View Full Version : Postfinal Debate about Zeitgeist


BumbleBeeMouth
02-02-2011, 12:17 PM
oooooh



for an album called zeitgeist it was kind of out of touch with not only the music around but also the fans it was supposed to appeal to.

The production was terrible and the songs were kind of bland. Which is a shame, because we know he can do better.

I dont really listen to it. But like yeah, its music i suppose.

wHATcOLOR
02-02-2011, 12:21 PM
suck on THIS, sjpaterra

Astur
02-02-2011, 12:25 PM
I recall many hating the song around here, but I've always been a sucker for Bleeding the Orchid. I saw them play it live on TV before listening to the actual album and it was like "woah, they might be back for real". But then I listened to the whole album and well. Just not. Makes a nice curio listen from time to time, that's for sure.

samuel redman
02-02-2011, 12:41 PM
it's a good album

slunken
02-02-2011, 12:42 PM
yea ^ i mean, compared to TBK

BumbleBeeMouth
02-02-2011, 12:45 PM
I recall many hating the song around here, but I've always been a sucker for Bleeding the Orchid. I saw them play it live on TV before listening to the actual album and it was like "woah, they might be back for real". But then I listened to the whole album and well. Just not. Makes a nice curio listen from time to time, that's for sure.

the rock am ring one?

dunno, its just kind of a bit meh

the version of shame on that gig was really good though. I remember watching it at uni and thinking, yeah this is where the song ends now... and then they went off on that bit at the end!

lol i love theres only 1k views on youtube for the first gig they did in ten years!

Trotskilicious
02-02-2011, 01:23 PM
haha good point about the title. it's called Zeitgeist but it exists in a bubble billy made in 1998.

Kahlo
02-02-2011, 01:28 PM
Pretty sure that Billy perceived the 2007 world of rock albums being bland, boring, underwhelming and badly produced. In that way it's totally part of the Zeitgeist - Billy Corgan's mental Zeitgeist (which would have made for a better album name)

BumbleBeeMouth
02-02-2011, 02:44 PM
kahlo thats so deep man.

so whats he been up to recently? has he done anything good?

I heard he was doing some single thing.

he should get into dubstep

Shallowed
02-02-2011, 02:48 PM
Recommend me some dupstep?

Eulogy
02-02-2011, 03:01 PM
TTW, Stellar, and Zeitgeist are the only songs I'll go to bat for. But I still like most of the other stuff on it at least a little I suppose.

ilikeplanets
02-02-2011, 06:00 PM
Starz.

ilikeplanets
02-02-2011, 06:12 PM
Recommend me some dupstep?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDpCQ437bsE

and this one I really enjoyed on acid, so if it sucks in reality, I'm sorry:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIEEIif21g4

Cade McNown
02-02-2011, 08:13 PM
TTW, Stellar, and Zeitgeist are the only songs I'll go to bat for. But I still like most of the other stuff on it at least a little I suppose.

agreed

pabrimmer
02-02-2011, 09:11 PM
I like Zeitgeist and the Teargarden stuff too. Bring the Light still makes me smile, and I think anyone listening with open ears and heart would agree that Song for a Son stands side by side with the tall trees of yesteryear.


"for an album called zeitgeist it was kind of out of touch with not only the music around but also the fans it was supposed to appeal to."

That's not how art works.

antiskum
02-03-2011, 12:47 AM
i listened to zeigeist and my parents died, my sister got knocked up and my girlfriend left me

zeitgeist changed my life

Shallowed
02-03-2011, 12:54 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDpCQ437bsE

and this one I really enjoyed on acid, so if it sucks in reality, I'm sorry:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIEEIif21g4

When I requested dubstep recommendations, the last thing I wanted was dubstep recommendations.

emotionalfriend
02-03-2011, 12:58 AM
i listened to zeigeist and my parents died, my sister got knocked up and my girlfriend left me

zeitgeist changed my life

and my marriage ended

vitaldust
02-04-2011, 08:34 PM
i listened to zeigeist and my parents died, my sister got knocked up and my girlfriend left me

zeitgeist changed my life

zeitgeist is bad enough to kill your parents. and destroy your life.

sjpaterra
02-04-2011, 09:06 PM
this IS a better thread... except i dont understand why people complain about the production? So many new rock records are protools'd to death and every rhythm sections sounds like something off a Lady gaga track... every song has a sort of 'dance-like' quality to it... which i think is totally lame. I'm glad ZEITGEIST was "all analog" and that the drums sound fucking fantastic and the guitars thundering, blistering, overdubbed, and tuned down a whole step and a half (i think?)... As far as the vocals, ok, all the la-la-la and ahhhhhhhh stuff upset me the most... and the lyrical content of songs like 'Bring the light' kinda fucking lack! I mean, how many fucking times does billy say "bring the light"? Same thing with c'mon lets go... c'mon, c'mon... too much c'mon... i lol'd at that c'mon thread... BUT AS FAR AS THE TIMBRE of his voice and what he's actually USING his voice for... i was rather impressed... and a lot of the lyrics had pretty dark, heavy imagery... namely Tarntula and united states

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 01:13 AM
what fucking rock records are you listening to? "Lady gaga track" what the fuck are you talking about? Do you even know?

killtrocity
02-05-2011, 01:41 AM
dude seems a bit out of touch...

I'm glad ZEITGEIST was "all analog" and that the drums sound fucking fantastic

yeah, the drums are the only part of it that are honestly good, except they are barely audible above all the other shit. Really too bad THE PRODUCTION killed them.

TheDeuce
02-05-2011, 03:04 AM
i like zeitgeist a lot.

drop: Bleeding The Orchard, That's The Way, P&C, For God And Country

add: stellar, ma belle, death from above, and (wishful thinking) Gossamer

hell, i'd even rather have G.L.O.W. or F.O.L. over those four i would drop.

but what a great album! and every studio release since American Gothic has been complete shit (except for maybe Pox).

Astur
02-05-2011, 05:04 AM
this IS a better thread... except i dont understand why people complain about the production? So many new rock records are protools'd to death and every rhythm sections sounds like something off a Lady gaga track... every song has a sort of 'dance-like' quality to it... which i think is totally lame. I'm glad ZEITGEIST was "all analog" and that the drums sound fucking fantastic and the guitars thundering, blistering, overdubbed, and tuned down a whole step and a half (i think?)... As far as the vocals, ok, all the la-la-la and ahhhhhhhh stuff upset me the most... and the lyrical content of songs like 'Bring the light' kinda fucking lack! I mean, how many fucking times does billy say "bring the light"? Same thing with c'mon lets go... c'mon, c'mon... too much c'mon... i lol'd at that c'mon thread... BUT AS FAR AS THE TIMBRE of his voice and what he's actually USING his voice for... i was rather impressed... and a lot of the lyrics had pretty dark, heavy imagery... namely Tarntula and united states

cool bro, story

BumbleBeeMouth
02-05-2011, 06:49 AM
glow is a good song.

until he ruins it with cmon cmon cmon cmon cmon cmon

sjpaterra
02-05-2011, 03:13 PM
what fucking rock records are you listening to? "Lady gaga track" what the fuck are you talking about? Do you even know?

if you had any idea what was mainstream and topping the charts these days, youd know exactly what i was talking about. Im not even trying to suggest that all new music sounds as bad as the top 40 shit... and the top 40 shit isnt even worth listening to, because its all garbage. as far as the smashing pumpkins, theyve pretty well always been a top 40 band but a top 40 band that very much deserved their time in the spotlight.... so far ZEITGEIST to sound the way it does, compared to LINKIN PARK or NEON TREES or CAGE THE ELEPHANT or GRIZZLY BEAR or ALTER BRIDGE (lol), my chemical romance, three days grace, and diusturbed? c'mon, those are the top 10 rock songs according to billboard as of today... WHAT THE FUCK? and florence + the machine? give me a break... all these recordings sound like piss and shit. And none of these are that far-off from lady gaga or whoever else you want to waste time thinking about. So good hats off to making a great-sounding (but uninspired and still lame) album in 2007

sjpaterra
02-05-2011, 03:16 PM
dude seems a bit out of touch...



yeah, the drums are the only part of it that are honestly good, except they are barely audible above all the other shit. Really too bad THE PRODUCTION killed them.


I dont know what youre talking about but the drums sound bloody fantastic and organic... you can turn an amp up to 10 but not a drum kit... the mixing/volume has a lot more to do with jimmy's actual playing than you might think. Its not all bad post-production

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 03:57 PM
if you had any idea what was mainstream and topping the charts these days, youd know exactly what i was talking about.

Who gives a shit what tops charts. Why is that so fucking important to you. Just because you haven't bothered to listen to rock music since 1997 doesn't make it ok for you to say dumb ass shit.

Im not even trying to suggest that all new music sounds as bad as the top 40 shit... and the top 40 shit isnt even worth listening to, because its all garbage.

That's an dinosaur aestetic that grew out of top forty grunge bands, paradoxically.

LINKIN PARK or NEON TREES or CAGE THE ELEPHANT or GRIZZLY BEAR or ALTER BRIDGE (lol), my chemical romance, three days grace, and diusturbed? c'mon, those are the top 10 rock songs according to billboard as of today... WHAT THE FUCK? and florence + the machine? give me a break... all these recordings sound like piss and shit.

Who cares what's on the Billboard charts. If you're giving Billy credit for releasing a rock record in 2007 that didn't sound like top ten 2007 songs then you really have no idea what was going on in 2007. Neon Bible, Icky Thump and In Rainbows all came out that year from big bands that may not be the holy "Top Forty" but sure are more relevant to rock and roll fans than the kiddy rock that you listed. And Nick Cave in his late 40s put out Grinderman which is better than Zeitgeist by someone who for all intents in purposes should be a dinosaur like Bill, but isn't. There's no excuse for ignorance.

I'm sure this is all "hipster shit" to you or something but that's why you're still saying dumb shit on an internet message board about "Lady Gaga tracks" and moaning about "top forty".

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 03:59 PM
i mean aught seven wasn't as bad ass as aught five but instead of WHINING CONSTANTLY about the damn kids and their new crap music maybe you should try to find some shit you like and stop acting like Zeitgeist is even a tenth as good as In Rainbows.

oh wait i forgot, In Rainbows sold a shit ton that year on peer to peer crowd sourcing and special edition vinyl. Stuff that doesn't pop up in those HOLY UNTOUCHABLE MAINSTREAM YARDSTICK BILLBOARD CHARTS. So much for your theory, anyway.

sjpaterra
02-05-2011, 06:33 PM
Except I made an effort to avoid mentioning the white stripes (RIP) and radiohead because those bands are a cut above the rest... Yeah, I bought the in rainbows box set, too... There are a TON of great bands playing great songs, I know. But there was a time when Jimi Hendrix, The Who, The Beatles, Cream, Neil Young, etc WERE top 40 and there was room for music to be commercial because it was GREAT... I think Billy tried to say "look, a big mainstream act like the pumpkins can still be mainstream and kick everybody's ass"... In Rainbows and Icky Thump sent more blood to my penis in 2007 than zeitgeist... after all, zeitgeist was a huge disappointment. I think the whole point of my INITIAL thread was that "woah, everyone says zeitgeist is totally shit but the truth is that its mostly shit but theres some incredible music on there that needs to be acknowledged and not tossed in the same pile as For God and Country"... JEEZE, fuck billboard and all those shitty bands. The truth is that rock and roll, in general, has pretty much run the gamut... There's about 500 years (250 if youre really anal) of incredible music thats always overlooked by new generations of music lovers because theres some sort of perverse interest in anything thats new... As great as the pumpkins are, and ive heard all their music as much as the rest of you, Debussy and Wagner some pretty gut=wrenching shit... dont be afraid of music with stupid titles like "classical" or "jazz"... i guess hwat im saying is that fi its great, its great, fuck rock and roll as an ideology... its just music for kids

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 07:17 PM
there was all kinds of terrible shit released in the 70s guy. just because we don't remember it didn't mean it didn't exist. Besides the fact that rock & roll was fresh and new at the time. I'm sure there were a bunch of fogeys complaining about The Who taking radio time away from their favorite crooners like Perry Cuomo n shit.

and zeitgeist is a very terrible record

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 07:17 PM
and i hate jazz

Order 66
02-05-2011, 07:19 PM
i bet if SP put out an album like In Rainbows they'd get completely railed for it. it was a good album but i agree with billy about the media/public kissing radiohead's ass. and there's not a lot i agree with him on these days

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 07:28 PM
that's a pretty dumb statement, are you trolling?

Order 66
02-05-2011, 07:35 PM
the problem with radiohead is they never put out anything good

Order 66
02-05-2011, 07:52 PM
but i do think radiohead is kind of a pimp for marrying gwyneth paltrow. props on that

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 08:13 PM
yah that is pretty cool right

slunken
02-05-2011, 08:13 PM
Perry Cuomo

haha you weezer fan

samuel redman
02-05-2011, 08:17 PM
you;d have to be an idiot to like radiohead

pavementtune
02-05-2011, 08:34 PM
but i do think radiohead is kind of a pimp for marrying gwyneth paltrow. props on that
That's the muse pimp, not radiohead.
Btw, Billy once said himself that radiohead is one of the best bands.

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 09:41 PM
actually that's the coldplay guy but thanks for playing

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 09:42 PM
you;d have to be an idiot to like radiohead

nah it's more like this: You'd have to be an idiot to hate Radiohead.

samuel redman
02-05-2011, 09:51 PM
well i disagree

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 10:10 PM
I know you're an idiot, you don't have to remind me.

samuel redman
02-05-2011, 10:14 PM
isn't this what newfangled music people think like? have different "opinions"? like you and i?

i loathe that word

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 10:18 PM
no you hate them, what's the point of that and making snide comments about their music & fans. "You have to be an idiot" etc.

you don't have to like them, but talking about how much they suck and how much you hate them makes you an idiot.

samuel redman
02-05-2011, 10:19 PM
i never said either of those words

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 10:22 PM
troll hard with a vengeance

Luke de Spa
02-05-2011, 10:27 PM
you'd have to be an idiot to like anything i don't like or dislike anything i like

and i like in rainbows

so i guess we're all idiots

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 10:34 PM
in rainbows is pretty tite

Luke de Spa
02-05-2011, 10:38 PM
that's just, like, your opinion, man

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 10:39 PM
i'm not an idiot for having it

Luke de Spa
02-05-2011, 10:44 PM
i dunno, that one guy doesn't seem to agree, and you wouldn't want to upset that one guy, right

Trotskilicious
02-05-2011, 10:49 PM
nah i want to upset him that's why I'm smoking

stumpycat
02-06-2011, 12:41 AM
I think what sjpaterra was getting at may have been said with the implicit assumption that Billy was holding true to his apparent infatuation with remaining "relevant" and having mainstream impact. With this goal in mind, I can see where Billy could have been tempted to "hot mix" the record in a terribly wrongheaded attempt to give his music at least a superficial semblance to the sound and feel of "top 40". Actually there were times on Zeitgeist where I thought I heard elements of this mentality at work anyway, as though trying to achieve something along the lines of what Green Day did with American Idiot. When I hear a song like "That's The Way," (which I know many people here cite as one of the more likable tunes from the album) my first impression is that it is an attempt at that poppy top 40 rock sound.

sjpaterra
02-06-2011, 12:10 PM
and i hate jazz

How the hell can you "hate" jazz? it IS the very essence of what music has always been about... PEOPLE PLAYING MUSIC! Its about ideas, creativity, improvisation, and good sounds. There's really nothing to hate... You may hate the idea of what YOU think jazz is all about but the truth is that if you ever get a chance to hear a Roland Kirk, Ornette coleman, Miles Davis, Lee Morgan, or Hank mobley record then your oppinion might change. i recommend you start listening, chap

Trotskilicious
02-06-2011, 03:08 PM
it's a lot of wankery and people who like it act like total fucking douchebags about it. (see above)

Order 66
02-06-2011, 03:10 PM
the truth is that if you ever get a chance to hear a Roland Kirk, Ornette coleman, Miles Davis, Lee Morgan, or Hank mobley record then your oppinion might change

how is that going to change my opinion of crappy music? nobody even knows who those people are

Trotskilicious
02-06-2011, 03:31 PM
i like miles davis alright but jazz never moved me.

exactlythesame
02-06-2011, 09:33 PM
jazz isn't really emotional, it's intellectual, thus the elitist attitude

stumpycat
02-06-2011, 10:40 PM
I used to hate the stuff, but the unconventional rhythms and complex structures have me coming back for more. I like my jazz hard lemonade style: the plain drink is the genre in question (rock, metal, etc.) and the jazz is the boozy stuff you add in that takes the experience of drinking it to another level.

slunken
02-06-2011, 10:49 PM
you like food metaphors, huh?

slunken
02-06-2011, 10:50 PM
didn't you do a steak/sp song variations thing once?

Luke de Spa
02-06-2011, 11:11 PM
billy corgan and food themes

stumpycat
02-06-2011, 11:40 PM
didn't you do a steak/sp song variations thing once?
Oh yeah, I did! I forgot about that one.
Then I did one a few days ago about margaritas, I think.
I cook in the evenings and I play music, so maybe that is why that association happens. But then again, margaritas and hard lemonade are not exactly "food" so I'm not sure why those come up except that they are both sensory experiences which happen to involve different sensory modalities that can be easily analogized.

FoolofaTook
02-07-2011, 11:50 AM
You're blowing my mind, dude!

slunken
02-07-2011, 01:56 PM
i'm just hungry now

Eulogy
02-07-2011, 03:09 PM
jazz isn't really emotional, it's intellectual, thus the elitist attitude

yeah haven't you guys ever seen the commitments

slunken
02-07-2011, 05:02 PM
they're talking about music not movies

ilikeplanets
02-07-2011, 10:24 PM
Every fan of a particular genre is going to be an elitist with an elitist attitude when it comes to music. Ever notice how fucking difficult it is to find a song that pleases everyone, or even just one or two of your friends? People, myself included, close the door to new or different sounds once they've decided that they like a particular genre.

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 12:08 AM
what's the phrase people keep saying "get better friends"?

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 01:02 AM
My best friend is like my carbon copy except for taste in music. Music seems like something that has to be experienced individually first before you can expect your friends to get hyped about it, and other people usually don't give a fuck about the GREATEST SONG EVER that you show them because they already have their set opinions about what good music is. It's one of the hardest things to explain to someone else.

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 01:13 AM
not really just play it they go hey that sounds pretty goo

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 01:17 AM
Your music is better than mine is though. More people like it, too. I listen to freaky avant guarde shit and really loud metal...and the smashing pumpkins. those are things that people dont seem to like or even give it a chance.

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 01:22 AM
yeah not everybody likes sleater-kinney and the pixies either

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 01:26 AM
so you see my point then. especially if that person was a fan of techno or rap and decided that they hated all music with guitars. they wouldn't even pay attention to your songs because they would hear the guitar and remember that they blacklisted any type of music that includes it.

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 01:34 AM
yeah jesus talk about a hard sell i usually can't play rap in my own house

and no, not everyone blacklists stuff, that's what kids do.

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 01:51 AM
So you've never generalized your tastes? "Oh I hate country/pop/jazz/!" Maybe you'd like an artist, but you'd probably avoid exposure because of it's 'genre'

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 01:53 AM
yes but i grew up

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 01:58 AM
bullshit. I've seen you call very broad things crap without giving an individual part of it a chance. but i refuse to dig for quotes so I'm sure you'll refute that.

Kahlo
02-08-2011, 03:22 AM
freaky avant guarde shit

.

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 05:22 AM
Excuse me, your highness.

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 08:56 AM
bullshit. I've seen you call very broad things crap without giving an individual part of it a chance. but i refuse to dig for quotes so I'm sure you'll refute that.

yeah i give everything a chance and sometimes i dislike it. sometimes i dislike it so intensely, like BlackOps, that I label it an Enemy of Culture

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 11:15 AM
I'm convinced your hatred of BlackOps is really a hard-to-deal-with love.

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 11:25 AM
the only person who plays that game that i know is my dealer so how is it that hard to deal with

Mo
02-08-2011, 11:58 AM
Maybe HE is hard to deal with?

Hurr hurr hurr.

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 12:05 PM
nah he's pretty relaxed. sometimes his buddy is over with his toddlers which is really uncomfortable though.

exactlythesame
02-08-2011, 05:52 PM
you should be ashamed

exactlythesame
02-08-2011, 05:52 PM
exposing your habits to toddlers like that

slunken
02-08-2011, 06:44 PM
freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit freaky avant guarde shit
freaky avant guarde shit

:rofl:

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 06:58 PM
you should be ashamed

i am mostly but I am just buying a plant to smoke, they are the ones doing xanax and cocaine

ilikeplanets
02-08-2011, 08:53 PM
:D

exactlythesame
02-08-2011, 09:01 PM
i am mostly but I am just buying a plant to smoke, they are the ones doing xanax and cocaine

those poor kids don't have a chance

it makes me want to weep for humanity

Trotskilicious
02-08-2011, 10:43 PM
trust me i know

amoergosum
07-17-2012, 12:50 PM
New interview >>>

But when we put that music out—2007’s Zeitgeist—all we heard was, “Oh, it’s not what I want.” It’s the sort of impressionistic version of what you’re supposed to sound like: the greatest-hits version of your sound. We got this weird, negative reaction, this chorus of, “Well, if you guys were smart, you’d just update the sound of one of your classic albums.”

Then touring was a dark thing with people getting really pissed off and screaming. Coming off of that, I went back to the sandbox and decided I’m just going to go back to what I do, start over, and take my lumps along the way.


Source:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/17/smashing-pumpkins-frontman-billy-corgan-what-i-learned-as-a-rock-star.html

RenewRevive
07-17-2012, 06:43 PM
who the fuck is billy listening to? nobody said this. the album just sucked hard, is all.

redbreegull
07-17-2012, 06:49 PM
Wait, is he saying Zeitgeist was a greatest hits of the Pumpkins sounds, or the fans wanted a greatest hits of their sound?

Zeitgeist actually was like review of all their previous sounds condensed into one record and a bunch of crappy songs.

pavementtune
07-17-2012, 09:43 PM
He must be rehearsing his interview rants. On Brian Solis he pretty much said the same, word by word.

vbshlofbvgos
07-17-2012, 10:11 PM
Wait, is he saying Zeitgeist was a greatest hits of the Pumpkins sounds, or the fans wanted a greatest hits of their sound?


yeah i was confused about that too. it seems like he said both.

amoergosum
07-23-2012, 04:10 AM
...haven't seen this clip before >>>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FspnTZTa-5I" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Monet LSD
07-23-2012, 04:32 AM
^^^ Wow, that is crazy good quality...

amoergosum
07-23-2012, 04:37 AM
^^^ Wow, that is crazy good quality...

...great quality and awesome camera/editing work.

amoergosum
07-23-2012, 05:24 AM
They should release that show on Blu-ray.

>>>

Grammy Nominated Giorgio Testi has established himself as a leading director of live performance and branded content, through his unique, cinematic approach to live music.

Most recently he directed Tinie Tempah Live at The O2, and his live direction of the Blur reunion show in Hyde Park earned the film a Grammy nomination for Best Long Form Music Video in 2010.

He has also directed Richard Ashcroft Live at Shepherds Bush and Sting Live at Abbey Road Studio 1, as well as the short Oasis documentary 'What's your story?' for channel Four. 2008 and 2009 saw him deliver multiple series of JD Set and Gaymers Grass Roots Gigs for Channel 4, and the Electric Proms for the BBC. More recently he directed the TV series Studio In Session for MTV which featured Foster The People, Razorlight and Antlers, and the 2012 Snowbombing Festival for Channel 4.

Giorgio began his directing career with the "Puffin On A Coffin Nail" DVD for Dirty Pretty Things which was nominated for an NME Award in 2006 and saw his "Bang Bang You're Dead" video voted no. 1 in the MTV 2 Chart of that year also.

Giorgio has also regularly worked with BBC Radio on a number of ground-breaking live projects, helping to develop their collaboration strand "6 Music Live" featuring Paul Weller and Adele, Heaven 17, La Roux , Gary Numan and Little Boots all shot at Maida Vale Studios, as well as with living legend Bon Jovi for BBC Radio 2 and collaborated with Hurts, Amy Winehouse, Pete Doherty, The Good The Bad and The Queen, White Stripes and Smashing Pumpkins on a variety of live shows.

Away from music Giorgio has worked on a number of viral and branded content films for a broad range of clients including Versace, Gas Jeans, Vogue, Pizza Express and Boots No17. He recently made a beautiful short film with The Kills 'Into The Unknown' which premiered on Vogue Italia in late 2011.

Source:
http://www.pulsefilms.com/talent/giorgio-testi/

Patuquitos
07-23-2012, 06:23 AM
...haven't seen this clip before >>>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FspnTZTa-5I" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I was in that gig. I can confirm it kicked ass. "To Sheila" was the highlight. That was before Zeitgeist was released, so listening to the album was a bit of a downer...

amoergosum
07-23-2012, 06:43 AM
Some more clips from the Madrid show >>>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/k-8cyRmt5Sw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/kcMoTcNkw6w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/O7eVIXb43I0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/tWDR-znY3mU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/m6j6eYaSs_A" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Rsx__z5dVcY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

meangreensp
07-23-2012, 06:49 AM
Zeitgeist had a really good tour and some really cool art surrounding it.

I really could care less what anyone thinks but Zeitgeist had some really good tracks that just had bad production and bad vocals. Doomsday Clock, Bleeding the Orchid, That's the Way, Tarantula, United States (especially this song), Bring the Light and For God and Country were ALL great songs RUINED by bad production and bad vocals.

That's why the songs kicked so much ass live.

amoergosum
07-23-2012, 08:29 AM
Bring the Light and For God and Country were ALL great songs RUINED by bad production and bad vocals.



First ever live performance of 'Bring the Light' >>>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JiUe1derdQg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

amoergosum
07-23-2012, 09:03 AM
Which Zeitgeist B-side/s would you have put on the album?

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/QkvdFaoCvrk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/3m5cu9L1iyM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ICHw1MLEAms" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

RenewRevive
07-23-2012, 01:47 PM
Stellar, Ma Belle and Zeitgeist. you could make a case for Death From Above, but meh.

as well as with living legend Bon Jovi

lol

nice video though, gotta say.

pavementtune
07-23-2012, 06:01 PM
Yes, PULSE is second to none ( at least in Europe). A 'Best Of' Testi's music videos is in the making, I guess it will feature the Smashing Pumpkins concert in Madrid.

Btw thank you for posting all these articles and videos, amoergosum.

Cowlishaw
07-23-2012, 06:51 PM
REVOLUTION! (LAU! LAU! LAU!)

amoergosum
07-24-2012, 02:16 AM
Listen to Jimmy here...
Absolutely.
Fucking.
Amazing.

>>>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/H9jyTsg9a4w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

subzero
07-24-2012, 09:17 AM
jimmy is the only remotely good thing about zeitgeist

amoergosum
07-24-2012, 09:56 AM
It's absolutely insane that they didn't in*clude 'Stellar' on the original release.
...love that song.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FUQkPVPxYLo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/kJtyKWxMixc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

1337
07-24-2012, 10:10 AM
can somebody speak for the masses, in a nutshell, about what the consensus beef is with Zeitgeist's production?

I'm just curious to know what the board in general thinks is the problem with it

opera de nuit
07-24-2012, 10:18 AM
over-blown, no nuance, no warmth, dry-as-a-bone, cheesy billy harmonies, etc. you name it. probably brickwalled too, but i can't say i've listened to it enough to know for sure.

meangreensp
07-24-2012, 11:35 AM
can somebody speak for the masses, in a nutshell, about what the consensus beef is with Zeitgeist's production?

I'm just curious to know what the board in general thinks is the problem with it

Roy Thomas Baker and mastering is what's wrong with it.

Was it any coincidence that Billy's solo in Bring the Light sounded like Brian May? Anyway, Baker neutered the layered guitar sound of the Pumpkins and took all of the dreamy-ness from their music. It was produced so cold and lifeless that it sounds like crap. He did a good job with the dynamics and the little Tarantula break down makes me know that he chose to eradicate all the dreamy Pumpkin sound from the album. Pomp and Circumstance should've been Take Me Down or Cupid de Locke but it was produced like he was singing in a concrete basement.

RTB also obviously tried to make Billy Corgan sound like Freddie Mercury. He did the Queen vox layer on Zeitgeist. Corgan's voice blows now, so it was a horrific idea.

The album was then obliterated in mastering erasing any shred of depth. Surprisingly, it wasn't necessarily brickwalled as it had a lot of range but everything sounded shallow and the drums disconnected.

There are NO redeeming factor's about Z's production. Tarantula was a chore to play at loud levels.

redbreegull
07-24-2012, 11:58 AM
bad production is only one of Z's problems, and RTB wasn't even the only producer who worked on the record

redbreegull
07-24-2012, 12:08 PM
First ever live performance of 'Bring the Light' >>>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JiUe1derdQg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

this actually sounds pretty sloppy for this era of live performances. b0lly keeps looking down at his guitar like he doesn't know where to put his fingers

amoergosum
07-24-2012, 12:09 PM
Surprisingly, it wasn't necessarily brickwalled as it had a lot of range but everything sounded shallow and the drums disconnected.


Nope, it has an awful dynamic range >>>
http://www.dr.loudness-war.info/index.php?search_artist=&search_album=zeitgeist

BurtSampson
07-24-2012, 12:24 PM
You guys are ridiculous. Remember when you were chompin' at the bit for a shitty ass mp3 somebody recorded with their cell phone of "tarantula"?? It was just a rehearsal jam, not even a complete song, but yet everybody started making these speculations of how the album would sound.. For the most part, at first anyway- alot of folks here liked the album despite its cheesy moments... I think once the novelty wore down of a "new" SP album, thats when everyone started jumping on the bandwagon bitching and complaining about every little thing...

Here are the facts people: It had been several years since anything new from SP...Within a matter of just months, we got a great DVD/Documentary that was NOT shitty whatsoever.. We also got lots of extra b-sides and American Gothic.. If you look at Zeitgeist as a whole (including the DVD and extra songs), it's really not THAT bad...I hate the Billy choir just as much as you do, but this era had good songs that I still listen to even today.. (Neverlost, 7 shades, For God, Sunkissed, Rose March, 99 Floors, Stellar, Ma Belle,).. Despite its crappy moments, I refuse to hate on Zeitgeist and over-analyze the shit out of it... It's the last album/tour we got with Jimmy so why not be at least a little thankful??

because Doomsday Clock and Billy in a head dress won't let me be thankful

BurtSampson
07-24-2012, 12:38 PM
I love life every day
in each and every way
Kafka would be proud
to find out

It's the means that has me spooked

Please don't stop, it's lonely at the top, these lonely days, will they ever stop?

A GROWN MAN WROTE THESE LYRICS

redbreegull
07-24-2012, 01:27 PM
I never caught that Kafka line before what the fuck is that supposed to mean? was BiCorg feeling a bit arthropod-esque that day or something

RenewRevive
07-24-2012, 01:40 PM
Nope, it has an awful dynamic range >>>
http://www.dr.loudness-war.info/index.php?search_artist=&search_album=zeitgeist

ugh.

Slurpee
07-24-2012, 02:46 PM
Once you have cleared your mind of every expectation, Zeitgeist is kind of fun to listen to, like watching a bad movie. But it will never be good. Never, ever.

Kahlo
07-24-2012, 03:59 PM
I never caught that Kafka line before what the fuck is that supposed to mean? was BiCorg feeling a bit arthropod-esque that day or something

Burt missed out a line:

Kafka would be proud, to find out
i'm certain of the end
it's the means that has me spooked

doesn't really need much explaining. I do like these lyrics, even if they are a bit cheesy

Trotskilicious
07-24-2012, 04:00 PM
what about the robber button

Kahlo
07-24-2012, 04:08 PM
http://forums.netphoria.org/showthread.php?t=175761

amoergosum
07-25-2012, 03:04 AM
Billy Corgan and Jimmy Chamberlin discuss the making of Zeitgeist >>>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9vLgq4O7oz0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Vnv-89-_bn4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9wHZJO6jGiM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/1sQwiIAhALM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/gDOQ5CL1AJs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

amoergosum
07-25-2012, 03:31 AM
I get the feeling that one of Jimmy's breaking points was listening to Billy's "GROUNDBREAKING" idea about Teargarden.. He probably just thought it was BS, and wanted to do another record (which is exactly what Billy ended up doing anyway).


In this 2007 interview Billy talked about the project, probably for the first time publicly >>>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODyiD3yptOw#t=20m2s

BurtSampson
07-26-2012, 01:16 AM
never heard that Zeitgeist interview, it was really interesting. I feel like the making of that album is so mysterious.

amoergosum
07-26-2012, 01:59 AM
I love how Billy and Jimmy showed what the original versions of some of the songs sounded like.
The discussion about The Shuffle was very funny.
Jimmy Chamberlin:
"JC don't play that." ...:)

>>>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sQwiIAhALM#t=2m13s

Monet LSD
07-26-2012, 02:36 AM
Yes, and I love how JC takes something that he hates (the main beat he described is the same one throughout Tarantula) and just makes it badass. Just absolutely kills it.

1337
07-26-2012, 03:50 AM
Maybe this discredits my Pumpkins fandom to you people, but I never read nearly this much into the production of Zeitgeist. Or the lyrics, for that matter. Or the Billy-orchestra. You people actually pay attention to and let this shit affect you like this?

Zeitgeist, in my opinion, is a way better album than Oceania. Sound-wise, lyrically and vocally. I've never EVER heard anything b0lly has done that repulsed me the way Oceania did as a whole the first time I listened to it from start to finish. The songs are BAD. The lyrics are embarrassing and awful. And it sounds like absolute shit with those saccharine-rich keyboards and drums that sounds like Byrney's beating on some cardboard boxes and a plastic basket filled with thumbtacks.

There's your production failure. His name is Bob Ludwig, and he ruins everything he puts his hands on.

Zeitgeist at least resembled an SP album in sound. Oceania sounds like a bad MSOTS follow-up by Zwan. The lyrics and the vocal performance alone on Oceania sink the album, not to mention b0lly is aping numerous past-Pumpkins songs to try and give a bunch of the Oceania tracks wings.

It just boggles my mind that people rag on Zeitgeist and yet praise Oceania like it's the "new Siamese Dream" or something.

Kahlo
07-26-2012, 04:00 AM
Oceania repulsed you

lol

I'm just jealous you had any kind of strong emotional reaction to it. Honestly. At best most of us went 'this is....ok'

amoergosum
07-26-2012, 04:02 AM
Zeitgeist, in my opinion, is a way better album than Oceania.

...no doubt about it.

1337
07-26-2012, 04:11 AM
Oceania repulsed you

lol

I'm just jealous you had any kind of strong emotional reaction to it. Honestly. At best most of us went 'this is....ok'

I'm not kidding; it literally did

I sat down with excellent, quality headphones in a comfy armchair like a total nerd and followed along with the lyrics and everything, and I was baffled at how awful the album is. I literally said out loud to nobody in particular, "what the fuck is this SHIT?"

and I stand by that, because it hasn't grown on me an ounce since.

Okay..."Panopticon" isn't that bad, but it's nothing great by Billy's standards, either.

And that's the problem I have with the record: I've been able to warm to and appreciate everything this guy's done, even at his so-called worst (Zwan). But this album -- that I wanted to love from the start as the "Great Pumpkin Comeback" -- turned me off instantly. Like a fucking lightswitch

it's just sad when I'd rather listen to "Owata" on repeat than any one song on Oceania once.

Monet LSD
07-26-2012, 04:35 AM
I'd rather listen to "Owata" on repeat than any one song on Oceania once.

Woah, woah, wait, what?

Disliking Oceania is valid, but there's nothing worse than studio Owata.

:think:

1337
07-26-2012, 04:40 AM
OMG just got acknowledged by superfan Monty

PUNKINFREEKOUTENGAGE!!1!

1337
07-26-2012, 04:41 AM
Woah, woah, wait, what?

Disliking Oceania is valid, but there's nothing worse than studio Owata.

:think:

I've taken serious Netphoria-level heat on the O-board for admitting to my love for the first two minutes of Owata

and I can name you at least a dozen Corgan-penned tracks that are "shit next to a Stop sign" compared to it.

Monet LSD
07-26-2012, 04:51 AM
OMG just got acknowledged by superfan Monty

PUNKINFREEKOUTENGAGE!!1!

What the fuck are you talking about?

I've taken serious Netphoria-level heat on the O-board for admitting to my love for the first two minutes of Owata

Well, that says something.

I can name you at least a dozen Corgan-penned tracks that are "shit next to a Stop sign" compared to it.

What does Shit Next To A Stop Sign mean? And let's hear that list.

1337
07-26-2012, 08:39 AM
1. One Diamond, One Heart
2. The Celestials
3. Pomp and Circumstance
4. Sorrows (In Blue)
5. Wildflower
6. Tom Tom
7. In My Body
8. Endless Summer
9. With Every Light
10. Starz
11. Spangled
12. Desire

could probably do a top 25 if you pressed, but why bother?

reprise85
07-26-2012, 08:45 AM
in my body is a great fucking song. so is desire and with every light

endless summer is p. good too

Dogfighter28
07-26-2012, 08:48 AM
No one who likes Zeitgeist better than Oceania is a proper person

Dogfighter28
07-26-2012, 08:48 AM
And the same goes for anyone who thinks Oceania is good enough to be considered canon.

DeadOpera
07-26-2012, 08:53 AM
don't feed the trolls.

1337
07-26-2012, 09:08 AM
No one who likes Zeitgeist better than Oceania is a proper person

I could say the same thing about somebody who openly praises Oceania

but I won't.

reprise85
07-26-2012, 09:10 AM
zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

1337
07-26-2012, 09:11 AM
don't feed the trolls.

Not that I care

but what's with the constant "troll" labels and shitty rep remarks every time somebody makes a post someone else doesn't agree with?

I'm generally curious about this. Like, I know it's Netphoria and all, but the fact that some of you go out of your way to let routine opinions bother you to the point where you have to comment on it via reputation points is hilarious

cry me a fucking river already :cry:

reprise85
07-26-2012, 09:23 AM
what makes you think reputation takes emotion or involvement of more than 5 seconds

DeadOpera
07-26-2012, 09:31 AM
it makes me feel good that futureboy gives me negative rep, he's a nice fellow. It makes me laugh that rotten ugly thinks he is giving me negative rep on old posts from 2004. dumb kid

1337
07-26-2012, 09:50 AM
what makes you think reputation takes emotion or involvement of more than 5 seconds

Anything shitty takes emotion. Negativity is the most honest emotion there is

what makes you think I'll care for five seconds or even two if you're shitty enough to leave bad rep points on my profile?

1337
07-26-2012, 09:52 AM
it makes me feel good that futureboy gives me negative rep, he's a nice fellow. It makes me laugh that rotten ugly thinks he is giving me negative rep on old posts from 2004. dumb kid

Speaking of laughing

"you are crying about rep.... you'll just get it worse x10000."

made me laugh so fucking hard I almost pissed myself.

are you going to stuff me into my locker and steal my shoelaces, too?

DeadOpera
07-26-2012, 09:52 AM
because you're making posts about it.


you care.

DeadOpera
07-26-2012, 09:53 AM
go ahead and keep making posts about it. you'll find out soon enough :)

rottenugly
07-26-2012, 09:54 AM
come on, 1337, don't turn out like croPUMPKINs or lala. just ignore the trollz.

1337
07-26-2012, 09:59 AM
because you're making posts about it.


you care.

Whoa. Is that right

they should involve you in the space program for that brainstorm.

1337
07-26-2012, 10:02 AM
come on, 1337, don't turn out like croPUMPKINs or lala. just ignore the trollz.

ironic that he posts about trolling in every SP-related thread, isn't it?

DeadOpera
07-26-2012, 10:04 AM
Whoa. Is that right

they should involve you in the space program for that brainstorm.


okay dumbass...

DeadOpera
07-26-2012, 10:05 AM
i'm not even leaving you negative rep points.

amoergosum
07-26-2012, 11:12 AM
Can we get back to the interview I posted?
>>>
http://forums.netphoria.org/showpost.php?p=3889879&postcount=134

...very interesting.

Trotskilicious
07-26-2012, 12:26 PM
I'm just jealous you had any kind of strong emotional reaction to it. Honestly. At best most of us went 'this is....ok'

this

Trotskilicious
07-26-2012, 12:26 PM
maybe we would have if we didn't give up because zeitgest sucked so bad

Trotskilicious
07-26-2012, 12:28 PM
but what's with the constant "troll" labels and shitty rep remarks every time somebody makes a post someone else doesn't agree with?

are you new to the internet

reprise85
07-26-2012, 02:53 PM
Anything shitty takes emotion. Negativity is the most honest emotion there is

what makes you think I'll care for five seconds or even two if you're shitty enough to leave bad rep points on my profile?

the whole point of rep is to let someone know what you think about the post. i mean, i rarely post hateful rep, but who cares.

isn't you calling someone shitty also a hateful emotion and thus by your own logic you care even though you say you don't?

jesus this is a stupid conversation.

myosis
07-26-2012, 03:06 PM
i think oceania is better than zeitgeist because i haven't heard it

Rocket Launcher
07-26-2012, 03:56 PM
from the core record, 7 shades of gray, bleeding the orchid and bring the light aged well for me, i think they are well produced all in all. but the b-sides like zeitgeist, stellar and ma belle are pretty acoustic pieces in their own.

whywontyoulistn
07-26-2012, 04:03 PM
7 shades of gray

Ummm...been catching up on some reading recently, have we?

brutechinasky
07-26-2012, 04:19 PM
And the same goes for anyone who thinks Oceania is good enough to be considered canon.

what the fuck does that even mean

it's canon and it's mediocre

RenewRevive
07-26-2012, 05:16 PM
1. One Diamond, One Heart
2. The Celestials
3. Pomp and Circumstance
4. Sorrows (In Blue)
5. Wildflower
6. Tom Tom
7. In My Body
8. Endless Summer
9. With Every Light
10. Starz
11. Spangled
12. Desire

could probably do a top 25 if you pressed, but why bother?

aw, come on, you're losing your marbles amigo.

Tom Tom is the best Teargarden song.
Starz is probably the best Zeit song.
Nothing off Machina II is inferior to Owata.
Why wouldn't you pick Baby Lets Rock of MSotS, instead of good tracks?
WEL. really?

tbh Owata i had high hopes for, but they fucked it over royally. i still don't actually hate it, but c'mon, just CMON!

myosis
07-26-2012, 05:40 PM
i've had a feeling for a while, that a better SP comeback would have been to release a single without any warning whatsoever.
make the tracks : United States + 7 Shades of Black + Starz
use this image as a cover (just the flag part, no "smashing pumpkins")

http://www.mashupciti.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/smashingpumpkins_web.jpg

be done with it.

stumpycat
07-26-2012, 11:01 PM
Yeah, pretty much; at least it would have competed nicely with the Green Day cover.

1337
07-27-2012, 04:31 AM
the whole point of rep is to let someone know what you think about the post. i mean, i rarely post hateful rep, but who cares.

isn't you calling someone shitty also a hateful emotion and thus by your own logic you care even though you say you don't?

jesus this is a stupid conversation.

I know, right?

it's just amazing to think some bitter whingebag asswipe who calls himself Deadopera would think I care what he thinks of my posts

thats all.

Oceania sucks

1337
07-27-2012, 04:33 AM
i've had a feeling for a while, that a better SP comeback would have been to release a single without any warning whatsoever.
make the tracks : United States + 7 Shades of Black + Starz
use this image as a cover (just the flag part, no "smashing pumpkins")

http://www.mashupciti.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/smashingpumpkins_web.jpg

be done with it.

That makes a load of sense. Drop a 10-minute comeback single with no fanfare or even a name on the cover

because we all know that was the way to get your name out there back in 2007 :rolleyes:

bunny
07-27-2012, 04:46 AM
the production of this album has really failed it.
it didn't sit well when it was was released, and it didn't age well either.
which is quite unfortunate because I actually like the songwriting, they are great songs - billy just turned them to shit in the studio (as we've come to expect i guess)

the development of that era are a total write off for me though.
FOL, Glow, Superchrist, American Gothic. puke and please hit me in the head to forget them.

we'll still have the residency songs as live recordings, simple as they should be.
http://thepumpkins.net/music/672-music-residency-songs-07
It would have been amazing if they had tracked all of them for us in this room with zero overdubs.
http://c438342.r42.cf2.rackcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/dvd-1.jpg

The Leaving Lament & If All Goes Wrong are some of my favorite songs ever...

Kahlo
07-27-2012, 05:07 AM
on the IAGW DVD I thought those acoustic sessions were actually the low point - perhaps it is because I thought that that particular selection of songs were incredibly weak.

1337
07-27-2012, 05:25 AM
aw, come on, you're losing your marbles amigo.

Tom Tom is the best Teargarden song.
Starz is probably the best Zeit song.
Nothing off Machina II is inferior to Owata.
Why wouldn't you pick Baby Lets Rock of MSotS, instead of good tracks?
WEL. really?

tbh Owata i had high hopes for, but they fucked it over royally. i still don't actually hate it, but c'mon, just CMON!

how did they fuck it over royally?

And it's all a matter of opinion when it comes to who likes which songs more than others. That list isn't definitive for anybody but me

RenewRevive
07-27-2012, 09:06 AM
how did they fuck it over royally?

for real? i don't think, other than you, i've ever heard anyone think they did a good job with the finished product. okay, the original live version of Owata with the horn section was good. then they went to the electric version, with the tacked on city shoutout, but i still had hopes. then the studio version shows up with the synth which seems to be billy's idea of adding body to the song. it didn't work and has been rightly derided. now, i still don't hate the song, but it was a missed opportunity to be one of the best TbK efforts.

And it's all a matter of opinion when it comes to who likes which songs more than others. That list isn't definitive for anybody but me

this i can agree with.

subzero
07-27-2012, 09:15 AM
arguing over the best zeitgeist and teargarden songs is like fighting over the biggest turd in the toilet

Trotskilicious
07-27-2012, 10:01 AM
hahahaha CLASSICK

reprise85
07-27-2012, 12:28 PM
I know, right?

it's just amazing to think some bitter whingebag asswipe who calls himself Deadopera would think I care what he thinks of my posts

thats all.

Oceania sucks

for the record i don't agree with this

meangreensp
07-27-2012, 04:07 PM
1337 is as stupid as his screen name.

BurtSampson
07-27-2012, 04:13 PM
Can we all at least agree that Widow Wake My Mind is the worst song of all time? or at least Astral Planes? or at LEAST G.L.O.W.?

come on come on come on

bunny
07-27-2012, 06:19 PM
Can we all at least agree that Widow Wake My Mind is the worst song of all time?

:banging:

DeadOpera
07-27-2012, 06:43 PM
I know, right?

it's just amazing to think some bitter whingebag asswipe who calls himself Deadopera would think I care what he thinks of my posts

thats all.

Oceania sucks
how am i bitter? because I pointed out how you care about the rep comments I made about you? you keep bringing it up and everyone else agrees + you're a dumbass for liking zeitgeist more than oceania.


and what was really funny was me making a joke on future boys rep and you crying like a little bitch because of it.

DeadOpera
07-27-2012, 06:44 PM
and who the hell uses whingebag

myosis
07-27-2012, 09:04 PM
Private Message: used
Yesterday, 10:49 AM
DeadOpera
Minion of Satan





Location: ck
Posts: 6,200 used

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i'm sorry that i've been neglecting you by not leaving any comments. from now on I will make sure to leave something when giving neutral rep. please do not respond to this PM as my inbox is full.

myosis
07-27-2012, 09:04 PM
DeadOpera is definitely a classy guy in my book

samuel redman
07-28-2012, 02:25 PM
whatever happened to Shadowland. that was so good

1337
07-30-2012, 05:04 AM
for real? i don't think, other than you, i've ever heard anyone think they did a good job with the finished product.

did I say I thought they did a good job with the finished product? All I said was I thought the song was better than some of their others

1337
07-30-2012, 05:07 AM
how am i bitter? because I pointed out how you care about the rep comments I made about you? you keep bringing it up and everyone else agrees + you're a dumbass for liking zeitgeist more than oceania.


and what was really funny was me making a joke on future boys rep and you crying like a little bitch because of it.

DeadOpera

Date of Birth:
June 24, 1981
Age:
31
Biography:
fu
Location:
ck
Interests:
yo
Occupation:
u!

There's how I know you're bitter. Not to mention your constant trolling about "posting remarks regarding reputation points"

cry me a river, you little emo pussy. When you lose your virginity, then you'll have something to harp about

meangreensp
07-30-2012, 12:51 PM
I was all upset that I received negative rep then I realized it was 1337, so I figured it was just his penis envy. NBD

myosis
07-30-2012, 01:29 PM
i am upset that i remember that my rep powers were forever taken away by Katy Lied when he got a favor from BlueStar. i don't even know how many points i'm in the red but i bet it's millions.

subzero
07-31-2012, 12:25 AM
widow wake my mind owns

Trotskilicious
07-31-2012, 09:29 AM
seriously 1337 you're about five years late with this trolling

subzero
07-31-2012, 01:00 PM
we're all just circling the drain at this point anyway

slunken
08-02-2012, 09:20 PM
Bot deleted from my iPhone

iPumpkin
08-02-2012, 09:22 PM
The spam is the best part of this thread

amoergosum
09-27-2012, 10:03 AM
New interview:

Stereogum: I remember seeing you play — I’m not sure what year it was, but you were touring for Zeitgeist — and it seeming like a really frustrating time. You seemed really annoyed. How is that experience different from how it feels now touring on this record?

Corgan: Well, look. There is the 1990 version of playing a song somebody doesn’t want to hear, and they put their fingers in their ears, and you think, “Fuck you. Good.” And then there’s the 2008 version, where you’re like, “Oh man, they’re just waiting for me to play … fill in the blank.” That’s a different feeling. I remember opening for the Buzzcocks in Paris. I think it was ’92. Weird room, didn’t sound very good, we didn’t get a sound check. We go out there, and the crowd is pretty old — mid-30s, early-40s. They were not interested in our brand of psychedelia, particularly in Paris. And we played — I’ve got the cassette somewhere — I told the band, “Just jam, fuck it.” Because literally we would stop and would be met by silence or the derisive whistle of European football fans. So we played six songs for 45 minutes, which means we played every song for about nine minutes. Even ones that weren’t supposed to be played that long, we just noodled. But we took great pleasure in being annoying. There’s a certain power in that. When you’re 40 years old, and the person’s standing there going, “Why doesn’t he play ’33′? I love that song. Why has he gotta play this 25-minute Pink Floyd song?” — it’s not the same feeling. On the Zeitgeist tour we’d play “Set The Controls To The Heart Of The Sun,” and we did this bit where we’d break down and we had little birds that we bought — they’re Audubon birds, where they actually have samples of the bird’s call. So we would walk up to the microphone and play our little bird calls, and people would boo the birds. And we’d laugh. We were like, “They’re booing bird calls.” Of course people are shouting, “Play some music!” OK, what are we playing? It’s totally a different experience, because what do you bond around? And then you read the review: “Ugh, Corgan. He wouldn’t play any of his hits.” And then I’d look at the set list and I would have played nine “hit” songs. So then you start thinking, “What’s the magic number?” And then you realize, there isn’t one. Twenty-four hits isn’t enough, because then you didn’t play _____. And then the punk-rock guy kicks in, and then of course I took it deeper and darker, and it got weirder and weirder. I drove Jimmy Chamberlain insane with how dark it all got. And that’s saying something.

Source:
http://stereogum.com/1157482/billy-corgan-on-the-state-of-the-alternative-community/top-stories/lead-story/

RenewRevive
09-27-2012, 12:34 PM
so, in a nutshell he's blaming the fans - again.

stumpycat
09-27-2012, 10:00 PM
“Ugh, Corgan. He wouldn’t play any of his hits.” And then I’d look at the set list and I would have played nine “hit” songs.
GODDAMN BILL YOU ARE ONE DENSE MOTHERFUCKER SOMETIMES.

Eulogy
09-27-2012, 10:27 PM
set the controls ruined those shows, imo

it's one thing to play fun music and noodle and be good. that just sucked.

redbreegull
09-27-2012, 10:32 PM
set the controls ruined those shows, imo

it's one thing to play fun music and noodle and be good. that just sucked.

it's also one thing to do it for five minutes, and another to do it for 35 minutes

Shallowed
09-27-2012, 10:44 PM
The 1992 Paris show that Billy was talking about:

http://archive.org/details/tsp1992-02-05.shn

amoergosum
09-30-2012, 04:53 PM
"@salpanza: @Billy what are the chances we'll ever see zeitgeist on vinyl?". VERY GOOD

"@rafaeldamage: @Billy but first remix it for the love of god." THAT's THE PLAN

meangreensp
09-30-2012, 06:30 PM
"@salpanza: @Billy what are the chances we'll ever see zeitgeist on vinyl?". VERY GOOD

"@rafaeldamage: @Billy but first remix it for the love of god." THAT's THE PLAN

Wow, so is he pretty much admitting that it sounds like ass? I'm really excited, I am of the belief that it is a good album with terrible mastering.

Astur
09-30-2012, 06:33 PM
Corgan: That feeds into the narcissistic strain. Why is that narcissistic strain there? Back in the day, I would run into Kim and Thurston backstage at a festival, and Thurston would talk to me about guitars and Kim would walk right past me. Why did Kim Gordon feel the need to walk past me? Why was I such a threat to Kim Gordon? I was a huge Sonic Youth fan. I saw Sonic Youth in ’87 at the Metro. I had every Sonic Youth album. I looked up to Kim Gordon. Why didn’t Kim Gordon walk past me in the hallway and mumble, “Hello?” Because what I represented was some sort of weird threat to their beautiful world that they were able to bubble around in for so many years.

what the

Sonic Johnny
09-30-2012, 08:34 PM
We got to hear Jimmy tackle a shuffle beat with badass results (Tarantula) Billy played one badass guitar solo (Bring The Light), and there was one pretty great B-side (Death From Above). Gossamer had a ballin riff (ner-ner-nerrnerr-NERR-NERR-NERR-NERR NERR NERR NERR NERR NERR NERR NERR NERR-DANANA-NERR-DANANA-NERRRRR NERRR) but overall was bloated and shitty as we heard it. Everything else sucked pretty bad. Ginger was fun to look at. Still better than TBK but what the fuck does that count for

Eulogy
09-30-2012, 08:36 PM
death from above sucks.

stellar and zeitgeist are great songs. probably the two best. and neither ended up on the album.

Sonic Johnny
09-30-2012, 08:46 PM
^ Just went back and listened to those songs. I was, in fact, thinking of Zeitgeist, not DFA. Kinda highlights that I havent listened to any of those songs since 2009

redbull
09-30-2012, 09:00 PM
stellar is fucking stupid and i don't know why anyone gives a shit about that song other than it being 6 minutes long

the live piano versions of death from above are the best thing to come out of that whole album/tour

meangreensp
09-30-2012, 09:21 PM
Death From Above was garbage. Just trash.

reprise85
09-30-2012, 10:03 PM
death from above is the best zeitgeist song, followed by zeitgeist and then possibly starz

reprise85
09-30-2012, 10:04 PM
stellar is fucking stupid and i don't know why anyone gives a shit about that song other than it being 6 minutes long

the live piano versions of death from above are the best thing to come out of that whole album/tour

i'm not a fan of the piano version though. studio version ftw

Order 66
09-30-2012, 10:26 PM
i thought DFA was fantastic even though it didnt really have a place on zietgeist. kind of comes to show how disjointed the album was despite having good material

reprise85
09-30-2012, 10:58 PM
i forgot who said it recently but some boarder said imagine DFA if it was written during the MCIS era, how well it could have turned out

redbull
09-30-2012, 11:06 PM
i was just going to say how it reminds me of blank a lot

themadcaplaughs
10-01-2012, 09:32 AM
Death From Above was garbage. Just trash.

Agreed

samuel redman
10-01-2012, 02:40 PM
loving the little two note slide solo in That's The Way (My Love Is)

old skool guitar sound for a second

emotionalfriend
10-01-2012, 05:29 PM
Ginger was fun to look at.

This.

And I still like Tarantula, 7 Shades of Black, and Zeitgeist (the song). Other than that, meh.

meangreensp
10-01-2012, 11:25 PM
This.

And I still like Tarantula, 7 Shades of Black, and Zeitgeist (the song). Other than that, meh.

Tarantula was great. That breakdown was pure old Pumpkin earsex.

amoergosum
07-10-2014, 03:41 AM
>>>

HAPPY TOGETHER / SP ALBUM UPDATE

July 10, 2014

One to go, BEING BEIGE having been sung, with Shredder’s guitar part to go for basics; and that in the morning before I tackle ONE AND ALL, and the de facto end-of-the-road.



Yesterday, post my mea cupa de licto, we were able to come to terms (grips?) with DORIAN. Which pulled me from the digital edge. So with all that said and confessed, I thought I might share a bit on this album’s singing process.



Last album (OCEANIA) I sang without headphones, citing my usual complaint that with them on I no sing the same as I would if you was in the room. A problem for me, personally, to hear where on an album like ZEITGESIT I wasn’t able to generate the same tonal power as you might hear live. And for context, MELLON COLLIE was sung without headphones, often times in the control room with the speakers blasting. MACHINA too.



Per this/that, I noticed an appreciable shift towards my singing on OCEANIA towards the positive. But Herr Howard convinced me to at least try *his headphones, and I’d say he was right to do so, as this has helped to find that balance between good pitch and edgy (dare I use the word?) performances.



On BEING BEIGE there are two choruses, and if given his druthers Howard would have me quintuple tracked on them all. “Like Kyley Papyrus,” he says. Verses are single takes, and I started today just focused on those; probably 8-9 takes each to get the best focus without overdoing it. Chorus 1 we (unsuccessfully) went for doubles (which means two vocals, the same, that lock), and for Chorus 2, triples! That went well actually, and having heard the final result I left Howard with the note that he should ditch the doubles on Chorus 1, figuring we can fill out the parts later with harmonies or other background singing (takes, anyone?)



The entire session, as far as singing, took about 3 hours, and that’s with breaks; and that’s been pretty consistent throughout the last few weeks. So thank you Howard’s headphones!



W.P.C.

null123
07-10-2014, 04:00 AM
Sounds foreboding.

dodoz
07-10-2014, 09:00 AM
Was Billy's guitar biting him while he was playing the intro to "Starz" ?
This silly "aow....aow" intro always cracked me up.

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 02:38 AM
I think he can't reconcile his need to be "in the conversation" culturally ie "be relevant" with his need to be himself. Who he is and what (I think) he wants to say is completely at odds with the zeitgeist and where things are going. He wants to make a protest statement about the world but he can't because the very same conflict that creates that desire in him manifests as the world not taking him seriously. He can't move the conversation onto his terms. So artistically I think this has resulted in him losing a sense of his own voice - the work often feels uninspired and cold now, I think because Billy seems to be working on music in almost purely formal terms. Songcraft and such have continued to be high level but it doesn't mean a lot if it's not being used as a vehicle to say something. In terms of intellectual/emotional/political content his music feels very timid and noncommittal.

That's pretty spot on. It doesn't seem like he ever poors his heart out anymore or anything... I think Zeitgeist may have been the last time he did, and even then it didn't seem like he had a lot of personal stuff to say.

But if you look at tracks like that's the way, pomp, tarantula ETC they seem a lot more personal than anything that's came after.

I think how the reformation went down broke his heart. He probably assumed that that was his ticket back into the mainstream.

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 02:40 AM
like people absolutely TRASHED Zeitgeist.

I think it was too bad.

A song like That's the way was as brilliant as a a lot of his other material as far as I was concerned.

dreams of glass
12-13-2014, 03:03 AM
In retrospect, a lot of stuff sounds real good

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/ri7M8dJYlk8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 03:17 AM
I really liked the 2007 lineup. I saw em live and it was 1 of the best shows I've ever seen. Everyone left the venue in awe about what they had just witnessed. I saw the band years later in Seattle with Byrne and Nicole and it was just so flat and sterile... Like night and day.

Aside from the obvious, I think SP needs a keyboardist in the band. It just seems cheap with the backing tracks.

amoergosum
12-13-2014, 03:20 AM
I really liked the 2007 lineup. I saw em live and it was 1 of the best shows I've ever seen.

Which show did you go to?

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 04:16 AM
I saw them at the PNE forum in Vancouver I think it was around September

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 04:18 AM
Was a pretty killer setlist


Superchrist
Doomsday Clock
Rocket
Drown
Bring the Light
Tonight, Tonight
Tarantula
Starz
Zero
Glass and the Ghost Children
To Sheila
1979
United States
That's the Way (My Love Is)
Hummer
Ava Adore
Bullet with Butterfly Wings
Heavy Metal Machine / On the Road Again
Encore:
Today
Starla


It was the first time all tour that they played Ava Adore and Rocket.

Superchrist fucking kicked my ass too. I'd never heard any version of it before the show, and it was a really wicked way to open the set. It sounded so huge.

I don't know what got lost in translation with the recorded version. Didn't hold a flame to it

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 04:26 AM
The lighting was some of the best I'd ever seen with a live band too.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/-sGiCDUt-r8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

They really went the whole 9 yards with this tour

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 06:36 AM
It's always troubled me why people would rate this as one of the WORST sp songs!?

For me it's always one of my go to tracks when I'm feeling down, or high, or drunk... It's just a fantastic song... And it's so well written.

It's gotta be why Corgan gets fed up. He writes a gem but people shit over it... It's incredible

Anyways, this thread is for other P+C fans to show their love

fuzzyroes
12-13-2014, 06:37 AM
I mean, the subtle build up of this song is genius... And how it climaxes with the trademarked Corgan-distortion-fucking ripping guitar solo is just climatic.

I fucking love this song

amoergosum
12-13-2014, 08:25 AM
I saw them at the PNE forum in Vancouver I think it was around September

>>>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/uTt1K0rZb4M" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>