It seems there is much distaste for Zwan on this board. I fully support that feeling.

When MSOTS came out everyone was creaming over new studio Billy material... I was one of those people, and I have since lost interest in Zwan.

Why? Because Billy's a dumb fuck. He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear), charges WAY too much for tickets, and he has the worst official band site in history (not to mention the worst official board in history).

Did I forget to mention the immature twats that hoard every show they can to try & stay 1337? The bullshit politics in the zwan community really turn me off of the band.

Originally posted by palidor
When MSOTS came out everyone was creaming over new studio Billy material... I was one of those people, and I have since lost interest in Zwan.

Why? Because Billy's a dumb fuck. He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear), charges WAY too much for tickets, and he has the worst official band site in history (not to mention the worst official board in history).

Did I forget to mention the immature twats that hoard every show they can to try & stay 1337? The bullshit politics in the zwan community really turn me off of the band.

Wow. That is shockingly accurate.

I think the album is ok & had my favorites on them so I can't complain about that. I feel the immature fans of the band are what ruin the experience for some of us. This includ es the "I want to feel like I'm in with the band" & "I'm so cool I am hoarding zwan" crowd.

With each passing day, some just show their true colors & show why the overall community's picture of bliss that was around during the beginning was nothing but a mirage.

You forgot the crappy choice of b-sides on the singles, plus the fact that you can only get the full tracklistings on expensive imports. Oh yeah, and the clipping.

Originally posted by palidor
rant

that was awesome dude

HELLO- SP IS NOT ZWAN , SO WHO GIVES A SHIT IF SP FANS HATE ZWAN? NO COMPARISON. CORGAN IS OVER SP MAYBE WE SHOULD ALL MOVE ON BOYS AND GIRLS . JUST LIKE WHEN SP PUT OUT ADORE AND LOST SOME FAN BASE-WHO CARES REALLY? MOVE ON.

i think i can claim to be the first person to return my Zwan CD.

i returned it the day after it came out. that static and clipping sounded like crap, and the album just wasnt good. 3rd eye blind could shit out what zwan does.

Originally posted by palidor
When MSOTS came out everyone was creaming over new studio Billy material... I was one of those people, and I have since lost interest in Zwan.

Why? Because Billy's a dumb fuck. He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear), charges WAY too much for tickets, and he has the worst official band site in history (not to mention the worst official board in history).

Did I forget to mention the immature twats that hoard every show they can to try & stay 1337? The bullshit politics in the zwan community really turn me off of the band.

we should start a mass email/snail mail campaign wherein we all send that message to billy. except replace the word "twats" with "quinto and friends."

Originally posted by alisonmonster
HELLO- SP IS NOT ZWAN , SO WHO GIVES A SHIT IF SP FANS HATE ZWAN? NO COMPARISON. CORGAN IS OVER SP MAYBE WE SHOULD ALL MOVE ON BOYS AND GIRLS . JUST LIKE WHEN SP PUT OUT ADORE AND LOST SOME FAN BASE-WHO CARES REALLY? MOVE ON.

we're still allowed to have opinions. is it the fact that you can't stand to hear criticism? grow up, or maybe "move on" to another board.

Originally posted by palidor


I even like the album, and I still completely agree.
------->Jeff Compton

Zwan sucks....They blew it a long time ago.

Originally posted by Egadsman


I even like the album, and I still completely agree.


Same here. Though to be fair, Billy currently has the *second* worst official board in history. As bad as the z-board is, it still hasn't quite slipped totally into SP o-board level idiocy yet. (It looks like they're trying their hardest though.)

Originally posted by Corganist


Same here. Though to be fair, Billy currently has the *second* worst official board in history. As bad as the z-board is, it still hasn't quite slipped totally into SP o-board level idiocy yet. (It looks like they're trying their hardest though.)

the bright colors make them refrain from deluding in to topics with titles all like "ONLY BILLY UNDERSTANSD ME!# :( "

now they're all "I UNDERSTNAD EVERBODY!@# :) "

yeah, whateva.

though i agree with some of these opinions, i feel for the most part you people just like to complain. You can NEVER be pleased, no matter what. Why, i can't say for sure but i think it's because the majority of you literally devote your whole time to the band/billy. Do other shit!

As far as the fans go, yeah it's annoying to go to a zwan show and hear some jackass complain about how there are kids there with zero shirts on, but honestly.. so what?? IT'S THEIR LOSS! You're there to have your fun and that's that. When i saw them in Boston, i was there to have my fun, and i did. i really didn't give a fuck about how leet the other fans were trying to act.

You people just let the stupidest petty shit ruin it for you, and because of that maybe you don't deserve "the perfect tracklist" or the "perfect fan community."

just my thoughts.

or the album just sucks

I still listen to ji/msots once in a month... wait, make it 2.:erm

I dig the album, it was soild guitar solos and excellent Jimmy drumming over catchy rock songs. Baby, Lets Rock, Yeah and Jesus I / Mary Star of the Sea ownz.

Originally posted by palidor
When MSOTS came out everyone was creaming over new studio Billy material... I was one of those people, and I have since lost interest in Zwan.

Why? Because Billy's a dumb fuck. He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear), charges WAY too much for tickets, and he has the worst official band site in history (not to mention the worst official board in history).

Did I forget to mention the immature twats that hoard every show they can to try & stay 1337? The bullshit politics in the zwan community really turn me off of the band.

i agree with all that, but i did like seeing zwan live.

I like Zwan. The cheese gets a little out of hand at times...but I can get past that.

<3

i like zwan and the show i went to rocked (seattle) but i have to agree with most that is said here. it does seem to me that billy's ego has gotten in the way of his artistic abilities. instead of sticking to djali and the older rocking zwan stuff he went pop to try to become big and famous again. you had your time in the spotlight, now move on and make some quality music like we all know you can damnit.

Originally posted by palidor
When MSOTS came out everyone was creaming over new studio Billy material... I was one of those people, and I have since lost interest in Zwan.


i wasn't.
welcome to the bandwagon.
i was calling it crap from day one.
thank god i didn't get suckered into flying out to california for those first shows.

Originally posted by distance
thank god i didn't get suckered into flying out to california for those first shows.
They totally rocked back then. Those were awesome shows man!

Maybe if songs like El Sol and Declarations didnt sound so pumpkin-ish I could forget that Corgan was a Pumpkin like he wants us all to.
I waited anxiously to see if zwan was actually going to do something different. I gave it a chance. The shit is just too damn happy ass for my taste. Id rather listen to some old queens of the stone age any day than that reproduced shit that billy puts out now.
If billy wants to really do something decent, and different he can.
As for his prissy stupid ass band zwan.. he shouldnt have broken up the pumpkins so fast and he fuckin knows it. He fucked himself by doing so. He should of let the machina era go by then come back with some old school shit like from the SD Era.

Originally posted by distance


i wasn't.
welcome to the bandwagon.
i was calling it crap from day one.
thank god i didn't get suckered into flying out to california for those first shows.

I don't think all zwan is crap. I think they put on an awesome live show, and they have lots of good material.. it's just that none of it is on the album.

I don't think MSOTS is bad by any means, it's a solid album.. it's just that I think as fans we have been seriously cockteased after they played so much awesome material live, only to pick the shittiest songs for the studio release.

We all know what Billy is capable of doing, so it's disappointing to see him piss away his musical career with shitty tracks like "Heartsong" and "Settle Down".

Originally posted by palidor


I don't think all zwan is crap. I think they put on an awesome live show, and they have lots of good material.. it's just that none of it is on the album.



I feel so too. I mean, I find some songs like Spilled Milk good. But I still can't really get myself to appreciate Zwan...

Originally posted by distance


i wasn't.
welcome to the bandwagon.
i was calling it crap from day one.
thank god i didn't get suckered into flying out to california for those first shows.

woo hoo. you're the best! everybody bow down to you. how stupid of us to ever like zwan.

i have started to hate the album though. and their boring ass setlists. damn. i'm on the bandwagon!

Originally posted by distance


i wasn't.
welcome to the bandwagon.
i was calling it crap from day one.
thank god i didn't get suckered into flying out to california for those first shows. chrysanthemum & shining path own you.

those first few shows were great.....boy have they taken a bunch of wrong turns.

The first shows were fucking rad. It was their best material as far as I'm concerned. Billy probably didn't want to put it on the album because it wasn't "born" in Chicago or some gay shit like that. CALIFORNIA IS EVIL! IT WILL JINX MY ALBUM!!! What a fucking turd.

Billy told me they stopped playing the early songs because they were too similar to Pumpkins material.

I kinda like the album :erm Tho i do agree with a lot of what's been said here, sad to say it, but it's an enjoyable album.

Zwan acoustic rocks, however. 02-18 and 04-05 whoop any other Zwan bootleg's ass.

Originally posted by palidor
When MSOTS came out everyone was creaming over new studio Billy material... I was one of those people, and I have since lost interest in Zwan.

Why? Because Billy's a dumb fuck. He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear), charges WAY too much for tickets, and he has the worst official band site in history (not to mention the worst official board in history).

Did I forget to mention the immature twats that hoard every show they can to try & stay 1337? The bullshit politics in the zwan community really turn me off of the band.

winner

Originally posted by palidor

...Billy's a dumb fuck. He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear), charges WAY too much for tickets, and he has the worst official band site in history...

The bullshit politics in the zwan community really turn me off of the band.

I'll tack on the incredibly lame decision to play the same setlist exclusivly for damn near 6 months straight. bleck

pzane

don't forget the shittiest videos to ever be created. I always thought that videos were supposed to get people to like the band, not make people hate them.

Always liked the album, still like it. I think it's very good.

Everyone else can die

Originally posted by OffTopicMan
Always liked the album, still like it. I think it's very good.



kenny rogers?

Why does everyone like chrysanthemum so damn much? It sounds like JLHB to me.

Originally posted by OnTopicMan


kenny rogers?

Moderators please ban OnTopicMan since he has clearly gone offtopic and needs to be terminated.

Thanks,
Offtopicman

Originally posted by OffTopicMan


Moderators please ban OnTopicMan since he has clearly gone offtopic and needs to be terminated.

Thanks,
Offtopicman

Moderators please ban OffTopicMan since he clearly was the one who stole the dipping sauce from every pizza pizza in the greater Sudbury area.

Thanks,
Ontopicman

Originally posted by machinaddict
don't forget the shittiest videos to ever be created. I always thought that videos were supposed to get people to like the band, not make people hate them.

:rofl:

I was trolling the billy-corgan.com boards and they were discussing their clothing style, and a few people said "I dress like Billy in the Lyric video" and I about crapped my pants laughing.


Their videos are soooo fucking lame. And they're not even being aired very often on any of the music tv stations. It's embarassing.

Oh yeah, and MSOTS blows.

Well... netphoria you have messed up.

Zwan are pretty damn great, but all I hear here is bitching and moaning. Some of you make valid points, Corgan has made some pretty bad choices, and sure the upbeat nature of the album isn't to everyones tastes, but there are plenty of people that disregard the fact that there are still some great Corgan songs in Zwan, for example Lyric, which I hear badmouthed plenty on netphoria, but which is a fucking awesome uplifting song.

I used to find netphoria's stance on the Pumpkins to be the most level headed, but recently I am just growing tired of the "Let's take the piss out of Zwan and Billy shit" that has populated this board.

I think I'll end by saying that Mary Star of the Sea is a great album, and that anyone who has disregarded Zwan is missing out... and to counter those who wish to retort with the typical netphorian insecure smartass putdown: I don't give a flying fuck what you think, plebeian.

Originally posted by Woody

I used to find netphoria's stance on the Pumpkins to be the most level headed

Never visited AMSP, huh? Once upon a time Netphoria was to AMSP what the Oboard/Zboard are to Netphoria.

Viva Usenet.

-Brandon

Originally posted by Woody
and to counter those who wish to retort with the typical netphorian insecure smartass putdown: I don't give a flying fuck what you think, plebeian.
Fuck your guys!!!

i like zwan and i like the album and billy corgan can destroy all of you

Originally posted by kevinjboconnor
i like zwan and i like the album and billy corgan can destroy all of you
http://members.rogers.com/zerolove/john.jpg

Originally posted by Woody
Well... netphoria you have messed up.

Zwan are pretty damn great, but all I hear here is bitching and moaning. Some of you make valid points, Corgan has made some pretty bad choices, and sure the upbeat nature of the album isn't to everyones tastes, but there are plenty of people that disregard the fact that there are still some great Corgan songs in Zwan, for example Lyric, which I hear badmouthed plenty on netphoria, but which is a fucking awesome uplifting song.

I used to find netphoria's stance on the Pumpkins to be the most level headed, but recently I am just growing tired of the "Let's take the piss out of Zwan and Billy shit" that has populated this board.

I think I'll end by saying that Mary Star of the Sea is a great album, and that anyone who has disregarded Zwan is missing out... and to counter those who wish to retort with the typical netphorian insecure smartass putdown: I don't give a flying fuck what you think, plebeian.


Yep , I absolutely agree!:D

I just don't like Zwan because, well, the upbeat happiness DOES get on my nerves...the music videos and artwork are the GAYEST damn thing in the world, and I'm not even a homophobe! Also, with Zwan, you don't get much variety. The pumpkins had heavy songs, softer songs, and then just things that came completely out of left field. And I think that's what I liked about them. Zwan sounds too contrived most of the time...

Originally posted by Deege
Also, with Zwan, you don't get much variety.

I agree, but only in regards to the album. The band in general is pretty varied, it's just that MSOTS doesn't show it at all. Every song sounds the same and it gets tedious and boring.

Well... they keep yapping on about all the different incarnations of the band or whatnot, but maybe the separation isn't a good thing. Maybe the Djali album will end up sucking just as much as this album did, simply because there'll be no variety.

I do kinda have high hopes for the Djali album, though, cause the material from those shows was wonderful, mostly, but I really hope they don't make the mistakes they made with this one, and I really, really hope it won't end up sounding like the Honestly b-sides, cause I don't think I could take a whole album of that.

Agreed, the material played at their early shows displayed a much more promising diversity than anything on the alblum. Alot of what was musically interesting seemed to be cut from MSOTS.

Will all of you stop complaining about nothing? For myself, I find the album actually quite good. Billy's voice has changed, I hear less feeling in it but the album still remains extremely good. Just think of the other bands around: it depends on everyone's taste but I can't think of many other better bands...
Another point, Zwan have only done one album. I don't think the first album of any band in history has ever been their best. They have only started working together and they'll get better as time goes on. I also think Billy and Matt make a good partnership.

PS: I was glad I went to see them on concert.

I enjoy the MSOTS stuff alot more than I listen to the Djali Zwan stuff (I'm basing this upon the Dec. 2001 shows and the Honestly b-sides) If anything, I think those songs are much more repetative and full of "sameness"than any of the MSOTS stuff. Fact of the matter is, guitar solos rule, Silly Sally drools.

i would have liked/would like to see zwan do just songs like Jesus, I, Mary Star, Spilled Milk, ect.

long and rocking. yeah, i wouldn't mind that.

but, as far as all the other complaints, eh. i'm still a fan.

I think the problem is most of you are horrible people, and this is Netphoria. But that's my stance.

Originally posted by Kumar Littlejeans
I think the problem is most of you are horrible people, and this is Netphoria. But that's my stance.
http://members.rogers.com/zerolove/netfub.gif

Originally posted by Kill the Joy
Maybe if songs like El Sol and Declarations didnt sound so pumpkin-ish I could forget that Corgan was a Pumpkin like he wants us all to.
I waited anxiously to see if zwan was actually going to do something different. I gave it a chance. The shit is just too damn happy ass for my taste. Id rather listen to some old queens of the stone age any day than that reproduced shit that billy puts out now.
If billy wants to really do something decent, and different he can.
As for his prissy stupid ass band zwan.. he shouldnt have broken up the pumpkins so fast and he fuckin knows it. He fucked himself by doing so. He should of let the machina era go by then come back with some old school shit like from the SD Era.

Billy was the only one who ever worked to make anything out of the Pumpkins, who made Siamese Dreams when D'arcy and Iha were fucking around? The rest of the band weren't particulary interested in Machina. The problem with people like you is that you want Billy to do everything your way. You can't just sit back and enjoy what he and his bands put out. Why don't you just fucking walk away and let a real fan take your place...and take your queens with you

hear, hear.

oh, i thought he said 'queers'.

Originally posted by Atom--Ant


Billy was the only one who ever worked to make anything out of the Pumpkins, who made Siamese Dreams when D'arcy and Iha were fucking around?

Billy: Alright, this is it guys, let's make our second album!
D'arcy/James: Nah, we're gonna fuck around instead!
Billy: :(... so I'll have to play all the instruments myself then?
James: Sure looks that way, sport
Billy: Ok then.... you guys enjoy yourselves

the album's great i just figured he'd have learned by now not to put together a band that *******s a heroin junkie. i mean that could lead to some shit like having to cancel a bunch of tour dates that your european fans have been eagerly anticipating. oh wait. my bad.

Originally posted by palidor


We all know what Billy is capable of doing, so it's disappointing to see him piss away his musical career with shitty tracks like "Heartsong"

you had a slight point with the hoarding pussies of the community. but this statement just goes to show how completely stupid and idiotic you really are. poor poor palidor.

this thread made me :D

Originally posted by Brandont_h


Never visited AMSP, huh? Once upon a time Netphoria was to AMSP what the Oboard/Zboard are to Netphoria.

Viva Usenet.

-Brandon

RIP AMSP
Lately you can find more spam than posts.

Originally posted by Ugly
I enjoy the MSOTS stuff alot more than I listen to the Djali Zwan stuff (I'm basing this upon the Dec. 2001 shows and the Honestly b-sides) If anything, I think those songs are much more repetative and full of "sameness"than any of the MSOTS stuff. Fact of the matter is, guitar solos rule, Silly Sally drools.

I so agree with this.

Acoustic guitars are for girls and hippies. Plug it in, mutha!

Originally posted by David
i would have liked/would like to see zwan do just songs like Jesus, I, Mary Star, Spilled Milk, ect.

long and rocking. yeah, i wouldn't mind that.

but, as far as all the other complaints, eh. i'm still a fan.

pretty much my feelings too. They really need to push themselves into more interesting territory. They have the talent, its shown in a few songs. They (or maybe just Billy) don't really seem to care to go there though.

Originally posted by Ketch
I don't think the first album of any band in history has ever been their best.

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drf300/f350/f35011er0ap.jpg
http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drd100/d107/d107033sn8b.jpg
http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drf700/f750/f75072t5l5k.jpg
http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/dre700/e785/e78511axdrb.jpg

etc.

Originally posted by Alias


you had a slight point with the hoarding pussies of the community. but this statement just goes to show how completely stupid and idiotic you really are. poor poor palidor.

Your opinion matters. That really, really hurt my feelings.

Your opinion matters. That really, really hurt my feelings.

If you didn't say Heartsong I probably would have agreed with you.

Originally posted by Enzed


Acoustic guitars are for girls and hippies. Plug it in, mutha!

:rockon:

Originally posted by sawdust restaurants

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/dre700/e785/e78511axdrb.jpg

etc.
http://www.artistdirect.com/Images/Sources/AMGCOVERS/music/cover200/drd100/d114/d11429yumpn.jpg
http://www.nzmusic.org.nz/media/omc.jpg

Originally posted by palidor


Your opinion matters. That really, really hurt my feelings.
since it's a measly messageboard, it matters just as much as your petty and pathetic little ramblings on here. well, aside from the fact that i dont post here 30 times a day, wussy.

Originally posted by Alias

since it's a measly messageboard, it matters just as much as your petty and pathetic little ramblings on here. well, aside from the fact that i dont post here 30 times a day, wussy.

Date Registered:
05-24-2001
Status:
Apocalyptic Poster_
Total Posts:
2012 (2.59 posts per day)

http://www.nerdvision.net/jason/wwfpics/vince44.jpg

You were way off, twit!

Originally posted by palidor
When MSOTS came out everyone was creaming over new studio Billy material... I was one of those people, and I have since lost interest in Zwan.

Why? Because Billy's a dumb fuck. He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear), charges WAY too much for tickets, and he has the worst official band site in history (not to mention the worst official board in history).

i hope you die in a fire you fuckin retard, what the fuck do you know about music... i got zwan tickets twice for 25 bucks, thats much less then any major label show ive been to in years and only 10 dollars mor ehten the cheapest indie shows i go to... and what a fuckin loser you are, you judge a band by its website and official message board, you must be some lonely internet piece of shit... most of the good bands on the planet dont even have a websit elead alone a message board ya useless dipshit... just die... die... do it... now... die

Originally posted by Tabris


i hope you die in a fire you fuckin retard, what the fuck do you know about music... i got zwan tickets twice for 25 bucks, thats much less then any major label show ive been to in years and only 10 dollars mor ehten the cheapest indie shows i go to... and what a fuckin loser you are, you judge a band by its website and official message board, you must be some lonely internet piece of shit... most of the good bands on the planet dont even have a websit elead alone a message board ya useless dipshit... just die... die... do it... now... die

i bet you registered just for that

Originally posted by Tabris


i hope you die in a fire you fuckin retard, what the fuck do you know about music... i got zwan tickets twice for 25 bucks, thats much less then any major label show ive been to in years and only 10 dollars mor ehten the cheapest indie shows i go to... and what a fuckin loser you are, you judge a band by its website and official message board, you must be some lonely internet piece of shit... most of the good bands on the planet dont even have a websit elead alone a message board ya useless dipshit... just die... die... do it... now... die

http://www.nerdvision.net/jason/wwfpics/vince14.jpg

omigod, omigod.. you really gave it to me. i'm not going to be able to sleep for a week!

<i>originally posted by Palidor</I><B>
He put the worst possible tracklist on MSOTS (basically left off all the stuff the fans wanted to hear),</B>

I don’t agree with this at all. I think the MSOTS stuff is the strongest and most rocking stuff they did. Guitar solos all over the place, a nice variety in the tunes by throwing in a three-piece guitar set up instead of two guitarist and a bassist which is similar to the Pumpkins set up. The more the merrier, I say. I don’t dig Heartsongs but, well, nobody likes Heartsongs and I think Come With Me is a weak ender. I think the MSOTS Zwan songs are much more enjoyable and energetic than the Djali Zwan stuff. The only things I miss from the first shows are Chrystanthemum and Spilled Milk (and they still play Spilled Milk on tour). The later much more guitar oriented and based around hooks and riffs instead of meandering around musically and not really going anywhere. If you’re going to play for me, entertain me and make a song that I'll remember and be humming the next day. Don’t bore me silly. That's a death kneel for a band.