View Full Version : Britpop tiers


Catherine Wheel
12-24-2014, 02:06 PM
Same idea as the other tier thread. For fun come up with a tier system for Britpop bands

Tier 1: Doves, Coldplay, Elbow, The Verve, Blur
Tier 2: Snow Patrol, Suede, Thirteen Senses, I Am Kloot, A Silent Film, Kula Shaker
Tier 3: Pulp, Starsailor, Spiritualized, Embrace, Elastica, Supergrass, Oasis

Elijah Moon
12-24-2014, 02:17 PM
I would've put Pulp higher and Snow Patrol lower. Oh and Suede are much, much better than Coldplay, in my eyes.

Catherine Wheel
12-24-2014, 02:58 PM
I really liked Suedes first album but that's about it.

Elijah Moon
12-24-2014, 03:02 PM
In terms of impact, surely Oasis is top tier?

Elijah Moon
12-24-2014, 03:03 PM
I'd add the Manic Street Preachers (they were briefly called Britpop).

Catherine Wheel
12-24-2014, 03:09 PM
This isn't an impact tier though. It's a quality tier just like the other one. I thought about adding M.S.P. but if I added them I'd probably have to add Ride too. In the end those bands arent as known for Britpop as much as other styles.

Elijah Moon
12-24-2014, 03:09 PM
Fair enough.

I'm Hardcore
12-24-2014, 04:44 PM
Spiritualized? britpop? haha good one

Elijah Moon
12-24-2014, 04:45 PM
Super Furry Animals were great in those days, although they might be a bit more obscure and it's debatable whether they were considered Britpop.

Elphenor
12-24-2014, 10:47 PM
Britpop has one of the worst shit to good ratio's of any genre that has produced some great stuff

It's about tied with Grunge

Catherine Wheel
12-24-2014, 11:27 PM
I forgot about Kula Shaker. I like their more recent stuff. They turned out to be pretty good. They are probably second tier.

Elphenor
12-24-2014, 11:28 PM
I like Supergrass

fuzzyroes
12-24-2014, 11:56 PM
Is Catherine Wheel an alternate alias for Elphenor?

What kind of music fan stresses so much about "genre tiers"....

Preposterous

fuzzyroes
12-24-2014, 11:58 PM
It's funny how the Stone Roses are nowhere on his list... Yet he includes Oasis, Coldplay, Verve, Blur, snow patrol, kula shaker, supergrass ETC who are ALL on record stating that they've been heavily influenced by The Stone Roses.

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 12:14 AM
Stone Roses are shitty Happy Mondays

fuzzyroes
12-25-2014, 12:17 AM
Woahhh dude, you're so edgy

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 12:21 AM
What does that even mean in this context

houseofglass11
12-25-2014, 01:32 AM
Where are the Smiths? James?

Trotskilicious
12-25-2014, 01:40 AM
Is Catherine Wheel an alternate alias for Elphenor?

seriously what is with you doing this

I'm Hardcore
12-25-2014, 04:30 AM
Stone Roses are shitty Happy Mondays

two very different bands

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 04:51 AM
I find Stone Roses to be a really bland version of the "House Rock" Happy Mondays played.

I'm Hardcore
12-25-2014, 04:56 AM
your ears are broken

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 04:57 AM
They are different though you're right.

I'm Hardcore
12-25-2014, 05:00 AM
Happy Mondays were a lot more 'popular' than their music warranted, if you ask me

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 05:03 AM
I really, really like their first album. It's all I wanted to listen to for about a month. It's very much The Clash on MDMA

houseofglass11
12-25-2014, 05:04 AM
Happy Mondays were crap. Stone Roses were great. Elph is a tard'.

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 05:06 AM
lol

I think we already established that we have opposite tastes house

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 05:07 AM
Happy Mondays have so much more personality even if they're technically awful

Shallowed
12-25-2014, 05:09 AM
CW I know you've mentioned Rate Your Music before, but do you have an account there? It seems like the sort of thing that you'd really love.

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 05:14 AM
Kuff Dam -> Tart Tart

Like holy shit, what a way to announce your presence

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 05:24 AM
"Son, I'm 30
I only went with your mother because she's dirty
and I don't have a decent bone in me
what you get is just what you see yeah
I see it I take it freely
and all the bad piss ugly things I feed me
I never help or give to the needy
Come on and see me"

This is like an exact conversation I've had with my Dad

Catherine Wheel
12-25-2014, 05:39 AM
CW I know you've mentioned Rate Your Music before, but do you have an account there? It seems like the sort of thing that you'd really love.

I don't. I've thought about getting an account. Just never got around to doing it.

Elijah Moon
12-25-2014, 06:38 AM
Stone Roses only made one decent album, but it was excellent in my opinion, and they should be up the list just for that and the fact they were a massive influence on Oasis and several other Britpop outfits.

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 07:11 AM
Yeah but Oasis suckkkk

Trotskilicious
12-25-2014, 07:22 AM
yet another banal opinion from the king of suck

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 08:32 AM
Seriously one of the worst popular British bands. Wonderwall by itself is an inescapable atrocity, the type of song that just MUST have been made for annoying Supermarket loops.

And that's not even their worst song.

Liam Gallagher's voice is awful and those stupid sunglasses

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/FAPtTS0TYtU/0.jpg

slunken
12-25-2014, 09:54 AM
If some one you liked wore those glasses you would have a pair. Thats your problem - always looking to other people to define your own personality.

slunken
12-25-2014, 09:58 AM
Merry christmas

reprise85
12-25-2014, 11:37 AM
wonderwall is ok, but champagne supernova is so awful

houseofglass11
12-25-2014, 01:35 PM
Oasis do not suck. Definitely Maybe was a killer album.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/81Z-WRuQe2w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mals Marola
12-25-2014, 05:38 PM
are you joking with that first list? coldplay & snow patrol are two of the most americanized british bands i've ever heard bought & sold

blur, oasis, pulp, suede were the best

supergrass picked up excellently where a couple of 'em left off, turned up the tempos a bit

stone roses & i guess the smiths/morrissey + the la's were the fore-runners

the verve are better'n probably all of them save for stone roses & blur but were only britpop for like, the last 2 seconds of the 90s portion of their career

Elphenor
12-25-2014, 10:36 PM
If some one you liked wore those glasses you would have a pair. Thats your problem - always looking to other people to define your own personality.

They're John Lennon glasses and they look awful on anyone but John Lennon. I would never wear them

soniclovenoize
12-26-2014, 12:40 AM
What I thought they were Harry Potter glasses.

vixnix
12-26-2014, 07:37 AM
Pulp are tier 1, I don't care what you do about the rest.

whywontyoulistn
12-26-2014, 08:46 AM
Lol Thirteen Senses? Utter nobodies.

Catherine Wheel
12-26-2014, 08:49 AM
are you joking with that first list? coldplay & snow patrol are two of the most americanized british bands i've ever heard bought & sold

blur, oasis, pulp, suede were the best

supergrass picked up excellently where a couple of 'em left off, turned up the tempos a bit

stone roses & i guess the smiths/morrissey + the la's were the fore-runners

the verve are better'n probably all of them save for stone roses & blur but were only britpop for like, the last 2 seconds of the 90s portion of their career

I think the Americanization of Coldplay is a fairly recent thing that started with Mylo Xyloto. I wouldn't say that on their first 4 albums they were American sounding at all. Quite the opposite actually. The first 4 albums are very British sounding. With Mylo they kind of went in American pop rock direction.

vixnix
12-26-2014, 09:22 AM
stop embarrassing us all with this continued discussion of coldplay

Mals Marola
12-26-2014, 11:05 AM
I think the Americanization of Coldplay is a fairly recent thing that started with Mylo Xyloto. I wouldn't say that on their first 4 albums they were American sounding at all. Quite the opposite actually. The first 4 albums are very British sounding. With Mylo they kind of went in American pop rock direction.

i just meant they sounded like five for fighting

i measure something's "britpopness" by how closely it resembles parklife i guess

Catherine Wheel
12-26-2014, 12:51 PM
What do you think of Doves? I love Lost Souls and Some Cities. Lost Souls is one of my favorite albums of all time. I hold them in as high regard as The Verve at times.

Mals Marola
12-26-2014, 01:10 PM
i like lost souls a lot actually

have had that album for a while, the verve are one of my favorite bands tho & i wouldn't quite put them on that level, if only for ashcroft & mccabe's identities as songwriters/performers

The exploding boy
12-26-2014, 03:18 PM
Happy Mondays were crap. Stone Roses were crap. Y'all tards.

Fixed it.




Though if i had to pick who's worse...probably the mondays.


And yeah as vix said, Pulp are tier 1.


I never got oasis. Boring riffs, awful voice...

brutechinasky
12-26-2014, 03:35 PM
always thought mansun were pretty cool, if they even qualify as britpop

Barry swedgin
12-26-2014, 04:02 PM
Seriously one of the worst popular British bands. Wonderwall by itself is an inescapable atrocity, the type of song that just MUST have been made for annoying Supermarket loops.

And that's not even their worst song.

Liam Gallagher's voice is awful and those stupid sunglasses

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/FAPtTS0TYtU/0.jpg

It's easy to look back and say Oasis are shit but, guaranteed, if you'd been 19 in 1994, living in a shitty flat (anywhere in the UK) with only the weekend to live for you'd have fukn loved Oasis. You would have been MAD FER IT! :banging:

Mals Marola
12-26-2014, 04:31 PM
I was 14 in 2004 & fukn loved them

From the first four albums & a couple on the later ones to the b-side collection, brit rawk

Catherine Wheel
12-26-2014, 05:49 PM
Here's a favorite of mine by Kula Shaker. One of their more recent songs.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=h47fHpIL-MY

vixnix
12-26-2014, 06:30 PM
I was 15 in 1995 and I loved Oasis, What's the Story Morning Glory was my summer soundtrack end of 95/start of 96. And I still love Wonderwall actually. It is embarrassing to admit that, but it's true. I have a penchant for pop songs that really go all-out to be anthems for a generation. They get overplayed and tired to everyone not part of that generation...like The Sound of Silence. But I can't help feeling affection for a song that reaches that high, regardless of whether or not they succeed in being meaningful the way they hope to be.

Elphenor
12-26-2014, 06:37 PM
I like the way he says laff on Supersonic that's about it

Rhyming laugh with autograph is rad

Elphenor
12-26-2014, 07:07 PM
Thank God for Radiohead

fuzzyroes
12-26-2014, 10:11 PM
Wonderwalls a fantastic song. It's one of those tracks that'll stand the test of time and be played regularly 30-40 years from now.

I didn't really listen to Oasis after What's the Story, but those first 2 albums have a handful of great songs.

fuzzyroes
12-26-2014, 10:13 PM
This songs just excellent

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/r8OipmKFDeM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Great musicianship, great melodies, fantastic hook. These guys were a great band at times.

toase
12-26-2014, 10:14 PM
I have no idea what a tier is, I hope it is related to S&M

fuzzyroes
12-26-2014, 10:16 PM
They're John Lennon glasses and they look awful on anyone but John Lennon. I would never wear them

They look cool on Ozzy

http://www.kboing.com.br/fotos/imagens/50c9bbf88ca11.jpg

Elphenor
12-26-2014, 10:41 PM
Yeah, no

Trotskilicious
12-26-2014, 10:42 PM
elph hates ozzy because he thinks he's supposed to, i bet

Elphenor
12-26-2014, 10:42 PM
Sabbath was a great band, Ozzy was never cool imo

I feel similarly about The Stooges, Iggy sucks but they were still an amazing band

Elphenor
12-26-2014, 10:45 PM
Not that those two bands have anything in common other than being bands fronted by vocalists that I think are lame but still made great music

fuzzyroes
12-26-2014, 10:54 PM
What's lame about Ozzy?

Elphenor
12-26-2014, 10:55 PM
Wearing those glasses and not being John Lennon for one

Elphenor
12-26-2014, 11:04 PM
Jim Morrison will always be the only cool big hedonistic rock star of the 70's because he had that air of Art School and mystery even if his lyrics and poetry are questionable

toase
12-26-2014, 11:12 PM
Sabbath was a great band, Ozzy was never cool imo

I feel similarly about The Stooges, Iggy sucks but they were still an amazing band

I really try my best to be the worst poster but...

Trotskilicious
12-26-2014, 11:15 PM
i know he's pretty gifted

slunken
12-26-2014, 11:54 PM
Jim Morrison will always be the only cool big hedonistic rock star of the 70's because he had that air of Art School and mystery even if his lyrics and poetry are questionable

Pure comedy

slunken
12-26-2014, 11:55 PM
I like how art school is capitalized.

Hey elph i went to art school too ride the snake

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 12:15 AM
hot damn you're on a streak, too Elphy-baby!

read this without seeing who posted earlier

I like the way he says laff on Supersonic that's about it

Rhyming laugh with autograph is rad

Thank God for Radiohead

& thought post b was an ironic response to post a

i didn't think it was possible to make that succession of posts seriously, but sure enough i have been proven wrong this night

reprise85
12-27-2014, 12:21 AM
i like this oasis song. actually this album is pretty decent.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/zq0DldWTXdA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

toase
12-27-2014, 12:32 AM
"this videos is not available for you country"

fuck you youtube

fuzzyroes
12-27-2014, 12:36 AM
Anyone hear the rumors that Youtubes eventually going to move to some subscription service? Fucking weak.

toase
12-27-2014, 12:48 AM
I don't think so.... their ad system is pretty solid

Trotskilicious
12-27-2014, 12:49 AM
you manage to surprise me on a daily basis fuzzy

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 12:50 AM
who the fuck even told you that? some dude selling crack on a subway corner? seems legit

Trotskilicious
12-27-2014, 12:52 AM
i bet it was someone like me who will tell fuzzy all the stupidest bullshit that anyone ever thought of because everyone knows he's dumb enough to not only repeat it, but to have an opinion about it and never surrender when presented evidence to the contrary

or he's order 66. it's a hard call.

Trotskilicious
12-27-2014, 12:53 AM
"That's what I heard man, and you know what they say everything has a bit of truth to it but anyway I'm totally right, have you considered that I heard they were switching to a subscription model?"

fuzzyroes
12-27-2014, 12:57 AM
http://gizmodo.com/youtube-is-launching-a-subscription-service-1657917600

I could see them wiping out a shit ton of music if they're making their own streaming service in the vain of Spotify or whatever.

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 12:59 AM
are you kidding, it says clear as day that it's just going to be an alternative to having to watch the ads before videos, there is no "move" to it aside from a theoretical chosen one by the buyers, lol

fuzzyroes
12-27-2014, 01:01 AM
Sure, but any time a service starts focusing on subscription models, you can be sure that the free products going to suffer.

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 01:05 AM
for spotify wasn't it always a choice

the free part hasn't exactly suffered as far as i can tell, you just have the ads

with youtube it's been the same way, it's just that there hasn't really been a "subscription service" until now

Elphenor
12-27-2014, 01:05 AM
hot damn you're on a streak, too Elphy-baby!

read this without seeing who posted earlier





& thought post b was an ironic response to post a

i didn't think it was possible to make that succession of posts seriously, but sure enough i have been proven wrong this night

"Thank God for Radiohead" wasn't really serious, but I'm totally serious about liking the way some Brits say laff and it's especially great the way he drags it out and puts attitude on it

fuzzyroes
12-27-2014, 01:06 AM
yeah, I guess I should have googled the shit before mentioning it...

But still, I don't really notice many adds when I'm fucking around on Youtube.

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 01:09 AM
that's like the story of oasis though

back that with the fact that noel gallagher's a great, prolific songwriter and shit what's not to like

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/AMy-pTscB78" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Elphenor
12-27-2014, 01:11 AM
I don't think he's a great songwriter that's the thing

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 01:15 AM
he's... extremely prolific

that b-side album coulda been a double, maybe triple if they'd actually pulled from everything, there are songs not even present on that one that i'd say are quality material

that's not really the criteria being prolific, but still, he definitely wasn't falling short in consistency either

Elphenor
12-27-2014, 01:16 AM
Yeah I edited to "great" because obviously he's prolific

I just think they're pretty weak

toase
12-27-2014, 01:19 AM
Now that I know what a tier is:

1) Bealtes, Rolling Stones, Black Sabbath
2) My Bloody Valentine, Scott Walker, Kate Bush
3) Tricky, Massive Attack, Portishead
4) Amy Winehouse, Oasis, Blur

vixnix
12-27-2014, 01:22 AM
so now Massive Attack is britpop, apparently

vixnix
12-27-2014, 01:22 AM
and no pulp!

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 01:22 AM
he's effortlessly great, there's no denying it

if someone can listen to definitely maybe & not be completely swept up by the energy and enthusiasm of it all, i don't really see why they'd waste their time with anything else in the "rock & roll" region

Elphenor
12-27-2014, 01:24 AM
You can't really get away with that kind of statement with any band nevertheless fucking Oasis

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 01:25 AM
well, look at that, i just did

toase
12-27-2014, 01:26 AM
so now Massive Attack is britpop, apparently

hmm I guess I got that wrong
But whats is pop anyways? (kiding)

Pulp is not my thing :(

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 01:32 AM
oh wow i thought that was a joke

http://media0.giphy.com/media/aBooMpl2faiHK/200_s.gif

vixnix
12-27-2014, 01:35 AM
I was hard on you Elphenor, but you're not actually that bad.

FWIW, everyone wore Lennons in the mid 90s. I had a few pairs - one pair had silver rims and this sort of rainbow reflective coating on them. So don't be too hard on Liam for that. Be hard on him because he's an insufferable git with a bandsaw voice.

Noel's not what I'd call a terrific songwriter but he always came across in interviews like he understood that, that's part of what I liked about him and Oasis. I think he knew their popularity was due more to the tragic nature of popular music tastes than any particular talent he had. Though I still think Wonderwall is a good song. Those chords are wonderful and the progression is fairly unmistakeable now, and it wasn't a truly hideous misuse of a good progression. Some truly wonderful riffs have been wasted on terrible lyrics and melodies over the years but Wonderwall doesn't top any of my lists in that regard.

You gotta give the guy props for not whining like a little mama's boy when his fame and popularity subsided, the way....some other figures in popular music, from the same era, have continued to do...

Catherine Wheel
12-27-2014, 01:43 AM
Oasis are like Blur in that they have some good b sides but what winds up on their albums is pretty awful for the most part. I do like Wonderwall though.

Blur have enough good b sides to make several albums out of. Oasis don't quite cut it in that regard.

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 01:49 AM
Oasis are like Blur in that they have some good b sides but what winds up on their albums is pretty awful for the most part.

this is not the case for either of these bands, what are you even talking about lol

Catherine Wheel
12-27-2014, 01:56 AM
Blur's first four albums are insufferable. Self Titled and 13 are great. And then there are all their wonderful b sides which I made albums out of.

Elphenor
12-27-2014, 01:58 AM
Blur is legit I guess

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 02:41 AM
they're fucking great

jesus christ, what a community

Blur's first four albums are insufferable. Self Titled and 13 are great. And then there are all their wonderful b sides which I made albums out of.

why are you even talking about britpop, with an opinion like that (not an "elitist post," those are just the albums that pretty much defined the thing via blur & whatnot, before they you know, kind of disowned it with the albums you mentioned along with think tank)

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 02:47 AM
i mean parklife is one of three or four definitive britpop albums, calling their first four albums "insufferable" is like trying to rank '60s british pop/rock after having said everything the beatles did in that decade was shit

Elphenor
12-27-2014, 02:49 AM
I really don't like Brit-pop minus a few groups

80's UK stuff was just sooooooo much better

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 02:51 AM
what is the point of even comparing that

it's like apples & fucking broccoli

Elphenor
12-27-2014, 02:53 AM
Well it's like you're wondering how I can be so-so about Blur and hate Oasis and it's because Britpop is garbage

Catherine Wheel
12-27-2014, 02:54 AM
Urban Hymns and Lost Souls and A Rush of Blood To The Head are also definitive Britpop and I love those. I also like Suede's first one and that's definitive Britpop.

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 02:56 AM
i wasn't wondering that in fact i've become pretty accustomed to your "questionable" opinions

i don't really care, it's all a "your loss" situation to me in this cases. maybe someday the poor men will come around

until then...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/SD8gO8TAr4s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 02:59 AM
Urban Hymns and Lost Souls and A Rush of Blood To The Head are also definitive Britpop and I love those. I also like Suede's first one and that's definitive Britpop.

yeah, that was one of the ones i had in mind, too

those first three, while pretty good (urban hymns is particularly great) were after the thing was done, the whole britpop thing was early 90s and sonically it had moved on to either the alty experimental stuff blur, pulp, etc. had started doing or the more melancholic less overtly "british" stuff that made people want to coin the term anyway

i don't know it's just such an obvious sonic difference to me i think it's kind of funny when people try & group bands like radiohead in with that whole movement/party/thing

parklife, different class, definitely maybe, & suede were the ones i was originally referring to, by the way

Catherine Wheel
12-27-2014, 03:05 AM
The second wave of Britpop (Coldplay, Elbow, Doves) was a lot more melancholic than the first wave. Lot more songs composed on piano too.

What do you think of Seldom Seen Kid by Elbow?

Mals Marola
12-27-2014, 03:08 AM
i'm sounding like a fucking journalist/elphenor here & i realize but i mean, if yer gonna give something a name, might as well make it count, right?

& no i've never heard that song (or album?), or even band really

not so great on the 2nd-wave brit pahp!

Trotskilicious
12-27-2014, 03:59 AM
fuckin catherine wheel

pavementtune
12-27-2014, 11:20 AM
& no i've never heard that song (or album?), or even band really

not so great on the 2nd-wave brit pahp!


from what I've seen of your taste on here, I'd guess you'll like Elbow.
you could start from 2014 going backwards, I like their latest album a lot




<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/Q9HWyO-z_BQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



http://vinyliciously.gr/images/uploads/ELBOW---THE-TAKE-OFF-AND-LANDING-OF-EVERYTHING-2LP-2.jpg


(on a side note - what the fuck is it with the "tiers" in this thread, is everything that's British automatically Britpop? I'm gonna start labelling music as post-3rd wave Amirock.)

Barry swedgin
12-27-2014, 03:37 PM
Urban Hymns and Lost Souls and A Rush of Blood To The Head are also definitive Britpop and I love those. I also like Suede's first one and that's definitive Britpop.

I've never regarded Suede as Britpop, especially their first album. It's generally regarded that the emergence of Oasis (and Britpop) burst the Suede bubble. Suede were your poetry reading, heroin taking, studenty types - definitely not Britpop.

Britpop was about getting pissed up with your mates, taking Es and charlie, watching football (soccer) and shagging birds - definitely not Suede-like behaviour.

Barry swedgin
12-27-2014, 03:40 PM
Well it's like you're wondering how I can be so-so about Blur and hate Oasis and it's because Britpop is garbage

I agree, looking back at Britpop most of it is rubbish.

mojo
12-27-2014, 05:32 PM
In terms of impact, surely Oasis is top tier?

yes, this list is a joke without correcting that. 4 percent of the adult British population applied for tickets to the two Knebworth shows - myself not included but still...

mojo
12-27-2014, 06:35 PM
This isn't an impact tier though. It's a quality tier just like the other one. I thought about adding M.S.P. but if I added them I'd probably have to add Ride too. In the end those bands aren't as known for Britpop as much as other styles.

These things are subject to an inevitable bit of revisionism but being an old cunt I can recall clearly that no-one started talking about Britpop until 1993 when Suede's first album came out and Blur switched from Stone Roses wannabes to a much more Kinks-inspired, London sound with Modern Life..Ride, Slowdive etc.. were part of the old generation of MBV-inspired shoegaze (shoegazing as we called it back then) bands that Britpop swept away, although it was dying out anyway. The Manics were definitely considered Britpop but only after Richie left/disappeared and they left the darkness of Holy Bible behind for the more radio friendly Design for Life & its parent album Everything Must Go. As for Oasis, yes, it's easy to knock them now but the first two albums have their moments (Live Forever being a stand-out for me) it was great to have a band from the alternative world (kind of) outsell Phil Collins and all those other 80s dinosaurs who were still very much roaming around in 1994, despite grunge etc. But from 2014 it's pretty fucking clear that the outstanding talent to emerge from the Britpop era is Damon Albarn and the good news is he's not half as fucking arrogant and annoying as he was back then....

slunken
12-27-2014, 06:56 PM
that's a lotta text, mojo

slunken
12-27-2014, 06:57 PM
holy bible, mbv, 2014, oasis, phil collins; damn son

mojo
12-27-2014, 07:02 PM
that's a lotta text, mojo


like i said, I'm an old cunt.

slunken
12-27-2014, 07:05 PM
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb14/slunken_2007/tumblr_mbi6dztSBi1qzfcdpo1_500_zps2660650b.jpg (http://s207.photobucket.com/user/slunken_2007/media/tumblr_mbi6dztSBi1qzfcdpo1_500_zps2660650b.jpg.htm l)
gpoy

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 12:22 AM
I've never regarded Suede as Britpop

oh please

this

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/YP2enk5w5fk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

is like the definition of britpop

(& boy do i love it)

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 12:26 AM
That sounds so much like Bowie

I like Suede

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 12:30 AM
yeah to be fair coming up was prob their most ba-ritt pahp record

first two were darker'n RODEO head

Barry swedgin
12-28-2014, 07:06 AM
yeah thats a good Suede tune, agreed.

I've just never seen them as Britpop, much like (The) Verve. In fact Verve's 'Northern Soul' album is probably my favourite album of that era. I'm not sure it's entirely fair to tar it with the Britpop name mind!

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 04:12 PM
i agree about the Verve

Suede have a totally different thing going for them though, i've always thought. from imagery to approach and sonics bla bla bla, the whole package up until (and really even through) head music + new morning

i love all that stuff, britpop or not. if suede aren't bp, though, nobody is; it was a fugazi, fu-gayzi, i'm a wahzy you're a woozy

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 04:54 PM
"They're [Americans] sick of all that Oasis shit - do you think the Gallaghers could get a job in an American group? They couldn't even make it past New York! Have you noticed that about Oasis, they're always trying to conquer America, but never make it past New Jersey!"

-Mark E. Smith

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 04:56 PM
To give that context, he's talking about how posh British bands can't handle what he calls the "Work and Play" American lifestyle

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 05:24 PM
Well, that's flattering to americans, I guess, but i don't really get it - oasis were practically the most popular British band "'cross the pond" this side of bush

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 05:29 PM
He's getting at what I don't like about Oasis, they're supposed to Rock but they don't Rock

But mostly I'm taking the piss by quoting Marky taking the piss

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 05:37 PM
Britpop has these watered down Rock guitars by adopting The Stones adopting Bo Diddley and such rather than getting straight to the simplistic root of The Blues ala Punk

slunken
12-28-2014, 05:55 PM
Britpop has these watered down Rock guitars by adopting The Stones adopting Bo Diddley and such rather than getting straight to the simplistic root of The Blues ala Punk

lol

slunken
12-28-2014, 05:59 PM
its like you don't even bother reading wikipedia entries at the very least - you're just pulling ideas out of thin air sometimes

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 05:59 PM
Richard Hell said something very similar in his autobiography but not specifically about Britpop

slunken
12-28-2014, 06:03 PM
i'm fairly certain britpop is more influenced by poppier rock acts such as the beatles and the kinks, as opposed to traditional blues rock acts like the stones or bo diddley.

surely you remember the whole mods vs rockers debate.

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 06:06 PM
Well yes completely, but just like in American 90's rock there's that 70's British Blues influence that I find vulgar

Elphenor
12-28-2014, 06:12 PM
Like note above where Mals said something along the line of "You must not appreciate Rawk if you don't like Oasis"

but they're like Beatles with totally limp guitars imo

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 06:23 PM
"rawk" is about not giving a fuck. Gallagher may act like a badass, but listen to that overproduced tripe that his band spews out. Totally does give a fuck, if you ask me

slunken
12-28-2014, 06:31 PM
Well yes completely, but just like in American 90's rock there's that 70's British Blues influence that I find vulgar



I don't really see a lot of that in popular 90s music except for maybe like Aerosmith, Black Crowes, Guns and Roses or STP. Even Pearl Jam mostly sounded like the Who, none of that clapton, jeff beck, yardbirds, zz top, chuck berry, bo diddley, rolling stones stuff. aka - the blues.

slunken
12-28-2014, 06:32 PM
but they're like Beatles with totally limp guitars imo

the beatles always had limp guitars and that's a defining characteristic of britpop

slunken
12-28-2014, 06:33 PM
they're more interested in vocal harmonies than blowing up speakers

FoolofaTook
12-28-2014, 07:00 PM
Tier 1: Coldplay


http://fc06.deviantart.net/fs47/f/2009/202/c/3/You_Have_FAILED_Please_Die_by_StLonginus.jpg

vixnix
12-28-2014, 07:27 PM
The Beatles are no more listenable to me than Oasis - I would have a hard time choosing one over the other, if we're talking about listening for pleasure rather than study.

Of course, stuck on a desert island, I would take the Beatles because there's more variety in the writing, at least. But in a world of choices...the variety is pretty limited and it's still not what I'd consider the best music of that generation, or anything. They were just the most popular...much like Oasis.

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 07:34 PM
Like note above where Mals said something along the line of "You must not appreciate Rawk if you don't like Oasis"

that's not what i said, it was more about the contrivance of someone who couldn't appreciate the simple pleasures of Definitely Maybe, not a call to quote Mark E. Smith or whatever, lol

i like oasis, i'm not here to defend their actions or anything, but as far as the not giving a shit thing: i think the reluctance to actually strap down and sound like the beatles, just sort of banging the drums & turning up the guitars, can vouch for that a bit

i've never seen noel as one who "didn't give a shit" neccesarily, he was always kind of managerial in the way he pretty much came in, said he was writing the songs, told the band what was what

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 07:44 PM
just sort of banging the drums & turning up the guitars, can vouch for that a bit


that is in no way how Oasis sound, nor is it their ethos. same boat as the Foo Fighters for me - safe music.

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:06 PM
ah, so you've only heard wonderwall and/or champagne supernova

i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"

& for what it's worth, i don't like the foo fighters

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:10 PM
i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"



i've listened to practically everything they released on the studio albums by this point, i think i have some sort of authority on "how they sound"

.

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:12 PM
so they don't give a fuck because the first minute of this song isn't structured four-chord pop music?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/GjwRIjrC4io" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:12 PM
ooooooh outside the square right here, Gallaghers.

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:13 PM
OOOOOOH TURN IT UP LOUD BOYS!!

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/oHQL7BoeDbA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:14 PM
Definitely Maybe isn't the worst album in the world. But seriously if you think this band "turned up guitars and banged drums", i'd hasten to say that your musical experience is somewhat limited.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/BJKpUH2kJQg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:14 PM
i wasn't equating not-giving-a-fuck with making avant garde art-jazz or whatever the hell it is you're getting at

i didn't say they were extremely removed from the "songwriting box" either

it's just that their whole approach to the thing was pretty much, from gallagher's mouth, "snorting coke and hitting record," not some laborious radio-minded process

and hearing all their albums, that's just something i did for bands i got into at 14

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:15 PM
it's just that their whole approach to the thing was pretty much, from gallagher's mouth, "snorting coke and hitting record," not some laborious radio-minded process


which is complete bullshit. they have ALWAYS been radio-friendly.

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:15 PM
you mentioned "avant garde art jazz", not me.

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:16 PM
but i guess, you are an authority....

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:18 PM
they have ALWAYS been radio-friendly.

they have, mostly because their favorite music was, honestly

if L & N had grown up on ornette coleman or something it would have been loud saxophones & tom-heavy percussion, they just happened to really like their set of Beatles, Stones, & Kinks' best-ofs

their "not giving a fuck" attitude was more about the kind of booksmart attitude they felt was bein projected by Radiohead & co, a bitter middle-class rebellion thing than any resistance toward actually being played & listened to. if that was the case they would have broken up after album 1, if not sooner

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:21 PM
if L & N had grown up on ornette coleman or something it would have been loud saxophones & tom-heavy percussion, they just happened to really like their set of Beatles, Stones, & Kinks' best-ofs

and?

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:21 PM
if i grew up in an African-American household, chances are i'd listen to nothing but hip hop. what's your fucking point man?

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:22 PM
their "not giving a fuck" attitude was more about the kind of booksmart attitude they felt was bein projected by Radiohead & co, a bitter middle-class rebellion thing than any resistance toward actually being played & listened to. if that was the case they would have broken up after album 1, if not sooner

so they "rebelled" and became a better, more musically superior band than Radiohead? is that what you're saying?

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:27 PM
you mentioned "avant garde art jazz", not me.

because you started making it seem more like a debate about their actual song structures or something, i was just stating what i thought was the obvious - they were just playing noel's songs through turned-up guitars and pounding drums

maybe the drum part subsided a little after Definitely Maybe, since they changed drummers in that instance. maybe "pounding" isn't the best word, but still. there's something reckless about that part of the band at times particularly on stuff like "Fade Away."
but i guess, you are an authority....

when i've heard practically all of their album material? i think i'm an authority to make objective statements on how they sound, yes

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:30 PM
and?

if i grew up in an African-American household, chances are i'd listen to nothing but hip hop. what's your fucking point man?

so they "rebelled" and became a better, more musically superior band than Radiohead? is that what you're saying?

my point was that they were radio-friendly because their favorite bands were some of the most radio-friendly in the history of rock & roll, it wasn't some market ploy. you're saying the popularity element of 'em is a reflection on their shit-giving status or whatever, i'm saying they just like the beatles & other people seemed to like their interpretation of that.

i don't even know how you could get that third thing from what i'd said, though

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:31 PM
i was just stating what i thought was the obvious - they were just playing noel's songs through turned-up guitars and pounding drums


i was just stating what i thought was the obvious - there is nothing special about Oasis, never has been. musically and lyrically unremarkable, safe rock.


when i've heard practically all of their album material? i think i'm an authority to make objective statements on how they sound, yes

i've heard their records too, and you sound a jerk

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:33 PM
my point was that they were radio-friendly because their favorite bands were some of the most radio-friendly in the history of rock & roll, it wasn't some market ploy. you're saying the popularity element of 'em is a reflection on their shit-giving status or whatever, i'm saying they just like the beatles & other people seemed to like their interpretation of that.


no. i said that Oasis have always tried to portray themselves as not giving a fuck, which is completely off base.

their popularity comes from the fact that casual music fans can sing along to their songs at parties, much like a Bon Jovi or a Bryan Adams.

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:35 PM
the comment about hearing all of their albums wasn't a boast, i was just pointing out where i was coming from on that. and honestly, didn't think anyone who'd heard stuff outside of the radio singles/acoustic songs would disagree that oasis were loud.

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:35 PM
"all my people, right here, right now. do you know what i mean? yeah, yeah"

- Bono

mojo
12-28-2014, 08:41 PM
Never loved Oasis (too much of a disappointed/impatient Stone Roses fan for that) but wound up seeing them a few times. When Liam was into it he was utterly captivating, when he wasn’t it was murder. It took Noel going solo to appreciate that he has zero stage presence and charisma without Liam, no matter how dry and hilarious he is in interviews. Couldn’t give less of a fuck about whether they reform but do sincerely wish they’d written more songs like this –

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9I3CwSXhd40

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:41 PM
they've never made a secret of wanting to be the biggest band in the world, or feeling like they were the best

but in terms of what they didn't give a fuck about? people thinking they weren't intricate or arty enough, basically, wasn't fabricated. how they were wasn't an act

I'm Hardcore
12-28-2014, 08:44 PM
they've never made a secret of wanting to be the biggest band in the world, or feeling like they were the best


end of argument, then. dudes totally gave a fuck, always.

slunken
12-28-2014, 08:53 PM
where were u whil we were gettin high

Mals Marola
12-28-2014, 08:54 PM
that wasn't what the attitude was ever directed to, though
it was at bands who actually went out of their way to state that they didn't want "huge followings"
i was disagreeing about the band's approach & their alleged "overproduced tripe," when i feel like - until they actually became big maybe - they were about as straightforward as it gets. what they said is what they did

slunken
12-28-2014, 08:55 PM
until they actually became big maybe

definitely maybe :jimmy:

mojo
12-28-2014, 08:58 PM
end of argument, then. dudes totally gave a fuck, always.

Of course. Always. Especially Noel. He was a working class roadie nearing 30 when Creation signed them and the chance wasn't going to come again. There's a hilarious bit in the book about Creation when, in one of their first meetings, Noel says how much he loves U2 and Alan MacGee is appalled and changes the subject to Big Star. Noel duly affects much enthusiasm for all things Alex Chilton but later conceded he'd never heard of them. Being on the same label as the Mary Chain, Ride, Primal Scream & MBV gave Oasis a crucial launchpad as an indie band (at least in UK) and it obscured who and what they really were and then they were massive and it didn't matter...

Catherine Wheel
12-28-2014, 11:18 PM
Well yes completely, but just like in American 90's rock there's that 70's British Blues influence that I find vulgar

I'm with slunken. There's hardly any blues in 90s American rock outside of Aerosmith and Guns and Roses.

Oasis being somewhat influenced by the Rolling Stones did make them different from most of their Britpop peers.

mojo
12-29-2014, 12:11 AM
I'm with slunken. There's hardly any blues in 90s American rock outside of Aerosmith and Guns and Roses.

Oasis being somewhat influenced by the Rolling Stones did make them different from most of their Britpop peers.

The only Britpop era album that bears a big Stones influence is Primal Scream's Give Out Don't Give Up...to the point of parody in fact.

Catherine Wheel
12-29-2014, 01:20 AM
So Coldplay and Oasis do have something in common. They were never cool bands within the Britpop scene. Both always looked down upon by indie rock fans and hipsters.

I'm Hardcore
12-29-2014, 01:23 AM
and they're both godawful

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 11:24 AM
They really are

mojo
12-29-2014, 11:38 AM
So Coldplay and Oasis do have something in common. They were never cool bands within the Britpop scene. Both always looked down upon by indie rock fans and hipsters.

Britpop was over by 1998.
Coldplay is another era & they were only considered 'indie' for about six months.
Same deal with Snow Patrol - not a Britpop band.
Oasis were not looked down on by the indie crowd until that bloated cokey third record and even then people forgave them because of the love for the first two records.
Just looked at the initial post again and, as others have commented, Pulp are top tier in any language. Common People was the greatest song to emerge from the whole scene IMO.

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 11:40 AM
Pulp sound so much like The Cure. I like them

slunken
12-29-2014, 12:09 PM
I was doing some guitar pedal research and i remember you asking some effect questions obe time so if younwant to sound like smiths or early 17 seconds cure you need a chorus pedal.

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 12:27 PM
I know 17 seconds is all Chorus pedal. It's the only pedal I own.

I learned to play electric guitar with 17 Seconds and a Chorus pedal

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 12:29 PM
In Your House is the first song I learned to play

Best Cure album

Second song I learned was Come as you Are because again I love that chorus effect

slunken
12-29-2014, 02:33 PM
That's a flange fwiw

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 02:38 PM
Which one?

slunken
12-29-2014, 05:45 PM
nirvarna

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 06:11 PM
Are you sure? Everyone I've met plays it with Chorus. Wiki says it's chorus

The exploding boy
12-29-2014, 06:31 PM
Pulp sound so much like The Cure. I like them

I love both bands but what!?

Examples please....

mojo
12-29-2014, 08:39 PM
Pulp sound so much like The Cure. I like them

There's some wonky 80s synths in common but that's all.

In fact they couldn't be more different.

Robert Smith's whole schtick is to ESCAPE suburban banality through the Holy trinity of fantasy, success and exotic literary allusion (A Forest, Jumping Someone Else's Train & Killing an Arab), while Jarvis' schtick is to EMBRACE that same banality, rendering every last excruciating detail and fumbled kiss into art with a capital A.

So, no, don't see the Cure/Pulp comparison much.

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 08:52 PM
I'm not talking about the lyrics. Which is why I say "sound like". I'm not deep enough into Pulp lyrics to comment on them.

The synths, vocal delivery, and song strunctures are where I hear it

Mals Marola
12-29-2014, 08:54 PM
nah even at their most gothiest in the 80s they were rubbin more shoulders with The The than The Cure

cure did "fuck wit" something remotely considerable as britpop for a minute or two though, every now and then (in the 90z mostly)

Elphenor
12-29-2014, 09:10 PM
I'm talking more about Pop Cure than Goth Cure. Pulp do not sound remotely gothy no

mojo
12-29-2014, 11:02 PM
I'm talking more about Pop Cure than Goth Cure. Pulp do not sound remotely gothy no

Fair enough.
Jarvis was the best lyricist of the 90s IMO, as piercing and cinematic as Morrissey at his best but without the cloying self-regard. Take a song like Babies - weird, heartbreaking, specific-but-elusive and utterly personal - I mean who the fuck else writes lyrics/songs remotely like that?

The exploding boy
12-30-2014, 12:46 AM
^

i was gonna state in some thread i dont remember which recently that Cocker was one of the best 90's lyricist but then didn't. I've got the book of his lyrics that was published.

Babies...one of the great one for sure, there's a lot of songs with a similar theme in his work, young nostalgic failed loves or girls being with other guys or both....babies, disco 2000, do you remember the first time? Pink glove....possibly some are about the same girls... Other great lyrics, Bar Italia, Like a friend, mile end, and common people of course. He definitely has a knack for turning very personal lyrics into somehow something universal..or relatable. Not many lyricists can do that. Most who are very relatable tend to also be kinda vague. I think he often achieves that with just a few well placed and delivered lines. Suddenly it makes it seem like you lived the exact same situation even if you didn't really. Or like common people, we've all known slummers. They were maybe not from greece or studied culture at st martin's college, but we've known them.

soniclovenoize
12-31-2014, 09:58 AM
Tier 1: my favorite bands
Tier 2: shit I don't care about
Tier 3: your favorite bands

Great thread CW

Mals Marola
12-31-2014, 01:01 PM
this thread is hilarious because of Spiritualized & who the fuck is "I am Kloot"

wow

slunken
12-31-2014, 09:35 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/THl_znprBUM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>