This is a funny thread. Femenists are so stuck up http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/smile.gif

these posts are too long
whatever happened to a good old one liner?

http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/rolleyes.gif remember that American society is a bit different from Denmark. When I was in Switzerland there was a hell of a lot more open "leering" (leering, being quite different from simply looking) and cat-calling than there is in even Las Vegas construction sites.

I know. I was told that is not cool to kiss in public in America. Thats just stupid.

I really hope you're being sarcastic

Well I am not. I dont mean just a kiss, but more intimit and such. Well, I was with this american girl in and she didnt like it when I kissed her on the dance floor or something. Maybe she was just tired of me, thats a possibillity.

haha...well, unless you live in the heart of the Bible Belt or whatever here, a little PDA isn't looked down upon. Some people are just more reserved than others. America as a country is reserved compared to the rest of the world in many ways. Ontario, Canada lets women walk around topless! Uh, not that anyone ever does.


[This message has been edited by Smiley33 (edited 04-25-2002).]

Topless is pretty common on the beach, in Denmark. But its rare to see a 19 yr old run around topless. But I think in some ways we are more 'free' in Denmark.

It's not fair, and you're probably not a sick creep, but it's not going to get easier for you until you stop taking what people say so seriously and personally. And I would say the same thing to feminists who take this issue so closely to heart.

What I'm saying is, the reason why you got so upset just then is the same reason why women get upset when people stare at their breasts. In the end, though, the other person doesn't matter. I mean, everyone will have experiences where people will do things and say things that you don't think are fair and right but you can't do anything to stop it. The best you can do is not to let it affect you as much as they might want it to.

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Boot the grime of this world in the crotch, dear.

Eh. I let her get to me. I was stressed about other things too, and she struck a cord.

But thanks. And I agree with everything you're saying. http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/biggrin.gif

hm. excuse me. you let ME get to YOU? it's my fucking post asshole. i still don't see how anyone could argue with what i'm saying. so, fuck YOU.

I don't know if my point's been made in this thread already because I have other things to do tonight than lurk around in Netphoria, but if this is true, why the FUCK do women with small chests complain? get implants? stuff their bras? get padded bras? falsies? Because, whether you admit it or not, you love the attention.

Would it help if a girl stared at your breasts for a while?

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Boot the grime of this world in the crotch, dear.

i can't believe you are actually accusing women of victimizing men by getting offended/hurt/upset when men leer at them.

Because some girls like it, and some don't. Some feel offended by it but still like it. Some love it but are afraid to admit it. Some hate it but think they're supposed to like it. Others like it but think they're supposed to hate it.

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Boot the grime of this world in the crotch, dear.

because our "puritan bible-thumping society" has dictated to women that they aren't worth anything unless they're sexy. however, you don't see ME with implants. so don't you dare call ME a hypocrite

You know. You sound just a wee bit stuck up here.
Maybe you should rant some more about how women are equal and should be treated as such and you're better than everone else and shouldn't be argued with.
Oh, and you're *not* the H-word.
http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/smile.gif

My god you are dense as fuck. This thread was originally about etiquette. Simple fucking etiquette. What don't you understand about etiquette? So stop letting that fly over your head and feeling like your manhood is being threatened. Can I punch you in the face? If that bothers you it's your fault for letting it bother you!

I thought it was about the worst thing about being a girl. I said what I thought the worst thing was, but no one seemed to care. http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/frown.gif

i hate it when girls pinch my naked butt..

it's demeaning and it hurts.

I'm sorry. I should really be more gentle.

Getting punched in the face is unwanted physical contact. It's illegal, uncommon, and definitely not something you'd expect to happen to you (in most places). Getting looked at *even* in the chest is not illegal, uncommon, or even unexpected.

Sure it might be rude to look someone in the chest when they're talking to you. You're obviously more interested in thier body than what they have to say. But it's honest, and when you're not being ignored for your breasts, it's not even that. It's just something Samsa finds uncomfortable.
And I'm trying to argue that there's not much of a reason for her to call it *the worst thing* or even a bad thing most of the time.

not all women want large chests. i, for one, wouldn't mind a double masectomy. i just don't like breasts much, period.
also, it's our culture. we're very breast-oriented, as opposed to asses, thighs, hips etc, like other cultures (though the lines are starting to blur a bit) so women routinely base their value on their sexuality. b/c we live in a sexist environment, whether ANY of you want to fully admit it or not. i don't hate all men. i don't love all women. in fact, i dislike both rather proportionately...but the fact of sexism and male dominance in society is hardly something to be disputed.
a lot of guys here tend to think that what they're doing is perfectly natural and 'masculine' (though that term is never fully defined), well, perhaps it is..and perhaps it's also 'natural' for women not to like it. so, we're at an ostensible impass. either both sides have to learn tolerance or it's gonna stay that way. ugh. progress is slow and requires immense patience, not to mention maintenence. i think i'm gonna leave that last line as the thought of the day.

I read it, but it didn't strike me as something I might disagree with, or need to expand on.
In fact just the doctor you have to see to help prevent/detect a lot of those gender-based problems seems really really scary to me.
I took a GF to a Gyno once. She had an infection and it could of killed her if she hadn't gone.
I'm sooo glad I don't *ever* have to see one.
http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/smile.gif

*cough* *sputter*
Everyone bases their value on their sexuality. Either directly with their body and intellect or indirectly with their wealth,connections, or whatever.
And it's not because everyone's sexist. Men are too. It's just men get judged more on things that are less obvious than our appearance. (Of course we're still judged on that).

No, I really do want to punch you in the face!

you're being too vague. i think it's pretty well understood that for the bulk of time, women have been the subjegated sex, no contest. don't bring petty masculine issues into this, b/c it's really not that relevant. and no, not everyone bases their value on their sexuality. at least not in such a direct sense. i really don't think that i do, in a major way. i value things like intelligence and personality far above basic attractiveness, i mean, on a friendship level, not my ability to 'score'.

That's true, but I think my point was that as a woman, you don't have to let it become a bothersome thing. I don't know what it is about this street I'm living on now, but I can't walk to the store without a carful of guys driving by and whistling at me. And it really doesn't bother me. I don't immediately think, "Oh my god, they don't see me as a person," I just think, "Well, that was amusing," and keep walking. It's the same thing when guys stare at my breasts, which half of the time I probably hardly notice because it doesn't seem like such an important thing to pay attention to. The more that you think of the possibility of yourself as nothing more than a sexual object and let that even enter into the equation, the easier it is to be hurt and offended. If someone I don't know and who doesn't know me thinks I have nice breasts and doesn't see anything else, that's fine, I'm never going to see them again and I really don't care.

I guess what I'm saying is that while feminism does serve a definite purpose and while some people have had experiences that give them good reason to be upset about being stared at or hit on, that feminism can also be destructive to the way women view themselves. It can lead us to expect to be held down by society and to be viewed as objects whereas we might not see that as much if we just look at our lives as they are. We read a lot of things and hear a lot of things and sometimes experience things that make us upset, but getting men to fall all over themselves treating us with the utmost respect isn't the answer either, because it goes back to the idea that we are special and fragile and need to be treated differently. It perpetuates what already exists because we expect it to be that way. It doesn't have to be, and the real trick to getting society to fully accept women as equals is to act like we already are. Things like rape and sexual harrassment are an injustice, but those kinds of things aren't men vs. women, they're basic human rights. Society isn't a huge endless masculine trap that women are doomed to fall into, and the longer women keep viewing it that way the longer it's going to seem that way.

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Boot the grime of this world in the crotch, dear.

i think you make a lot of good points, and i for one, am usually not too terribly bothered if i guy looks at my boobs or something. usually i just toss shit like that off. that doesn't, however, make the action RIGHT or RESPONSIBLE. just like some people can slag off being made fun of or abused doesn't mean the abuse is proper. of course i'm exaggerating for the purpose of argument, but the essential point remains the same.