinite beach, and that i take myself waaaay to seriously to be brought down by that stuff and not enjoy what i can. well i try to anyway.

honestly can't tell if any of this comes off as profound or absolute new age stoner bullshit. gonna hit submit before i change my mind
I feel similarly most of the time, really. I am glad that my life is so insignificant that I can't really screw it up. If that makes sense? But instead of seeing myself as less than a grain of sand I see myself as a light so small that no one can see that it's on or when it goes out.

This might reflect my intimacy issues lol

 
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