discuss.

there's really nothing to discuss. the statement is true.

pajo is a better musician. but james knows how to speak. so in my book:

jamez > pajo

Originally posted by shaunna
there's really nothing to discuss. the statement is true.

w3rd.

You guys are fucked. You are not TROO FANS! DIE!!!!!!!!! :(

Duh. Let's put it another way:

Papa M vs. Let it Come Down

Not a fair fight. But I have to agree that James has a slightly cooler vibe to him, just because he dresses better, interacts with the audience/fans, and occasionally seems to be doing something onstage.

TSP > Billy > Jimmy > Matt > James > David > James > B0lly > Crack Whore Slut > Machina-era goth whore > Zwan

James defnitely has a better, more comfortable vibe during live shows. But, maybe that came from 13 years of doing world tours? James dresses nicer. And he doesn't smoke... at least I don't think he does. Musically, though, I don't really know enough about Pajo to judge. All I know is that James's solos during By Starlight at the Vancouver '

James defnitely has a better, more comfortable vibe during live shows. But, maybe that came from 13 years of doing world tours? James dresses nicer. And he doesn't smoke... at least I don't think he does. Musically, though, I don't really know enough about Pajo to judge. All I know is that whenever I listen to By Starlight from the 1997 Vancouver show, I think "Damn, James is amazing."

Pajo may have better musicanship but I sure as hell haven’t heard it. Any of his contributions are buried away in the mix on the album and his live stuff is drowned out by Billy’s vocals and guitar and Jimmy’s drums. For all of Billy’s jacking off about how Zwan is a “colaborative effort” James had a more defined essence in the Pumpkins tunes. James had more of a presence in the live band musically too often picking up the slack while Billy went off into wanker-land. James actually has stage presence in a goofy-sort of lame joke kind of way, that was his bit and you could count on at least one groaner a show from him. I love that. Pajo, by contrast, has the stage presence of a turnip. And as much as we like to say "its all about the music" at a live show, the tallent is also supposed to be entertaining and engaging with the audience. He doesn't do that and in the end he's just "the guy on the side of the stage who looks like James".

Therefore James > Pajo.

Ever seen what Pajo is playing on stage? he is hardly doing anything. His talent is being wasted on Zwan.

Originally posted by Ugly
Pajo may have better musicanship but I sure as hell haven’t heard it. Any of his contributions are buried away in the mix on the album and his live stuff is drowned out by Billy’s vocals and guitar and Jimmy’s drums. For all of Billy’s jacking off about how Zwan is a “colaborative effort” James had a more defined essence in the Pumpkins tunes. James had more of a presence in the live band musically too often picking up the slack while Billy went off into wanker-land. James actually has stage presence in a goofy-sort of lame joke kind of way, that was his bit and you could count on at least one groaner a show from him. I love that. Pajo, by contrast, has the stage presence of a turnip. And as much as we like to say "its all about the music" at a live show, the tallent is also supposed to be entertaining and engaging with the audience. He doesn't do that and in the end he's just "the guy on the side of the stage who looks like James".

Therefore James > Pajo.

I have to admit, this is a very convincing argument. But I'd rather not take sides. I love James because of all the years that I've been a SP fan, but I also really like everything that I've heard Pajo do(besides Zwan).

Anyway, I don't see why we should have to decide who is "better". I like both of them in different ways. The context is so different. It's apples and oranges, man. They're both fruit and they're both round, and they both grow on trees, but um... what was I gonna say? Oh, right... different tastes. And both are good.

Originally posted by Smiley
apples and oranges
APPELS+ORANJES

It's pretty much an established fact that other guitarists who play with Billy get overshadowed. How much of that is deserved is another matter altogether...but when you're comparing Pajo and Iha it seems bizzare anyone would side with Pajo. He's usually turned down so low in the mix, I have a hard time even hearing what he's playing. And as far as stage prescence goes, he has none. Simple as that. I had the pleasure of seeing SP 6 times, 3 of those times, I was close to James. After seeing what he can do live, I gained a whole new respect for him. Simply put, the man can PLAY. He's fast as hell...and is more than capable of pulling off some crazy lead work. Not to mention his crazy and wacky sense of humor.

And must I even mention Iha's usuage of the Lazer Tag gun?

Pajo is boring.

James is far superior.

Alright, this is what I like to hear. You guys have put my Netphorian Rage into words. GO JAMES!

Np: The Boy -- James fucking Iha

everyone saying iha has obviously never heard anything pajo has done outside of zwan.

as a player with corgan, i prefer iha, sure. but pajo is a much more accomplished musician in his own right.

Originally posted by shaunna
as a player with corgan, i prefer iha, sure. but pajo is a much more accomplished musician in his own right. yeah. i agree with this.

Maybe this is obvious to everyone but me, but why is James always necessarily compared to Pajo and not to Sweeney? If Pajo is indeed so low in the mix and doesn't contribute much playing in the first place, why not compare James to the guitarist who does contribute?

Anyway... I too agree with shaunna.

Originally posted by Glare Seethe
Maybe this is obvious to everyone but me, but why is James always necessarily compared to Pajo and not to Sweeney? If Pajo is indeed so low in the mix and doesn't contribute much playing in the first place, why not compare James to the guitarist who does contribute?
This is a damn good point!

Originally posted by Glare Seethe
Maybe this is obvious to everyone but me, but why is James always necessarily compared to Pajo and not to Sweeney? If Pajo is indeed so low in the mix and doesn't contribute much playing in the first place, why not compare James to the guitarist who does contribute?

Anyway... I too agree with shaunna.


okay - whose jokes are funnier - james or sweeney?

Originally posted by jack_kerouac03



okay - whose jokes are funnier - james or sweeney?

jaymz.

Originally posted by jack_kerouac03



okay - whose jokes are funnier - james or sweeney? ah, that's a tough one.

Maybe the real question to ask is why are Sweeney and Pajo wasting their talent in a band as bad as Zwan?

Originally posted by jack_kerouac03
okay - whose jokes are funnier - james or sweeney?

James' jokes are way funnier, but you have to consider the fact that his back catalogue is far more extensive than Sweeney's. Wait, actually I don't know if his "jokes" are funnier, but his general stage banter, at least, is... If only for the Concerto In C Minor on August 28th, 1994.

pajo is iha with a tan

Originally posted by jczeroman
TSP > Billy > Jimmy > Matt > James > David > James > B0lly > Crack Whore Slut > Machina-era goth whore > Zwan

Jimmy > all

Originally posted by King of the Horseflies


Jimmy > all

he is most definitely a demi-god, no doubt about that. Without him MSOTS would just be a bunk acid trip.

without jimmy zwan would be nothing. the guy is amazing. msots the song always gets me.

Originally posted by jczeroman

Without him MSOTS would just be a bunk acid trip.
An overly cheesy one at that.

Originally posted by jczeroman
TSP > Billy > Jimmy > Matt > James > David > James > B0lly > Crack Whore Slut > Machina-era goth whore > Zwan

you forgot to add "> mike garson" after zwan.

Originally posted by Virex Kills


you forgot to add "> mike garson" after zwan.

well played ;)

Iha voice is a lot better then Pajo

Originally posted by MonteLDS
Iha voice is a lot better then Pajo

And I bet Pajo's English is better than yours.

Originally posted by Virex Kills


And I bet Pajo's English is better than yours.

your off topic

Originally posted by MonteLDS


your off topic

my off-topic
:rofl:

Originally posted by MonteLDS


your off topic


you're off topic.

Originally posted by jack_kerouac03
you're off topic.
your guys are fucked

james looks cooler. but musically:

speed kills> desire.

fucking ebow

what about james on the ebow? james is the man. writes the sappiests songs ever and still rocks. his nuts must be huge.

damnit i need to read more carefully.

Originally posted by Slurpee
Duh. Let's put it another way:

Papa M vs. Let it Come Down

Not a fair fight. But I have to agree that James has a slightly cooler vibe to him, just because he dresses better, interacts with the audience/fans, and occasionally seems to be doing something onstage.

Originally posted by ernstdaydreamer

Originally posted by shaunna
everyone saying iha has obviously never heard anything pajo has done outside of zwan.

as a player with corgan, i prefer iha, sure. but pajo is a much more accomplished musician in his own right.

The truth.

what the fuck is wrong with you guys...Iha is a shitload better than Pajo

hoser