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Old 11-13-2018, 04:30 PM   #1111
Mals Marola
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I feel like initially it was very quickly painted as "Pumpkins album to avoid" or something and kept that reputation even through the late 00s, when I had friends who were Pumpkins fans but never even heard the album because they "heard it sucked," and these were people who gave Zeitgeist a chance

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:42 PM   #1112
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That was a SERIOUS question...

My question. Only show I've ever slept overnight in line for tickets to.

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:49 PM   #1113
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you got some gnarly prepositions going on at the end of that there sentence

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 06:03 PM   #1114
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Thanks, your input has been invaluable.

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 06:40 PM   #1115
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Your welcome.

Btw are you in anyway shape or form related to Tolpeyburd?

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 07:51 PM   #1116
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Your welcome.
Pro tip. Best not to play Grammar Police then immediately fuck up "you're."

Oh, and I was here when Topleyburd was just a twinkle in Pakula's eye.

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 07:58 PM   #1117
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Pro tip. Best not to play Grammar Police then immediately fuck up "you're."

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:00 PM   #1118
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i live for this shit

this is what keeps me going

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:04 PM   #1119
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Originally Posted by tweedyburd View Post
Oh, and I was here when Topleyburd was just a twinkle in Pakula's eye.
Doubt it!

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:17 PM   #1120
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Originally Posted by RenewRevive View Post
Has Billy ever given a definitive version of why he thinks Machina was a relative flop?

I mean "the fans didn't get it" and "vastly disappointed" are descriptions of fan reaction.

Yeah Virgin wouldn't back it as a double album but surely his choice of song selection and the production / mixing were the biggest impediments? That's down to Billy and to a lesser extent Flood. They had well over 30 songs that were fully formed, so it's curious why many of the 15 that made the final cut were deemed superior to those that ended up on MII. Also, the decision to slather the album in - what exactly I'm not sure but it's there and is detrimental.

With better song selection and choices in the studio surely Machina would have done at least as well as Adore?
The production of Machina 1 is great, unique and has aged brilliantly.
The tracklist was poor.

The production of MII was... scrappy and unfinished.
But it had better material.

Clean up MII and re-sequence both albums and there's a commercially viable 1-disc in there. We're getting a 39 track sequence....

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:22 PM   #1121
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I’ve always found the production of M1 to be muddy. I hope he’s remixing it from the ground up.

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:38 PM   #1122
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He's been using so much compression in the past decade, TBH I don't think he's in a place that would result in superior mixes.

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:02 PM   #1123
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i love the way Machina I sounds, tbh. The remix side of things i'm anticipating is almost entirely on Machina II

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:02 PM   #1124
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but i mean, even then, stuff like Cash Car Star & Innosense sounds about as good as I could ever expect it to. Getting a "pure transfer" for the first time will be cool tho

 
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Old 11-13-2018, 10:29 PM   #1125
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Originally Posted by Mals Marola View Post
i love the way Machina I sounds, tbh. The remix side of things i'm anticipating is almost entirely on Machina II
Yeah, I love the way M1 sounds. M2 is what needs the remix.

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 08:26 AM   #1126
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Originally Posted by houseofglass11 View Post
I’ve always found the production of M1 to be muddy. I hope he’s remixing it from the ground up.
It only sounds muddy on cheap audio. Get a real HiFi...


The M II has at least nice unfiltered low frequencies to disturb the neighbours.

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 08:35 AM   #1127
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It only sounds muddy on cheap audio. Get a real HiFi...
You can't make music that's only for hi-fi nerds, audiophiles and people who can afford good systems, that's ridiculous.

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 08:47 AM   #1128
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Originally Posted by FoolofaTook View Post
you got some gnarly prepositions going on at the end of that there sentence

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 09:29 AM   #1129
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aw look at that pussycat. i just want to grab it and give it a stirring shake.

i need a cat so bad.

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 09:30 AM   #1130
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next to where i live there is a parking lot by a bank. i swear sometmes up to a dozen or more kitties congregate. it's strange: they are the sleekest, plumpest, self-complacantest feral cats conceivable.

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 12:01 PM   #1131
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Cash Car Star felt like the beginning of the end for Billy being able to write a great rock song.

Man he pushed the hell out of that song and I can't stand it.

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 12:02 PM   #1132
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Lyrically CCS was pretty hamfisted. Dross was killer though. Hard to believe that song didn’t make it on Machina I, would’ve been a good single.

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 12:06 PM   #1133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mals Marola View Post
I feel like initially it was very quickly painted as "Pumpkins album to avoid" or something and kept that reputation even through the late 00s, when I had friends who were Pumpkins fans but never even heard the album because they "heard it sucked," and these were people who gave Zeitgeist a chance
I probably phrased my post poorly. There's any number of reasons why it failed commercially, even the bad reviews are just subjective. What I meant is has Billy ever stated what it is about the album - sound, song choices, production etc - that they got wrong?

 
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Old 11-14-2018, 12:15 PM   #1134
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Originally Posted by Woody View Post
The production of Machina 1 is great, unique and has aged brilliantly.
The tracklist was poor.

The production of MII was... scrappy and unfinished.
But it had better material.

Clean up MII and re-sequence both albums and there's a commercially viable 1-disc in there. We're getting a 39 track sequence....
I agree with you in that I prefer MII songs. Don't you find Machina too compressed though? It's the only original SP album that gives me ear fatigue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mals Marola View Post
but i mean, even then, stuff like Cash Car Star & Innosense sounds about as good as I could ever expect it to. Getting a "pure transfer" for the first time will be cool tho
Yeah, some sound better than others. Billy has suggested a unified sound for the sequence, hoping this will mean a toning down of Machina and more a middle-point between the two, personally. I don't want the songs neutered like Speed Kills.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dustrocck View Post
Cash Car Star felt like the beginning of the end for Billy being able to write a great rock song.

Man he pushed the hell out of that song and I can't stand it.
The lyrics aren't great but the riffs and especially the drums are fantastic.

 
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Old 11-20-2018, 03:14 AM   #1135
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Old 11-20-2018, 12:44 PM   #1136
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love the irony of that being the one post where his bottom-line word isn't comically oversized

 
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Old 11-20-2018, 01:05 PM   #1137
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Here you go


 
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Old 11-20-2018, 03:18 PM   #1138
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Originally Posted by FoolofaTook View Post
aw look at that pussycat. i just want to grab it and give it a stirring shake.

i need a cat so bad.
TOOK IS A PUSSYGRABBER

 
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Old 11-20-2018, 03:20 PM   #1139
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Originally Posted by houseofglass11 View Post
Lyrically CCS was pretty hamfisted. Dross was killer though. Hard to believe that song didn’t make it on Machina I, would’ve been a good single.
Yeah, Dross was awesome. Love that one.

 
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Old 11-20-2018, 03:26 PM   #1140
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Originally Posted by Zer0 Hour View Post
TOOK IS A PUSSYGRABBER
no that's just the urge that wells up in me when confronted by a wide, furry bottom.

in reality i am very respectful of grimalkins and approach slowly so as not to scare them with my towering figure. then i speak in a special voice, usually some sort of british accent/growly voice thing, and squat to offer my hands to them for sniffing.

if you try to grab a cat they will run and not be very pleased with you. you also might get scratched.

 
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