well?

im pretty good, i've got a good knack for flavour within certain cuisines, especially italian and indian

im less good at traditional cooking like pies and hotpots.

I can cook basic things but don't get much opportunity to do so or to try anything challenging. I would like to though.

i can cook very basic meals. could do more if i tried i guess. too lazy tbh.

I think i am a good cook. Last night I made eggrolls that turned out pretty good and tonight I'm making angel hair with feta and sundried tomatos.

i just made and ate some tuna steaks.

this is all new to me. so far all i've done here is pasta, chicken breasts, and now the tuna. pretty hard to fuck those things up.

You'd be surprised.

angel hair with feta and sundried tomatos.

I'd say pick one or the other unless you really like salty.

I'd say feta with fresh tomatoes, olive oil, and mushrooms maybe.

I'm pretty good but not pretty awesome so I will refrain from voting.

I'm pretty good but not pretty awesome so I will refrain from voting.

^

and since there is no sp_aced option I'm pretty much fucked

My lasagna (either spinach, veggie or bologna) is legendary. Everything else is acceptable at best.

I'm a good cook but sometimes my ambitions get ahead of my skills so I have pretty royal fuckups on a regular basis.

Also angel hair pasta makes me want to punch someone.

penne for the win

I think I can cook pretty well off-the-cuff for myself. I cook a lot actually but its basically the same exact thing with different sauces.

Chicken breasst or ahi tuna steak
Roasted Veggies
couscous or whole wheat pasta.

My cabinets are filled with seasonings and sauces tho, so at least even tho I am eating green beans, zucchini and squash every night with baked chicken or seared tuna, it can taste different so I'm not totally bored. I always keep truffle oil and chili oil on hand and tons of shallots and garlic. jars of chutney and asian chili pastes.

I always have Naan in the freezer too, so I think i'll make chicken korma tonight.


but other than that, i have tons of recipe books. I don't really know how to cook much else than what i wrote above without cheating.

i thought everybody used recipes just some people have them committed to memory

and whole wheat pasta grosssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

i thought everybody used recipes just some people have them committed to memory

and whole wheat pasta grosssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

oh i love it.

I was such a cunt-y teenager I wouldn't ever let my mom teach me how to cook. I regret that, she's amazing- she can just throw things together and remember recipes and create her own great meals.

I am the only person in my house that knows how to cook at all, tho- i swear to god my roommates barely know how to use the microwave. pretty bad for 24-26 year olds.

I feel like if you can read you can cook. Obviously this excludes really difficult things, but the basics aren't too hard to figure out. I really want to get my Italian Grandmother to show me some of the "harder" meals because her food is just awesome. That being said, I feel like it's generally just laziness/not wanting to pay for real ingredients that keeps me from making decent meals for myself. Ramen noodles = 3 minutes on the stove whereas lasagna is kind of a production.

I try alot of new recipes, but some of the best stuff I've made, I've just sort of thrown together willy-nilly.

http://jenny-zzz.smugmug.com/photos/360960825_NH76u-M.jpg

I was such a cunt-y teenager I wouldn't ever let my mom teach me how to cook.
i've also made this mistake. now i need to read up on all the basics i could have learned from watching my mother

why were computer games more important to me than that

Ramen noodles = 3 minutes on the stove

that shit is rank

why do people eat it

I hate recipes

i like to bake.

<img src="http://photos-b.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-snc1/v433/168/94/220000626/n220000626_30473745_3651.jpg" />

probably the best thing i've made so far, although my pizza is improving

i want to try <a href="http://tastingtable.com/entry_detail/99/Jim_Lahey_reveals_his_recipe_for_no-knead_pizza_dough_.htm">this dough recipe</a>

i could probably make pizza if i had a mixer

use a whisk. don't be a pizza pussy.

bitch i don't have one of those either

but i can flip it up in the air n shit man. i'm an ace.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3081/3224217906_d9b2756414.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3392/3223359707_0753546f9a.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3256/3223359375_e5ddf5cfbd.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3256/3223359375_e5ddf5cfbd.jpg

.

i could probably make pizza if i had a mixer
lazy american. a mixer is totally unnecessary. use your hands

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3392/3223359707_0753546f9a.jpg
what's in this?

basmati rice, garbanzo beans, sweet peas, and broccoli in korma curry.

I can do the cooking dance almost as good as lil b

I knife I knife I knife

My family, all very great cooks. One grandmother taught cooking for a living, the other had 18 children so she learned a thing or two.... my dad, my mom, my brother, great cooks. I learned enough from them to be able to cook pretty good food but can't be bothered. The shame of my family I am. Well that's one reason I am anyway....

dis nigga fux up rice a roni

i surprise myself sometimes.

like, i made french onion soup a couple months ago and i was fucking amazed that i did it.

really, though, i credit it to the recipe itself. if the recipe is well written and you've got the right kitchenware, it's pretty hard to fuck up a dish. for everyday things, i can improvise a dish pretty easily with stuff around the house. it just depends on if i'm wanting soup, pasta, stir fry, whatever.

i can cook a few things quite well. pizza making has become a hobby of mine over the past six months or so. dough from scratch, 00 flour cut with AP, three day cold ferment in the fridge. i'll make my own sauce sometimes with san marzano's, but they are retardedly expensive. i hand stretch the dough in the air, but don't toss it because its mostly for show, and gets flour all over my condo.

i'll make fresh pasta from scratch sometimes, but it really is a lot of work.

I've become pretty good at asian food. my fried noodles/rice/veg don't taste like a white person made them anymore. can do a decent curry as well.

my strengths are in mexican, vegan, and comfort food. my mac and cheese is legend. can make a perfect omelette.

i'm not an amazing cook but i like what i cook and other people like what i cook and i can cook many different things. so that's good.

I've become pretty good at asian food. my rice/veg don't taste like a white person made them anymore. can do a decent curry as well.

can make a perfect omelette.

i'm not an amazing cook but i like what i cook and other people like what i cook and i can cook many different things. so that's good.

this is about where i'm at

meaning: i cook a few basic concepts but i feel i do them well

when youre talking rice and veggies and curry there are easily a bazillion different variations on the theme

that's enough of a playpen for me to run around in for the time being

i've recently grown out of favor from the hotter, red curries and moved toward the more flavorful yellow curries. less tomato and more mango or coconut. lately have been having a showdown between korma and mango curry to see which i like more.

when youre talking rice and veggies and curry there are easily a bazillion different variations on the theme

pretty much. that's the cool thing. make it to your mood. I've learned to make sambals as well, then i use that to fry the rice in. less oil. healthier. tasty as fuck. i think my new favorite thing is fried noodles. another endless options dish and so simple once you get it down.

i've never been crazy about yellow or green curries. some are nice but I'm down for masala and coconut most of the time.

pretty much. that's the cool thing. make it to your mood. I've learned to make sambals as well, then i use that to fry the rice in. less oil. healthier. tasty as fuck. i think my new favorite thing is fried noodles. another endless options dish and so simple once you get it down.

i've never been crazy about yellow or green curries. some are nice but I'm down for masala and coconut most of the time.

i haven't moved to noodles yet but am looking to soon. masala and jalfreezi are great don't get me wrong but i'm definitely more of a korma/mango/yellow/green man myself.

it probably has more to do with my vegetable choices than anything. but yea i've been eating variations of this dish daily for almost half a year now and haven't grown sick of it in the slightest. soo many veggies and soo many sauces to choose from.

laksa and tom kar ftw

I'm a total home cook - I can follow more complicated recipes and I'm pretty intuitive in the kitchen because I started young. One of the benefits of being the oldest child and only daughter, in a family where both parents have undiagnosed, untreated mental health issues. If I wanted my family to sit down together and eat a dinner other than ramen noodles, there were nights when I had to make it myself. When I was 11 I started making a lot of mac and cheese, pumpkin soup, and frittata - and fruit crumble for dessert. I cooked everything from scratch because I didn't know there was another way - my parents both liked fairly unprocessed food. Then my family would laugh at me and criticise whatever I'd made, so I have crippling anxiety about cooking for other people.

I still make a lot of pumpkin soup. Trying to be gluten free because i get really bad bloating if I eat it.

basmati rice, broccolli, chick peas, and eggplant, in a jalfreezi sauce

basmati rice, garbanzo beans, sweet peas, and broccoli in korma curry.

basmati rice, double cheeseburger, ghee, fenugreek, paneer, mashed into a paste, coated in pea flour and deep-fried until crisp

cherry tomatoes with basil, olive oil, burrata, maldon salt, freshly-cracked black pepper and three dirty martinis

beef wellington and a bottle of low-end chateauneuf-du-pape

Pffft snob

is beef wellington good? i've never had it

i'm pretty sure it's not, because gordon ramsay serves a lot of it and although he's entertaining he seems like a pretty terrible cook

i love to cook and i'm not bad at all, but i do end up cooking some awful shit from time to time because i like to try new recipes that i only use as a outline.

i'm pretty sure it's not, because gordon ramsay serves a lot of it and although he's entertaining he seems like a pretty terrible cook

surely gordon ramsay does not have that kind of power over traditional recipes

i'm going to try it

this looks pretty good http://www.seriouseats.com/2012/12/the-food-lab-beef-wellington-ultimate.html

i made french onion soup once. I did good. It was a pioneer woman recipe.

this looks pretty good http://www.seriouseats.com/2012/12/the-food-lab-beef-wellington-ultimate.html

yuck, foie gras!!

http://www.veganpeace.com/animal_cruelty/Pictures/FoieGras.jpg

http://www.veganpeace.com/animal_cruelty/Pictures/FoieGras2.jpg

http://www.stoptac.org/uploads/images/Other%20issues/foie%20gras%202.jpg

http://www.animalliberationfront.com/Saints/Musicians/Maria-Daines/FoieGrastherearend.jpg

http://www.allanimalrights.org/images/fg.jpg

http://www.renovegans.com/media/images/ex/animals/ducks/foie-gras.jpg

^
|

Mankind is psychopathic.

Yesterday someone sent me pictures of Darigold farms and how they treat milking cows. Disgusting. appaling. distressing, all those words. I can't even enjoy dairy anymore. I've slowly become near vegetarian and now it looks like i'm gonna be done with dairy. Sure the odds are the milk I buy is from ethical farms but who knows for sure anymore? I can't put money into this. It's hard enough living with myself everyday.

The thing is all vegan fake dairy sucks. I can't even enjoy alternative milks. Rice, soy, almond. They suck and are expensive. I guess i'm gonna drink water, eat fruits and vegetables and grains like a goddam hippie. Ignorance really is bliss.

How do people doing these jobs live with themselves? I hope they have long and painful deaths. Fuck making a living , it's not worth this. If I was down to a job like this, i'd rather throw myself off a bridge.

Well why do I give a shit, we're on our last leg as a species. Our end can't come fast enough.

i don't know enough about foie gras to have an opinion, but i would've forgone it anyway so whatever. but a few pictures aren't a compelling argument

i used to see things differently (i was vegetarian for about five years, vegan for a few months) but as far as i'm concerned now, humane farming is fine from a welfare perspective. the environmental argument is stronger IMHO, but hey west antarctic ice shelf how you doin

even then that's still wishful thinking

MEAT ROBOTS

I switched between vegan/vegetarianism for 7 years and I'm omnivorous now but still eat a lot of plant food. I think animal husbandry and slaughter is ok provided we're not wasteful (which we are) and we genuinely care for the animals while they're alive (which often, we don't - particularly in some instances, like cage eggs, sow crates, veal, foie gras, etc.) It isn't good for them or us, to mistreat them or not take their life with some sense of regret and gratitude.

self interested animal welfare advocate. george carlin totally nailed that one. the planet is fine!

was it necessary to post all that shit

like i just wanted to read about cooking and you posted a deluge of foie gras pictures.

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no cooking with foie gras!

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no cooking with foie gras!
fuck you.

you really have no right to be sanctimonious about the force feeding of animals when you're perfectly fine with killing them and eating them "humanely".

you fucking idiot.

oh pardon me, not considering what rights i have

lol rights

go home, your mother baked a fish for you

fuck you.

you really have no right to be sanctimonious about the force feeding of animals when you're perfectly fine with killing them and eating them "humanely".

you fucking idiot.

count me in as an idiot.

My problem isn't with killing, its with torture, mistreatement, etc

Keeping animals in absolutely humane conditions and then killing them. Fine. Killing has always been part of living. It is for us, it is for carnivorous animals, i can deal with that.

The problem of course is that if you're going for mass production, realistically that's not really possible to do this in completely ethical and humane conditions. I'm sure i'd find the conditions in ethical farms lacking even. So this is why i'd just rather altogether forget about it. But technically its not the murder i have a problem with, its everything leading up to it.

I think basically the only time where eating meat/dairy/eggs was done in the best ethical and humane conditions was when people raised cattle, chickens etc for their own person needs. When you're trying to have farms that raises and kills hundreds (or produces hundreds of liters of milk or thousands of eggs) a day, it can't possibly be done humanely i don't think or at least, the risk is too high that its not being done properly.

can we not have the full meat is murder argument and just focus on "fuck you vixnix for posting those pictures"

fuck you vixnix for posting those pictures

Eh, anything that can sensibilize anyone to those type of issues is fine by me. Even if done obnoxiously.

I'm pretty sure if you ask people "hey would you like to see what they do to ducks and geese in the process of preparing them for foie gras?" The vast majority would say no thanks.

you think the cows and chickens that makeup the beef and chicken you eat are cuddled to death?

dumb bitch.

I sense an underlying current of hostility towards vixnix on this forum. It's just a feeling though.

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/SSR6ZzjDZ94" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I don't know why Boston never had a record called Cream Donut. seems like a missed opportunity.

and now we're back on food.

I cooked the turkey for my family's thanksgiving last year. I didn't anticipate how stressful it would be. I guess since it's the "star" of the dinner or whatever. I made a brine for it and let it sit in it overnight. Everyone said it turned out moist and good. Im not sure it was worth the trouble, though.

My beautiful brine (not mine really, pioneer woman's. again.) The house smelled nice.
http://i.imgur.com/IwzTv70l.jpg

you think the cows and chickens that makeup the beef and chicken you eat are cuddled to death?

farms in NZ are almost all pasture because the annual rainfall supports that, and we eat a lot of sheep, that are well suited to the climate and terrain. They wouldn't enjoy being cuddled except by their mothers and they're free to do that until they're separated which is a horrible day to see them all, crying out for each other. but they get over it - they're not that bright.

Cows are a bit different though. And chickens....have you ever had chickens? We kept them for a while and they were pretty easy - better as egg producers than as meat. Same with cows - better as milk producers than meat producers, as far as returns go - but only in small scale quantities...intensive dairy farming creates a lot of pollution. In my opinion. A lot of egg producers down this way are switched over to free range practices to keep up with market demand, though it's far cheaper and easier just to get your own chickens IMO.

I get the feeling a lot of people here have not spent a lot of time on actual farms or butchery units to get up close and personal with what they're eating. They just pick it up at the supermarket and get the rage whenever somebody tries to educate them a little. calm down already!!

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/SSR6ZzjDZ94" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

this song is seriously great i defy you to tell me why it is not great

I sense an underlying current of hostility towards vixnix on this forum. It's just a feeling though.

actually rolling back on this thread, have her on ignore too, i see that it was more sensationalist trolling

i honestly think she might be nimrod's daughter

even then that's still wishful thinking

MEAT ROBOTS

what if like, man, this vegetarian/vegan moment is evolution at work man like man what if man we are evolving by making this "choice" and this choice will help us survive when that antarctic shelf melts man

We are in a CSA and it's really helped my cooking. Tonight was a frittata with spring onions, Swiss chard and a little bacon. Delicious.

why do you hate america

The rent is too damn high.

that's why i hate austin

although there's like SO MANY REASONS now

the alamo draft house or something

It's worth it for Taco Deli.

FUCK TACO DELI SERIOUSLY FUCK THAT PLACE

<U><B><i>FUCK TACO DELI, FUCK ITS GODDAMN OVERPRICED WHITE PEOPLE GOURMET BULLSHIT TO THE END OF FUCKING TIME</b></u></i>

b.. but i love white people

THREE TACOS

FIFTEEN DOLLARS

FUCK YOU!!! AND IT'S CROWDED!!! AND YOUR GODDAMN 22 YEAR OLD MIDWESTERN CLERK CALLED ME DUDE THE WHOLE TIME!!! I'M A GROWN ASS MAN!!! GET OUT OF MY TOWN!!!

IN ADDITION:

FUCK YOU FRANKLIN'S GODDAMN 2009 BARBECUE YOU PIECE OF SHIT FUCKING MOTHERFUCKING

FUCK YOU IN AND OUT BURGER YOU GODDAMN CALIFORNIA MOVIE HYPE FUCKER YOUR BURGERS FUCKING SUCK AND STAY IN YOUR GODDAMN STATE

I knew that'd set you off. :) There's an In-and-Out now? Most overrated burger I've probably ever had was from one of those.

IF I HAVE TO HEAR ONE MORE GODDAMN TOURIST ASK ME HOW I NEVER HEARD OR BEEN TO FRANKLINS FUCKING 2009 BARBECUE EVEN THOUGH I AM FROM HERE I WILL PROBABLKY END UP MURDERING THEM

ALL I CAN BELLOW AT THEM NOW IS <B>ART'Z, GODDAMN YOU, YOU KILLED ART'Z YOU MOTHERFUCKING CULTURE VAMPIRE</B>

the sushi place in the hilton is really good. srs

I knew that'd set you off. :) There's an In-and-Out now? Most overrated burger I've probably ever had was from one of those.

yes

also the tamale house on airport is closed forever

so yeah tacodeli makes me super mad lately and i had a very bad experience recently

i mean the food was good but 15 dollars for 3 fancy ass tacos that were equivalent to a great truck with 2 dollar tacos? eat my DIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICK AND GET OUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUT

Franklins is really good but not worth those lines now. J Mueller's short-lived return trumped it, esp his ribs. Mmmmmhmmmmm.

plus super annoying obviously non native check out girl really pissed me off with all the duderation i'm like look goddamn it i'm wearing slacks and a collared shirt i know you read about austin in a magazine but

Franklins is really good but not worth those lines now. J Mueller's short-lived return trumped it, esp his ribs. Mmmmmhmmmmm.

i'm pretty much primarily consumed with finding good hamburgers and tex-mex...bbq is just not something that i really quest for.

but the franklin's thing is a serious problem, it seems like so many people here have just moved here. so they act like verything they go to has been there forever when in reality most of it has been hera about five years and all the stuff i fucking remember has closed down or become compromised it seems like the economy recovering means that we're getting even more fresh faced tourists coming to be young and retired every day and tbh a lot of them now aren't even the hip kids that want to be here to be hip. it's like they're just boring middle americans that come here because it's so cool and they saw about it on the teevee but they just live in the suburbs and go to ihop anyway

yes

also the tamale house on airport is closed forever

so yeah tacodeli makes me super mad lately and i had a very bad experience recently

i mean the food was good but 15 dollars for 3 fancy ass tacos that were equivalent to a great truck with 2 dollar tacos? eat my DIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICK AND GET OUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUT

I haven't been in a long while, it was like $2/taco last time I was there. I do and will stick with Torchy's, as overpriced as it is.

Except the Guadalupe location, fuck that noise.

This is how I feel without tamale house in my life

<img src="http://metrouk2.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/batswing.gif">

Hop daddy v Cow Bells v Mighty Fine v Hut's -who wins?

(Answer: not Hut's)

I haven't been in a long while, it was like $2/taco last time I was there.

seriously what tacos were these i mean i dunno i ordered three things they were small and my bill was 15 dollars


I do and will stick with Torchy's, as overpriced as it is.


i spend 8 bucks on two tacos and it's a lot of food. i'm down with torchy's. the green chile pork is plenty authentic and i even like some of their white trash tex mex touches like the queso covered chicken strip

Hop daddy v Cow Bells v Mighty Fine v Hut's -who wins?

(Answer: not Hut's)

the answer is definitely not hop doddy either

i'm a native, dude. i like top notch, hillbert's, hutt's and whataburger.

i came to enjoy p.terry's. mighty fine is perty good

hopdoddy fucking sucks. the tacodeli of burger joints

and the yuppie crowd it attracts makes me nauseous.

I miss Parkside. :( Haven't been able to go last several times we've been in town. Though we did make it to Black's last month (thank god for that toll road you can drive like 110 on)

the answer is definitely not hop doddy either

i'm a native, dude. i like top notch, hillbert's, hutt's and whataburger.

i came to enjoy p.terry's. mighty fine is perty good

hopdoddy fucking sucks. the tacodeli of burger joints

and the yuppie crowd it attracts makes me nauseous.

Cow Bell's is mine, but I'd just as much get a Whataburger jalapeño w/ cheese.

i've never been to that place, never heard of it actually

keep in mind i was going to mighty fine weekly but that's only because top notch and whataburger were too far away (seriously the only place in austin that was 15 minutes from a WB)

I miss Parkside. :( Haven't been able to go last several times we've been in town. Though we did make it to Black's last month (thank god for that toll road you can drive like 110 on)

they built a black's on barton creek

yea seriously

also people who say they are from austin and i go what high school did you go to oh i mean i moved here when i went to college

fuck you dogg

also people who say they are from austin and i go what high school did you go to oh i mean i moved here when i went to college

fuck you dogg

Had a guy from Bastrop claim he was an Austin native once. That was good.

i know a dude from bastrop that calls bastrop and i give him cred for being local

i mean i'm honestly relieved these days when they're from houston

"well at least you're from texas, jesus christ."

East Texas Oil Belt 4 lyfe

not really trying to do the meat is murder thing, but anyone who tries to say it's alright to kill an animal because it was raised in a pasture before its totally unnecessary slaughter is just trying to lend moral justification for something they know is unjustifiable. i'm more understanding of people who say "yeah, killing animals is shitty but meat is delicious". at least they're in touch with the real reason they eat meat.

if you had any respect for animals that you eat, you wouldn't kill them for the mere luxury of having a steak dinner. so they lived on a pasture. who gives a shit. you're complicit in the needless killing of a sentient being. this perspective is just plain lazy as fuck since buying organic/grass-fed/free-range/whatever meat literally requires no sacrifice on your part, yet you believe it entitles you to some level of sanctimony when it means literally fuck-all.

how are you hurting an animal if you treat it well and then kill it quickly and painlessly?

would you be alright with me killing your children quickly and painlessly even though you gave them a good life?

get bent you cretin.

i'd love to throw them on the spit.

give them a nice honey glaze.

maybe make some head cheese out of their eyeballs and spinal cord. can't let it go to waste now. gotta show respect for god's creation.

You didn't actually answer the question there little buddy...why not give it one more go, you know what they say....fourth time lucky

I've used a rhetorical device known as "answering a question with a question", you dipshit.

not really trying to do the meat is murder thing, but anyone who tries to say it's alright to kill an animal because it was raised in a pasture before its totally unnecessary slaughter is just trying to lend moral justification for something they know is unjustifiable. i'm more understanding of people who say "yeah, killing animals is shitty but meat is delicious". at least they're in touch with the real reason they eat meat.

WELL THE REAL REASON would be because of biological necessity

and ethics are something white people came up with

how are you hurting an animal if you treat it well and then kill it quickly and painlessly?

hurt is involved in the act of killing. the animal may experience pain in the afterlife. how do you know? the living animals around it get hurt too. stressed. pain. people doing the killing also get hurt. feelings. a good life and a quick death doesn't mean there is a void of hurt creation. animals grieve. maybe not all of them at our level. i'd call that hurt too.

WELL THE REAL REASON would be because of biological necessity
You know that to false, but I'm not going through this again with you.

biological necessity WHY AM I STILL ALIVE THEN. goddamn.

and ethics are something white people came up with

you know this is irrefutable

lock up the sharks

the murderers of the sea

humans are a blight and we consume, do not resist. give in to the void.

soon this world will die by our hand and a new evolution will take place

it's the way of things

you're being obtuse.

incredibly, my friend

i will not try to change your mind as long as i can eat my large burger which is my vice

or my millions of tacos

but seriously white people came up with ethics

just something to think about

i thought tribes did.

incredibly, my friend

i will not try to change your mind as long as i can eat my large burger which is my vice
that's not the argument i'm making here. you're in touch with your hedonism.

im just annoyed at people who think they're being wonderful animal guardians by giving them a nice pasture to live and graze on in spite of actually killing them for literally no reason other than straight up hedonism.

like noyen said, animals grieve. in fact, one of the worst thing you can do to a person is to kill someone they love. if you try to impart some notion of suffering on animals, you can't ignore this fact.

no it was free range and the farmer played simon and garfunkel for him. it was a good life. and now he's in my belly.

i avoided using the word moral here because it usually has some divine connotation.

could you expand on why white people constructing the notion of ethics is relevant here.

i thought tribes did.

the mmo?

i'm okay with killing certain things because i trained my own mind with the help of white people, no doubt, that my guilt and need for survival is worth their hurt and death. being in denial of what you're doing is one thing, embracing it is another. i mean, i've watched that movie "earthlings" hundreds of times and i've been hunting deer and slaughted cows, chickens, goats and sheep. it's a lot of work when you get bloody and have to look at an animal die whether it is painless, quick or not. compartmentalizing that eating wilbur is okay vs foie torture feeding is wrong is fooling yrself because it's all the same means to an end. torture sucks and we've all be brainwashed that that part is okay because they're going to die anyway, me included. i agree with the hippies at the same time. you should wholly embrace the industry of killing and torturing animals if you eat meat because.... SIZZLER BUFFET.

If you're going to kill the animal anyway - not just for hedonistic reasons, but for nutrition, too - are you saying it isn't a more ethical decision to treat them in a way they enjoy, before killing them quickly and painlessly, rather than keeping them however is cheapest or most desirable to you, and then killing them without any regard to their suffering?

That seems like a strange and untenable line of argument.

the mmo?

haha! but for real. little tribes created religions and mythology and tacos and thus ethics are born.

If you're going to kill the animal anyway - not just for hedonistic reasons, but for nutrition, too - are you saying it isn't a more ethical decision to treat them in a way they enjoy, before killing them quickly and painlessly, rather than keeping them however is cheapest or most desirable to you, and then killing them without any regard to their suffering?

That seems like a strange and untenable line of argument.

ethics.. ethics... look up at how magical that word is and the connotations behind it. ethic is a intangible thing made up. by tribes of white people.

that makes you feel better. can you not wrap your head around this. your niceness is selfishness. can you not see that one group of people justify doing things one way and another justifies it doing it another and another group of people dont give a fuck because it doesnt matter to them.

if you're going to base your argument on the notion that animal products are nutritionally necessary, i'm living proof that you're an idiot.

and i just defended your "untenable" line of logic. surely that can't happen in your world.

guys, it's been real, but i'm gonna drink the rest of my cough syrup, have a wank and hopefully never wake up.

if you're going to base your argument on the notion that animal products are nutritionally necessary, i'm living proof that you're an idiot.

I didn't say they were nutritionally necessary - I was a vegan/vegetarian for 7 years in a row, so I know that. But you're an idiot if you think that humans are not evolved to consume animal flesh as a food source. Meat does nourish the human animal. That's why it smells good when it's cooking on an open fire, and tastes good when we're eating it.

How long have you been a vegetarian? And have you ever stayed on farms with animals reared for meat? Have you worked in butchery units?

I know what is involved in putting meat on my plate. It isn't nice. Neither is abortion. We're not nice animals. But we can make decisions about how to lessen our impact on others, and providing animals with pleasant lives, and killing them quickly and painlessly, before eating them, is a way to do that. I know the kind of animal I'm eating and whether or not I could kill it if I had to. I could. That's the nature of who I am - if it comes down to my children and me being nourished, I'll kill the beast and stick it on the fire, no worries.

well then fucking happy birthday to you and a big pat on the back.

"nourished"

shut up.

she plays organ in church, you can't touch those ethics.

I guess the point here, is don't delude yourself about what you are - none of us are nice. We all do things that are horrible. Raising animals to slaughter them for food, is horrible. But there can be greater and lesser amounts of horror.

I am being called out as an idiot for thinking that an animal kept like this before being slaughtered:

http://www.teara.govt.nz/files/p20080nsil.jpg
is better off than an animal kept like this, before being slaughtered:
http://www.lennial.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/foie-gras-1.jpg

Yeah, maybe not, in some abstract, "I-grew-up-in-the-suburbs-and-have-never-hunted-or-gathered-my-own-meal-my food-decisions-are-things-like-do-I-buy-the-organic-lentils-or-the-ones-in-the-glass-jar-to-avoid-the-BPA" way, there is no difference.

But to me there is. I'm pretty sure...to the animals...there is a difference for them. We could stop slaughtering them altogether and survive - but we're not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to kid myself that I am capable of that, any more than a rat is, or a lion is, or a shark is. You guise all seem to have this very inflated idea about what humanity is whereby we are able to live independently of the evolutionary history that precedes our lives today.

I don't think i could do true veganism but i'm gonna get as close to it as i can. More like vegetarian plus or something. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the idea of going dairy free. I don't think i can do that. I'd rather find a dairy producer i can be assured are ethical if thats even possible to know for sure. I think there's some hippie-run sites for these things.

I wish i didn't give a shit but i think at this point it's pretty much part of my mental problems, I think i have TOO much compassion for animals. More than i do for humans for sure. I mean i've reached the point where i avoid killing bugs around the house. My dad was raised on a farm where they slaughtered pigs and chickens so he now thinks i'm pretty much retarded. I was raised in the countryside, around farms, but not on one.

i just remembered that vixnix made a big deal about raising her retard kid as a vegan because he cried after seeing a lamb on the television or something

you guys remember that thread right

was that even six months ago

After seven years switching between vegetarianism and veganism, I began craving animal flesh - and when I became pregnant for the first time it got even worse so in the end I just stopped fighting it.

I would always eat shellfish and fish, maybe a couple of times a year - I would get these huge urges and would give in and eat a lot of mussels or some sashimi or something. The reward signals in my brain were crazy, it was like crack.

The same when I finally gave in and began eating chicken - I was living in a house with vegan flatmates at the time, so I would buy cooked chicken drumsticks from the deli on the way home from uni, and eat them hunched over on a park bench in the botanic gardens, then smoke a cigarette and chew some gum to disguise the smell of decaying animal flesh on me. But I remember feeling a surge of good feelings, sitting on that park bench. Eating those chicken drumsticks made me feel like I was walking on air.

I was all systems go as a 16 year old vegan - and 23 when I finally gave up. My health improved pretty dramatically. You gotta look at the sort of breeding you have before you go vegan...this:
http://www.iisd.ca/uncsd/prepp/images/22july/Photo_11-tn.jpg
and veganism don't necessarily jive, that much.

When you remove large quantities of saturated fat and animal protein from the Samoan diet, and replace it with plant fats and carbohydrates...you commonly see this:

http://travelcrawler.co.uk/wp-content/plugins/RSSPoster_PRO/cache/0b2d7_article-0-1A628470000005DC-631_306x464.jpg

Samoans are big eaters and need plenty of plant fibre, animal protein, and animal fat in their diets to stop themselves from becoming overweight. Without the appropriate food and appropriate amount of rest triggering the right chemical reactions from the brain, the hormones that control their appetite and satiety become out of kilter and we will just keep eating until we throw up - watching what we eat is miserable and leads to obsession because unless we mimic the conditions we are adapted for, we feel the need to eat something else.

Trots he was never vegan - he was vegetarian. But the poor thing couldn't make it work - when we were eating meat he would "just try it" and then couldn't stop himself from eating it once he started...I could see he was starting to feel ashamed of himself. So I told him it sad that we kill the animals for meat, but they are given a good life. Which is true - we buy free range chicken/eggs/pork, and grass feed lamb/beef. Still not sold on beef. It's expensive environmentally to rear it, and no better in terms of nutrition, than sheep or pork. And cows and pigs are significantly smarter than sheep. You can't send a dog to round them up, for instance.

beef is so good i think i will have some now

I think it's popular because it's a very tasty meat in the sense that the musky animal taste:delicious fatty & protein-y taste ratio is ideally balanced for the human palate.

Like, goat tastes like goats...sheep tastes like sheep...but beef and chicken are both very mild tasting. So they're very popular with children, and Americans.

what does it say about me that i would eat most of what is on thisiswhyyourefat. Well, or would anyway when i was still eating meat a few months back. Most of the stuff with meat looks in fact like the kind of stuff i might break veg for.

hungry as fuck RN too

I think it's popular because it's a very tasty meat in the sense that the musky animal taste:delicious fatty & protein-y taste ratio is ideally balanced for the human palate.

Like, goat tastes like goats...sheep tastes like sheep...but beef and chicken are both very mild tasting. So they're very popular with children, and Americans.

Lamb is/was actually my favorite meat. We often had it at home when i was growing up. A lamb roast is better than any other type of roast. Thing is after i moved out i probably only ever had it once every like...3 or 4 years. I went to an afghan resturant a few years ago that made amazing lamb roast with fried spinachs. One of the best thing i've eaten at any restaurant.

I actually prefer mutton! I like it a bit stronger tasting, with more fat through it. But sheep meat is my favourite, of the land animals.

If I had to pick one animal though it would probably be fish. No surprises there.

It isn't good for them or us, to mistreat them or not take their life with some sense of regret and gratitude.

eh, this is nonsense

eating meat is not necessary for your survival. if you have regret, stop doing it

gratitude for something taken without being given isn't gratitude

etc.

what if like, man, this vegetarian/vegan moment is evolution at work man like man what if man we are evolving by making this "choice" and this choice will help us survive when that antarctic shelf melts man

what if it's like quantum consciousness and shit

I knew that'd set you off. :) There's an In-and-Out now? Most overrated burger I've probably ever had was from one of those.

yeah, this

i watched the big lebowski so many times i was certain those were going to be good burgers walter but they were just okay

best burgers i had in the US were at super duper on market street in san francisco and some gastropub in orange

super duper was actually exactly like i was expecting in-n-out to be

i actually haven't started cooking since recently. i'm almost down 20 pounds from 6 months ago... amazing how much your health improves once you stop eating out all the time

eating meat is not necessary for your survival. if you have regret, stop doing it

gratitude for something taken without being given isn't gratitude

etc.

Sort of half formed ideas here.

i actually haven't started cooking since recently. i'm almost down 20 pounds from 6 months ago... amazing how much your health improves once you stop eating out all the time

Where/what did you eat out before? I should try that, I want to put on weight, but I'm losing weight when I can't cook myself.

Sort of half formed ideas here.

that's just another way of saying "i don't agree"

at least i gave you some reasons

eh, this is nonsense

eating meat is not necessary for your survival. if you have regret, stop doing it

gratitude for something taken without being given isn't gratitude

etc.

what is your concept of survival? does it ******* some kind of gradation like I will be in better condition in 20 years if I eat a bit of meat every few days than if I don't...that kind of thing? Or just...if I don't eat meat, I won't die in the next few days.

if you have regret, stop doing it = non sequitur

gratitude for something taken without being given isn't gratitude - why not?

there you go

gratitude for something taken without being given isn't gratitude - why not?
thank you for this thing i took from you without your consent!

hey, you have this thing and i will take it from you, even though you don't want me to, but don't worry, i'll show regret and gratitude! THANKS, DEAD ANIMAL! THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS THING YOU HAD NO SAY IN! it's in the bible!

I just googled for advice on explaining transitive vs intransitive verbs because it has been a while since I've thought about it, and what do you know, the concept I was looking to explain already has a name: intransitive gratitude

It's like how people feel grateful for Billy Corgan's music even though he didn't give it to them specifically.

I feel grateful that I can be nourished by the flesh of a dead animal. And I feel regret that it had to die for me to receive that specific type of nourishment.

I suppose it could just be sadness and shame that i mask with other emotions that I find more palatable/digestible. It's hard to tell with these sorts of things and you know partly because it doesn't matter, I'm still going to eat meat, so....

like i said, it's in the bible, siad corgan.

amen to that, brother ice cream!

DORK SIDED!!!1 IN THE NAME OF JESUS I PRAY GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY HOUSE

Where/what did you eat out before? I should try that, I want to put on weight, but I'm losing weight when I can't cook myself.
i want to, too, but i'm afraid fast food would just make me body flabby and give me a large muffin top and more cellulite. mmm popeyes.

have you considered weight lifting and protein shakes? or just protein shakes after a walk or some junk?

i frequent a body-building website and they have so many options and i've read lots of reviews but i just can't pull the trigger on anything. but i want some sooo bad!

i know a dude from bastrop that calls bastrop and i give him cred for being local

my aunt lives in bastrop. i once fell of my bike going down a hill there and i ate oysters downtown.

maybe that dude is my cousin or some shit.

Where/what did you eat out before? I should try that, I want to put on weight, but I'm losing weight when I can't cook myself.

i think the main thing contributing to my weight gain was pho. they opened a noodle house across from work so i got in the habit of going there for lunch almost everyday

and i'd eat chinese takeout at least once a week

then my doctor was like "yeah... you need to cut this shit out" not only was i getting fat but my cholesteral/blood pressure was getting up there

...

you should drink more alcohol. no downsides. win-win.

what about bruschetta or fettunta, with butter and cheese and roasted tomatoes and basil. or nuts? Just eat peanut butter out of the jar, spread on apples and bananas. that seems to work for me. or pesto. so many delicious fattening ideas.

You don't get fat from whiskey, vodka, rum. Beer would work

what if you add a mixer?
and yes, beer definitely works.

what if you add a mixer?
and yes, beer definitely works.

Now that sounds like an idea. But what can you mix in rum and vodka that gets you fat? (And isn't plain sugar.)

Asian places should be good - or are you vegetarian?

Now that sounds like an idea. But what can you mix in rum and vodka that gets you fat? (And isn't plain sugar.)

bloody maries are pretty good...

Now that sounds like an idea. But what can you mix in rum and vodka that gets you fat? (And isn't plain sugar.)

coke goes with both.
cranberry juice goes well with vodka (and often a load of sugar is added).

isn't that the main point though, that it's basically plain sugar. or what did you mean with that? did you want to exclude coke?

bloody maries are pretty good...

but are they fattening? what will make you fat, besides the alcohol?

...

I'd kill a man right now for a chicken fried steak from a legit Texas place. :/

i actually haven't started cooking since recently. i'm almost down 20 pounds from 6 months ago... amazing how much your health improves once you stop eating out all the time

this right here

but are they fattening? what will make you fat, besides the alcohol?

Not much, but as a mixer, there are more calories in tomato juice and tabasco sauce than there are in a sugar-free mixer. Plus there are nutrients in the tomato juice and lemon juice, overall conditioning might help her gain, if she is surviving on protein shakes at the moment...there are ingredients in sugar-free soft drinks and protein shakes that her body might be processing as toxins, which is using up energy that could otherwise be spent absorbing the available nutrients. Maybe. I don't know.

I never eat out. I'm still overweight. In fact, I eat about 1200 calories a day now (I think they say a adult male should eat about 2000) and I have for at least three months and i'm still not losing anything. Sure exercize was an issue but I've been doing a lot better recently in this regard. I am about 30 pounds overweight. I still eat too much carbs though. I should give up bread.

I have to say I was about only ten pounds overweight 3 years back. then I started wasting most of my free time on some mmo for about 2 years. Next thing I knew I was up 30 pounds. I gave up this life waster a year ago. I lost about ten of those pounds fairly easily. Now im stuck around 200. I should be 165.

super duper was actually exactly like i was expecting in-n-out to be

i really had an expectation of california's answer to whataburger but what i got was fancy mcdonalds. i mean i should have known that would be the case, mcdonalds is the california burger chain...

plus they put a huge slice of onion on my burger, thick. i dunno if this is how they always do it but that was pretty intense

culvers on the other hand, i guess i should expect Wisconsin people to know their way around beef, cheese and custard.

downtown bastrop?

it's like a block of brick buildings. there was an oyster bar, an ice cream shop, and that's all i remember because those are the places i went.

i went to lost pines a lot when i was a kid...i found the boy scout campsite on google recently...everything around it is burt to a crisp, but I could recognize the bmx track for sure

No 😩

Trade some with me. 116, I'd take 15 from you.

And vixey - you got it right with Bloody Mary. Fine stuff, and the taste is absolutely okay before dinner.


116 - how tall are you though? Are you medically underweight...do you reckon you're malnourished or just very lean?

Glad you like bloody maries :)

can we get an old netphorian to come back and make a post of average length.

can we get an old netphorian to come back and make a post of average length.

I'm not sure why but i feel this post might be a, so to speak, "dig', at me.

Anyway, 116 seems dangerously thin. my brother is about 125,5'9", he could never gain a pound. My father's genes, lucky bastard, i got my mom's, the only reason i ever was under 150 (i maintained that for a few years) was because i used to occasionally go on crash diets. They worked at 20 (twice I lost 30 pounds in a month), they don't at 35. I also have a little less willpower.

...

Ah that sucks - sounds like you do really need to watch what you eat - just like me. But for the opposite reason to me lol.

I have always dreamed of being small - I'm only a couple of inches taller than you but since adolescence have never been lighter than 180 - so I'm big. Big all over, big feet, big hands, big head, big quadriceps, big biceps, big rib cage, big everything. Smallest I'll ever be is a medium/12.

I'm kinda gentler on myself now - our bodies are not perfect, but they are ours. They're the ones that we get, so we have to look after them.

.

I actually think a near flat bust looks beautiful in a way - youthful...my bust disappears when I lose weight. I don't really care but after breastfeeding two babies for two years each, my boobs look pretty used up and sad when they're not filled up with fat...not youthful and beautiful lol

A mum at my old playgroup discovered she had the early stages of breast cancer and had a double mastectomy and then implants...I'm glad the procedures exist. My Gran lived with the shame of a mastectomy for most of her adult life and I wish she hadn't had to. It's a horrible thing to lose your bust, I reckon. And I did have one high school acquaintance who all of us felt sorry for because she was tall and beautiful and perfectly proportioned except that she had no bust at all...it was horrible for her,trying to find ball gowns that hid it. So I can see for someone in her situation, having a beautiful body but covering it up all the time and feeling ashamed...and not planning to fill out via motherhood for a good decade or so...a boob job would be a life changing thing. And similarly, breast reductions can make an amazing difference.

But just going from one perfectly proportional size to another, bigger one...LA doesn't sound like my kind of place either....

.

116 pounds, 5 foot 8 and a natural B cup pretty much is perfection to most guys anyway! You must have to beat them off with a stick. I never had that problem though I suppose if I had, at least I could have swung the stick good and hard...

I was going to say actually, I have managed to heal myself with food after coming down with a horrible cold virus...I roasted up some pumpkin and garlic and ate it with cream cheese and crumbled vintage cheddar...and then made myself a litre of hot water, lemon juice, grated fresh ginger, and honey...feel loads better today.

My husband told me last night that he had purchased a packet of oven-bake fries and two cans of beans with small sausages in them, for dinner. I gaped and asked him if he could maybe make pumpkin soup, instead...and he laughed incredulously and said "I can't make soup!". So it looks like he needs to learn how to make soup...I didn't realise.

I trimmed and halved some brussel sprouts today and pan fried them face down in butter...they were pretty good. Nobody liked them except me, though.

I was until now 100% certain Pavementtune was a guy. (which explains why i thought 116 was dangerously thin)

what is your concept of survival? does it ******* some kind of gradation like I will be in better condition in 20 years if I eat a bit of meat every few days than if I don't...that kind of thing? Or just...if I don't eat meat, I won't die in the next few days.
for most people, it's not necessary to eat meat in order to live to a ripe old age. that's what i meant.

if you have regret, stop doing it = non sequitur

you said this:

It isn't good for them or us, to mistreat them or not take their life with some sense of regret and gratitude.

i was referring to that. if i regretted eating meat, and i didn't need to eat it in order to survive, i would consider giving it up.

gratitude for something taken without being given isn't gratitude - why not?

because it's not freely given; animals don't give up their lives as part of the beautiful fabric of nature, people outsmart them and kill them.

it's a forced utility transfer. that means the kind of untargeted gratitude we are capable of feeling – e.g., to the universe for meeting the conditions necessary for our existence – is misplaced. it's easy to imagine that kind of sentiment contributing to a false sense of justification – it feels wholesome, virtuous even

animals don't give up their lives as part of the beautiful fabric of nature, people outsmart them and kill them.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/aDaOgu2CQtI?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

i wasn't really being sarcastic earlier, the concept that ideas are evolution is fascinating to me RIGHT NOW

for most people, it's not necessary to eat meat in order to live to a ripe old age. that's what i meant.



you said this:



i was referring to that. if i regretted eating meat, and i didn't need to eat it in order to survive, i would consider giving it up.



because it's not freely given; animals don't give up their lives as part of the beautiful fabric of nature, people outsmart them and kill them.

it's a forced utility transfer. that means the kind of untargeted gratitude we are capable of feeling – e.g., to the universe for meeting the conditions necessary for our existence – is misplaced. it's easy to imagine that kind of sentiment contributing to a false sense of justification – it feels wholesome, virtuous even

Living to a ripe old age and maintaining a editable quality of life at a ripe old age are two different things. In my opinion optimal human nourishment includes regular consumption of animal flesh.

Whether or not instransitive gratitude is misplaced, I still feel it. You claimed I couldn't feel gratitude in that instance. I disagree, I think intransitive gratitude is a fairly widespread phenomenon. It doesn't require the consent of an object because it's not directed at one. It could be part of a survival mechanism that allowed us to form and emotional connection to our environment, which motivated us to take better care of it, this enhance our chances of survival. Many subsistence/environmentally sustainable traditional cultures have thanksgiving rituals where the thanks they have for their harvest, spoils of hunt/ agriculture are given thanks for and I don't see a reason to suspect the gratitude is not real.

As for the non sequitur, the validity of that is tied up with the question of nutrition. If I didn't need to eat meat to maintain optimal condition I would consider giving it up because of the regret I feel. That isn't the case for me. I continue to eat meat because I think it is good for me and I am self interested - at the same time, I'm compassionate enough to feel regret about my own fairly un changeable nature.

it's really boring to cook for one person so I don't really bother to try anything interesting
plus i'm trying to lose like 20 pounds so most of my cooking concerns are balancing macronutrients
thinking of ordering some Soylent

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ah shoot

it's really boring to cook for one person so I don't really bother to try anything interesting

this right here

i never cook much for myself, except fried eggs for breakfast. i cook a lot with ******.

I've been the same weight +/-10 lb. for the last ten years

Living to a ripe old age and maintaining a editable quality of life at a ripe old age are two different things. In my opinion optimal human nourishment includes regular consumption of animal flesh.
that's not a matter of opinion, though. the best we can say is we have a vague picture of what 'optimal' human nourishment resembles, but it's fuzzy and not the same for everyone anyway. there is a growing consensus that vegetarian diets lead to better long term health outcomes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarianism#Health_effects).

for most people, therefore, the 'quality of life' factors are aesthetic/sensory rather than health-related; meat is a nutritionally-convenient source of protein, iron, vitamin b12 etc., but hardly the only option. it just tastes better than the alternatives, so people are understandably reluctant to give it up even if they feel bad about animal deaths being an unavoidable part of the process. i get that. my point was simply that a preference is not in the same category of ethical justification as survival.

(i agree with you that this is a continuum rather than a binary, but i'm defining 'survival' as something along the lines 'you get sick and die without it' or 'you have no other sources of food' – i.e., it is preference-agnostic.)

Whether or not instransitive gratitude is misplaced, I still feel it. You claimed I couldn't feel gratitude in that instance. I disagree, I think intransitive gratitude is a fairly widespread phenomenon. It doesn't require the consent of an object because it's not directed at one. It could be part of a survival mechanism that allowed us to form and emotional connection to our environment, which motivated us to take better care of it, this enhance our chances of survival. Many subsistence/environmentally sustainable traditional cultures have thanksgiving rituals where the thanks they have for their harvest, spoils of hunt/ agriculture are given thanks for and I don't see a reason to suspect the gratitude is not real.
i never said you didn't feel it. i said the feeling was misplaced and suggested that it was potentially destructive.

to give you another example, consider the gratitude routinely expressed by political leaders for the 'sacrifices' soldiers make by dying in combat.

now, those soldiers and their families deserve respect, absolutely, but is gratitude really the right reaction? i mean, the situations in which those deaths occur arguably arise from the interaction of a multitude of inordinately complicated systems: the military-industrial complex, nation-building political narratives motivated by xenophobia and energy security, an uncritical or complicit media that regurgitates propaganda to a working class systematically kneecapped by a laissez-faire capitalist economy that increasingly accrues wealth to the wealthy, etc. etc.

i don't offer that as an analogy, just as an example of misplaced 'intransitive' gratitude. if it encourages complacency when further action would otherwise be deemed necessary, it's easy to see how it's a bad thing, right? it makes it easier to explain away problematic processes that happen to benefit us, and uncritically preserve the status quo.

As for the non sequitur, the validity of that is tied up with the question of nutrition. If I didn't need to eat meat to maintain optimal condition I would consider giving it up because of the regret I feel. That isn't the case for me. I continue to eat meat because I think it is good for me and I am self interested - at the same time, I'm compassionate enough to feel regret about my own fairly un changeable nature.

i don't know how to read this. you're resistant to change so you'd rather not bother with self-reflection?

i think that sums it up nicely

made this tonight, with steamed broccolini: http://cuisine.co.nz/cuisine.nsf/recipes/fish-in-crazy-water

you can't go wrong with a dish called "fish in crazy water" imho

gratitude for something taken without being given isn't gratitude

I read this as you saying you don't think I could be feeling gratitude of any kind, misguided or not, because gratitude requires an object.

i don't know how to read this. you're resistant to change so you'd rather not bother with self-reflection?

I'm of Polynesian descent, the traditional diet includes regular intakes animal protein. Polynesians have consumed that diet for thousands of years and over that period I think it's likely that the survivors are the ones who were best adapted to it.

The wikipedia article you linked to lists a number of boutique grain products that have not been successfully commercially cultivated outside of their native environments, which is why places like Peru now grow huge amounts of a grain that was previously a staple, for export - they can barely afford to buy it, themselves. They eat imported junk. Rice is the same - the widespread cultivation of rice is a contributor to deforestation and has similar implications as it does for the Peruvians, for those who grow it as a cash crop.

Humans are mostly omnivores - and we've adapted to be omnivores because most environments it is the most sensible and sustainable diet, IMO. It doesn't make it the nicest diet, in terms of how we interact with our environment - but in terms of surviving as a group - I think it is the most sensible and sustainable diet.

I'm of Polynesian descent, the traditional diet includes regular intakes animal protein. Polynesians have consumed that diet for thousands of years and over that period I think it's likely that the survivors are the ones who were best adapted to it.
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The wikipedia article you linked to lists a number of boutique grain products that have not been successfully commercially cultivated outside of their native environments, which is why places like Peru now grow huge amounts of a grain that was previously a staple, for export - they can barely afford to buy it, themselves. They eat imported junk. Rice is the same - the widespread cultivation of rice is a contributor to deforestation and has similar implications as it does for the Peruvians, for those who grow it as a cash crop.
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Humans are mostly omnivores - and we've adapted to be omnivores because most environments it is the most sensible and sustainable diet, IMO. It doesn't make it the nicest diet, in terms of how we interact with our environment - but in terms of surviving as a group - I think it is the most sensible and sustainable diet.
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oh, that's not a constructive method of conversation? SORRY

If we're talking about a diet that enables survival, sustainability is part of that conversation. Claiming that we don't need to eat meat to stay alive because we can rely on plains of quinoa and rice to sustain us instead, is problematic if your bottom line is survival...climate change and peak oil are both going to affect a diet dependent on protein rich crops.

There are no studies that I'm aware of - Polynesians are a small group of humans, population-wise. That, and their long period of isolation from other human cultures means that interest in their traditions and diet is limited.

The main source for Samoans that I know is An Account of Samoan History up to 1918 by Teo Tuvale.

In it he writes:

For one meal: 1 pound of baked taro, one or two breadfruit averaging three quarters of a pound in weight, half a pound of fish, 3 papasami [sic], half a pound of pork and in addition anything else that can be procured or is prepared. This is usually followed by the juice of a cocoanut [sic]. If available the above foods and amounts will be consumed twice a day as the Samoan's digestive capacity seems to be limited only by his ability to procure the food or have it procured for him. The above foods and quantities have been checked several times from personal observation and should the amount consumed at a feast be mentioned one would be liable to be put down as a liar.

There are theories that to sail from one island to another, the convoy was often out at sea for long periods of time - so natural selection favoured those who were able to eat everything that was available, when it was made available, and store it preceding a long stretch of low calorie and fluid intake.