I got a USB external hdd

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 06:59 AM

I want to use it to back up my computer to (which I've already tested out and it worked quite well) but also to store music recording files and work off them from the external drive

was it a mistake to buy USB and should I swap it for a Firewire or will I not notice a difference

the guy in the shop was one of those lameass know-it-all nerd types who refused to be helpful

ChristHimself! · 10-28-2006, 07:02 AM

just be fucking careful with where you put it, you don't want to knock it off your computer desk when it's on and end up losing years worth of shit like a muppet

Ever · 10-28-2006, 07:07 AM

The safest way to store stuff is on tape. However I'm not sure what advantages firewire over USB, but I myself have been using a USB (2) external hard drive for a while and it's been fine. I store my mp3 and video games (mainly ISOs) on it.

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 07:08 AM

k guys thanks but that's not what im asking COME ON

Ever · 10-28-2006, 07:16 AM

Well I'll put it this way, unless you're working with individual large files such as with video editting or something you won't notice a difference. Or if you're constantly moving large files to and fro the hard drive. But in my experience a USB 2 external disk runs at a speed where I can't tell the difference between it and my internal HDD.

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 07:27 AM

what if I'm running a file that's about 1.5 GB in size of the external HDD

will I notice a change in performance if it's Firewire

Ever · 10-28-2006, 07:31 AM

Yeah you will if it's that big. Is it a video? Cause if it is it's kinda like this: You can watch it at full speed with no skips and stuff but if you search through it all the time then it will lag and be slow and there's definently a difference as opposed to running it off your internal HDD. Especially if you're doing somehting like video editting. But if you're just watching a video or mounting a dvd image it's fine.

barden · 10-28-2006, 07:33 AM

Geeks.

Ever · 10-28-2006, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barden

Geeks.

Unintentionally in my case. I'm taking an accelerated course (two years ahead) in information process technology in high school and as part of our work on mulitmedia we had to edit video footage and make a promotional dvd for our school. Now to get the footage from one place to the other i.e school to home I needed an external HDD.

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ever

Yeah you will if it's that big. Is it a video? Cause if it is it's kinda like this: You can watch it at full speed with no skips and stuff but if you search through it all the time then it will lag and be slow and there's definently a difference as opposed to running it off your internal HDD. Especially if you're doing somehting like video editting. But if you're just watching a video or mounting a dvd image it's fine.

it's music recording

and there are like 15 tracks running at once in this particular file

I'm getting this thing where it will stop after like a minute and say 'there are too many tracks playing at once' and I'm wondering if that will also happen with Firewire

Ever · 10-28-2006, 07:48 AM

I'm really not sure, try running it all form your internal HDD if at all possible and if it works on that then it might be a speed issue but as it stands there's a possiblity that it's somehting completely unrelated. I'm no expert or anything, I'm just trying to help.

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 07:52 AM

yeah I should've mentioned that I get that issue on the internal HDD as well. It's a laptop [hard drive], I've heard they're not so fast

I'll wait for one of those dudes with the technical know-how to show up

ChristHimself! · 10-28-2006, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celluloid_love

I'm getting this thing where it will stop after like a minute and say 'there are too many tracks playing at once'

I would expect that's got more to do with processing power/ram than it does to do with your hd.

I would always record music locally anyway just to reduce any possibility of lag in the recording, and then move it onto the external hd when you're done.

ChristHimself! · 10-28-2006, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celluloid_love

yeah I should've mentioned that I get that issue on the internal HDD as well.

Yeah, that'll be down to processing power and ram, I'm pretty certain. I would never have that many tracks running at once on a laptop, especially if I was trying to record simultaneously.

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 07:55 AM

I was hoping with this hard drive that I could get better performance DURING recording by running the files off the hard drive

if the hard drive isn't really an element in this case then don't worry

thanks

ChristHimself! · 10-28-2006, 07:57 AM

im assuming you're running a bunch of tracks and recording extra ones on top

you could always bounce all those tracks down to one, and just export it and listen to that when you record

that way it's not as much strain on your computer, and then you can record your extra track and add it in to the original

ChristHimself! · 10-28-2006, 07:59 AM

and if you want to go really ghetto (well, not exactly ghetto) you could export it as an mp3 and listen to it on an mp3 player just to help you keep time while you record your next part, so that the pc is only having to focus on recording.

Obviously the more tracks you add to the original, the longer it's going to take to export the final version, but it is a workaround.

brendo_91 · 10-28-2006, 08:44 AM

is this protools and are you running an mbox.

also if its mbox, which port is the mbox plugged into and which is the hd plugged into.

mbox needs to be in the left of the macbook pro i.e. the power side.

try messing with the hardware setup options in tools.

also i hope you're running 7.1.1 on 10.4.7...

also, what external hdd is this? you need one with the oxford chipset for protools becuase most easily found one, the prolific chipset, cant handle the throughput, and you could possibly lose everything thats on the drive. took me a while to work that one out. too late to save my music collection unfortunately. that was a year ago and i'm STILL ripping cd's.

ChristHimself - i have the same computer but I think one model lower - I think c_l's is the 2.0 while mine's the 1.83 lapcook pro. It's certainly not a performance issue.

as far as firewire vs usb... firewire has a higher average ransfer rate (400) while usb has a higher peak transfer rate (480)... in practice i've been able to record 8 tracks simultaneously from USB, haven't tried any more than that, and I don't think I've tried playing back more than that either from USB, I mostly use firewire with my drive (a Lacie D2).

brendo_91 · 10-28-2006, 08:48 AM

the fact that it's happening with or without external disk makes me think it's a usb bandwidth issue between computer and mbox. using the left usb port will help but the mbox is shitful, it's a fucking joke. mbox2 pro would solve this problem i think- at around $1000.

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 09:46 AM

I'm not using PT brendo

hahahaha

sorry

Effloresce · 10-28-2006, 11:55 AM

If it's just for music and videos, USB is fine. If you're doing editing and stuff on it, you might want FireWire.

Also, the next time you need an external drive, do this. Buy an internal OEM drive from a site like newegg for really cheap (you can get a 320GB drive for under $150 usually). Then, buy an external enclosure like the Vantec NexStar which is about $30. A few bucks more if you want FireWire. You save yourself a lot of money that way.

Skradgee · 10-28-2006, 12:11 PM

I've got a 750GB external drive, so HA!!

My 2 cents...either way using USB 2.0 or Firewire you should be fine, but like CH said record to an internal drive if you can and then move it to the external drive after, but the 'too many tracks playing at once' message likely has nothing to do with the drive you're using.

brendo_91 · 10-28-2006, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effloresce

Then, buy an external enclosure like the Vantec NexStar which is about $30 and absolutely shitful for recording onto, due to it being a Prolific chipset drive.

Most of what I said still applies even if you're using Logic.

Also, I will point out my LaCie is actually FASTER than my internal disk...

Anyway, if this is Logic? Head into preferences, audio, drivers... set the buffer size higher, and tick "larger disk buffer". process buffer range Large. I also wonder if on the general tab of the audio section, if you unticked "audio engine overload message" it might stop dying in the arse as soon as it starts to struggle.

celluloid_love · 10-28-2006, 01:22 PM

Okay, thanks people. I figure I might as well stick with the USB.

it's really not making that big a difference to ME either way, I was kind of just curious how big the difference was in practical terms

Quiet CD · 10-28-2006, 01:36 PM

Firewire has higher sustained read/write rates (especially for small files)... USB has a higher burst rate, but that never proves to be accurate.

Esotarious · 10-28-2006, 08:18 PM

Yeah for doing any kind of audio editing I always tell my clients to go Firewire. The whole architecture is different. USB shares bandwidth amongst the other devices where as Firewire has a road all to itself. (A faster road at that). You could probably get away with using USB 2.0, but firewire drives really aren't that much more expensive these days.

Glyph makes the best Audio/Video drives with the best warranty.

10-28-2006, 06:59 AM	#1
celluloid_love Minion of Satan Location: creepyu Posts: 7,225	I got a USB external hdd I want to use it to back up my computer to (which I've already tested out and it worked quite well) but also to store music recording files and work off them from the external drive was it a mistake to buy USB and should I swap it for a Firewire or will I not notice a difference the guy in the shop was one of those lameass know-it-all nerd types who refused to be helpful

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10-28-2006, 07:02 AM	#2
ChristHimself! mental problems angel Location: i want u 2 caress me like a tropical priest Posts: 20,594	just be fucking careful with where you put it, you don't want to knock it off your computer desk when it's on and end up losing years worth of shit like a muppet

10-28-2006, 07:07 AM	#3
Ever Minion of Satan Location: ☆.。.:*・゜`★ Posts: 8,203	The safest way to store stuff is on tape. However I'm not sure what advantages firewire over USB, but I myself have been using a USB (2) external hard drive for a while and it's been fine. I store my mp3 and video games (mainly ISOs) on it.

10-28-2006, 07:08 AM	#4
celluloid_love Minion of Satan Location: creepyu Posts: 7,225	k guys thanks but that's not what im asking COME ON

10-28-2006, 07:16 AM	#5
Ever Minion of Satan Location: ☆.。.:*・゜`★ Posts: 8,203	Well I'll put it this way, unless you're working with individual large files such as with video editting or something you won't notice a difference. Or if you're constantly moving large files to and fro the hard drive. But in my experience a USB 2 external disk runs at a speed where I can't tell the difference between it and my internal HDD.

10-28-2006, 07:27 AM	#6
celluloid_love Minion of Satan Location: creepyu Posts: 7,225	what if I'm running a file that's about 1.5 GB in size of the external HDD will I notice a change in performance if it's Firewire

10-28-2006, 07:31 AM	#7
Ever Minion of Satan Location: ☆.。.:*・゜`★ Posts: 8,203	Yeah you will if it's that big. Is it a video? Cause if it is it's kinda like this: You can watch it at full speed with no skips and stuff but if you search through it all the time then it will lag and be slow and there's definently a difference as opposed to running it off your internal HDD. Especially if you're doing somehting like video editting. But if you're just watching a video or mounting a dvd image it's fine.

10-28-2006, 07:33 AM	#8
barden Braindead Location: The Ghetto Posts: 19,611	Geeks.

10-28-2006, 07:48 AM	#11
Ever Minion of Satan Location: ☆.。.:*・゜`★ Posts: 8,203	I'm really not sure, try running it all form your internal HDD if at all possible and if it works on that then it might be a speed issue but as it stands there's a possiblity that it's somehting completely unrelated. I'm no expert or anything, I'm just trying to help.

10-28-2006, 07:52 AM	#12
celluloid_love Minion of Satan Location: creepyu Posts: 7,225	yeah I should've mentioned that I get that issue on the internal HDD as well. It's a laptop [hard drive], I've heard they're not so fast I'll wait for one of those dudes with the technical know-how to show up

10-28-2006, 07:55 AM	#15
celluloid_love Minion of Satan Location: creepyu Posts: 7,225	I was hoping with this hard drive that I could get better performance DURING recording by running the files off the hard drive if the hard drive isn't really an element in this case then don't worry thanks

10-28-2006, 07:57 AM	#16
ChristHimself! mental problems angel Location: i want u 2 caress me like a tropical priest Posts: 20,594	im assuming you're running a bunch of tracks and recording extra ones on top you could always bounce all those tracks down to one, and just export it and listen to that when you record that way it's not as much strain on your computer, and then you can record your extra track and add it in to the original

10-28-2006, 07:59 AM	#17
ChristHimself! mental problems angel Location: i want u 2 caress me like a tropical priest Posts: 20,594	and if you want to go really ghetto (well, not exactly ghetto) you could export it as an mp3 and listen to it on an mp3 player just to help you keep time while you record your next part, so that the pc is only having to focus on recording. Obviously the more tracks you add to the original, the longer it's going to take to export the final version, but it is a workaround.

10-28-2006, 08:44 AM	#18
brendo_91 Minion of Satan Location: ██████████ Posts: 6,479	is this protools and are you running an mbox. also if its mbox, which port is the mbox plugged into and which is the hd plugged into. mbox needs to be in the left of the macbook pro i.e. the power side. try messing with the hardware setup options in tools. also i hope you're running 7.1.1 on 10.4.7... also, what external hdd is this? you need one with the oxford chipset for protools becuase most easily found one, the prolific chipset, cant handle the throughput, and you could possibly lose everything thats on the drive. took me a while to work that one out. too late to save my music collection unfortunately. that was a year ago and i'm STILL ripping cd's. ChristHimself - i have the same computer but I think one model lower - I think c_l's is the 2.0 while mine's the 1.83 lapcook pro. It's certainly not a performance issue. as far as firewire vs usb... firewire has a higher average ransfer rate (400) while usb has a higher peak transfer rate (480)... in practice i've been able to record 8 tracks simultaneously from USB, haven't tried any more than that, and I don't think I've tried playing back more than that either from USB, I mostly use firewire with my drive (a Lacie D2).

10-28-2006, 08:48 AM	#19
brendo_91 Minion of Satan Location: ██████████ Posts: 6,479	the fact that it's happening with or without external disk makes me think it's a usb bandwidth issue between computer and mbox. using the left usb port will help but the mbox is shitful, it's a fucking joke. mbox2 pro would solve this problem i think- at around $1000.

10-28-2006, 09:46 AM	#20
celluloid_love Minion of Satan Location: creepyu Posts: 7,225	I'm not using PT brendo hahahaha sorry

10-28-2006, 11:55 AM	#21
Effloresce Banned Posts: 5,018	If it's just for music and videos, USB is fine. If you're doing editing and stuff on it, you might want FireWire. Also, the next time you need an external drive, do this. Buy an internal OEM drive from a site like newegg for really cheap (you can get a 320GB drive for under $150 usually). Then, buy an external enclosure like the Vantec NexStar which is about $30. A few bucks more if you want FireWire. You save yourself a lot of money that way.

10-28-2006, 12:11 PM	#22
Skradgee Boardcaster Location: reporting live Posts: 3,720	I've got a 750GB external drive, so HA!! My 2 cents...either way using USB 2.0 or Firewire you should be fine, but like CH said record to an internal drive if you can and then move it to the external drive after, but the 'too many tracks playing at once' message likely has nothing to do with the drive you're using.

10-28-2006, 01:22 PM	#24
celluloid_love Minion of Satan Location: creepyu Posts: 7,225	Okay, thanks people. I figure I might as well stick with the USB. it's really not making that big a difference to ME either way, I was kind of just curious how big the difference was in practical terms

10-28-2006, 01:36 PM	#25
Quiet CD Apocalyptic Poster Location: wherever you aren't Posts: 3,241	Firewire has higher sustained read/write rates (especially for small files)... USB has a higher burst rate, but that never proves to be accurate.

10-28-2006, 08:18 PM	#26
Esotarious Pledge Location: Indiana Posts: 198	Yeah for doing any kind of audio editing I always tell my clients to go Firewire. The whole architecture is different. USB shares bandwidth amongst the other devices where as Firewire has a road all to itself. (A faster road at that). You could probably get away with using USB 2.0, but firewire drives really aren't that much more expensive these days. Glyph makes the best Audio/Video drives with the best warranty.