View Full Version : How does Billy compare to Josh Homme as a guitarist?


Catherine Wheel
11-11-2011, 10:06 AM
Who is more proficient? Who is more creative with guitar? To me Josh is the only person from that generation that can really come close to Billy in talent as a guitarist. He always impresses me.

supermaid
11-11-2011, 12:23 PM
billy

supermaid
11-11-2011, 12:23 PM
just joshing, it's josh

supermaid
11-11-2011, 12:24 PM
buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo


josh joshing josh joshers joshed joshes josh

billy billied blerbleblerbleblerble

redbreegull
11-11-2011, 12:35 PM
Catherine Wheel, you are insane dude. You make the most random comparisons imaginable

Billy is a LOT better.

Catherine Wheel
11-11-2011, 12:38 PM
How is it random? I mean they both play hard rock and psychedelic influenced alternative rock. They are both influenced by Zeppelin and Sabbath but they have both developed their own style. I fail to see how it's a bad comparison.

samuel redman
11-11-2011, 12:56 PM
one thing that will always be there about billy is his ability to play and understand the guitar

definitely a guitar god type player

Catherine Wheel
11-11-2011, 01:03 PM
http://www.customasapblog.com/the-best-modern-guitarists

Although honestly I think the description of Josh's playing sells him short

redbreegull
11-11-2011, 01:11 PM
Yeah, Billy is one of the most underrated guitarists.

-left handed dude who taught himself to play right handed
-learned by ear, claims to have acquired his lead skills from a book
-can play in a vast array of styles and brings uniqueness to each one (not like most hard rock guitarists, whose soft songs sound like heavy songs without the energy)
-expanded guitar distortion density to a level probably not reached by any other rock band on studio recordings
-hands down developed the best use of feedback of any rock guitarist
-has an instantly recognizable style... naturally brings a feeling to the instrument which is not really possible to imitate
-despite the decline of his songwriting and ability to produce his music, his guitar skill has never ebbed. He can be playing the shittiest Teargarden song but if he sticks a solo in the middle, it will sound like sex no matter what

redbreegull
11-11-2011, 01:12 PM
http://www.customasapblog.com/the-best-modern-guitarists

Matt Bellamy are you fucking kidding me

Billy Corgan is easily far, far beyond those other four people, but Bellamy isn't even notable. I thought the list said "top 5" not "top 700"

To me, the only one that really comes close in terms of well-rounded uniqueness, inventiveness, technical skill and feeling is Johnny Greenwood. There are a lot of other notable modern guitarists (by modern I mean post-1970s and 80s hair metal which is where most people stop counting guitar heroes), but none of those guys on that list are too amazing except Frusciante. I'm thinking Kim Thayil, Mark Kozelek, Nels Cline, Kevin Shields, Thurston Moore, J. Mascis to start.

Catherine Wheel
11-11-2011, 01:20 PM
I think QOTSA's Rated R deserves to be seen in a closer light to Siamese Dream. I'm not going to say it's as good as Siamese Dream but it definitely changed my whole perspective on rock. It's that type of album.

soniclovenoize
11-11-2011, 02:04 PM
(not like most hard rock guitarists, whose soft songs sound like heavy songs without the energy)

lol

killtrocity
11-11-2011, 02:26 PM
Matt Bellamy are you fucking kidding me


Yeah really... :erm:

People talk about his voice, not his guitar ability

houseofglass11
11-11-2011, 02:28 PM
Josh Homeboy and Queens of the Date Rape/Frat Age have nothing on Billy or SP.

And Frusciante, Bellamy, Brent Hinds (who?)...really? Those guys are OK, but Billy was far more of a sonic innovator and a much more talented guitarist.

Frusciante could barely play a barre chord properly back in the day when he was heroin'd up. And when he came back around he was nowhere near as good as when he first started with RHCP, he lost all his chops.

Bellamy...the heavy metal Radiohead with some Queen pillaging thrown in. boring.

houseofglass11
11-11-2011, 02:30 PM
I think QOTSA's Rated R deserves to be seen in a closer light to Siamese Dream. I'm not going to say it's as good as Siamese Dream but it definitely changed my whole perspective on rock. It's that type of album.

Are you serious? I bought that album when it came out and my opinion on it hasn't changed. It's not that great. Tinny muddy sounding guitars and mediocre songs. I'd rather listen to Black Sabbath than some band doing a piss poor impersonation of them.

scottytheoneand
11-11-2011, 02:35 PM
of all the people in the world...Josh Homme? Seriously?

Homme is OK, but billy is in a whole other league of guitar players. Jeff is a better player.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/I8aTgDhZrxU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

redbreegull
11-11-2011, 02:41 PM
I like Queens of the Stone Age, but Rated R is not a Siamese Dream type album. Listen to the sonic difference between Disarm and Silverfuck. The dynamics of Rated R pale by comparison. Homme isn't a bad guitarist but is better compared to someone like Dave Grohl than Billy Corgan, who is basically a god of the instrument.

Catherine Wheel
11-11-2011, 03:04 PM
You think he's only as good as Grohl? That's almost an insult. I never saw him as being that mediocre. Surely he's a bit more interesting than that.

redbreegull
11-11-2011, 03:09 PM
I'm being hyperbolic, but he's just not in the same league as Corgan.

redbreegull
11-11-2011, 03:13 PM
it's like asking who is the better drummer jimmy chamberlin or matt cameron

redbreegull
11-11-2011, 04:21 PM
no he isn't. Jeff fucking sucks. you'd have to be a retard to think jeff could even be half as good.


Billy definitely sucks now where as Josh does not. TMV was fucking amazing live I recommend everyone to check them out when they tour again.

Really what it comes down to is preference. Billy was without a doubt a guitar god for about 5 years. 90-95

Kyuss and QOTSA are fucking badass though.

Billy does have more slower songs and has an array of many styles, not so much anymore though. Josh normally plays hard rock, but is also very unique and adventurous with his styles of music today.

Billy was rock god, but not anymore. I'd rank Josh higher than billy at this moment in time.


In the long run Billy has been a better guitarist than Josh. His soloing and creativity in the early 90's was unmatched and incredible. I think he's burnt out now and just going through the motions. Josh has more to bring to the table and is still improving and being more daring in his music.

Billy's lead guitar work isn't really any less awe-inspiring now than in 1993. Maybe you disagree, but I really think that despite the bad songs and bad production, he's just a motherfucker on the guitar. The solo on Starla from this tour floors me as much as any of his lead work in the past. If anything, he kind of lost his way in boring metal/shred lead work over the past few years but got his guitar focus back together for this tour.

Shallowed
11-11-2011, 04:40 PM
Billy is certainly more dynamic in tone and style, but most of Josh's riffs are heavier and meaner sounding than everything Billy's done, Tales of a Scorched Earth and X.Y.U. aside.

applepwnz
11-11-2011, 06:41 PM
I've heard of Billy, that's a major point he has in my book over that other fellow

Dogfighter28
11-11-2011, 07:16 PM
Billy is very tasteful and he excels at songcraft when it comes to guitar. However, he sticks mainly to standard pentatonic structures and he's not really advancing the instrument or anything. I think he gets a LITTLE too much credit from SP fans and a LITTLE not enough credit from the rest of everyone..

Grox
11-11-2011, 08:34 PM
standard pentatonic structures? explain

Copperpot5
11-11-2011, 10:33 PM
Billy's Starla solo 10/5 in super-slo-mo (Twixtor/Added frames):

<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/XG9evgAr1fg?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/XG9evgAr1fg?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>

Order 66
11-11-2011, 10:40 PM
billy is arguably the best guitarist of his generation

the thing i always found unique about his playing is there's no recognizable "billy style" that you associate with like you would with jimmy page or van halen or whatever. besides maybe his usage of octave chords, he has no set staple. he utilizes every style. its all open

redbreegull
11-12-2011, 12:42 AM
Using pentatonic heavily is not a bad thing... Most popular hard rock guitarists focus on the pentatonic. Billy is just fucking amazing.

T&T
11-12-2011, 01:14 AM
Billy's Starla solo 10/5 in super-slo-mo (Twixtor/Added frames):

<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/XG9evgAr1fg?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/XG9evgAr1fg?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>
awesome clip

lest be honest — a few dud notes (unless you consider branching to random modes on quick passes acceptable), but an awesome clip!

he/she/it
11-12-2011, 01:34 AM
Billy's Starla solo 10/5 in super-slo-mo (Twixtor/Added frames):

<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/XG9evgAr1fg?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/XG9evgAr1fg?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>

Just for comparison:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7jWSqXqQF0Y#t=4519s

selection7
11-17-2011, 01:42 AM
Billy is very tasteful and he excels at songcraft when it comes to guitar. However, he sticks mainly to standard pentatonic structures and he's not really advancing the instrument or anything. I think he gets a LITTLE too much credit from SP fans and a LITTLE not enough credit from the rest of everyone..
Bill doing non-pentatonic makes me think of that Jesus, I vid...6:15 into it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfcjR2A4PzQ
I have no idea what he's playing, btw.

Also, one thing that separates him is his playing doesn't sound bluesy in general, it sounds more modern, even though he probably favors a blues pentatonic. When I solo it just sounds like I'm stuck in 1973.:unhappy:
Another advantage Billy has is that same creative spark that makes him an elite songwriter also benefits his technical playing. I think in the preface to the MCIS tab book he mentions having to fight the urge to become one of those guitar players that only other guitar players care about.

???
11-17-2011, 01:47 PM
ok obviously you guys know nothing about guitar.

billy plays the most soulful guitar solos i've ever heard, but i feel that his rhythm playing is for the most part uninteresting. his overall style is very traditional, very 70s. simplistic, mostly chord-based guitar riffs with intricate call-and-response lead/solos over the top. as more of a rhythm/lead hybrid player myself, i find pumpkins songs tediously easy to play and i generally find more inspiration listening to guitarists such as josh homme, matt bellamy, jack white to name a few popular current examples, as well as jeff buckley, johnny marr, jonny greenwood. i feel that soloing is somewhat passe and writing interesting riffs is a far more worthy enterprise. i certainly wish i could shred like billy (and there are three secrets to effectively emulating his style) but i have little need to. on the one hand, billy is probably a far greater rhythm player than he lets on (didn't he once say "i could write great riffs all day, but sometimes they don't make for the best songs"?) so i can understand why he plays the way he does. but on the other hand, the other guitarists i mentioned never sacrified song quality by dumbing down their guitar playing, and neither do i. so maybe billy is really just a product of his primary influences and doesn't aspire to play any other way.

in summary, i feel he is the most underrated player of guitar solos (is that the same thing as a "guitar soloist"?) and his playing pretty much defines "alternative" because he generally eschews traditional pentatonic scales and mixes them up with others (myxolydian etc). and he is, to me, one of the greatest producers of the guitar and has contributed significantly to the evolution of the way guitar is recorded. but in terms of dynamic rhythm/lead playing, he is nothing compared to homme and the other players i mentioned.

-drops mic-

i'm drunk btw

supermaid
11-17-2011, 01:52 PM
your greatest fan,

gary guitar

scottytheoneand
11-17-2011, 02:02 PM
stupid thread gets stupider

stumpycat
11-18-2011, 12:20 AM
I actually agree with Isle's view on Billy's playing. His rhythm and structure is often boringly standard by comparison, but his leads are far more creative and seldom sound like some standard paint-by-numbers blues variants (nor do they usually sound like wanky Van Halen shredding.) I think that Billy could utilize more interesting, non-standard riffing if he wanted to do so, but it is as though he's afraid that it will make for a less than pleasing and catchy hook and is inappropriate to base a "proper" song structure around. (Trotsky would probably call it a "dinosaur mentality".) Isn't that what Pistachio Medley is really all about - interesting less conventional riffs that Billy never bothered to base a proper song around?

Morlock
11-18-2011, 01:20 AM
Billy Corgan, when he is at his peak, is incredible and hard to top by other rock guitarists. Josh Homme however is almost at peak all the time, and that shouldn't be underestimated. From Songs for the Deaf on he really established himself as a world class guitarist. super-bluesy, yes, but also very passionate, soulful, kickass and cool. Pure rock'n'roll.

Catherine Wheel
11-18-2011, 04:05 PM
More love for Josh. Awesome.

Although I would say that even before Songs For The Deaf he was a world class guitarist. Some of his best guitar solos are from QOTSA's early years (How To Handle A Rope, The Bronze) Their most ambitious material in general is from their early years. (You Can't Quit Me Baby, Better Living Through Chemistry, Infinity)

By the time QOTSA had become successful Josh's guitar solos were much less inspired and interesting.

Ball Sack Face
11-18-2011, 06:55 PM
who gives a shit

stumpycat
11-18-2011, 09:42 PM
More love for Josh. Awesome.


By the time QOTSA had become successful Josh's guitar solos were much less inspired and interesting.
But isn't that basically what always happens? ;)

Trotskilicious
11-19-2011, 04:18 AM
Yeah, Billy is one of the most underrated guitarists.

except in his own mind

Trotskilicious
11-19-2011, 04:18 AM
that's why he kind of deserves being underrated honestly

RenewRevive
11-19-2011, 09:33 AM
Billy's lead guitar work isn't really any less awe-inspiring now than in 1993. Maybe you disagree, but I really think that despite the bad songs and bad production, he's just a motherfucker on the guitar. The solo on Starla from this tour floors me as much as any of his lead work in the past. If anything, he kind of lost his way in boring metal/shred lead work over the past few years but got his guitar focus back together for this tour.

his playing on the current tour is surprisingly great.

Phoenix Down
12-31-2014, 10:58 PM
Brent Hinds (who?)

:erm:

That comment must make you pretty embarrassed now.

null123
01-01-2015, 12:12 AM
Josh Homme is hott

houseofglass11
01-01-2015, 12:46 AM
Nope, I'm not a Mastodon fan.

Also, this thread was necro-bumped, but Billy is still 10x the guitarist that Josh Homme is.

Funbags
01-01-2015, 02:10 AM
Also, one thing that separates him is his playing doesn't sound bluesy in general, it sounds more modern, even though he probably favors a blues pentatonic. When I solo it just sounds like I'm stuck in 1973.:unhappy:

The secret-sauce in the psychedelic Pumpkins sound is the Mixolydian mode. The riff from Starla is literally running up a Mixolydian scale note for note, for example.

Billy's psychedelic solos also contain a mix of Mixolydian and Phrygian Dominant licks (the snake charmer bits he often throws in), which he probably picked up from being a big Richie Blackmore/Uli Jon Roth fan.

Phoenix Down
01-02-2015, 11:27 AM
Nope, I'm not a Mastodon fan.

I'm pretty sure it's possible to acknowledge good guitarists without being a fan. And Brent Hinds certainly has crazy shredding skills, I'd rate him higher as Homme.
Maybe you wanna check out their latest album, though. It's more of a hard rock record really.

And regarding Homme: I love QOTSA but I think Kyuss is where it's at if we talk guitar here.

Elphenor
01-02-2015, 11:45 AM
Kyusssss

Awww Yeahhh

brutechinasky
01-02-2015, 11:59 AM
james is better than both

Elphenor
01-02-2015, 12:02 PM
Corgan fucking destroys Homme btw and I like QOTSA

Some of the solos on Gish where Corgan was less restrained than he would be on SD and MCIS are monstrous

The exploding boy
01-02-2015, 04:14 PM
All i know is

Number of QOTSA records ever owned: 0

Number of SP records ever owned: 8


So i'll give that one to Bolly....

Trotskilicious
01-02-2015, 07:15 PM
ok obviously you guys know nothing about guitar.

billy plays the most soulful guitar solos i've ever heard, but i feel that his rhythm playing is for the most part uninteresting. his overall style is very traditional, very 70s. simplistic, mostly chord-based guitar riffs with intricate call-and-response lead/solos over the top. as more of a rhythm/lead hybrid player myself, i find pumpkins songs tediously easy to play and i generally find more inspiration listening to guitarists such as josh homme, matt bellamy, jack white to name a few popular current examples, as well as jeff buckley, johnny marr, jonny greenwood. i feel that soloing is somewhat passe and writing interesting riffs is a far more worthy enterprise. i certainly wish i could shred like billy (and there are three secrets to effectively emulating his style) but i have little need to. on the one hand, billy is probably a far greater rhythm player than he lets on (didn't he once say "i could write great riffs all day, but sometimes they don't make for the best songs"?) so i can understand why he plays the way he does. but on the other hand, the other guitarists i mentioned never sacrified song quality by dumbing down their guitar playing, and neither do i. so maybe billy is really just a product of his primary influences and doesn't aspire to play any other way.

in summary, i feel he is the most underrated player of guitar solos (is that the same thing as a "guitar soloist"?) and his playing pretty much defines "alternative" because he generally eschews traditional pentatonic scales and mixes them up with others (myxolydian etc). and he is, to me, one of the greatest producers of the guitar and has contributed significantly to the evolution of the way guitar is recorded. but in terms of dynamic rhythm/lead playing, he is nothing compared to homme and the other players i mentioned.

-drops mic-

i'm drunk btw

hooray it's isle

Trotskilicious
01-02-2015, 07:16 PM
oh, jesus this is 3 years old how embarassing

and josh homme is hotttt i think him & brody are the hotttttest rock couple by far

slunken
01-02-2015, 10:11 PM
one of my favorite parts about netphoria lately is that almost no matter what thread i click on, the top post that i see first is someone defending some other band

breaking news: smashing pumpkins attract obsessive nerd status fans

dreams of glass
01-05-2015, 09:28 PM
The secret-sauce in the psychedelic Pumpkins sound is the Mixolydian mode. The riff from Starla is literally running up a Mixolydian scale note for note, for example.

Billy's psychedelic solos also contain a mix of Mixolydian and Phrygian Dominant licks (the snake charmer bits he often throws in), which he probably picked up from being a big Richie Blackmore/Uli Jon Roth fan.


When I was just starting out playing guitar, and I didn't know too much theory, I would sit and try to replicate the "Pumpkins sound", just by ear.

Years later, after learning theory, I realized that I was pretty much gravitating towards A Mixolydian (aka D major) to capture that sound.