an oklahoma with a dead sam bradford = tennessee

great defense
lots of talent
no QB

right?

I'd put OU's defense way above Tennessee's. OU and UT have probably two of the top 6-8 defenses in the country.

yeah i'm not quite getting the idea that Tennesee is better than Oklahoma because of one player.

well i am getting it actually, it's typical homer crap

i said texas was for real if they could beat oklahoma...

well you also said texas wasn't that good because they beat Colorado by like four touchdowns or something, i still can't make heads or tails of that.

But Alabama struggling to beat a bad Tennessee team should be forgiven because it is a CONFERENCE game man!!!

i thought colorado and oklahoma were both in texas's conference

maybe i don't know any better since dogfucker is professor of football

If you think Oklahoma's defense is better than Tennessee's you're the one being a homer

Oklahoma's defense gives up nine less points a game, five less total yards a game, and has more forced turnovers.

So, Oklahoma beats Tennessee in every defensive category that is important. But, yes, you're right - Tennessee's defense is better.

College Football - Statistics by Team - Rivals.com (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/stats/byteam?cat1=defense&cat2=Total&conference=I-A_all&year=2009&sort=1137)

I mean when your offense is as bad at Tennessee's is and the offense can't stay on the field it's going to skew the statistics. I'll shut my mouth when a Big 12/Big 10 school actually shows up in the title game.

Dogfighter, I don't think you can spin the Tennessee game into anything other than the ugly near loss it was. The Vols defense is good (and in comparison to OU, I think they probably get the edge despite the raw numbers just based on the caliber of teams they've both played), but they shouldn't have been good enough to hold Bama to 10 points if the Tide played well. I think Alabama is clearly a better team than Texas, but if you're looking at what both teams have done against the competition they've faced, there's not a big difference right now.

I really hope that an SEC team and Texas make it through the rest of the year unscathed though. Otherwise it's gonna get ugly when there are a half dozen 1 loss teams (along with undefeated Mountain West/Big East teams) vying for spots in the championship. I can see a 1 loss SEC champion getting shut out just due to all the officiating shenanigans that have gone on in favor of their top teams the last few weeks.

it's really all hogwash and trash talk

any two teams can match up differently, there is no use comparing them unless it's on the field

i wish texas the best of luck in reaching the title game and hopefully we will be there and it will be a good game

I really hope that an SEC team and Texas make it through the rest of the year unscathed though. Otherwise it's gonna get ugly when there are a half dozen 1 loss teams (along with undefeated Mountain West/Big East teams) vying for spots in the championship. I can see a 1 loss SEC champion getting shut out just due to all the officiating shenanigans that have gone on in favor of their top teams the last few weeks.


fight fight fight for IOWA

Cincinnati looks a lot better than iowa

i don't buy it.

wtf has cincy even done? beaten USF?

Arizona, Michigan, MSU, PSU, Wisconsin... those are at least mildly impressive.

fight fight fight for IOWA

Iowa sucks. They almost lost to Arkansas State! Do you realize how bad you have to be to be the second worst college football team in Arkansas right now? And the sad thing is that Arkansas State is actually, at best, the third worst team in the state. We have Division I-AA teams better than ASU.

So yeah, Iowa can win out for all I care...but I'd fight for Boise or Cincy getting in the title game before I'd ever suggest Iowa deserves to be there.

You know that "They almost lost to ______" is never an acceptable argument to make.

"Who've you beaten?" is the only question that really even makes any sense to ask. I'm not saying that Iowa is a great team or that it's not embarrassing to barely beat Norther Iowa and Arkansas State. But I will say that Boise and Cincy would probably not be 4-0 even in the Big Ten right now.

In fairness, I haven't actually gotten to watch too many teams with any regularity this year. So I could be off. But Iowa's the darling of the computer polls which I often find to be worth more than the human ones.

Boise has been destroying everyone

because they haven't played anyone!

Look, the WAC fucking blows. One win against Oklahoma in a BCS bowl game a few years ago (and let's not forget that Oklahoma always blows those fucking things) does nothing to make the conference legitimate.

Look at the top of the WAC right now. Fucking Nevada is 3-0. Nevada gets shut out by ND's shitty defense and then puts up SEVENTY against a team that's 3-1 in conference.

Please.

also Oregon hasn't proven anything to me yet this year and will likely get crushed by USC. imo.

ehh that was kind of disingenuous. i actually just kinda looked past the Boise/Oregon game.

but. my opinions is still the same. fuck the WAC.

If TCU runs the table though, then sure.

playoff

also Oregon hasn't proven anything to me yet this year and will likely get crushed by USC. imo.

They have beat two ranked teams, a Purdue team which beat tOSU, a UCLA team which beat Tennessee and hammered Washington which beat USC. Their only loss was by 11 to a top-5 team, away, at the start of the year. I think that is fairly impressive.

They have beat two ranked teams, a Purdue team which beat tOSU, a UCLA team which beat Tennessee and hammered Washington which beat USC. Their only loss was by 11 to a top-5 team, away, at the start of the year. I think that is fairly impressive.

I'll start by saying that Oregon is a top 25 team. The win against Utah is a solid one.

But, I don't know how much weight I put on the Cal victory. They were quickly exposed as posers. And Purdue? 3-5 Purdue? Purdue that lost to NIU, ND, Northwestern, and Minnesota in consecutive weeks? No credit for that at all. And 3-5 Washington? More impressive than Purdue, but still nothing to make a big deal about. And UCLA has lost four in a row. Come on man.

But the Utah game is a saving grace. and maybe they're better than I think.

a Purdue team which beat tOSU
Woah woah woah. Let's not get carried away here. Sweater Vest blew that game more than Purdue actually winning it.

I'd always put an undefeated team in a BCS bowl over a 1-loss big school. If you have a loss, fuck you, take what you can get. The only guarantee for anything in NCAA Football is to win out. Fuck the BCS system, we need an 8 team playoff.

\ we need an 8 team playoff.

well we ain't getting that.

I'll start by saying that Oregon is a top 25 team. The win against Utah is a solid one.

But, I don't know how much weight I put on the Cal victory. They were quickly exposed as posers. And Purdue? 3-5 Purdue? Purdue that lost to NIU, ND, Northwestern, and Minnesota in consecutive weeks? No credit for that at all. And 3-5 Washington? More impressive than Purdue, but still nothing to make a big deal about. And UCLA has lost four in a row. Come on man.

But the Utah game is a saving grace. and maybe they're better than I think.

Cal has not been exposed as posers. They have been exposed as inconsistent. And aside from top-10 teams, one on the road (which is understandable), they have beaten everyone else.

The Purdue and Washington argument is to show that these aren't crap teams - but teams in a middling tier which have both beaten top-15 teams. Same with UCLA, demonstrating that UCLA (which has lost four games, yes) is also at worst an inconsistent middling team.

Aside from Washington State, Oregon has not yet played a gimmie game. USC has played two.

Cal has not been exposed as posers. They have been exposed as inconsistent. And aside from top-10 teams, one on the road (which is understandable), they have beaten everyone else.

The Purdue and Washington argument is to show that these aren't crap teams - but teams in a middling tier which have both beaten top-15 teams. Same with UCLA, demonstrating that UCLA (which has lost four games, yes) is also at worst an inconsistent middling team.

Aside from Washington State, Oregon has not yet played a gimmie game. USC has played two.

Calling Purdue and Washington "middling" is completely ridiculous.

Calling Purdue and Washington "middling" is completely ridiculous.

If I remember correctly, by definition of the tiers that we layed out God-knows how many years ago, we classified middling teams as those that go to bowls or could almost go to bowls (win four to seven games). They play competitive within the conference (aren't pushovers) and have the capacity to knock off the top tier of the conference.

Purdue and Washington did that.

i'd say there's a difference between 4 wins and 6 wins

but we'll see how purdue and uw do

i'd say there's a difference between 4 wins and 6 wins

but we'll see how purdue and uw do

My point is more that Purdue and Washington have already shown that they are definitely not doormats - teams that get pasted every week (Washington State). And by virtue of their wins against top 15 teams, they are currently fairly middling. Agreed that this may play out differently (as with all talk at this point of the season), but at the moment, these teams have both shown they are no pushovers, and wins against them count for something.

do they play notre dame this year because i bet eugoogily wouldn't be questioning this if they were ND opponentslol

jesus christ trots try knowing something about this season before talking shit

do they play notre dame this year because i bet eugoogily wouldn't be questioning this if they were ND opponentslol

...... they both played Notre Dame and it went down to the wire. But I can see past my own homerism and recognize that Purdue and Washington are awful fucking teams.

Jake Locker's pretty good though.

A win against OSU is ok. But that game says more about OSU than it does about Purdue. Same with USC/Washington. If those two matchups happened 100 times, OSU and USC would probably win close to 99 of them. That doesn't mean they don't get credit for the victories, but it has little to do with the actual discernible quality of the teams. You can't make judgments based on one game in the regular season. You just can't. It's the entire body of work.

A win against OSU is ok. But that game says more about OSU than it does about Purdue. Same with USC/Washington. If those two matchups happened 100 times, OSU and USC would probably win close to 99 of them. That doesn't mean they don't get credit for the victories, but it has little to do with the actual discernible quality of the teams. You can't make judgments based on one game in the regular season. You just can't. It's the entire body of work.

I see your point, and I think your reasoning is good. I just think you are misinformed, and therefore reaching poor conclusions.

Purdue was in every single game it played this year - even against Oregon, Notre Dame and then beating tOSU. I would put the ration with tOSU more like 35/100 - which is expected from a upper-tier/middling or lower-middling match-up.

Washington gave LSU a good game, lost to ND in overtime, lost to ASU on the last play. Again, this is not a crap team. I would give them opportunity to beat USC a similar amount 30/100.

Point being, way back at the start of this conversation, that Oregon's 6-1 result is much better than USC's. They should be ranked higher than USC, and have the best (or at least one of the best) resume of any one-loss team as far as I can see.

I think you're giving too much credit to these teams. Everyone has given Notre Dame a good game. WSU probably will tomorrow. That's what happens when you have one of the worst defenses in the country.

but hey we'll know more about this tomorrow i suppose

I think you're giving too much credit to these teams. Everyone has given Notre Dame a good game. WSU probably will tomorrow. That's what happens when you have one of the worst defenses in the country.

This statement made me lol...

Eulogy, you are a fun fan of ND to listen to. So much drama.

jesus christ trots try knowing something about this season before talking shit

don't have time for knowing who a team i hate plays shithead

<img src="http://forums.netphoria.org/wwwboard/icons/icon7.gif" height ="500" width="500">


......

So happy Oregon won.

So happy Texas beat the ever living fuck out of Oklahoma State - they are finally looking like one of the top 2 teams in the country.

Penn State, with a win this week vs. Ohio State (which should happen, as they have more talent offensively by far), is virtually a lock for the Fiesta Bowl.

so you still think baylor is a cinderella team whoever it was that was defending them i think sppunk

didn't they lose their heisman hopeful qb?

good work this week texas, florida, and oregon.

Losing their qb four weeks into the season killed Baylor.

I specifically said he was their team.

well i'd say that the only challenge left on texas's schedule is A&M because the hate in their hearts always leads to them playing way up for texas, would you agree with that or do you think Baylor is still someone that could surprise

how in the world could you guys care about college football? all of the players are such ghetto trash. it's unwatchable

well i'd say that the only challenge left on texas's schedule is A&M because the hate in their hearts always leads to them playing way up for texas, would you agree with that or do you think Baylor is still someone that could surprise

Texas will roll over Baylor easily but I can see them needing a 4th quarter miracle to win at TAMU.

how in the world could you guys care about college football? all of the players are such ghetto trash. it's unwatchable

ignore list, i'm really tired of seeing you pop up in threads just to be a wet blanket.

goodbye sam red

Texas will roll over Baylor easily but I can see them needing a 4th quarter miracle to win at TAMU.

me too. they are almost always on point against texas.

reminds me of my HS actually. two years in a row the team went 0-9 only to beat their rival in the last game.

ignore list, i'm really tired of seeing you A in threads just to be a wet blanket.

goodbye sam red

so you're saying football players aren't idiotic ghetto thug clones who think the world revolves around them?

wow i've never been so wrong in my entire life.

my bad jczeroman. :-/

also, shut up samuel redman.

it makes me literally ill to see this gangster plague spread to more and more people, it's destroying this country

lol trolls

wow i've never been so wrong in my entire life.

my bad jczeroman. :-/

also, shut up samuel redman.


Having never been wrong in my life, I have no idea what this feels like.

To be fair, I would not give Oregon the Pac-10 title yet. Their last four games are all very losable.

Texas will roll over Baylor easily but I can see them needing a 4th quarter miracle to win at TAMU.

I can see this...but I can ALSO see them ripping out their heart in the first quarter just like Mizzou and Oklahoma State. That's what makes elite teams...just crushing the other teams soul under your boot before halftime.

Also yeah I'm finally convinced Texas is a top 2 team. Our defense is disgusting.

I can see this...but I can ALSO see them ripping out their heart in the first quarter just like Mizzou and Oklahoma State. That's what makes elite teams...just crushing the other teams soul under your boot before halftime.

A&M is going to present matchup issues with Texas, and at A&M they always play Texas incredibly tough. UT might pull away late, but I fully expect them to be losing at halftime.

By the way Florida's Brandon Spikes deserves to be punched in the face repeatedly. That son of a bitch is a worthless piece of trash.

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Having never been wrong in my life, I have no idea what this feels like.

it feels like today when you expected to go undefeated on Fantasy Football only to be blown out.

so how about that pac-10

so how about that pac-10

Best conference in the country this year - easily.

just becasue they beat themselves up does not mean they are the best conference.

the top 2 teams in the conference played pretty bad yesterday. oh but wait is stanford a legit bcs contender now or something

Best conference in the country this year - easily.

:sigh:

:holding back:

ugh.

i am still in shock.

the top 2 teams in the conference played pretty bad yesterday.

i hope you're not talking about texas

not scoring 50+ points on a team that is vastly outmatched is not a negative strike against their talent jesus fucking christ.

you guys suck. charlie weiss sucks. clausen is big-time overrated. usc isn't very good this year so the close game there didn't mean anything. Michigan is terrible so the loss there really sucks.

sorry to rub it in I just hate how all the ND hooplah is based on name recognition only.

i hope you're not talking about texas

not scoring 50+ points on a team that is vastly outmatched is not a negative strike against their talent jesus fucking christ.

nah he meant pac 10

Texas was pretty good yesteday. UCF has the best D in Conference USA, for whatever it's worth. So yeah 35-3 looks good to me.

oh yeah in the conference ok

just getting cranky ahead of time because i know dogfucker will come in and say OMG TEXAS DIDN'T SCORE 70 POINTS THEY SUCK

By the way this is the closest I've watched Bama all year and I have no doubt Texas could handle them. Florida would be a tougher matchup.

Hey how about Penn State????? lol

Also, I'm finally starting to accept TCU could be really good. It's a shame their schedule sucks so bad. Hopefully they'll play a SEC champ close-game loser in a BCS bowl.

Hey how about Penn State????? lol

Buckeyes are such a weird team this year. Never know who's gonna show up. They might beat Iowa handily.

Cincinnati is vastly overrated

you guys suck. charlie weiss sucks. clausen is big-time overrated. usc isn't very good this year so the close game there didn't mean anything. Michigan is terrible so the loss there really sucks.

sorry to rub it in I just hate how all the ND hooplah is based on name recognition only.

yea its really annoying. ive changed my mind a little bit on clausen. slightly above average qb who will probably have a not so good season next year after weis is fired and will make it nowhere in the nfl if he makes it there.

i dont think notre dame will ever be a top football program again. why would any blue chip recruit want to go there?

my soon-to-be alma mater ucf :(

i only have gone to one game, the one where they opened up the new stadium against texas. i remember watching that game and thinking, "wtf is up with the hype around colt mccoy?!? this guy wont be around after texas recruits some standout freshman in the offseason"

just becasue they beat themselves up does not mean they are the best conference.

the top 2 teams in the conference played pretty bad yesterday. oh but wait is stanford a legit bcs contender now or something

No, they are the best conference because of their records against other conferences, the level and quality of play within conference and objective power ranks which almost unanimously have the pac-10 as the best conference in the country.

And Oregon didn't play badly - their offence was brilliant and Maisoli had twice as good of a game as he had against USC. Their defence got beat, understandably, by the best QB and RB in the conference.

USC did play poorly, but I think Arizona is likely a better team.

ugh.

i am still in shock.

I hate this. Every time I get so unabashedly happy about Notre Dame losing, I just see Eulogy upset, and it ruins the purity of the moment.

i hate every team that other netphorians like

alabama
oregon
penn state
notre dame
etc

im a gator fan

yea its really annoying. ive changed my mind a little bit on clausen. slightly above average qb who will probably have a not so good season next year after weis is fired and will make it nowhere in the nfl if he makes it there.

i dont think notre dame will ever be a top football program again. why would any blue chip recruit want to go there?

Clausen is one of the best quarterbacks in the country. Jon Tenuta is a fucking cunt who can't get anyone to make a FUCKING TACKLE. ugh ugh ugh.

And you can express shock at recruits wanting to come here, but they do, and they are, and they have been. The opportunity to play for one of the most storied teams in all of sports obviously still has some appeal. Recruiting is the least of Notre Dame's worries. But if you can't get players to play, then it doesn't matter who you recruit. And that's the problem right now. The O-line and D-lines are both worthless too.

ugh ugh uggggggh.

my guess is that appeal is waning as we speak

ok maybe if urban meyer goes there they have a shot

i hate every team that other netphorians like

alabama
oregon
penn state
notre dame
etc

You really hate Oregon. Why, in God's name?

I can understand every team on that list but Oregon. That's like me saying I hate West Virginian, or freaking Clemson.

my guess is that appeal is waning as we speak

yeah that's been said before

being televised nationally every week is nice. and that's not gonna stop. it's guaranteed exposure. people will continue to come here.

so why in gods name have they been mediocre-ok-bcs team that gets crushed for so long. just bad coaching huh

Storied programs dominate Ladder 119's top rungs - College Football - ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=2947988)

number 23 for those 10 years. thats fair, i guess. a barely top 25 team.

so why in gods name have they been mediocre-ok-bcs team that gets crushed for so long. just bad coaching huh

Willingham didn't recruit anyone after he got some talented skill players in Quinn's class. Or coach, for that matter. So that explains a few years. Now I don't really know what the problem is. But it isn't the talent level of the recruits.

jimmie johnson crashes on lap 3. my weekend is looking up!

Buckeyes are such a weird team this year. Never know who's gonna show up. They might beat Iowa handily.

Without Stanzi Iowa doesn't win another game.

And Texas beat a Central Florida team that'd be probably every team in the SEC minus Alabama, Florida, LSU and maybe Georgia.

And Texas beat a Central Florida team that'd be probably every team in the SEC minus Alabama, Florida, LSU and maybe Georgia.

that's a funny joke

And Texas beat a Central Florida team that'd be probably every team in the SEC minus Alabama, Florida, LSU and maybe Georgia.

what makes you say that. ucf BARELY beat marshall at home and was losing to buffalo and just won that game by 6 points. oh yea, that was at home too.

buffalo has a losing record in their shittastic conference

that's a funny joke

considering georgia is definitely not the 4th best team in the sec :erm:

College football in general is a joke this year. No conference is drastically better than others (though the Big XII is pretty fucking bad right now).

I wouldn't be surprised if a Central Florida could handle Arkansas, Ole Miss, Vandy, South Carolina, etc. Those teams aren't very good and equal to other middling teams around college football. There's a drastic drop-off after Florida, Texas, Bama and TCU.

I hope TCU gets a chance to beat the fuck out of someone in a BCS bowl, because that team is legit.

what makes you say that. ucf BARELY beat marshall at home and was losing to buffalo and just won that game by 6 points. oh yea, that was at home too.

UCF's offense can't score but I think they have a defense that could contain many offenses - I just said SEC for shock value but you can substitute any conference.

Fuck, they'd probably win the Big XII north! ha

NDNation Features: Memo to Jack: Fix It (http://www.ndnation.com/blog/2008/12/memo-to-jack-fix-it.html)

guy knows what he's talking about.

I don’t post to NDNATION often, but read it daily. Before anyone dismisses this as another “internet wacko” post, know this…

I am a proud member of the 1988 National Championship team; I was on the team in 1985 when we were abused and embarrassed by Miami. I was also on the team that beat Miami three years later. I am a part of its proud heritage. I wear a National Championship ring. I have a stake in Notre Dame. I have talked to many of my teammates who feel as I do. We never lost to USC.

Sadly, I am also embarrassed by what Notre Dame football has become. For the past 12 years, Notre Dame football has wallowed in mediocrity. The performance of the football team the last two years is not only historically far below standard; it is far below the talent level on the current team. This team is under-performing. I refuse to blame the players.

I’ve seen what failure looks like, and I’ve seen what excellence looks like. There are many symptoms of this under-performance, but the root cause is leadership. All of the great Notre Dame teams had the following in common: they were tough SOBs—they were physically and mentally tough, and fundamentally sound.

It is no accident that Anthony Johnson, a fullback on our team, would knock down the edge every single time. Not once in a while, not occasionally, every single time! Think about that and compare it to our current play. He was tough, and he was taught how to block. Oh yeah, and the man never, never lost yards when given the ball. Was Anthony Johnson a heralded recruit?—do some research.

Can youth and inexperience explain under-performance? Ask Mike Heldt, Dean Brown, Tim Ryan (a converted LB), Andy Heck (a converted TE), and Tim Grunhard.

I’ve seen great teaching and fundamental development on the football field, from Lou, to Joe Moore, to Pete Cordelli, to Barry Alvarez.

Is the situation hopeless? I don’t think so. Here is what needs to be done and needs to be done now.

The recipe for success at Notre Dame is simple:

First, find a great coach, with a proven track record of having his teams playing at (in the case of great programs) or above their historical level of performance, and get the hell out of his way. It works every time. Refuse to settle for less. When Lou was forced out, the replacements ... Wannstedt, Barnett, and Davie --- are you kidding me? Willingham? Are you seriously kidding me?

Second, Notre Dame’s identity has historically been one of hard work, discipline, toughness—what though the odds. That needs to be a part of all future teams. No more Bob “all ball” Davie, no more Ty “deer in the headlights” Willingham, and no more transparent “good cop, bad cop”, or “I am going to be more accessible to the players”, and personnel groupings shenanigans. Here’s a good rule of thumb—speak softly, but carry a big stick.

We should be able to line up, point to where we are running the ball and gain 3 yards-with any and all personnel. On that point, it was not uncommon for Lou to replace the entire 1st team OL with the 2nd team OL if they were under-performing just to send a shot across the bow (and to give Joe M. a crack at them).

We should have a coach who can maintain at or near an .800 winning percentage (as a goal). That means beating Navy, Air Force, Army, SD State (puke), Nevada (Puke), Syracuse (in its current state), 100% of time. That means beating the likes of Purdue, Boston College, and Pitt 90 percent of the time. That means beating Michigan and USC at least 50% of the time. Please, to all, no more of the dumb-downed expectations.

We should never, ever dumb down expectations. Let’s be clear, very clear to all what the minimum expectation should be every year—9-3. In fact, 9-3 is a sub-par season for Notre Dame…period! Anything below 9-3 should cause concern, serious concern. We should be a perennial top 10 program and in the BCS discussion every 4 out of 5 years. An occasional reloading year (8-4) is acceptable as long as the trajectory is clear.

To NDNATION, please keep the pressure on.

You really hate Oregon. Why, in God's name?

I can understand every team on that list but Oregon. That's like me saying I hate West Virginian, or freaking Clemson.

because you like oregon pay attention here

Obviously a bad call against LSU. I don't think they would have scored if they did get the ball back. McElroy is getting a little bit better, and the offense wasn't too bad against LSU - at least played better than Florida did.

TCU looks pretty great. I as well hope they get a BCS bowl shot.

Trots, Texas is very good. Get your panties out of that tither. I said as much like two weeks ago.

PAC-10 is a very balanced conference this year, but I'm still not sure they could stand up to the more elite defenses of the Big 12 and SEC.

Can't wait for the SEC championship.

lets take a road trip to atl duders

Peace out Charlie Weis, dont' let the door hit that fat ass on the way out. Maybe you can use some of that $18 million buyout to hire a personal trainer.

Also the Pac 10 is just silly. How you can judge if they're really the best conference when NO ONE plays any defense.

Colt McCoy is now the WINNINGEST COLLEGE QB OF ALL TIME, and if he can maintain his 70% career completion average over the next 3 games, he'll be the only college qb to have ever done so.

tebag must be close to that

my last game ever as a student and it ends like that

they let us go out onto the field after everyone else cleared out. i wanted to take a big dump on it.

fuck you, charlie weis. FUCK. YOU.

the band inexplicably played the 1812 overture (played in between the third and fourth quarters and then again after the alma mater and fight song postgame) which has grown into some sort of tribute to the current coach.

the boos were loud and AWESOME.

stay classy

what the hell is that supposed to meam

Also the Pac 10 is just silly. How you can judge if they're really the best conference when NO ONE plays any defense.

That is a really ignorant thing to say this season.

the band inexplicably played the 1812 overture (played in between the third and fourth quarters and then again after the alma mater and fight song postgame) which has grown into some sort of tribute to the current coach.


what does napoleon being driven out of russia have to do with charlie weiss

what does napoleon being driven out of russia have to do with charlie weiss

nothing. people used to chant "lou" and hold up an L. Now it's "weis" and a W. Most people don't do it anymore because, you know. He sucks.

Who do we think the likely replacement is? The idea of Brian Kelly doesn't exactly get me fired up.

Lower academic standards and offer Urban Meyer the world. That's the only thing I can really hope for.

you hope for lowering academic standards

if you really wanted winning football that bad you should have gone to a public school

just become a basketball fan, private schools can still compete

you hope for lowering academic standards

if you really wanted winning football that bad you should have gone to a public school

Honestly I don't think they're all that high to begin with. I don't know what the issue is.

Someone needs to come in and win some goddamn games. Soon.

I dunno about Stoops either. He's shit the bed in pretty much every big game in the last few years.

I just hope whatever ND does about replacing Weis doesn't ripple out far enough to affect SEC coaching much. I don't want Meyer to leave Florida, because I'm afraid whatever domino effect ensues might sweep up Bobby Petrino in it's wake. I don't think Petrino's reputation as a job-hopper is all that fair...but I'm still going to worry when better opportunities are out there for him. I just hope Arkansas gets at least a couple more years out of the guy if he's gonna bail. He's already brought us right back to where Nutt had us when he left (Nutt was 7-4 at this point in his final season at Ark), and if Ryan Mallett comes back next year, Arkansas is going to make a serious run at the SEC championship (and won't flame out like Ole Miss did this year).

So yeah, Charlie Weis's fuckups better not affect my team.

hey how about the oregon game

That is a really ignorant thing to say this season.

You're just bitter because you guys might still lose to the beavers and play in a December bowl because you DON'T PLAY ANY DEFENSE.

I'm just being an asshole, and ya'll did shut down Cal...but the Pac-10 poor-defense stereotype is still alive and kicking with good reason.

wooo celebration

^you should get bi up on that shit

i thought i posted that in the pic thread

whoops

Honestly I don't think they're all that high to begin with.

that's just the general lowering of standards across the board because each generation since the boom is dumber than the last

i mean think about this, ND still has higher standards for most universities these days and i know you have classes with people where you're just like <i>how the fuck did you make it this far, stop devaluing my degree you fucking chimpanzee.</i>

like those fucking anuses in my history seminar classes what all they could do was talk about roman warfare. like anything comes up and they reference like some campaign or another and it's like I THOUGHT YOU STUDIED HISTORY WAR DOESN'T SOLVE FUCKING ANYTHING YOU MOTHERFUCKING MONKEY

or those fucking 20 something assholes that can reference naval ship call numbers like they served in the pacific theater. LOOK YOU SHITSTAIN I'M GOING TO KILL YOU. SOON.

before anyone says anything i know that as a stoner who smoked his way to a college degree that i am more than likely one of those people devaluing the bachelor's degree but lord and heaven at least i have more sense than those fucks

and yes i am drunk right now i still can't believe there is a bar on earth that has newcastle for $2 that isn't in FUCKING NEWCASTLE

wow. ha actually in Newcastle it'd probably be 2 quid which would be like 4 fucking bucks.

texas fight.

a&m will be scary next year if they can get their defense together.

Danielson is taking Tebow worship to new levels today

Danielson is taking Tebow worship to new levels today

Thank God we only have to suffer through one more game of that after this one.

I'm pretty pumped for Arkansas/LSU tonight. If Arkansas wins, then the bowl situation in the SEC is going to get real interesting. With Ole Miss pulling a classic Houston Nutt special against MSU today, there could be three 8-4 (4-4) teams in the SEC west. I'd be thrilled if the Hogs had a legit shot at the Capital One bowl, but hopefully the Cotton Bowl is the worst they can do now.

I'm pretty pumped for Arkansas/LSU tonight. If Arkansas wins, then the bowl situation in the SEC is going to get real interesting. With Ole Miss pulling a classic Houston Nutt special against MSU today, there could be three 8-4 (4-4) teams in the SEC west. I'd be thrilled if the Hogs had a legit shot at the Capital One bowl, but hopefully the Cotton Bowl is the worst they can do now.

It must be nice to be in a conference with more than two decent bowls. The pac-10 has such crap bowl arrangements.

ugggggggggggh

i guess it's a fitting end. also, jim harbaugh is a fucking whiny douche.

jim harbaugh is a winner

wrong thread but holy shit, VY taking down Arizona today with a 99 yard drive with 2 minutes left.

cya later charlie

wrong thread but holy shit, VY taking down Arizona today with a 99 yard drive with 2 minutes left.

i knows i seed it wif my own 2 is

that stanford game was SO satisfying. i love nothing more than to watch notre dame lose

that stanford game was SO satisfying. i love nothing more than to watch notre dame lose

I know, It is weird because I have developed such a pure disdain for this team and I have no idea why. None of my teams are rivals with them or anything - but I just love seeing them lose.

and as long as people love to see them lose, they'll remain relevant and have a shot at coming back.

you just watch. goddamn it.

this really is a pretty nice place though. there's a pretty high level of arrogance in certain segments of the student body/administration... but on the whole i still don't get the incredible level of disdain people have for it.

but then again i don't get the impression that anyone feels similarly about ND basketball or anything. so maybe something else is at work here.

I think we just watch the highlights because college football live jacks off to Notre Dame's misery

I think we just watch the highlights because college football live jacks off to Notre Dame's misery

Chicken/egg

Chicken/egg

I have a hard boiled egg stuck in my anus, what should I do?? - Yahoo! Answers (http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080713224534AAifLCP)

i hate notre dame because they're the ultimate front runner bandwagon team, not that you're a front runner or bandwagoner Eulogy because you go there it's why i don't level personal insults at you because of your college affiliation

i mean in the 90s they were the front runner's dream. pretty good team that you can watch every week on TV. now, it's just funny. Brian Kelly? LOL ND is really in the dumpster if they can't get anyone from a major school to come to coach them. Brian Kelly, what a fucking joke.

I can't hate ND if they get Kelly he's a class act and a great coach and he would surely lead them to 10 wins a year against their cupcake schedule

Stoops rumors were all over today. And based on his comments, I think there's a shot. He's been so goddamn wishy-washy.

"Well why won't you just say no?"

"I don't like the way you worded it."

I mean come the fuck on. Have we learned nothing in the past few years?

I can't hate ND if they get Kelly he's a class act and a great coach and he would surely lead them to 10 wins a year against their cupcake schedule

ND's schedule is no more cupcake than any other team. Seriously.

At least it wasn't until the 7-home game thing. Which is so fucking dumb I don't even know where to begin. But the teams ND plays are fine. USC and Michigan every year. BC most years. I have difficulty classifying Navy as a cupcake (not just because they've beaten us). Pitt was top-25 (at least) this year. Stanford beat two top-10 teams. MSU is not a perennial cupcake (unless you wanna throw the entire Big 10 under the bus).

But hey you're right, I bet ND couldn't handle FIU, North Texas, and Chattanooga. Give me a fucking break.

But I don't want Kelly. Give me some goddamn defense.

ND doesn't even have conference play that's the whole point

ND doesn't even have conference play that's the whole point

What does that have to do with the strength of their schedule? Your argument makes no sense.

Next.

Dude even Lou Holtz said on Sportscenter last night that anyone should be able to get 9 or 10 wins with Notre Dame's schedule which he said was "conducive to winning"

yes but lou holtz is a fucking idiot and a total homer. he's fucking awful.

total homer.
...which is the point

Dude even Lou Holtz said on Sportscenter last night that anyone should be able to get 9 or 10 wins with Notre Dame's schedule which he said was "conducive to winning"

He also said Notre Dame would be in the National Championship game this year.

The schedule this year is easier than the last two years, but jesus christ. Stop listening to people on TV and LOOK AT IT.

Sagarin (I know it's just one system but it's a pretty reputable one) has ND's schedule 24th.

Alabama's 27th. Really just get off this track. It doesn't lead anywhere.

...which is the point

what point do you have there? That a homer boy that thinks ND is a top 25 program every year thinks their schedule is easy? I'd be surprised if Lou knew anything about any one of the teams on their schedule.

Stop listening to people on TV and LOOK AT IT.

and yeah this

watching sportscenter does not an expert make

When did I say anything about Alabama

the point is a homer is the last person to admit their schedule is weak

Sagarin (I know it's just one system but it's a pretty reputable one) has ND's schedule 24th.

Alabama's 27th. Really just get off this track. It doesn't lead anywhere.

in case this was missed

I don't care what the rankings say man all I know is an elite football program would handily win 10 of those games

When did I say anything about Alabama

the point is a homer is the last person to admit their schedule is weak

not really

a homer on the line of lou holtz doesn't think anyone can stand toe to toe with ND if they're properly coached so any schedule would be "weak" to him

also he knows less than nothing about teams that are not notre dame and nothing about ND when you get down to it so, in sum, he knows nothing at all.

i think he was a good coach once 70 years ago

I don't care what the rankings say man all I know is an elite football program would handily win 10 of those games

any elite program would handily win 10 games of any current division I schedule.

you're flailing pretty embarrassingly here.

hey trots hows it feel to be on the doorsteps of an SEC dismantling

I don't care what the rankings say man all I know is an elite football program would handily win 10 of those games

thank you captain obvious

not really

a homer on the line of lou holtz doesn't think anyone can stand toe to toe with ND if they're properly coached so any schedule would be "weak" to him

also he knows less than nothing about teams that are not notre dame and nothing about ND when you get down to it so, in sum, he knows nothing at all.

i think he was a good coach once 70 years ago

hey now

#1 in '88 and #2 in '93 (second to a team he beat, no less). I will always have a soft spot for him. But he has massive horse blinders on when saying anything about ND.

i think he has knowledge of the game of football like the xes and os and how to motivate people but that doesn't mean he actually knows anything about different teams and how good they are at this stage

i think all of these guys just blow it out of their ass

I wish ND would show up on Bama's schedule. They had some good games back in the day and we are the two most successful franchises in NCAA history.

eulogy i am now drunk and i offer my apologies and i will reiterate my hope for brian kelly to become your coach and bring you glory

This board has no soul there is fucking college football out the ass this week where are your hearts men!

Chomp Chomp, motherfucker. 'Bama's got no shot today.

Rest of my picks in games that matter:

Pitt
Texas

Is that it?

USC

Georgia Tech

Florida doesn't look so good now that the SEC has no vested interest in helping them win anymore.

Also, LOL at USC. Bet Carroll wishes he wouldn't have pulled that stunt at the end of the UCLA game now that karma has swung back around on him.

No offense Eulogy, but I kinda hope your predictions for the rest of the day go just as well as they have thus far. I'd love to see Texas lose.

Wow I fucked up today

ROLL TIDE MOTHERFUCKERS

good luck tonight Texas fans. Rather play you than TCU.

TEXAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nebraska should have won that game. Go figure their idiot kicker kicks the ball out of bounds after the Huskers take the lead with barely over a minute left, giving Texas great field position to set up the game-winning field goal as time expires.

The Legend of Colt McCoy becomes complete in Pasadena in January...NOT! 'Bama takes it all in the Title Game.

TEXAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

was that game really worth getting excited about? watching alabama and then watching texas was pretty.... surprising.

do you have anything to say for yourself eulogy

do you have anything to say for yourself eulogy

probably my worst performance of all time. at least I got two right.

was that game really worth getting excited about?

no

that final offensive play was the worst call i have ever seen

i'm buying beers to whoever comes to my house for the game

college football is lame, coaches get paid way too much by public universities, and i hardly follow it anymore but i'm still better at picking who will win against the spread than almost all of you

I won both the Netphoria pickem and my family one (in which 15 people participated)

Fuck you

was that game really worth getting excited about? watching alabama and then watching texas was pretty.... surprising.

The "pundits" need to remember these games: Alabama-LSU, Alabama-Tennessee and Alabama-Auburn before they continue all this mess about Texas not being deserving of the title game. This season is looking so much like 2005, it's not funny.

And we all know how that turned out.

I say shut up and let em play boys

The "pundits" need to remember these games: Alabama-LSU, Alabama-Tennessee and Alabama-Auburn before they continue all this mess about Texas not being deserving of the title game.

This is a fair point.

Also

Clausen and Tate gone.

Do I smell another 3-9 campaign?!

For the sake of argument, however...

LSU is a very good team. Any argument that a close game with them is evidence of weakness is pretty desperate.

Tennessee has a fantastic defense and Bama was up something like 12-3 with 2 or three minutes remaining. They got back in on an uncharacteristic fumble from Ingram and a miraculous onside kick. Not saying it was a great game for Bama but its not like Tennessee was ever in a great position until the very end.

Auburn was a rivalry game which is a cliche to say but there have been many times Bama or Auburn was undefeated and had their season spoiled. And the way McElroy finished with the drive at the end was stellar.

For the sake of argument, however...

LSU is a very good team. Any argument that a close game with them is evidence of weakness is pretty desperate.

Tennessee has a fantastic defense and Bama was up something like 12-3 with 2 or three minutes remaining. They got back in on an uncharacteristic fumble from Ingram and a miraculous onside kick. Not saying it was a great game for Bama but its not like Tennessee was ever in a great position until the very end.

Auburn was a rivalry game which is a cliche to say but there have been many times Bama or Auburn was undefeated and had their season spoiled. And the way McElroy finished with the drive at the end was stellar.

Nebraska has the most dominating defense (and player) in football, and Texas was playing field position the whole game. It almost bit them in the ass, but they managed to pull it out.

Texas' close games with Oklahoma and A&M are intense rivalries, too, so you can chalk all the games up equally.

My point is Alabama hasn't picked up these lofty superior wins that so many are giving them credit for in relation to Texas. They both beat who they played, pulled out wins while struggling and finished their job.

Now we sit back for 30 days and salivate at the thought of Texas beating the ever living fuck out of Alabama and it's fake 12 "national championships."

I never questioned Texas's worthiness of the title game. I was just defending your attacks.

What did Bama ever do to you? Geez. Are all Texas fans so brazen?

My point is Alabama hasn't picked up these lofty superior wins that so many are giving them credit for in relation to Texas. They both beat who they played, pulled out wins while struggling and finished their job.


They sure as shit got one lofty and superior win. Did you watch that game Saturday? I was a Bama doubter until I watched that game.

I don't see Texas pulling it out. :-/

They sure as shit got one lofty and superior win. Did you watch that game Saturday? I was a Bama doubter until I watched that game.

I don't see Texas pulling it out. :-/

There was little doubt in my mind Florida would lose that game - Florida hasn't been that great all year and without their defensive star it was evident. The offense struggled throughout the year to find a rhythm against solid defenses, and Alabama chewed them up all game it appeared (didn't get to watch hardly any of it).

I have nothing against Alabama, just love the Longhorns and hate the SEC and Nick Saban cocksuckers. I do have a problem with Alabama claiming all those titles, but we've discussed that in depth already.

I think it'll be a great game, an offensive struggle, and Texas is able to win because the Legend of Colt is a force that cannot be stopped. :)

I think it'll be a great game, an offensive struggle, and Texas is able to win because the Legend of Colt is a force that cannot be stopped. :)

As long as he keeps his eye on the clock lolol

Nah I think it'll be a good game. Texas is 3-0 in BCS games, yeah?

3-0, yep (the Fiesta Bowl vs. Ohio State and the two Rose Bowls (Michigan, USC).

That play at the end was bizarro world, considering they are always so exact with the clock and play calling. I am curious if Colt was fully aware of his surroundings as that game progressed, because he was doing stuff he has never done (wild overthrows, weird runs, etc). He got knocked hard all game.

This season is looking so much like 2005, it's not funny.

lol whut

Are all Texas fans so brazen?

everyone but me, yes.

i mean i think sppunk has some kind of archetypal idea of texas that doesn't exist. this team really is not as good as 2005 and have frequently struggled to establish offense against decent teams because of the total lack of any respectable ground game.

defense is lights out but there's two major problems with the offense 1) no running game, 2) poor protection, that will spell absolute doom for them against Alabama.

I won both the Netphoria pickem and my family one (in which 15 people participated)

Fuck youI came in second in the Netphoria one and I don't even follow the sport that much

You were the only other one who kept playing because I was dominating and everyone quit

for that I give you props

I was in second place the whole way

lol whut

No one gave Texas a chance in hell to beat USC, and no one is giving Texas a chance ib hell to beat Alabama.

Texas hasn't had a running game (minus the qb) since Benson left.

god shut up nimrod

No one gave Texas a chance in hell to beat USC, and no one is giving Texas a chance ib hell to beat Alabama.

Texas hasn't had a running game (minus the qb) since Benson left.

Only problem is that Colt McCoy is no Vince Young.

If Bama comes out and plays like they did in the SEC Championship, there's no way it'll even be close. But Bama has had a slight tendency to be caught flat-footed at times (Utah last year, Tennessee and Auburn this year). That'll be what Texas has to hope for.

I think Bama rolls either way. Better resume, better coaching.

sppunk:

vince young was a great running game

colt mccoy is not

also, selvin young was a lot better than this collection of nobodies these days. he did play NFL football, which is more than i can say for whoever is playing lately.

and you're also wrong (shocker) jamaal charles was a great back, post Benson.

and i'm glad you ignored the fact that any time the Texas O-Line goes up against at top D-Line they get knocked around, Colt gets rattled, and the rest of the game is mostly trying to keep him upright long enough to throw a shovel pass.

sppunk:

vince young was a great running game

colt mccoy is not

also, selvin young was a lot better than this collection of nobodies these days. he did play NFL football, which is more than i can say for whoever is playing lately.

and you're also wrong (shocker) jamaal charles was a great back, post Benson.

I said running back, not a running qb. Totally forgot about Charles, but they didn't use Young as they should have in my opinion.

The o-line is the biggest offensive issue, by far.

yeah but i said running game

so

Brian Kelly. meh. Better than fucking EDSALL though. I can't believe that name was being floated.

i hope suh gets the heisman.

i hope suh gets the heisman.

Anyone but Tebow or McCoy, and I'll be okay with it.

But especially not Tebow the crybaby. (I'm still waiting for him to do the good Christian thing and give back the trophy he stole from Darren McFadden a couple years ago.)

Tebow's a little bitch. But it's hard not to appreciate the way he played throughout his career. The best all-around college football player since Vince Young, imo.

Tebow is a pretty good player whose strengths have been excellently utilized by his coach, nothing more. He couldn't hold Vince Young's jock, IMO.

oh come on. a coach can't run the plays for him.

it's painful for me to give him credit but i think he deserves it.

although he went out with quite a whimper last week.

oh come on. a coach can't run the plays for him.

it's painful for me to give him credit but i think he deserves it.

although he went out with quite a whimper last week.

I give him credit for executing the plays. But I just think those plays are designed to put him in the very best position to succeed at all times. I don't mean to say that the guy is not a solid QB and a good player. I just don't think his production would be nearly what it is if he were in any other offense on any other team.

I just have never been amazed by Tebow's play. IMO, he's pretty boring to watch. I always think of the greats as guys who could pull rabbits out of their hat and make your jaw drop.

I give him credit for executing the plays. But I just think those plays are designed to put him in the very best position to succeed at all times. I don't mean to say that the guy is not a solid QB and a good player. I just don't think his production would be nearly what it is if he were in any other offense on any other team.

I just have never been amazed by Tebow's play. IMO, he's pretty boring to watch. I always think of the greats as guys who could pull rabbits out of their hat and make your jaw drop.

I think a guy who's just about automatic in 3rd-and-short situations is more important than a guy who makes your jaw drop. It's a different sort of greatness, sure, but still greatness, I think.

leave it to corganist to bash tebow's ability

Mark Ingram, eh? Too bad.

leave it to corganist to bash tebow's ability

He'll be lucky if his ability allows him to wear a headset on an NFL sideline, much less sniff the field in an NFL game that counts for anything.

The guy is a good college QB who has played in a great system while surrounded by outstanding talent. I'm not bashing his ability, but I'm not going to overhype it either. Tebow hasn't been great so much as he's been fortunate.

Ingram was as good a choice as any.

hmm remember what happened last time the running back from the team facing texas in the national championship won the heisman?

He'll be lucky if his ability allows him to wear a headset on an NFL sideline, much less sniff the field in an NFL game that counts for anything.

The guy is a good college QB who has played in a great system while surrounded by outstanding talent. I'm not bashing his ability, but I'm not going to overhype it either. Tebow hasn't been great so much as he's been fortunate.

They're completely different games. His potential in the NFL has nothing to do with this conversation.

I'll see you in January Turdillion

Hope you can handle us, we're no Mountain West team.

Alabama's no Conference USA team

Regarding Tennessee's hostesses:

Also on Friday, Keith Easterwood, a veteran summer basketball coach, said that on a visit last year with his son, a football recruit, he had to ask a hostess to stop brushing her breasts against both him and his son.
He recalled saying, “Young lady, if you don’t stop doing that, we’ve got a problem.”

Easterwood said that he took a group of basketball players to a Western Kentucky football game at Tennessee this year, and that the presence of the hostesses had his players “literally reduced to blubbering idiots.”

“I’ve been up there five times, four for football and one basketball visit,” Easterwood said. “My observation is that this is a very organized operation. These girls have obviously been groomed. There’s a lot of eye contact and touching.”

Source (http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/the_sporting_blog/entry/view/47529/lane_kiffin,_confusing_concern_for_compliments)

Sorry, but Ingram was the fourth most deserving of those five candidates.

Sorry, but Ingram was the fourth most deserving of those five candidates.

How would you have ranked them?

My list:

Suh
Ingram
Gerhart
McCoy
Tebow

Alabama's no Conference USA team

ummm, yeah but Texas didn't embarrassingly lose to a Conference USA team.

ummm, yeah but Texas didn't embarrassingly lose to a Conference USA team.

oh i see what you did there

i don't think there's any shame in losing to that utah team last year. i don't understand the overconfidence from you and sppunk. unless you're just trying to psych yourselves into believing.

It's not overconfidence, it's just rooting for your team. Alabama had a couple of really close calls this year against average competition, they're far from unbeatable.

10 reasons why Texas wins:

10. The Alabama pass defense
The Tide finished seventh in the nation against the pass allowing just 164 yards per game while it led the nation in pass efficiency defense. While that sounds impressive, the defense only faced one bomber of a quarterback, Ryan Mallett of Arkansas. While the Hog sophomore started out the season with two great games, this was only his third game with the team (he completed 12-of-35 passes for 160 yards and a touchdown with a pick). South Carolina’s Stephen Garcia had some success, but he couldn’t get his Gamecocks into the end zone, Ole Miss QB Jevan Snead had a lousy year (Bama doesn’t deserve too much credit for shutting him down), and Tim Tebow threw for 247 yards.

While the Tide defensive back seven is talented, Arkansas was the only team on the schedule ranked in the top 43 among passing teams (the Hogs were ranked tenth). Florida is fifth in the nation in passing efficiency (and Tebow had a decent 120.1 rating in the title game) and Auburn 18th (Chris Todd’s rating was 139.2), but the rest of the SEC teams are ranked 40th or lower. Colt McCoy didn’t have his most efficient season, and he struggled against Nebraska throwing three picks, but he’s too good to come up with another clunker.

9. The Texas run defense
Texas finished No. 1 in the nation in run defense allowing just 61 yards per game and gave up just five touchdowns. Only three teams got over 85 yards on the ground while Oklahoma finished with -16 net, Nebraska came up with just 67 and UTEP, led by star Donald Buckram, finished with just nine. Alabama has to be able to run well to win, and it has to be able to dominate with the offensive line. Florida could be shoved around if punched in the mouth a bit, while Texas is more physical up front.

8. Terrence Cody isn’t Ndamukong Suh
It’ll be tempting to assume that Cody, Bama’s terrific defensive tackle, will start rag-dolling the interior of the Texas offensive line just like Suh did in the Big 12 title game. But Cody and Suh play two different games and Texas will be facing a far different line. Suh is more of a playmaker and a pass rusher who works well in open space, while Cody is a space-eater who anchors the rest of the defense. Cody doesn’t have a sack on the year and has just six tackles for loss on the season; Suh had seven tackles for loss in one game against the Horns.

7. Utah
Yes, it’s a different year and there are different circumstances, but the Horns can learn a lot from the 2009 Sugar Bowl. Alabama was down after the loss to Florida in last year’s SEC Championship, didn’t have Andre Smith at tackle, and didn’t appear to be interested from moment one, but Utah had a lot to do with the butt-kicking.

The Utes came out with an up-tempo offense, was in a great rhythm from the start, and sold out on defense to get into the backfield. The Longhorns have the best pass rush Bama has faced, and that includes Ole Miss, and while they’ve been great at getting into the backfield all season long, they got better as the season wore on with 20 sacks in the final five games along with 42 tackles for loss. Granted, there was only one sack and four tackles for loss against Nebraska, but there wasn’t any need to get to the quarterback of an attack that managed just 106 yards of total offense. Like Utah of last year, Texas has a senior quarterback who knows what he’s doing, a dangerous receiving corps, and the potential to come out storming.

6. The Heisman factor
Teams full of 18-to-22-year-old kids always go for the easy motivation, and when they have a prize of a Heisman winner to stop, and with weeks to prepare, they tend to shut down the star and/or get the win in the bowl. The trend doesn’t lie.

2008 Heisman winner – Sam Bradford, Oklahoma. Loss to Florida.
2007 Heisman winner – Tim Tebow, Florida. Loss to Michigan.
2006 Heisman winner – Troy Smith, Ohio State. Loss to Florida.
2005 Heisman winner – Reggie Bush, USC. Loss to Texas.
2004 Heisman winner – Matt Leinart, USC. Win over Oklahoma.
2003 Heisman winner – Jason White, Oklahoma. Loss to LSU.
2002 Heisman winner – Carson Palmer, USC. Win over Iowa.
2001 Heisman winner – Eric Crouch, Nebraska. Loss to Miami.
2000 Heisman winner – Chris Weinke, Florida State. Loss to Oklahoma.

Going back further, the Heisman winners rocked in the 1990s, but in this decade they’re just 2-7 in bowl games and 1-6 in national championships. Of course, Alabama knows this and Mark Ingram should be ready, but that doesn’t mean he’s not going to be a marked man.

5. “Nobody respects us … “
This is like a great fastball; you know it’s coming, but you still might not be able to hit it. Alabama has already heard about how it has to guard against overconfidence and has already heard about how Texas is going to feel disrespected. That doesn’t mean that the Longhorns still won’t come out with a little bit of an edge and a little more nastiness than a Tide team that might be thinking deep down that blasting away against Florida decided the real national championship. Alabama made Tim Tebow cry and it’s going to worry about a Texas team that couldn’t stop Texas A&M and couldn’t produce offensively against Nebraska? The other problem might be Nick Saban as the favorite.

Under Saban, his underdog LSU team shocked Tennessee in the 2001 SEC Championship, and even with the win, Illinois was still ranked higher going into the Sugar Bowl. LSU won easily. The Tigers lost the 2003 Cotton Bowl to Texas, and then in the 2003 season were a 6.5-point underdog in the 2004 Sugar Bowl against Oklahoma. They won the national title. The next year, LSU was a 6.5-point favorite over Iowa in the Capital One Bowl and lost. Florida was favored in last year’s SEC Championship, but it was ranked fourth in the BCS while Bama was No. 1 (the Gators won), and the Tide was an 11-point favorite against Utah in the Sugar Bowl (and lost). This year, as the underdog against Florida in the SEC title game the Tide pulled off the win. Got all of that?

In the biggest of the big games, Saban, with the higher ranked team and as the favorite, won the 2007 Independence Bowl over Colorado and destroyed Georgia in the 2003 SEC Championship. But the track record hasn’t been strong when he’s coaching the team that’s supposed to get the win.

4. Colt McCoy is better than Greg McElroy
Can McElroy do it again? The late drive for the win over Auburn appeared to have sparked his confidence and he was magnificent against Florida completing 12-of-18 passes for 239 yards and a score. But now the Longhorns will get time to prepare for him.

It’s not like the Florida game was a fluke; McElroy was strong against Virginia Tech, Arkansas, and LSU, and he has only thrown one interception in his last six games, but he’s not Colt McCoy.

Granted, he wasn’t supposed to be Tim Tebow, either, and he outplayed the Gator star. But McCoy is every bit the winner that McElroy is (he’s the winningest starting quarterback in NCAA history), and he has been phenomenal in the three bowl games throwing for 308 yards and two scores in the 2006 Alamo Bowl win over Iowa, completed 21-of-31 passes for 174 yards in the easy win over Arizona State in the 2007 Holiday Bowl, and completed 41-of-58 passes for 414 yards and two touchdowns, including the game-winner in the final seconds, to beat Ohio State in the 2009 Fiesta Bowl. He has won all three of his bowl games, threw only one pick, and ran for two touchdowns.

3. Air travel
If you’re a believer in trends and historical tendencies, this one is for you.

Non-SEC fans always beef about how the SEC never travels anywhere. Here’s why …
2003 - at Hawaii 37 – Alabama 29
2002 - Alabama 21 - at Hawaii16
2000 - at UCLA 35 – Alabama 24
1991 - Fiesta Bowl Louisville 34 – Alabama 7

Since the 1985 24-3 Aloha Bowl win over USC, Alabama has taken a really long plane trip west four times and was 1-3. Yes, it’s a quirky trend, but it shows that the program just isn’t used to going anywhere far. Now compare Bama’s trips to what Texas has done under Mack Brown.

2009 Fiesta Bowl – Texas 24 – Ohio State 21.
2007 Holiday Bowl – Texas 52 – Arizona State 34
2006 Rose Bowl – Texas 41 – USC 38
2005 - Texas 25 – at Ohio State 22 (not a West Coast trip, but still a long, tough road game)
2005 Rose Bowl – Texas 38 – Michigan 37
2003 Holiday Bowl – Washington State 28 – Texas 20
2001 Holiday Bowl – Texas 47 – Washington 43

For what it’s worth, Texas is 6-1 on long trips to big games since 2001 and Brown is 2-0 in Pasadena. Speaking of trends …

2. The No. 2 vs. No. 1 thing
Go back to the disrespect factor, call it a quirk, whatever. A trend is a trend is a trend …

2009 BCS Championship – No. 2 Florida over No. 1 Oklahoma
2008 BCS Championship – No. 2 LSU over No. 1 Ohio State
2007 BCS Championship – No. 2 Florida over No. 1 Ohio State
2006 Rose Bowl – No. 2 Texas over No. 1 USC
2005 Orange Bowl – No. 1 USC over No. 2 Oklahoma
2004 Sugar Bowl – No. 2 LSU over No. 1 Oklahoma
2003 Fiesta Bowl – No. 2 Ohio State over No. 1 Miami

From 1999 to 2002 the BCS No. 1 beat the BCS No. 2, but the recent trend is alarming. Chalk it up to Oklahoma and Ohio State being overrated, or call it the No. 2 team feeling disrespected, but going 6-1 in the last seven games is a serious streak. Throw in the Heisman factor, and 2004 USC bucked the odds.

1. Texas really is good
It’s not like this is Oklahoma or Ohio State of the past few seasons and is getting another shot after disappointing America in previous big games, and it’s not like this is Boise State; a great team in a bad conference. The Big 12 might be awful this year, and Texas didn’t exactly extend itself in non-conference play, but this is a loaded team that’s keeping a tremendous roll going. The Longhorns have won 26 of their last 27 games, with the one loss coming on the all-timer of a Michael Crabtree touchdown, and have won 75 of their last 84 games with three of the losses coming to Oklahoma, one to a national title Ohio State team, and two to arch-rival Texas A&M. Under Mack Brown, Texas has nine straight double-digit win seasons with four straight bowl victories. This is one of the powerhouses of all powerhouses, and you don’t get to this point without being really good, and without knowing how to sidestep a few dozen landmines.

No longer is this the program full of underachieving talents with a questionable tactician as the head coach. Texas is loaded with a tremendous mix of star veterans and big-time young talents, and they have all the speed and skill of Alabama, all the offensive firepower, all the defensive toughness, and they have the ability to be the national champion.

Don’t focus on the Texas A&M and Nebraska games. The real measure of how good this team is might have come in the middle of the season with road stompings of Missouri and Oklahoma State. Those were two of the best four teams in the conference (Nebraska being the other) and the Longhorns won by a combined score of 82 to 21 in games that weren’t even that close. Yes, Texas A&M got hot and got the offense rolling, and Texas still won by double-digits. Yes, it took a slight-miracle of a timekeeping error and a bomb of a field goal to beat Nebraska, but that wasn’t any less shaky than Alabama needing two blocked field goals to beat Tennessee at home or a big late drive to get by Auburn.

You left out the part where Saban never loses when he has this long to prepare for his opponent

oh and you don't need Suh when you have a guy named Rolando McClain to complement Cody

You left out the part where Saban never loses when he has this long to prepare for his opponent


oh Hush there was like A MONTH before the Utah game and they got stomped.

Yeah that game sucked but we still had Shula's recruits who don't give a shit and gave up on the season after the FL loss

These teams are pretty even in any case, I don't like you poking your nose through every insignificant stat to try and pretend one team is better than the other. We won't know until January.

How would you have ranked them?



My list:

Gerhart
Suh
McCoy
Ingram

Now I watched about 4 games of Gerhart, and never saw Suh - so those two might be switched if I actually had to do a little homework.

Notice I omitted someone who got only a third of the votes of everyone else and should never have gone to New York.

You realize Ingram has 6.3 YPC and Gerhart has like 5.3 YPC

Also he sat out about half a game three times because Bama was blowing out opponents

And he still had like 80 yards on 7 or 8 carries those times

Look at the finalists:

Toby Gerhart,Stanford - His counting stats are good, especially the TDs!

ATTEMPTS YARDS TOUCHDOWNS
311 1,736 26
Gerhart is not a receiving threat with 149 receiving yards, total of 1885 yards from scrimmage.

C.J. Spiller, Clemson - Not the stats Gerhart and Ingram put up, he did score a TD in every game.

ATTEMPTS YARDS TOUCHDOWNS
201 1,145 11
Mark Ingram, Alabama - You know him and his stats:

ATTEMPTS YARDS TOUCHDOWNS
249 1,542 15
Of course you throw in the 322 receiving yards for1864 yards from scrimmage.

I don't think there's any harm in ruling out Spiller here. I don't see him beating out Ingram or Gerhart. In total yards from scrimmage, Ingram and Gerhart are basically tied. So, looking at just the rushing,

YPC

Ingram: 6.2 YPC

Gerhart: 5.6 YPC

Edge is clearly to Ingram

TDs:

Ingram: 15

Gerhart: 26

Edge is to Gerhart, though I'd love to have the time to see how many TDs for both backs were short yardage (i.e. cheapies), which would have gone to other backs on Bama.

Competition:

Here the balance is extremely one sided. The toughest defense Gerhart faced was ranked #20 by FEI in Oregon. Overall he faced 4 teams with defenses between 20 and 30 in his season, rushing for 649 yards (162/game) on 122 carries (5.3 YPC).

Ingram, on the other hand, faced 6 defenses ranked in the top 20(!) during the year. During those games, he ran for 924 yards (154 YPG) on 146 carries (6.3 YPC).

Once again, the edge is fairly clearly on Ingram's side here.

Top games:

Top games for both players came against top defenses, with Gerhart running for 223 yards on 38(!) attempts (5.8 YPC) against #20 defense Oregon, while Ingram ran for 246 on 24 (10.25) against the #9 Defense SC. Ingram once again clearly had the best top game.

Worst game:

Here, Gerhart's worst game was quite a bit better than Ingram's worst one, where Gerhart had a game of 82 yards on 17 carries (4.8 YPC) against Wake (not a great defense in case you were wondering), while Ingram had the totally inexplicable Auburn game, running for only 30 yards on 16 attempts (1.9 YPC). Even though it was a tougher defense, you can't rule this one in anyone's favor but Gerhart's.

Overall:

While Gerhart has the more total rushing yards, when receiving yards are considered, Ingram ties him. Although Gerhart has more yards per game, Ingram has a much superior YPC. Gerhart has more TDs, but Ingram played against far superior competition. Overall, any close look at the numbers shows Ingram has been a better RB all year than Gerhart, or any other RB for that matter. Gerhart was run to death with a huge attempt count, but he did not as effectively as Ingram.

I think Gerhart might win tonight, based on first of all the fact that Ingram's worst game was the second to last of the season, and second of all because I sense a kind of anti-Bama sentiment in the air. Sort of a desire to recognize another team's accomplishments, since Alabama has the SEC Championship and a good shot at the NC. I'd much rather win the NC than Ingram win any award, but In think the overall picture is clear. Ingram is the superior back.

dogfighter you were telling me the other day how ingram is not qualified to be the heisman winner wtf

I thought Gerhart might have the edge and either would have been a good choice. But to say Ingram is fourth (especially when you put your own team's back with at the very least EQUAL stats) is homer central for Mr. Pac 10.

I thought Gerhart might have the edge and either would have been a good choice. But to say Ingram is fourth (especially when you put your own team's back with at the very least EQUAL stats) is homer central for Mr. Pac 10.

Get your facts stright - my "own team's" back is Oregon's LaMichael James who played less than Ingram and had more rushing yards, more YPC and TDs. He's better than Ingram too, but I wouldn't put James on the heisman ballot either. It has nothing to do with the idea that Gerhart is on a Pac-10 team. The fact is, I've seen him four or five times, and he is an absolutely incredible running back. Reminds me of Ron Dayne's style. And his statistics back it up.

Please respond to the fact that Ingram has more YPC and his team is better

Please respond to the fact that Ingram has more YPC and his team is better

His team is better:
The award claims to be for the best player. Not the best player on ____ team criteria. In fact, playing on a team with 6 other all-americans, probably makes the case for others all the more stronger - as they had a lot less help. But really - all of that should be moot - it's an individual award.

Has more YPC:
YPC carry is not the only relevant statistic. There were other backs with better numbers (YPC) than Ingram.

It's not overconfidence, it's just rooting for your team.

i must be an untroo fan then for having realistic expectations

Yeah, I think Texas wins but it'll be a hell of a struggle.

Yeah, I think Texas wins but it'll be a hell of a struggle.

It will be like giving birth. It will be beautiful.

You guys wanna put something on the line?

How about, if Bama wins, all three of you have to have Nick Saban avatars for a month.

Texas wins, and I'll have an avatar of your choice for a month.

You in?