View Full Version : My reponse to someone who couldnt relate at all to Machina


Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 04:57 PM
so you guys wait until MACHINA to start complaining about pumpkins not spelling things out for you?? as if the other albums had no symbolism or mystery at all??? thats the point of the pumpkins.. if you want songs for stadiums of phony teens to sing along to and are about as real and complex as the back of a cereal box, go to an our lady peace concert. someone posted lines from the machina songs cuz they said no one can relate to machina and it was a dumb idea that no one got.. well i got it just fine and its my fav albums.. here is what the songs mean and i felt the need to do that cuz i need to show that they DO relate to me.. maybe im the only pumpkins fan on this board... i think i am. considering the album was written for us and only us could have gotten it.. well i got it.

Everlasting Gaze... "You know I'm not dead..."
-well pumpkins had been pretty much forgotten by mainstream music media and ignored after Adore... that line kinda informs whoever hears it that pumpkins didnt just go away and it has a duel meaning with the story as far as Glass saying despite all the trials and tribulations he is still here and still searching for happiness even if he isnt sure why.


Raindrops + Sunshowers... "And I'm just trying to walk with you..."
-between the rain drops... he says, rain falls on everyone.. he sends his echo out to get his love without obscure reflections of.... people try and find their true reflection or soul mate but problems like abuse or misfortune cloud that and can get in the way of true love.. i have definitly had that experience and i think most people do.

I of the Mourning... "I blow the dust off my guitar..."
-he is talking about how he reads our letters to feel better, his tears upon a faded ink... he betrayed rock and roll like he says with adore.. i mean yeah thats an exageration but that was the perception.. he remembers the past.. and god has spoken to him through the radio and he is reborn as glass... glass meaning you see yourself in him and he reflects you back on yourself so you can percieve yourself through him. but you cant relate to that? i know the first time i saw the rocket video is what really changed my life.. its the same as god speaking to glass through the radio and changing his life... pumpkins spoke to me through the radio and changed my life.. and im sure yours too.. its a beacon from another place that reached out to us.. thats teh point of teh song.. the power of radio and the power it has to change.

Sacred and Profane... "And I will prove my release..."
-sacred and profane.... he will proove his release.. when glass tries to start a revolution of love and oneness.. if you believe in him and what he is saying... you will be released from your troubles.. and he can proove it if you believe in him.. thats what glass is saying..im sure we have all had moments of self rightiousness and feelings we can change the world in an unrealistic way.. its teh same thing here.. he is forgetting human elements of behavior... i can relate to that tottally.

try try try... rather then go over every line for you... bassically about .. like billy said in an interview.. like try to hold on to him wherever he goes cuz he understands how it can be difficult.. so 'try' is almost sarcastic but more longing.. 'try to hold on to this heart'.. his heart...

Heavy Metal Machine... (the whole fuckin song)
-heavy metal machine. the whole song... how glass still believes in the power of rock and roll but 'its elemental to all the rust it brings'.. how its always a finite experience.. its about death and being reborn over and over... its not like other forms of art that might last thousands of years.. rock is short and it burns out and then something new comes of that... thats why pumpkins were around 13 years.. beatles less then ten years, led zeppelin ten years.. as opposed to decades... cuz rock must be born and die in an intense and exciting blaze or else its not rock. i think any rock fan can relate to thta pretty simply.. i know i can.

This Time... "As the curtain falls we bid you all goodnight"
this time... he said it was teh lats song he wrote for the album... he is lamenting that its over... in the story he knows the band is ending soon.. and he knows we feel that way too whether he announced it or not... if you remember in the story there was a big farewell concert too... he says in the song...ive got to move it on, ive got to sing my song.. while i still can.. dispatch the last alarms.. hand out the last few charms.. theres no surprises. he is saying everyone feels its over.. he is crashing down... he says the things we want to hold are in peices.. and he is saying he loves us and .. goodnight.

The Imploding Voice... (the whole fuckin song)
imploding voice.. well imploding means to turn inward... this is glass singing to himself.. the 'you' being himself... everywhere 'you' are....'your' never too far.. meaning you need accept yourself.. you need to love yourself... that only you can end your lonliness... as opposed to the earlier albums that were more immature and instead sought to be rescued by other people much to disaster. then at the end he throws the twist of 'me' instead of you.. and you notice the me is said with a different microphone.. almost as a joke or waking up from a dream or snapping out of a trance.. kinda breaking that perticular wall of perspective .. then 'you' and 'me' both are glass, the same person..because as opposed to the internal horror and desolation previous albums.. glass is clear and resolute and accepting of who he is and he needs himself. i can relate to that.. the whole point of these songs and why they are so great is teh weight they have based on the previous albums.. songs about suicide and death and loss and abondonment have become songs of self acceptence and love.. thats amazing and that powerful change is why i feel teh weight in the songs and you can feel it in voice. its a little bit colder a little bit worn.. thats very powerful to me because of the contrast.. anyone who has been in great pain understands that.

GatGC... (the whole fuckin song)
glass and teh ghost children... the ghost children being us.. well maybe not you guys cuz you dont seem to like the pumpkins but i do so...maybe its just me but... glass speaking to us... 'i want to live, i dont want to die' etc... he said the glass migrates under junes translucent skin.. meaning she is sick.. and the spiders.. meaning rock stars that as the story says she has been starfucking cuz she is 'lost'... spiders like the spiders from mars... (8 legs, 8 notes)...etc.. the spiders wonder what they have got themselvs into when glass arrives... then the middle part where glass and june talk... the end is after she dies in the car crash... glass is reflecting... she counted the spiders as they crawled up inside her... cuz june was too far gone to be saved anyway... etc.. its more complicated than thta but in the interest of time... kinda the turning point in the album.. im sure we have all had moments when one minute things were great then someone close to you dies or something bad happens... or you broke up with someone.. in this case for glass someone he tried to change but in that he ended up driving her farther away.. i think many people including me but to less dramatic degrees have had that happen and can identify.

wound... glass puts his faith in god... trying to gain is strenght to get over june from that... i think anyone trying to get over someone looks to many places for answers.. i can relate to that.


TCToM... "This is the song I've been singing my whole life..."
what dont you get about that song? glass reflecting on the past pumpkins albums of terror and lonliness and desires... june is dead.. he cant hold back anymore and pretend that he doesnt need anyone but himself and god.. he cant be overrightious anymore cuz the death has forced him to confess and it all pours out that he did it all for her.. and she is what he wanted all along...

you forgot with every light... but bassically.. glass is spiraling downward back and forth between faith in god and his human needs and desires for love... so as opposed to the crying tree of mercury....throw away your for leave clover.. forget your desires and forget waiting for something in your life to change by luck or chance... go out and make it happen for yourself.. its almost over.. no more war and no more soldiers...

Blue Skies Bring Tears... (the whole fuckin song)
blue skies bring tears... glass hits rock bottom.. this is the end of everything.. glass and the ghost children.. pumpkins.. all the years.. all the albums.. it all ends here... glass asks for nothing given and nothing in return, fire out remaning traces of self esteem... drugs, mainline the deepest secrets, empty sex lick clean the dirty fingures, death... watch the seasons die.. he no more winter, rain or summer ways.... he has given up all faith in anything, god, the ghost children, himself..... he is a stranger to you as you are to yourself.. i mean anyone who has been very depressed or honestly tried to kill themselves have had these feelings.. complete dispear with no more faith that anything can help you or that you can help yourself.. i can relate to that.

Age of Innocense... "A little taste of what may come..."
my fav pumpkins song of all time... dismiss the backroads to ride these strees unafraid... resigned to scraping paint from your bones unashamed ....be yourself and dont be ashamed of who you truly are... who YOU are.. not who you define yourself as based on god or a partner or anything... desolation yes hesitation no.. never hang on to anything that is no longer relavant to you... destroy it always.. with no hesitation... if not it will only lead to pain.. and its also a metaphor for rock and roll. before the rites or rebirth come to fruition... the heavy metal cord comes in.. a little taste of what may come and a mere glimpse of what has passed the last 13 years.. the band is over... everyone is free and released but we seek to bind onto something out of fear.. rather than just live at comfort with who you are and not who you belong to or use to define yourself.. as you might have guessed all is never shown, we wont make it home... glass doesnt get the girl, he doesnt go to heaven... but instead he finds true meanings of himself and his place in the universe because that was gods plan for him. there are more meanings in the song but i dont wanna go through line by line of every song.. although some of you seem to need that. anyway, i can relate to this song.. to me its the most emotional of all.. cuz of its coldness and honesty.... no more june, no more god.. and now no more machines of god.. this songs puts us on our own, hopefully we learned something... live for the moment.... too young to die, to rich to care, to fucked to swear that i was there.... kinda everything is stipped down and bare..... and as the story says glass walks the streets as the sun rises and realizes he has fullfilled his destiny for him and god... i think anyone who has lived through all the albums and all of machina understands at this point what its about... sort of how all possiblities for happiness were exhausted and self acceptence and self relience is all that matters.. i can relate to that.

sawdust restaurants
07-12-2003, 04:59 PM
dude.

twilightfadez
07-12-2003, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by sawdust restaurants
dude.

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:00 PM
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

smoke a bowl and chill out man. no one takes you seriously anymore. so smoke a bowl of green ganja!

Boycott Graceland
07-12-2003, 05:01 PM
once again, it's your fucking opinion.

also, if you didn't feel insecure about all this shit, then you wouldn't be posting all this crap trying desperately to convince everyone of the right way to think about the band/music.

Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 05:02 PM
well i just spent a page explaining how the pumpkisn songs on machina relate to me... everyone's explanation for me being wrote is simply "i am' or 'they dont relate to me' with no eplanation so.. thanks pumpkins fans for prooving your intelligence once again.

Boycott Graceland
07-12-2003, 05:03 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
thanks pumpkins fans for prooving your intelligence once again.
you're doing your part too, butch.

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:04 PM
the problem is that instead of stating your OPINION, you go around acting as if you know it all and its all facts. people dont have to like machina to like the pumpkins ( i love machina ) hell they dont even have to relate to it to like it. its music and different people will percieve it differently and relate to it differently.

Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 05:05 PM
well im basing what the songs are about based on the lyrics.. lyrics from past albums, the history of the band, the issues surrounding the band at the time, billy messages on the old website.. the machina stories... so i have nothign to do with those so they have nothing to do with my opinion.

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:09 PM
no damnit its just your interpretation of these lyrics, events, etc. dont be so narrow minded.

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:09 PM
you're doing your part too, butch.

LOL

Boycott Graceland
07-12-2003, 05:10 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
so i have nothign to do with those so they have nothing to do with my opinion.
it's because of people like you that there are still wars.

Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 05:11 PM
well no one has posted ANY interprations at all except me so.. the point wasnt what its about anyway, the point was whether i can relate to it.. it sounds like none of you have even tried compared to me... and basides.. yes there is lots on the album thta is opinion based but other stuff is simply fact given to us to understand it more so... you cant hide your stupidity behind 'everything is opinion' like some little kid.

neopryn
07-12-2003, 05:11 PM
Billy doesn't love you anymore, Marlon. Give it up.

I really hope nobody read all of that.

Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 05:12 PM
you need to be glad there IS wars... as opposed to what? either everyone agrees which might not be bad.. or everyone just agrees to disagree... so a country tortures its people or rapes its women are is corrupt.. and thats all ok because we have different opinions. your really fucking stupid ya know

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:14 PM
lol. LOL. there is wars huh. oh lord dont get me started on that last post...

go read a book my friend.

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:16 PM
by the way i hate this goddamn post since no one is reading mine instead!

:unhappy:

Boycott Graceland
07-12-2003, 05:19 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
you need to be glad there IS wars... as opposed to what?
what the fuck? yay for mass destruction. who gives a shit about peaceful resoloution.

Originally posted by Marlon Brando
so a country tortures its people or rapes its women are is corrupt.. and thats all ok because we have different opinions.
"that's okay?" no, it's not fucking okay.

Originally posted by Marlon Brando
your really fucking stupid ya know
no, i'm not. however, you are somewhere near retarded. you are the type of the person who holds their opinion in a place where they won't listen to what anyone else has to say. just looks straight ahead and keeps repeating the same bullshit. go fuck yourself, junior.

Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 05:21 PM
alright let me consider your opinions... machina story was stupid... billy and the pumpkins were intelligent people for their whole lives then just out of the blue became stupid and put out a shit album to get our money... and the songs are unrelatable to anyone... and wars are never neccesary and are not at all a part of human nature. ok.. considering... considering... ok done. ive concluded you are a fucking idiot.

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:23 PM
being a pacifist is being stupid?

umm....

Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 05:25 PM
being a pacifest behind your computer living in america is fine... being a pacifest when armies are marching into your town to kill you or a government in a foreign country is torturing and abusing their people by force... thats fuckind stupid, like you.

eraserhead
07-12-2003, 05:29 PM
SEE: Gandhi
SEE: Martin Luther King Jr.
SEE: Jesus Christ

by the way i give up. i try to have an argument with you and all you do is insult me personally and use tons of cuss words to prove your superiority and maturity. goodnite and farewell.

Reyngel
07-12-2003, 05:35 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando


blablablablablabla.



You actually think that the rest of the albums had all the mystery and other shit that Machina did? As though Billy had been planning out a continuous story since 1988? lol. Trust me man, you are sorely mistaken.

As for all your comments on all of those lines I had picked out from the songs, I'm not even really gonna comment, cause they're YOUR INTERPRETATIONS. There is no way that you know wtf you're talking about. Billy never went down the tracklisting of Machina and explained in depth what the songs were about, so how can you use that in favor of what your'e trying to defend?

By the way, what exactly ARE you trying to defend? Machina? Listen man, we all own Machina. It's not like you need to convince us to buy it. If we don't like the album, then what does it hurt? Your feelings? If that's the case, then you really should just give up all this Machina crap, because your feelings have NOTHING to do with how I decide to feel about an album.

And by the way, I didn't "forget" some of the songs when going through and typing up lyrics. The ones I left out were the ones that I felt people could generally relate to.

And lastly, your little comment about us not being the ghost children since we "don't like the Pumpkins" and you do... ugh, shut the fuck up. I think Adore is the best album I have ever heard. Period. And I love Mellon Collie. And Siamese Dream. And TAFH. And I really enjoy Gish, and Pisces. And you know what? I kinda like Machina. But I don't think that it's the best shit the Pumpkins ever did. And because I don't, that means I don't like the Pumpkins?

Bleah.

sawdust restaurants
07-12-2003, 05:47 PM
the worst part about it is that he's sullying marlon brando's good name.

hampsterman22
07-12-2003, 06:06 PM
Originally posted by eraserhead
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

smoke a bowl and chill out man. no one takes you seriously anymore. so smoke a bowl of green ganja!

marlon, you are turning yourself into an ass.

hampsterman22
07-12-2003, 06:12 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
well no one has posted ANY interprations at all except me so.. the point wasnt what its about anyway, the point was whether i can relate to it.. it sounds like none of you have even tried compared to me... and basides.. yes there is lots on the album thta is opinion based but other stuff is simply fact given to us to understand it more so... you cant hide your stupidity behind 'everything is opinion' like some little kid.

judging solely on that quote, i think you jack off too much. your becoming fucking Hitler on us bud, just let the thing go, no one really gives a shit anymore.

pale blue eyes
07-12-2003, 06:20 PM
Originally posted by sawdust restaurants
the worst part about it is that he's sullying marlon brando's good name.

Isn't Marlon Brando crazy now anyway? Maybe he is the fat, pony-tailed, socialphobe Marlon Brando who doesn't leave his house anymore and only talks to Elizabeth Taylor and Jacko. I wonder if he has met Bubbles yet?

Marlon Brando
07-12-2003, 06:27 PM
Thank you all for showing how smashing pumpkins fans are the least intelligent of all music fans. from now on I will be forced to like pumpkins in private so as not to be associated with any of you.

hampsterman22
07-12-2003, 06:29 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
Thank you all for showing how smashing pumpkins fans are the least intelligent of all music fans. from now on I will be forced to like pumpkins in private so as not to be associated with any of you.

k man, but remember, practice the rhythm method, cause i dont want you to have kids that will be as fucking stupid, and arrogant as yourself.

pale blue eyes
07-12-2003, 06:39 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
Thank you all for showing how smashing pumpkins fans are the least intelligent of all music fans. from now on I will be forced to like pumpkins in private so as not to be associated with any of you.

If I am unitelligent because I think your "interpretation" of Machina is a load of crap than I'm guilty as charged. Machina came out like three years ago so while your thoughts might have been considered at the time, now they seem a bit over the top and stupid. Nobody cares and you are taking yourself way too seriously.

Have fun listening to the Pumpkins all by yourself *waves goodbye*

DeviousJ
07-12-2003, 06:43 PM
You know, 'relate to' means finding something which applies to yourself or your life. What does selling records have to do with most of us? Not a whole lot. Personally, I could overlook the whole concept bullshit if the album itself was better. Too may mediocre songs when we've been used to great ones. But of course I'm wrong, because no band has ever declined towards the end of their career, unless they do it intentionally of course.

Boycott Graceland
07-12-2003, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
i fuck sheep.
yep.

Ugly
07-12-2003, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
blah blah blah I'm a fucking stupid troll pay attention to me.

<img src = "http://www46.tok2.com/home/marine/chikasitu/kikakugai/t1000.gif">

friedicee
07-12-2003, 08:04 PM
it's not even that the songs were mediocre, their recorded versions were though. Most of the songs sounded MUCH better on the arising tour than they did on the album.

Gary
07-12-2003, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by friedicee
it's not even that the songs were mediocre, their recorded versions were though. Most of the songs sounded MUCH better on the arising tour than they did on the album.

Speaking of live machina tracks that sound far better than their studio counterparts, I would have to say that Heavy Metal Machine was the one that suffered the most. The Rock On>Heavy Metal Machine versions tend to be good, whereas the album version pretty much sucks.

Oddly enough though, I think that the Machina studio BSBT is the best version of it, and I know that a lot of people hate it with a passion :eyesp:

Dead
07-12-2003, 09:27 PM
I didn't read the entire topic but I skimmed it and did a word search and it looks like you skipped Stand Inside Your Love. What's up with that? Sorry if I missed a previous explanation.

NegativeSleep
07-12-2003, 09:38 PM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando
Thank you all for showing how smashing pumpkins fans are the least intelligent of all music fans. from now on I will be forced to like pumpkins in private so as not to be associated with any of you.

http://home.golden.net/~mtblanc/EXITSIGN.JPG

DeviousJ
07-12-2003, 10:16 PM
Originally posted by NegativeSleep


http://home.golden.net/~mtblanc/EXITSIGN.JPG

WHERE DO YOU PEOPLE KEEP GETTING THIS STUFF?

NegativeSleep
07-12-2003, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by DeviousJ
WHERE DO YOU PEOPLE KEEP GETTING THIS STUFF?

believe it or not, netphoria itself.

I'm giving back to the community!

DeviousJ
07-12-2003, 11:25 PM
Originally posted by NegativeSleep


believe it or not, netphoria itself.

I'm giving back to the community!

Yeah I know, I made it for a sig years ago. I mean in the John Malkovich IT'S MY HEAD! sense

<img src="http://forums.netphoria.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=423609">

NegativeSleep
07-12-2003, 11:35 PM
Originally posted by DeviousJ
Yeah I know, I made it for a sig years ago. I mean in the John Malkovich IT'S MY HEAD! sense


I'll add on a (TM)* everytime I use it

<FONT SIX="-4">* registered trademark of DeviousJ Enterprises</FONT>

DeviousJ
07-12-2003, 11:40 PM
Oh hey I don't mind, I just keep seeing things I made ages ago popping up and it confuses me

NegativeSleep
07-12-2003, 11:56 PM
Originally posted by DeviousJ
Oh hey I don't mind, I just keep seeing things I made ages ago popping up and it confuses me

the legacy ... must ... go .... on!

usually if I come across a remotely amusing image, I save it, and keep it for future reference.

Spaceboy917
07-16-2003, 07:02 AM
Originally posted by Bill Hicks


Kill yourself....this is not a joke and there's no joke coming...suck a tailpipe, fucking hang yourself, rid the world of your pathetic useless existence- you are fucked and you are fucking us: Kill yourself.

i wanna die
07-16-2003, 10:15 AM
Originally posted by Marlon Brando


Everlasting Gaze... "You know I'm not dead..."
-well pumpkins had been pretty much forgotten by mainstream music media and ignored after Adore... that line kinda informs whoever hears it that pumpkins didnt just go away and it has a duel meaning with the story as far as Glass saying despite all the trials and tribulations he is still here and still searching for happiness even if he isnt sure why.




an interviewer asked if that's what billy intended in writing that song and he said 'no..not in a million years'

Mariner
07-16-2003, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by i wanna die


an interviewer asked if that's what billy intended in writing that song and he said 'no..not in a million years'

HA!

http://www.sittingvolleyball.org.au/photos/tblaugh.jpg

:rofl:

ok...breathe...just remember to breathe...