View Full Version : Archive Update #12


D.
06-09-2009, 09:19 PM
you faggots.

T&T
06-09-2009, 09:30 PM
lol.

Shallowed
06-09-2009, 09:38 PM
Hello SP World,

I hope everyone is doing fine. We've been burning the midnight oil with the SP Archives. We've been able to track down a few things from the early days that will excite you all. The project is coming together very nicely. The biggest thing that will keep this project alive is your support. You are the audience. You are the ones reading this. You are the ones who are interested in the archives. One of the ideas we've been kicking around is to offer a pre-order for the box set. Other artists do pre-orders when they have new releases like Prince and Pearl Jam. We would need to sell a certain number of pre-orders in order for it to be a success. If we don't have enough pre-orders in a designated period of time, then the project would probably be shelved. I know that there are going to be some people out there that might wait until the set gets released to decide if they should buy it or not. We would reward those who pre-order by offering an extra disc in their set. This way there is an incentive for you to jump on the pre-sale and show us that you support the archives project.

In the past few months, I've mentioned some of the interesting things that I've found in the archives. I would like to talk about the Machina concept. There is a PMM article that was put up yesterday about the Machina mystery and some of the alchemy ideas. I went through a lot of reference material that the band used to make the artwork for the Machina album. I've come across numerous sketches by Vasily Kafanov. I even found an original painting that is found in the Machina album booklet. The reference material that I came across is really interesting. There are many works of art by Marc Chagall, and other works of art from the 15th and 16th century. If you're interested in looking at some of the art that influenced the Machina artwork, you should check out the book 'Alchemy: The Secret Art' by Stanislas Klossowski De Rola. Part working on the archives is seeing the original ideas and the thought process that went into the band's music and art. It's one chapter that is part of the big picture of the Smashing Pumpkins.

Here are some more of your questions:



Chris Morin asks: Does SP record (video and/or audio) for EVERY show they do? If so, when did they start?

The band has recorded a lot of shows. Billy even recorded the very first show at Chicago 21. There is quite a bit of material from the early days of the band. The band really started getting aggressive about recording shows and rehearsals around the time of Mellon Collie. Pretty much every single show after that has been recorded and there are also quite a few shows that were videotaped. There is video footage from many shows from the Adore tour in the archive from the Adore Documentary project.

Tom Woo asks: Are there many demos, instrumentals, or Billy solo recordings from Gish, Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie, and Adore that aren't circulating?

There is a ton! The amount of demos that are in the hands of the fan community is a very small fraction compared to what is in the archive. Just browsing through, I've seen different acoustic and alternate versions of songs that nobody knows about!

Dylan Hill asks: Is there or isn't there a live recording of Tales of a Scorched Earth?

That's a question that has been floating around the fan community for many years, but to the best of my knowledge they haven't played that one live. I've looked through the archive for a live recording, and I have yet to find one.

Thanks for your questions and comments. Please keep them rolling in, and I'll feature some of them here.

slunken
06-09-2009, 10:57 PM
Tom Woo asks: Are there many demos, instrumentals, or Billy solo recordings from Gish, Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie, and Adore that aren't circulating?

There is a ton! The amount of demos that are in the hands of the fan community is a very small fraction compared to what is in the archive. Just browsing through, I've seen different acoustic and alternate versions of songs that nobody knows about!
.


if they were smart they would start here. that's where the money is. it's a shame that they're starting where they left off with the gish box set i.e. that's all they would be able to release at this time for contractual/legal reasons.

who wants to throw a ballpark date out there for when any of this actually surfaces? archive-wise? 2010? i just wish there was more of a game plan. to me, it seems like, let's just let frank run wild through the archives and we'll see what happens. you need to start with the money-makers, not the chronological order. get your legal issues in order and then maybe you'll have the fan support you want!

dudehitscar
06-09-2009, 11:21 PM
for gods sake.. just release ONE gem we haven't heard. Everyone would stop complaining and be into the project.

slunken
06-09-2009, 11:28 PM
that's the thing that really gets my goat with this fucking money-grab archive proposal: how hard would it be to release a teaser mp3 with every other blog post or whatever?

apparently it's too hard because they don't have the legal rights to do so. therefore all these archive posts and what-not are really just brainstorming sessions. it's hard for the fan to care when there's nothing tangible (you know what i mean) to care about.

edit: not to mention that they're planning on "re-mastering" everything before it hits our ears? laaaaaaaaame. i, for one, want that original tape hiss and flat panning

T&T
06-09-2009, 11:56 PM
they don't have the legal rights
and until they get things sorted, it's just going to be a lame duck.

slunken
06-10-2009, 12:07 AM
yes and we get bitched at for not supporting what isn't there

Reyngel
06-10-2009, 12:19 AM
How many more fucking "We're making good progress" posts are there going to be before SOMETHING ACTUALLY GETS DONE

slunken
06-10-2009, 12:23 AM
my sources say "a lot"

pakula kind of had the right idea. let's turn this into a gambling site. who wants to bet that the archive posts won't go past #24 without turning into something horrendous/nonplus

edit: assuming that they haven't already?

T&T
06-10-2009, 12:23 AM
there's no reason why virgin would ever give up their ownership of billys work while he was under contract. they can use every penny they can get their grubby hands on. maybe billy is waiting for them to close shop? maybe pre-gish is all we're ever going to get out out of the archive project.
maybe the "pay for the new content" was a code for "i can't sell the old content for legal reasons, but pay for the new project and we'll let the things you want leak... have faith, bring the light"

always a mystery.

slunken
06-10-2009, 12:27 AM
cool. sign me up for "new content" as always. but until then i ain't bringin' no light, i'm here to accept it. that's how it works right? i mean, that's my position as a fan, right?

slunken
06-10-2009, 12:31 AM
also, which brings me to, what is the difference between "smashing pumpkins recordings" and "billy demos". how does that work in a legal sense? does it only matter if it was committed through the proper copyright channels (i forget the site)?

edit: for instance QAOS and Adore Demos II are considered "stolen". What does that have to do with the material that was never even submitted?

edit 2: ah, yes, Library of Congress

Slurpee
06-10-2009, 01:27 AM
You know, fuck this "maybe if we get enough interest" BS, just name the price, $100, $500, whatever, that I need to pay to get all this awesome shit. I'll pay it. Whatever you think is fair Billy for your life's work. Just decide if you're going to release it, and if yes, set the price. I'll pay it if I can. And you take a little risk in the process.

slunken
06-10-2009, 01:32 AM
just name the price, $100, $500, whatever, that I need to pay to get all this awesome shit. I'll pay it. Whatever you think is fair Billy for your life's work. Just decide if you're going to release it, and if yes, set the price. I'll pay it if I can. And you take a little risk in the process.

GISH BOX SET - PLZ SUPPLY PHOTOS

Hypocaust
06-10-2009, 02:13 AM
Yeah, it was totally better when we had absolutely no contact / info from the band and everyone was bitching: "We haven't heard anything for months, what are they doing?"

T&T
06-10-2009, 03:17 AM
edit: for instance QAOS and Adore Demos II are considered "stolen".

I always suspected billy of leaking QAOS and Adore Demos II to appease older fans unsatisfied with sp2. the timing of the leak was VERY convenient .
considering the virility billy went after the stolen paris hilton photo thieves, it's odd that these alleged illigal LOC leaks never caused him to bat an eye.

Reyngel
06-10-2009, 07:14 AM
I always suspected billy of leaking QAOS and Adore Demos II to appease older fans unsatisfied with sp2. the timing of the leak was VERY convenient .
considering the virility billy went after the stolen paris hilton photo thieves, it's odd that these alleged illigal LOC leaks never caused him to bat an eye.



Hm. You may have a point. He does seem to have a track record of issues with panic an anxiety when he's confronted with the idea that he might fail. Kind of like how he "coincidentally" announced the Pumpkins' revival on the eve of his solo album's debut.

slunken
06-10-2009, 12:58 PM
Yeah, it was totally better when we had absolutely no contact / info from the band and everyone was bitching: "We haven't heard anything for months, what are they doing?"

yeah, it's way better now when we can actually confirm that they're doing nothing or they're speculating about doing something or letting us know that something may be happening in the future. omg this jist in: GOD IS GREAT!

waltermcphilp
06-10-2009, 05:01 PM
i feel like these blog posts are just stalling for more time.

not sure what for.

also, how do we preorder, was there a link?

ryoga
06-10-2009, 05:05 PM
We would need to sell a certain number of pre-orders in order for it to be a success. If we don't have enough pre-orders in a designated period of time, then the project would probably be shelved.

Great, an ultimatum. I feel like I'm kind of being bullied here. I've read and received a couple dozen letters filled with very little information and now he's telling us to pre-order or we might get nothing. Where and what exactly am I pre-ordering here? It sucks because the archives were one of the only things that was exciting me about sp and something I was more than willing to pay for.

wHATcOLOR
06-10-2009, 05:22 PM
when first reading that, i thought it was a parody. seriously, if someone were to write an satirical archive update, i'd imagine it would read just like that. a few tired figues of speech, yet more references to what other artists are doing, more minutae about things no one cares about and some old pieces of junk he found.

assuming these continue to be weekly, what number do you guys think we'll hit by the time something is released? 50? 60? 75?


also, the whole deal about "if not enough of you guys pre-order, then we'll shelve it", it's really up to him and whomever else is involved.

it comes down to three things as i see it, content, awareness (marketing), and pricing. you put compelling content on there and do a decent job of letting people know, and price it at a point that works for consumers, then you're off to the races.

f any of that up, and don't wah wah wah to us about lack of interest, it's on you. this is the stupidest, worst, most sorry excuse for a band lately, but here we all are. still. we know there's got to be some great things in there, now let's see if you can do a good job of selling it.

Slurpee
06-10-2009, 05:30 PM
I always suspected billy of leaking QAOS and Adore Demos II to appease older fans unsatisfied with sp2. the timing of the leak was VERY convenient .
considering the virility billy went after the stolen paris hilton photo thieves, it's odd that these alleged illigal LOC leaks never caused him to bat an eye.

They were not leaked. I am sure of that.

Whether Billy somehow indicated that the shadily-procured copies could be put out by the people who procured them is something I don't know, but considering the manner in which they were distributed (each track by a different username with a different IP), it is highly, highly unlikely.

topleybird
06-10-2009, 05:36 PM
when first reading that, i thought it was a parody. seriously, if someone were to write an satirical archive update, i'd imagine it would read just like that.

Wait, that's real? That's exactly the impression I had, except I never decided it was not a parody. That first paragraph is, yeah, like you say—how is that not satire? "We have been digging. We found some great stuff. We've been thinking about how to deliver the stuff to you. Other artists have done different things to deliver their stuff."

wHATcOLOR
06-10-2009, 05:57 PM
man, maybe you're right!

T&T
06-10-2009, 05:58 PM
They were not leaked. I am sure of that.

Whether Billy somehow indicated that the shadily-procured copies could be put out by the people who procured them is something I don't know, but considering the manner in which they were distributed (each track by a different username with a different IP), it is highly, highly unlikely.
secretive release techniques are an obvious tool for getting attention.
how is it you're "sure" about anything? i'm just speculating.


salty bear will only release things if esty is banned... eh. the facts we have are all conjecture.

dustrock
06-10-2009, 06:19 PM
give us your VISA information and pre-order, and maybe then we'll give you the tracklisting.

no thanks.

They could call the box set: Smashing Pumpkins - National Spanish Lottery


or Smashing Pumpkins: Frozen Nigerian Funds

Joe
06-10-2009, 06:26 PM
yeah this totally seems to be just stalling for time.

i imagine by archive realease #100 a 4 song ep will be out , with new artwork and a $50 price tag

slunken
06-10-2009, 06:33 PM
it's been confirmed that no pre-orders will take place without knowing what exactly it is you would be pre-ordering.


Quinto has already made it clear that no one will have to pre-order undefined content.



salty bear will only release things if esty is banned... eh. the facts we have are all conjecture.

i forget about this to the point where i really don't believe it anymore

slunken
06-10-2009, 06:57 PM
Peel your eyes, and next to it you will see a piece of paper with some of the song titles from Siamese Dream scribbled on it.

:rofl:

hcueva
06-10-2009, 07:20 PM
mickyshambles' parody could fool so many people, except for the crotch thing, maybe.

Someone should really hijack Quinto's e-mail identity with telnet, like in the old days, and post something like that.

wHATcOLOR
08-03-2009, 04:08 PM
we're overdue for another update!

redbull
08-03-2009, 04:44 PM
maybe this project is dead

Shallowed
08-03-2009, 05:18 PM
Maybe Quinto is dead.

Shallowed
08-03-2009, 05:18 PM
Maybe Billy is dead.

Shallowed
08-03-2009, 05:18 PM
Bumfaced.

sh sh shayne
08-03-2009, 06:08 PM
Maybe Quinto is dead.

Naw he's still on aim al the tmie