View Full Version : Mellon Collie Silverfuck. What was the reaction?


BurtSampson
07-18-2012, 02:21 AM
Did people stand there and twiddle their thumbs like they used to do during Gossamer? or did people actually stick around for 40 minutes and listen to Billy yell BABY MY BAAAAAABY? I mean they're cool to listen to through bootlegs, but jesus it's pretty intense shit for a band that was selling out arenas based on a single where a kid rolls around in a tire.

stumpycat
07-18-2012, 03:21 AM
Did people stand there and twiddle their thumbs like they used to do during Gossamer? or did people actually stick around for 40 minutes and listen to Billy yell BABY MY BAAAAAABY? I mean they're cool to listen to through bootlegs, but jesus it's pretty intense shit for a band that was selling out arenas based on a single where a kid rolls around in a tire.
You are forgetting that everything which preceded those performances of Silverfuck (or Transmission, during the Adore era, for that matter) was not a test of patience for the audience as has sometimes been the case in concerts of the more recent past. But yes, deep into encores of the MCIS era there would be some audience clearance (at least during the Dallas 1997 show which culminated in a performance of TAFH after a noticeable swath of the audience allegedly left.)

SlingeroGuitaro
07-18-2012, 03:27 AM
I know several casual fans that didnt get it. They didn't know the original version and certainly didn't care for 45 minutes of riffing on 'she was a fucking whore.'

Shallowed
07-18-2012, 03:37 AM
What are some notable 1996-2000 performances of Silverfuck?

Redbull to thread.

Shallowed
07-18-2012, 03:47 AM
I haven't heard many MCIS era bootlegs, most shows I listen to come from the Pre-Gish to SD eras. Of the Silverfucks I've heard, I can't say I enjoyed them that much. I don't think it was the jammed-out-ness of them, it was probably more the tone of the guitars. They seem really synthetic and not very textured.

Shallowed
07-18-2012, 05:00 AM
I guess the quality of the recording of the bootleg itself plays a big part too. I just listened to the longest version of Silverfuck and there's a lot of BWOOOOO from the bass and the drums, which makes it hard to hear what's actually happening.

At least when they play songs that more or less match that of the album version, your familiarity with the song can fill in what you can't hear properly.

scottytheoneand
07-18-2012, 07:00 AM
an awful lot of people went to those shows with only the hits in their head. I bet that at least half of the people who bought MCIS never listened to it straight through.

but if you watch a lot of old concert footage from the mid 90s people really got into all of the songs. Look at the audience in this one.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/p1Q68zzvKHI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

amoergosum
07-18-2012, 07:13 AM
but if you watch a lot of old concert footage from the mid 90s people really got into all of the songs. Look at the audience in this one.


Look at the guy at 7:37 ...awesome.

ghost-mutt
07-18-2012, 10:20 AM
an awful lot of people went to those shows with only the hits in their head. I bet that at least half of the people who bought MCIS never listened to it straight through.

but if you watch a lot of old concert footage from the mid 90s people really got into all of the songs. Look at the audience in this one.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/p1Q68zzvKHI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

first time i've seen this. it's performances like this that make me wish the band just stayed dead.

BurtSampson
07-18-2012, 10:42 AM
an awful lot of people went to those shows with only the hits in their head. I bet that at least half of the people who bought MCIS never listened to it straight through.

but if you watch a lot of old concert footage from the mid 90s people really got into all of the songs. Look at the audience in this one.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/p1Q68zzvKHI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

god I love how he used to beat the shit out of his guitars.

amoergosum
07-18-2012, 10:51 AM
god I love how he used to beat the shit out of his guitars.

>>> 2:07
Yeah!

amoergosum
07-18-2012, 10:53 AM
an awful lot of people went to those shows with only the hits in their head. I bet that at least half of the people who bought MCIS never listened to it straight through.

but if you watch a lot of old concert footage from the mid 90s people really got into all of the songs. Look at the audience in this one.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/p1Q68zzvKHI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Jimmy.
Legend.

scottytheoneand
07-18-2012, 12:22 PM
I used to come home from concerts like that covered in bruises. I haven't seen an audience move like that in a decade. I don't think that it's just the bands that have changed, though.

I'm kind of glad a lot of that shit doesn't happen anymore. But you can't deny how crazy it used to feel being in the middle of it.

Slurpee
07-18-2012, 03:55 PM
I'm kind of glad a lot of that shit doesn't happen anymore. But you can't deny how crazy it used to feel being in the middle of it.

I'm sure it WILL start again, at some point soon, with some new type of music.

redbull
07-18-2012, 04:12 PM
What are some notable 1996-2000 performances of Silverfuck?

Redbull to thread.


what's up dawgs

I recommend these

http://archive.org/details/SmashingPumpkins1996-02-10.FLAC

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-05-14.vhs2.flac16 (this version has three drummers and is seriously the fucking dopest)
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9N_oweFC4ds" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-07-10.flac16

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-10-05.shn



this is the dallas show in question but its sort of a short and unremarkable silverfuck http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-12-01.flac16


and then there is the infamous vancouver version: http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-01-08.flac16


and then it gets super-far out for the longest two ever (we'll never know about jacksonville until someone find a full recording of it)
http://www.archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-01.flac16
http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-04.flac16

redbull
07-18-2012, 04:14 PM
an awful lot of people went to those shows with only the hits in their head. I bet that at least half of the people who bought MCIS never listened to it straight through.

but if you watch a lot of old concert footage from the mid 90s people really got into all of the songs. Look at the audience in this one.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/p1Q68zzvKHI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


forgot all about this show. incredible performance even with billy's awful 1994 guitar tone

redbull
07-18-2012, 04:18 PM
look at the crowd member getting thrown over the rail at 5:05

Grox
07-18-2012, 04:30 PM
awful 94 tone? wat?

redbull
07-18-2012, 04:34 PM
94 tone sucked bro, worst tone except for early 00 tours...witness the butchered rant versions of I Am One

soniclovenoize
07-18-2012, 04:40 PM
I saw them in September 1996 at the Minneapolis show. I'd say our Silverfuck was 20 minutes long (you can doublecheck on archive.org though) and anywhere between 1/3 to 1/2 of the audience left. Only half of the auditorium stayed for the entire Silverfuck.

As for the 1998 tour, which I again saw in Minneapolis, I can say a similar thing happened during Transmissions. A large majority of the audience was gone by the end of Transmissions.

So to answer your question, yes, this really happened.

josesaladbar
07-18-2012, 05:06 PM
i can hardly remember because the show i saw (Manchester, UK sometime in early 96) some crowd surfing idiot wearing massive army boots caught me in the head and i almost blacked out. What i do remember though was images on the big screen of some of the nasa apollo footage, stage separations and stuff. it was an awesome backdrop

myosis
07-18-2012, 05:21 PM
i wish my ex had not accidentally taped over my vancouver 97 boot.

Ihaguitar
07-18-2012, 05:39 PM
The difference was Silverfuck actually sounds interesting.

Monet LSD
07-18-2012, 06:58 PM
i wish my ex had not accidentally taped over my vancouver 97 boot.

http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-01-08.flac16

myosis
07-18-2012, 07:38 PM
my precious tape.

Shallowed
07-18-2012, 08:44 PM
this is the dallas show in question but its sort of a short and unremarkable silverfuck http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-12-01.flac16


I'm enjoying this one the most so far.

What the fuck is wrong with me?

Shallowed
07-18-2012, 09:38 PM
Which parts are Space Jam? Is it supposed to be the riff that's on Pastichio Medley? If it is, I don't really see the connection. I can't really identify the most identifiable parts of that short clip in any of these extended Silverfucks. The chuggy picking of the single bass note, the riff that is simply alternating between two power chords in a particular rhythmic pattern or the driving beat. Maybe I keep missing it because what we know of "Space Jam" is only a few seconds long, but when the band play live they wank out in whatever formless direction they feel like.

redbreegull
07-18-2012, 10:50 PM
I love the 94 tone :(

redbull
07-19-2012, 01:15 AM
Which parts are Space Jam? Is it supposed to be the riff that's on Pastichio Medley? If it is, I don't really see the connection. I can't really identify the most identifiable parts of that short clip in any of these extended Silverfucks. The chuggy picking of the single bass note, the riff that is simply alternating between two power chords in a particular rhythmic pattern or the driving beat. Maybe I keep missing it because what we know of "Space Jam" is only a few seconds long, but when the band play live they wank out in whatever formless direction they feel like.


Space Jam is the ascending triplet riff they play during the fast, they play a full version of the song with the "you gotta suck it up" choruses in the january and february 97 versions

it comes in around 14:21 on the vancouver show

stumpycat
07-19-2012, 02:03 AM
Silverfuck was most awesome when paired with Jackboot. That was a fucking awesome power-jam, not just 20 more minutes of random shit.

BurtSampson
07-19-2012, 06:16 PM
94 tone sucked bro, worst tone except for early 00 tours...witness the butchered rant versions of I Am One

what's wrong with the 1994 tone?

SlingeroGuitaro
07-19-2012, 09:31 PM
I always thought it was a little too muddy

BurtSampson
07-20-2012, 04:08 PM
I always thought it was a little too muddy

he did use a shit load of reverb, I guess. i just listened to a Lollapalooza show and James' little screaming freakouts he would do at the end of Silverfuck made me realize that if he'd have left and started a screamo band it'd been the best thing ever.

Grox
07-20-2012, 04:28 PM
what? i dont think they ever used reverb on their live guitars. do you know what reverb is

redbull
07-20-2012, 05:17 PM
i find it way too metallic and rough - its like soundgarden covering SP

Grox
07-20-2012, 05:37 PM
and also....whats wrong with the fast/rant version of I Am One? it's kinda badass

redbull
07-20-2012, 05:38 PM
i dunno, except for one or two versions, I just personally don't like it

Grox
07-20-2012, 05:50 PM
the second night at Downing Stadium is pretty sweet they open with it

Grox
07-20-2012, 05:50 PM
<object width="420" height="315"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/GxGAym6mTh8?version=3&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/GxGAym6mTh8?version=3&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="420" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

redbull
07-20-2012, 06:00 PM
my favorite is the night before where billy and the guy in the crowd argue about phil sims: http://archive.org/details/tsp1994-08-05.patched.flac16

diss session at 6:15: i'm not the best dresser, but tank tops are out dude

Shallowed
07-21-2012, 01:22 AM
Haha, I tend to listen to the boots of shows where there was a tense atmosphere or there's rough hecklers, and that is one of them.

Shallowed
07-21-2012, 01:35 AM
Yeah? FUCK YOU TOO, YOU FUCK!

BurtSampson
07-21-2012, 03:01 AM
my favorite is the night before where billy and the guy in the crowd argue about phil sims: http://archive.org/details/tsp1994-08-05.patched.flac16

diss session at 6:15: i'm not the best dresser, but tank tops are out dude

this is one of my favorite boots ever. it feels so fucking tense the whole time. I don't know what the deal with the Lollapalooza tour was, but goddamn was Billy ever standoffish. and yeah, I love 1994 I Am One, even though I never understood the point of the rants. they're so silly and pretentious.

BurtSampson
07-21-2012, 03:08 AM
Yeah? FUCK YOU TOO, YOU FUCK!

I DON'T TAKE SHIT FROM NO ONE. ESPECIALLY NOT SOMEONE IN A TANK TOP AND A MUSTACHE.

Shallowed
08-01-2013, 03:08 AM
I decided to listen to every MCIS live tour version of Silverfuck in chronological order. I'm up to 1996/04/06.

So far I'm liking the March/April 1996 versions, where the song is started with Billy singing acapella, followed by the other parts joining in. The riffs make more sense musically and it goes on to have a better structure and order.

The quieter bits with the looper pedal wanking still rubs me the wrong way, especially when they end the song without any resolution.

The most enjoyable thing about listening to these is hearing the evolution of the jam, what parts they keep and what parts they kept and which parts they altered. The thing that bothered me the most was not being familiar with the jam, but there is a structure that is becoming apparent, despite it being very loose.

BlackWings
08-01-2013, 03:36 AM
what's up dawgs

I recommend these

http://archive.org/details/SmashingPumpkins1996-02-10.FLAC

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-05-14.vhs2.flac16 (this version has three drummers and is seriously the fucking dopest)
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9N_oweFC4ds" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-07-10.flac16

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-10-05.shn




this is the dallas show in question but its sort of a short and unremarkable silverfuck http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-12-01.flac16


and then there is the infamous vancouver version: http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-01-08.flac16


and then it gets super-far out for the longest two ever (we'll never know about jacksonville until someone find a full recording of it)
http://www.archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-01.flac16
http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-04.flac16


HAHA! That version with Richard Patrick is fuckin hilarious and also slightly amazing.:blush:

emotionalfriend
08-01-2013, 02:12 PM
The MCIS version of Silverfuck I saw was 9/1/96 in Kansas City (a recording of this show still hasn't surfaced, other than a completely unlistenable microcassette(!) recording). There seemed to be a good amount of people that had left by the time it was over. It didn't help that they played TAFH leading up to Silverfuck. No one had a clue as to what that was, since it was only the second time it was played, and the Thirty-three single had yet to be released.

Adult Head
08-01-2013, 03:17 PM
this is one of my favorite boots ever. it feels so fucking tense the whole time. I don't know what the deal with the Lollapalooza tour was, but goddamn was Billy ever standoffish. and yeah, I love 1994 I Am One, even though I never understood the point of the rants. they're so silly and pretentious.

he still mad about high school

T&T
08-01-2013, 06:42 PM
The most enjoyable thing about listening to these is hearing the evolution of the jam, what parts they keep and what parts they kept and ....
that distinction is pretty interesting.

redbull
08-02-2013, 12:13 AM
The MCIS version of Silverfuck I saw was 9/1/96 in Kansas City (a recording of this show still hasn't surfaced, other than a completely unlistenable microcassette(!) recording). There seemed to be a good amount of people that had left by the time it was over. It didn't help that they played TAFH leading up to Silverfuck. No one had a clue as to what that was, since it was only the second time it was played, and the Thirty-three single had yet to be released.

if you have that recording please upload it. been trying to track it down for years

Bread Regal
08-02-2013, 12:28 AM
the '94 guitar tone is way too much pre-amp distortion, not enough post-amp. the beauty of siamese dream's sound comes from the speakers being pushed to their limits, and billy said himself in those confessions that the big muffs just didn't work live as a primary overdrive. they went with the ADA-MP1's for a distortion unit, but it just didn't work.

slunken
08-02-2013, 12:43 AM
the '94 guitar tone is way too much pre-amp distortion, not enough post-amp. the beauty of siamese dream's sound comes from the speakers being pushed to their limits, and billy said himself in those confessions that the big muffs just didn't work live as a primary overdrive. they went with the ADA-MP1's for a distortion unit, but it just didn't work.

here's the quote from a confesssion tagging that explanation from 1992 (which is innaccurate. spfc dates the triclops sessions from dec 92 to march of 93 - the month they also started playing that setup live):

ecause we have been cooped up for so long, the shows go fairly well energetically but are a bit of a train wreck musically…without forethought, we have transferred our normal practice set-ups to the stage, which means we are using the Big Muff fuzz pedals live…this proves to be a fatal mistake, because without the density of a small room around us, our guitars sound very thin and undefined rendering us sloppy and loose…jumpy nerves add to muddled arrangements, missed opportunities, and to top it all off, most of the songs do not have any lyrics…I skate by by singing my normal in-practice pig-latin, which to someone not paying much attention sounds relatively close to the actual English language…

and shortly before it is another one quoting 1992 as the year they got turned onto the big muff from catherine.

Bread Regal
08-02-2013, 01:06 AM
exactly.

i mean, the live solos from that era are fuckin incredible really, and i think the thin MP1 works great if you're soloing. It just cuts right through everything else. but for the rhythm parts that really needed that buzz-y drone-y tone, it either sucked, or they just weren't using them right. listen to any recording of hummer from that era and you will see what i mean.

BurtSampson
08-02-2013, 04:03 PM
I decided to listen to every MCIS live tour version of Silverfuck in chronological order. I'm up to 1996/04/06.

So far I'm liking the March/April 1996 versions, where the song is started with Billy singing acapella, followed by the other parts joining in. The riffs make more sense musically and it goes on to have a better structure and order.

The quieter bits with the looper pedal wanking still rubs me the wrong way, especially when they end the song without any resolution.

The most enjoyable thing about listening to these is hearing the evolution of the jam, what parts they keep and what parts they kept and which parts they altered. The thing that bothered me the most was not being familiar with the jam, but there is a structure that is becoming apparent, despite it being very loose.

Listening to the two versions from the TAFH reissue makes me want to do this as well. It's really interesting to see how it changed just between the time of those two. The 30+ minute one in Landover is a little much I think, though, because it just ends up falling apart about 22 minutes in and like you said, never reaches a resolution.

The 1997 ones with Space Jam and Bury Me were fucking tight though

stumpycat
08-02-2013, 11:41 PM
exactly.

i mean, the live solos from that era are fuckin incredible really, and i think the thin MP1 works great if you're soloing. It just cuts right through everything else. but for the rhythm parts that really needed that buzz-y drone-y tone, it either sucked, or they just weren't using them right. listen to any recording of hummer from that era and you will see what i mean.
Mmm-hmm. I agree 100%. Even playing around with trying to approximate the SD tone, in reality it always seems like a compromise between the nice warm buzz-drone and actually forming notes with individual distinction. What makes the power chord rhythms sound nice definitely does not make leads or any soloing effort especially sound very nice.

I don't like the 1994 tone either, but I'd describe it as sort of harsh/sharp and tending too much towards the high frequency end of the spectrum. By the MCIS tour they had really improved a lot in gear choices and settings to approximate the warm, bottom-heavy buzz-drone in a large live setting.

dustrock
08-03-2013, 12:17 AM
I'd say half the crowd left in Vancouver but they always have shitty crowds.

Gotta say it was a little much for me. I really enjoyed listening to the Landover Silverfuck but probably will never do so again.

Shallowed
08-04-2013, 03:13 AM
They seem to get a lot better a little while after Matt joined the band.

1996-09-22 for instance

edit: actually every one from that date onwards has been good.

Shallowed
08-05-2013, 08:00 AM
November 1996 wasn't a very good month but it gets better again towards the end.

1996-12-01 has some pretty Gossamer-esque vibes.

cookieshoes
08-05-2013, 11:52 AM
exactly.

i mean, the live solos from that era are fuckin incredible really, and i think the thin MP1 works great if you're soloing. It just cuts right through everything else. but for the rhythm parts that really needed that buzz-y drone-y tone, it either sucked, or they just weren't using them right. listen to any recording of hummer from that era and you will see what i mean.

But they didn't use the ADA MP-1 for any SD touring. They were using the Marshall JMP-1, which is the same unit that was also used to record and tour MCIS. I think it's easy to see why that unit stuck around as long as it did, as it has numerous toneshaping options which you can then save as presets. For live touring in 1993, Billy had the JMP-1 set up with all of the different sounds he needed to approximate the album live, whereas the ADA MP-1 was old news, and the Big Muff was a one-trick pony that had a scooped midrange, which is where all of those "Big Muffs get lost in the mix" comments usually come from.

I think what some don't like about the 1994 Pumpkins live sound is really due to the difference in how the various PA Systems were handled by the sound engineers from tour to tour. Listen to all of the available soundboard recordings available from August 1993->Lollapalooza (for Lolla use the soundtrack from the Vieuphoria bonus video), and you can hear that Billy's tone is more or less indistinguishable. It's the audience recordings which reveal that the band's sound was more bottom heavy or had more/less midrange to it during this tour or that, and for Summer 1994 I'd say that had mostly to do with the outdoor venues and the way in which the Lolla sound engineers treated the instrumentation. Sure, Billy likely tweaked his presets on his preamp and effects from tour to tour, but any change in sound on his end wasn't really that drastic, imo.

mcwheels
08-07-2013, 08:47 PM
I think jimmy's drumming is the reason to listen to these, although matt wasn't no slouch. billy could either shred pretty insanely or just make obnoxious noise, depending on the night. I was pretty impressed with the version i heard in san francisco at the tibet concert, and in san jose on 12-16-96 (wish there were good recordings of these.) I always liked the jackboot end jam from 93.

Rider
08-07-2013, 09:06 PM
my favorite is the night before where billy and the guy in the crowd argue about phil sims: http://archive.org/details/tsp1994-08-05.patched.flac16

diss session at 6:15: i'm not the best dresser, but tank tops are out dude


I was at that show Billy almost started a riot the crowd was so fucking pissed at him.

stumpycat
08-08-2013, 02:18 AM
I was at that show Billy almost started a riot the crowd was so fucking pissed at him.
WTF was his problem? What was he even going on about like a petulant 15 year old turd having a temper tantrum? The show sounds horrible. Is there a video of this? I want to SEE it.

Shallowed
08-08-2013, 05:32 AM
Well, that's it for the Mellon Collie Silverfucks.

On to Transmission.

Rider
08-08-2013, 08:30 AM
WTF was his problem? What was he even going on about like a petulant 15 year old turd having a temper tantrum? The show sounds horrible. Is there a video of this? I want to SEE it.

I'll just tell the story of the entire day and things people who were not there don't know.

It was a really hot dry summer that year in NYC. I don't think it had rained for weeks. The show was on Randals Island which is a pain in the ass to get to and Downing Stadium is a really nice sounding name for what is basically giant concrete horseshoe next to a mental asylum and surrounded by training grounds for the various NYC services (police, fire,sanitation).

It was dry,hot, and dusty. The concrete horsehoe has no facilities, no where to even get a sip of water or wash up. There were very few vendors there and the ones who were there were charging insane prices. The Mr Softee Truck would learn his lesson the hard way.

Despite all this the day is going fine. Then the rains come, it pours for an hour. The giant concrete horseshoe has no shelter, and no one was prepared for rain. This would have been fine though The thing that really got us all was the temperature dropped about 20 degrees after the storm.

A wet cold miserable crowd now finds out there will be no set by Nick Cave because of the weather. P-funk takes the stage. At this point I get in line in front of the dozen or so portable toilettea. To my horror we find the rain has filled them and there is now raw sewage in the giant concrete horseshoe.

Despite this the crowd picks up and enjoys the rest of the day.

Now this is the most important detail that people miss about the shows that summer and why TSP had so many problems. The Bestie Boys played before them, they were the hottest band that summer and they killed, it was fucking amazing and at this show was a homecoming for them on top of the fact that they were huge that summer. The Bestie Boy have just despite the elements put on one of the greatest sets I have or will ever see.

So now it's dark and it's getting really fucking cold. We just witnessed one of the best sets ever. C Love comes out, most of the crowd is kind of blown away but there are always those idiots in a crowd who would heckle her.

Now The Pumpkins come out. Instead of playing a blistering set to blow the crowd away we get what you hear. The wind is picking up, we are all wet and cold, standing in mud and shit. No one and I mean no was into Billys little jam session and when Billy can't have his way he gets pissy, instead of taking that negative energy and putting it into a blistering set he just makes everyone fucking miserable. Everyone hated it, my friend was begging me to leave, it just fucking sucked.

The Mr Softee truck had been pissing people off all day long charging insane prices for ice cream and dumping his trash on the ground out the window of the truck. During The Pumpkins set he starts cleaning the truck and and now he is actually throwing food away and people go fucking nuts. They start throwing trash at the truck and group of guys start trying to flip the truck..

Hands down the worst set I have ever seen

BurtSampson
08-08-2013, 05:38 PM
Well, that's it for the Mellon Collie Silverfucks.

On to Transmission.

favorite Silverfuck of all?

Shallowed
08-08-2013, 07:27 PM
I can't name one particular one right now, but I do remember there were a few good ones around April, September and November 1996.

January and February 1997 had some great and some meh Silverfucks.

I remember the last two the did were really good.

http://www.archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-04.flac16
http://www.archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-05.flac16

stumpycat
08-09-2013, 02:50 AM
I'll just tell the story of the entire day and things people who were not there don't know.



Cool [actual] story bro.
I actually looked this place up to get a sense of the geography after I posted and got the immediate impression it was probably a shit hole on that detail alone. It's also really stupid to fuck with NY people, they'll throw it right back at you.

Adult Head
08-15-2013, 11:15 PM
what's up dawgs

I recommend these

http://archive.org/details/SmashingPumpkins1996-02-10.FLAC

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-05-14.vhs2.flac16 (this version has three drummers and is seriously the fucking dopest)
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9N_oweFC4ds" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-07-10.flac16

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-10-05.shn



this is the dallas show in question but its sort of a short and unremarkable silverfuck http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-12-01.flac16


and then there is the infamous vancouver version: http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-01-08.flac16


and then it gets super-far out for the longest two ever (we'll never know about jacksonville until someone find a full recording of it)
http://www.archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-01.flac16
http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-04.flac16

this is one of the best posts in the history of the board, btw

Adult Head
08-15-2013, 11:34 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9N_oweFC4ds" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



@2:44 fuuuuuk yessss give me more

BumbleBeeMouth
08-18-2013, 10:09 AM
what's up dawgs

I recommend these

http://archive.org/details/SmashingPumpkins1996-02-10.FLAC

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-05-14.vhs2.flac16 (this version has three drummers and is seriously the fucking dopest)
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9N_oweFC4ds" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-07-10.flac16

http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-10-05.shn



this is the dallas show in question but its sort of a short and unremarkable silverfuck http://archive.org/details/tsp1996-12-01.flac16


and then there is the infamous vancouver version: http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-01-08.flac16


and then it gets super-far out for the longest two ever (we'll never know about jacksonville until someone find a full recording of it)
http://www.archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-01.flac16
http://archive.org/details/tsp1997-02-04.flac16

fuck, that's incredible

emotionalfriend
08-18-2013, 06:40 PM
if you have that recording please upload it. been trying to track it down for years

I've looked all over for it, but can't seem to find it. It was on cassette, and was probably lost when I recently moved along with my other cassettes. It seriously was unlistenable, though. Warbly as fuck, sounded like it was recorded underwater. Possibly the worst sounding recording of a show I've ever heard. I've been trying to track down an alternate source as well, but that has been impossible (as I'm sure you know).

redbull
08-18-2013, 08:55 PM
I've looked all over for it, but can't seem to find it. It was on cassette, and was probably lost when I recently moved along with my other cassettes. It seriously was unlistenable, though. Warbly as fuck, sounded like it was recorded underwater. Possibly the worst sounding recording of a show I've ever heard. I've been trying to track down an alternate source as well, but that has been impossible (as I'm sure you know).

bummer..i'll take anything from it at this point, though. if you ever happen to run across the tape, i'd be happy to get it transferred for you

slunken
09-23-2013, 10:40 PM
the '94 guitar tone is way too much pre-amp distortion, not enough post-amp. the beauty of siamese dream's sound comes from the speakers being pushed to their limits, and billy said himself in those confessions that the big muffs just didn't work live as a primary overdrive. they went with the ADA-MP1's for a distortion unit, but it just didn't work.


here's the quote from a confesssion tagging that explanation from 1992 (which is innaccurate. spfc dates the triclops sessions from dec 92 to march of 93 - the month they also started playing that setup live):
ecause we have been cooped up for so long, the shows go fairly well energetically but are a bit of a train wreck musically…without forethought, we have transferred our normal practice set-ups to the stage, which means we are using the Big Muff fuzz pedals live…this proves to be a fatal mistake, because without the density of a small room around us, our guitars sound very thin and undefined rendering us sloppy and loose…jumpy nerves add to muddled arrangements, missed opportunities, and to top it all off, most of the songs do not have any lyrics…I skate by by singing my normal in-practice pig-latin, which to someone not paying much attention sounds relatively close to the actual English language…


and shortly before it is another one quoting 1992 as the year they got turned onto the big muff from catherine.

<b>

came across this overlooked point browsing old amsp threads:

Another key element of Billy's sound, post-Gish, were the Fender Lace
> > Sensor pickups he installed on his favorite strats. *First it was just
> > a "red" one in the bridge, which is where he gets that
> > thinned-but-sustaining-all-day, trebly solo sound of his. *That was for
> > Siamese Dream. *Then, just before making Mellon Collie he bought a
> > "blue" one for the neck (which is why his rhythm parts and cording got
> > a lot thicker and bassier-- he loved the bottom end of blue lace
> > sensors), and a "silver" one for the middle (he used it for clean
> > sounds).
> >
>
> huh?? Really do your homework here - the lace sensor set was Always red,
> silver, blue. i'm also 90% sure that these were already in use when Gish
> was made.
Nope. *Look at any picture of him from the Gish era. *You'll see what
appear to be three stock strat pickups there. *Even pics of him playing 
Lollapalooza show very clearly that there's only one lace sensor in his
guitar, it's the red one in the bridge. *He liked it so much he added
the other two later. *I always thought the one lace sensor looked odd
besides the traditional pickups.

gradual pickup conversion

Ram27
09-23-2013, 11:02 PM
wow this is boring

slunken
09-23-2013, 11:13 PM
i would also like to take this time to point out that the internet has not changed one iota since 1994.

slunken
09-23-2013, 11:14 PM
except now there is youtube that is nice

cookieshoes
09-24-2013, 03:26 AM
<b>
gradual pickup conversion

Billy's pickups were always the same Lace Sensors (Blue in the neck, Silver in the middle, Red in the bridge), from August 1992. His bat strat and other touring guitars from the era still have those pickups in them. The only difference in appearance is that some of the pickups have white covers and some have black.

June 1992 - Gish Strat stolen. That Strat had single coil pickups.
July 1992 at the Metro - Billy used his backup guitars, which had single coil pickups.
August 1992 - Sunburst 57 reissue Strat with Lace Sensor Blue-Silver-Red pickups debuted. This guitar would become the bat strat.

From there on, apart from one-off guitars, all of his Strats would get the pickups swapped to have the same combination of Lace Sensors.

dodoz
04-02-2014, 08:30 PM
I saw the Pumpkins on this tour (Lyon, France, 4/27/96) and I was totally blown away by this "Silverfuck". I loved it, and I thought it was very bold of a band touring arenas at this point. As some of you pointed out, most people were only aware of "Mellon Collie" (especially in France where "Siamese Dream" didn't sell much at the time) and most came for "Bullet" that got radio airplay...

I was at the barrier, facing James and "Silverfuck" was at the same time very noisy - I vividly remember those waves of delay, the "baby, my baby, BABY... BABY... BABY...." "yelling at me", so to speak, and also a "comedown" in the show, a breather, as people in the pit stopped moshing at this point. It was unexpected, and also very psychedelic as you all know, judging from the videos of the tour (I loved the footage on the screen).
I also remember people around me with hands to their ears, but I don't know if part of the audience left during this song - being in the front row, I was looking at the stage, nothing else, I couldn't care less about what happened behind me...
I remember asking a friend on the way back "how long did "Silverfuck" last?" - it seemed so long, it's hard to tell when you're there if it's 15 minutes or 30...(the audience recording I found 6 years later gave it away : 21 minutes that night :) ).

The french magazine Rock Sound came out a while later and mentioned the show (it was more a mention than a proper review) and they talked about "la trop longue digression pink floydienne" - the overlong pink floydian digression, obviously referring to "Silverfuck".

I haven't heard a version of "Silverfuck" where people just started booing...did it ever happen ?

Unforgettable for me...and to this day, still the best show I ever attended. I saw "Billy's band" last year and it was so incredibly sad - but there's no point even comparing those two eras.

dodoz
04-27-2014, 11:57 AM
A'ight...No one cares but I've just realized that the show I attended was 18 years ago today...Boy, I still remember the show like it was yesterday.

Fonzie
04-28-2014, 03:26 AM
i find it way too metallic and rough - its like soundgarden covering SP

best thing ever?

chucklescrotum
04-28-2014, 05:48 AM
WTF was his problem? What was he even going on about like a petulant 15 year old turd having a temper tantrum? The show sounds horrible. Is there a video of this? I want to SEE it.

Bill's a dirty fat piece of shit. What do you expect? :love:

Ram27
07-25-2014, 09:23 PM
The fucking echo effect ruins half the jam. Well, either that or Melvoin warbling on the other drum kit.

smashingjj
07-26-2014, 07:20 PM
The reaction was something among the lines of

I hate to bring bad news but I was talking with people in the Smashing Pumpkins camp, and everyone is VERY PISSED OFF.

Appears this definitely wasn't some sort of gift that just recently leaked out, and SP is not in the business in looking the other way when it comes to "STOLEN TRACKS".

they are gonna go after the leaker(s) with lawyers along with using private investigators and cash rewards.

Ram27
07-26-2014, 07:35 PM
xyu

slunken
07-26-2014, 07:39 PM
"STOLEN TRACKS"

slunken
07-26-2014, 07:40 PM
WANTED

"STOLEN TRACKS"

CASH REWARD FOR MP3

Gooch
07-27-2014, 12:00 AM
I was at the continental airlines nj show in 96. Towards the end of the show they played tafh which no one knew, and people started leaving. Then they played silverfuck and there were streams of people leaving in droves like as if they turned the lights on, show over. Billy commented something about yeah the MTV crowd is leaving. I went with my cousin who was ten years older and a casual fan only, and he was pissed off that billy would play a long song that he never heard before and then get annoyed when people left during it. Me, I thought it was the greatest. I was surprised at the energy billy had during silverfuck after playing a whole show. It wuz awesome.

Ram27
07-27-2014, 04:28 PM
I'd listen to an hour long Silverfuck with the golden era lineup

Or hell even two or three hours.

Just play Silverfuck

chucklescrotum
07-27-2014, 06:01 PM
For me it's still amazing that the terrible song United States made it on the album instead of Gossamer.. they could have put a 20 minute version of Gossamer on there and it would have rocked

pavementtune
07-27-2014, 07:56 PM
They seem to get a lot better a little while after Matt joined the band.

1996-09-22 for instance

edit: actually every one from that date onwards has been good.

Toronto 1996-09-14


<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/U3Ap32ZBUXg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/nmH-TIaGaoA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



"we are, and have been, and will always be... the Smashing Pumpkins"

Ram27
07-27-2014, 08:04 PM
The one section

I put into a box underneath my bed
I put her in a box and this is what she said
I put her in a box and she lost our head
You're a whore and you always were
You wanted more didn't you yeah


, accompanied with the musical buildup, is fucking gold.

Shallowed
07-27-2014, 09:37 PM
Iwonder if this was just a rehearsed rant that he would make every night.

It was, and he did.

Ram27
12-18-2014, 10:49 PM
From Billy's AMA:

Um, back in the day, with SP, we felt we never had a song that was good enough to finish the show. So we started this idea of a song called "Silverfuck," but the song would always change, so in essence, we would never know where the song was going, nor would the audience, so over time we developed different themes and feelings to create what is in essence a living song.

If anything I like it better after hearing the jam around 100 times and knowing the structure

BurtSampson
10-11-2016, 01:14 PM
listening to some of these 1997 Silverfucks just proves to me that Matt was the only SP drummer that could hold his own vs Jimmy.

Brisk
10-15-2016, 04:36 PM
Jimmy.
Legend.

What is this video?!

crabshack
10-15-2016, 09:38 PM
That's not a video it's a quote from another poster

Brisk
10-16-2016, 07:44 AM
That's not a video it's a quote from another poster

What was the video that everyone was referring to on the first page?

BurtSampson
10-16-2016, 05:08 PM
it was this

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/dOjpDMz0D6w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Brisk
10-18-2016, 06:39 PM
Toronto 1996-09-14


<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/U3Ap32ZBUXg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/nmH-TIaGaoA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



"we are, and have been, and will always be... the Smashing Pumpkins"

When does he say that?

Grox
10-18-2016, 07:26 PM
.

Brisk
10-21-2016, 08:22 AM
That wailing solo/jam at the end after the bury me tag of the Vancouver show is brilliant. Any other versions like this?

fanfan
10-22-2016, 10:24 AM
Did people stand there and twiddle their thumbs like they used to do during Gossamer? or did people actually stick around for 40 minutes and listen to Billy yell BABY MY BAAAAAABY?
I only experienced Gossamer live once and I was diving into it, totally took me with it, I love that he doesn't stick to the short formats but still goes where he just wants to go.

FoolofaTook
10-23-2016, 05:55 PM
That's not a video it's a quote from another poster

BURN! YOU OWNED DAT BITCH!

FoolofaTook
10-23-2016, 06:00 PM
What was the video that everyone was referring to on the first page?

Too late now. You shouldn't have fucked up the first time. Now you'll never know.

Go away. Nobody likes you. Go cry in a corner and hate yourself.

Brisk
10-25-2016, 02:00 PM
ok can we get back to finding me badass solos like the silverfuck from 97 GM?

Mals Marola
10-25-2016, 02:14 PM
those were old days, we've moved on

everyone has jobs, a kid, & "One for All" now

Voice Implodes
10-30-2016, 05:35 AM
I have it somewhere.

I was in attendance for the Vancouver show that became the legendary bootleg. Audience was INTO Space Jam and Silverfuck. Still one of the best concerts I have ever been to out of hundreds.