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Originally Posted by MonumentsRocks
There's no objective basis to say that Machina and Adore weren't good albums; there's not really an objective basis to say any album is good or bad. At worst an album can be so derivative, and remind you so much of other albums that you say, good or bad, it's too close to what you've heard before, so it's lacking in creativity, it's a waste of your time, and it didn't advance the art. I think both Adore and Machina have very unique sounds to them. I think even Zeitgeist and Oceania are unique, if for no other reason than Billy Corgan's distinctive snarl... although if some want to criticize MtaE for sounding a little too commercial oriented, I'd accept that. Billy probably chose Tommy Lee in hopes of giving the tracks a more commercial, arena rock type of sound.
When talking about strong albums, record sales are the only objective measure, and Pearl Jam's Ten did outsell SD and MCIS, 10 mm to 4 mm, but I have a feeling if I looked at the sales of some of the other inductees, I certain they sold significantly less albums. Some of those inductees are only in there because prevailing opinion is that they're musical geniuses, and I think there is a strong argument to be made for Billy Corgan's musical genius, but again, because he goes on radio shows and says "I think I'm a genius" it probably repulses people, and they don't want to reward his outward ego with their awards. I guess the whole idea of an award to is shower praise upon gifted people who might not toot their horns much otherwise.
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Look man, I'm a fan of Billy Corgan and I like plenty of songs of his that are completely overlooked by most fans, but you're completely overrating his prowess. "Corgan's musical genius"...
Come on...Sure, he's been a great songwriter at times in his career, but let's be rational and sensible.
Adore and Machina were average albums. Doesn't mean that there isn't some great songs on each release, but as albums they're nothing to write home about.