Machina reissue a go

[Ram27]

agree, the 'metal' bits only click for me sometimes. the pretty stuff [try, this time, wound, home, real love] is great

[Joey Goldberg]

hey Ram
had you made a cover image for the JC Rocks Adore compilation? i have it on my comp & was gonna transfer to phone in a minute, just wanted to make sure I had the complete package

[smashingjj]

Originally Posted by LaBelle

most of the heavy songs from the machina era seem a bit forced to me. They're fine for what they are, but the best songs are the relatively mellow ones for sure.

I can imagine Billy being very much still in the Adore mindset songwriting wise and feeling he had to bring the rawk to be critically acclaimed again.

also, this.

[trev]

agree about the forced metal bits that don't really click.

but one of the reasons i like machina more than adore is largely because of the presence of some good heavier bits.

adore does the mellower stuff much better though.

[Ram27]

Originally Posted by Joey Goldberg

hey Ram
had you made a cover image for the JC Rocks Adore compilation? i have it on my comp & was gonna transfer to phone in a minute, just wanted to make sure I had the complete package

I didn't, but a lovely boarder whose name I forget did in that thread -->

[eviltimeban]

SIYL is a mix of the Adore style and the rawk style; it's the one perfect song on Machina.

[enthusaroo]

Originally Posted by eviltimeban

SIYL is a mix of the Adore style and the rawk style; it's the one perfect song on Machina.

it's kind of a gay song though

edit: like fuzzyroe's Dad

[slunken]

Originally Posted by Forgotten Child

No he didn't

no but for real he did

edit: and it's actually way better than anything us morons ever puzzled together

[smashingjj]

does it turn shit songs into good songs?

[run2pee]

Originally Posted by Ram27

I didn't, but a lovely boarder whose name I forget did in that thread -->

Omfg missed this the 1st time around, what utter gold

[slunken]

LEAKED

Look at everything between "La Deux Machina" and "La Deux Machina"

WHY would you not list all alt versions in a row behid the same song?

WHY would you start the list with a garbage instrumental and later list it again?

WHY do they appear in different places if you were just simply compiling a list?

WHY do all of the unknown demos appear after the second "La Deux Machina"?

I've listened to the playlist from LDM to LDM a handful of times, and it works (it works really well). Especially some of the specific song placements. Stand into Wound? That's obvious on any self-respecting playlist enthusiasts list.

The problem with a logical playlist is the you have all the love songs on the front end, then all the weird songs, then all the mean songs, then all the nice songs. This version gives a balance, the way it was intended.

First of all, yes shut up there are 2 version of LDM. This doesn't matter.

There is no way in hell this list was just a random list of songs. Is it finite? Probably not. But it's the first clue since and the closest we've gotten since 2000 toward a real list.

Who cares? Give it a shot. I liked it.

[Forgotten Child]

Originally Posted by slunken

LEAKED

Look at everything between "La Deux Machina" and "La Deux Machina"

WHY would you not list all alt versions in a row behid the same song?

WHY would you start the list with a garbage instrumental and later list it again?

WHY do they appear in different places if you were just simply compiling a list?

WHY do all of the unknown demos appear after the second "La Deux Machina"?

I've listened to the playlist from LDM to LDM a handful of times, and it works (it works really well). Especially some of the specific song placements. Stand into Wound? That's obvious on any self-respecting playlist enthusiasts list.

The problem with a logical playlist is the you have all the love songs on the front end, then all the weird songs, then all the mean songs, then all the nice songs. This version gives a balance, the way it was intended.

First of all, yes shut up there are 2 version of LDM. This doesn't matter.

There is no way in hell this list was just a random list of songs. Is it finite? Probably not. But it's the first clue since and the closest we've gotten since 2000 toward a real list.

Who cares? Give it a shot. I liked it.

Not the tracklist tho. He was digging the archives and asked people about machina era songs he forgot to add to the list. That's why he added the comment "revised list".

I remember asking him about Strength in Numbers (one of those stolen/leaked songs that happened what 2 years ago?), He said it's actually a Zeitgeist era song.

[Joey Goldberg]

anybody got a copy of Siamese Byrne I could borrow for the weekend?

[trev]

[Shadaloo]

At one point he showed a quick peek of some excel sheets that had some alternate versions.

Info culled from his Q&As was:

-The name of the album is apparently just going to be "Machina", no subtitles.
-Extras won't be included on streaming services, just the re-sequenced album
-Saturnine is not part of the re-sequenced album
-There is only one version each of Lucky 13, Slow Dawn and This Time. This Time's drum track was apparently recorded off Jimmy's first take.
-About 7 versions of Glass And The Ghost Children exist
-About 8 of Blue Skies Bring Tears
-"Tons" of alternate versions of Wound
-There are alt versions of White Spyder
-Sacred + Profane was written and recorded very quickly, no real alt versions except scratch lyrics
-Found a bunch of Arising rehearsals, and an acoustic Age Of Innocence
-Found a studio acoustic version of The Imploding Voice recorded on the same day as Untitled
-Found two Acoustic versions of Vanity
-Found a home piano version of I of The Mourning with vocals, and piano versions of "a host of songs"
-Found some studio takes of Pale Scales
-There's an alternate band version of In My Body
-Brought up a few previously unknown songs called Jester's Dance and Aldo Novocaine
-Raindrops + Sunshowers was much more straightforward and went through a bunch of changes before becoming the album version

[Shadaloo]

Also my go-to order is still:

Disc 1:

01. Glass' Theme
02. The Imploding Voice
03. Cash Car Star
04. Stand Inside Your Love
05. The Sacred And Profane
06. Real Love
07. Glass + The Ghost Children
08. Innosence
09. Raindrops + Sunshowers
10. Let Me Give The World To You
11. Vanity

Disc 2:

01. White Spyder
02. Lucky 13
03. Dross
04. Go
05. Speed Kills
06. Blue Skies Bring Tears
07. Heavy Metal Machine
08. The Crying Tree Of Mercury
09. Wound
10. Try, Try, Try
11. This Time

Disc 3:

01. The Everlasting Gaze
02. Saturnine
03. In My Body
04. I Of The Mourning
06. Slow Dawn
07. Home
08. Here's To The Atom Bomb
09. With Every Light
10. Age Of Innocence

[VoxUpDoc]

Originally Posted by Shadaloo

Also my go-to order is still:

Disc 1:

01. Glass' Theme
02. The Imploding Voice
03. Cash Car Star
04. Stand Inside Your Love
05. The Sacred And Profane
06. Real Love
07. Glass + The Ghost Children
08. Innosence
09. Raindrops + Sunshowers
10. Let Me Give The World To You
11. Vanity

Disc 2:

01. White Spyder
02. Lucky 13
03. Dross
04. Go
05. Speed Kills
06. Blue Skies Bring Tears
07. Heavy Metal Machine
08. The Crying Tree Of Mercury
09. Wound
10. Try, Try, Try
11. This Time

Disc 3:

01. The Everlasting Gaze
02. Saturnine
03. In My Body
04. I Of The Mourning
06. Slow Dawn
07. Home
08. Here's To The Atom Bomb
09. With Every Light
10. Age Of Innocence

Major infractions here.

NUMBER 1: 3 discs? This is brazen disregard for the rules of Machina.
2 discs or bust, Peter fucking Jackson.

NUMBER 2: Vanity is a transitional track, you cannot end a sequence on Vanity.

Other than that, good job.

[Shadaloo]

I suppose if I had to split my disc 2 halfway it'd be between Speed Kills and BSBT. That way you've got two discs at an hour and 5 or 7-odd minutes each, which I suppose while acceptable is pushing things a wee bit past MCIS disc length, a smidge long but should still fit on a CD (if that even matters anymore). I think it works best broken up into three 40-45 minute chunks.

As to Vanity, I always read it as showing of the end of the relationship, a parting on really bad terms, the kind of thing you end an act with because someone's just been evicted out of a house and is off to live on the streets and spiral down into bad drug use.

[FoolofaTook]

Originally Posted by Shadaloo

-About 7 versions of Glass And The Ghost Children exist
-About 8 of Blue Skies Bring Tears

[VoxUpDoc]

Originally Posted by FoolofaTook

True.

[Joey Goldberg]

i dunno, one of those BSBT versions completely changed my view of the song, pretty curious to see what the other alts have in store

& i always liked R+S but that early version was pretty hot, too

[Joey Goldberg]

dunno why anyone still on this board would do anything other than salivate at the promise of previously unreleased classic lineup stuff by this point tho, really

or are y'all too anxious for Shiny Lite Brites Vol 2 to fit in the extra anticipation?

[FoolofaTook]

8 "versions" of bsbt:

arising (the good one)
bloated mi
electrique mii (i.e., everyone took meth)
and 5 acoustic demos with b0llzebub screeching about sailors and their luvahs.

[VoxUpDoc]

Originally Posted by Joey Goldberg

dunno why anyone still on this board would do anything other than salivate at the promise of previously unreleased classic lineup stuff by this point tho, really

or are y'all too anxious for Shiny Lite Brites Vol 2 to fit in the extra anticipation?

G&TGC and BSBT will never be A tier SP tracks. No matter how Billy noodles ‘em.

Then some of the best material is just one take only.

The big draw will be the unreleased songs, remastered/mixed M2 stuff, and a few golden nuggs we can’t predict yet.

[VoxUpDoc]

So let's anal-yze Bill's "official" Machina tracklisting.

Disc 1:

1. Le Deux Machina - Start by losing 90% of the audience.
2. I Of The Mourning - There go the other 10%.
3. SIYL
4. Wound
=== Concert within an album bullshit
5.Glass' Theme
6. TEG
7. Dross
8. Cash Car Star
9. Heavy Metal Machine
10. Blue Skies (Heavy)
===
11. Speed Kills - this is either part of the "rock concert" or the b-side version
12. Crying Tree
13. G & TGC
14. Whyte Spider
15. Raindrops & Sunshowers
16. Here's to the Atom Bomb (V2) - IS THIS THE SHIT ONE?

Disc 2:

1. This Time
2. Sacred & Profane
3. Try, Try, Try
4. Age Of Innocence
5. With Every Light
6. Blue Skies Bring Tears UGH
7. If There Is A God (Piano)
8. Real Love
9. LMGTWTY
10. Innosense
11. The Imploding Voice
12. Home
13. In My Body
14. Le Deux Machina

Hmmm. So relegating Go from the album to b-side. Promoting Le Deux Machina to a bookend. Yikes.
Plus no Slow Dawn... Lucky 13... Vanity... Saturnine.
Disc 1 is long and everything after Speed Kills is kinda bad unless he's going to use alt versions.
Disc 2 is the better of the two, but I hate BSBT, so having it feature on the album twice instead of something better is a MISS. Ending on In My Body and Le Deux Machina (looping into Disc 1 presumably) is WEAK SAUCE.

I think this is believable and I don't like it much, but then I always hated many of the key tracks from M1.
I also don't think this tracklisting will change anyone's mind about this album as it pushes the M1 tracks front and center.

[wHATcOLOR]

wait, people don't hate Glass' Theme and Cash Car Star? these are very stupid songs, yes? like, objectively stupid.

"oh but the drums on ca.." yeah whatever dude. doesn't make it a good song

but "shattering fast im glass i'm gl.." shut UP!!

[wHATcOLOR]

here's my machina:

try, try, try (alt)
stand inside your love
speed kills (the one from MII)
real love
vanity
wound
sacred and profane
age of innocence
this time
home

that's it.

also let's be honest: the "machina mystery" was never more than half baked, and likely less than that. bill never had a cohesive, compelling concept beyond "oh the band is ending and i feel like i've been playing a character" - and that's totally, 100% fine. trying to make it into something grander than that is not necessary and kind of sad

the end. thank you for coming to my ted talk

[FoolofaTook]

You are a beautiful man, Big J. Good call on Sacred and Profane.

[wHATcOLOR]

[MyKeyZ]

Machina Ø: The Insane Nit Pickings And Ramblings Of An Obsessive Fanbase

01 Cash Car Star
02 Blue Skies Bring Tears (Heavy)
03 Dross
04 Wound
05 The Everlasting Gaze
06 The Sacred And Profane
07 The Imploding Voice
08 Home
09 Stand Inside Your Love
10 Slow Dawn
11 Lucky 13
12 Age Of Innocence
13 Let Me Give The World To You
14 With Every Light