View Full Version : What do you know about 2001 Untitled Single material?


Snooze
12-19-2007, 08:03 PM
I'm trying to get some specific information on track 3, Age of Innocence (Early Version) 4:14 produced by Billy Corgan and Mark 'Flood' Ellis. spfc.org infers the master AOI was recorded in November 1999 at Village Recorder and that this song was relatively a few months old at the time. Figuring machina came out in late February 2000 I suppose the time frame in which the Untitled Single version was recorded is rather short then. Anyone have any more information on it?

Also, does anyone know if the early version also is sans D'Arcy or Melissa with either Iha or Corgan on bass?

Rickpat12
12-19-2007, 08:21 PM
I thought Age of Innocense was recorded after Machina was complete, like it was the last song on after D'Arcy left.

Snooze
12-19-2007, 08:32 PM
Sorry to bump this, but I was wondering in addition to when AOI (EV) was recorded (Summer/early Fall 1999?) if it was at all possible the early version was early enough (and, assuming it was intended to be a pre-master recording, not critical enough to warrant Corgan or Iha to step in on bass to get the master done "in fewer takes") to host D'Arcy's expertise. Unless the Untitled Single version was recorded after (or during) the machina sessions and simply labeled Early Version because of it's less produced sound, maybe intended, as to fill up later B-side releases (i.e. Untitled EP)?

exactlythesame
12-19-2007, 08:45 PM
There's hardly any information on this recording of the song, but I'd imagine it was Corgan on bass. I doubt that there's any way of really knowing. The song is fairly simple and wouldn't require any "expertise" (not that D'arcy had any, but that's for another discussion.)

It was most likely recorded around the same time the MACHINA version was, but was eventually scrapped for the more produced sound.

Snooze
12-19-2007, 08:49 PM
Thanks! :)

Snooze
12-19-2007, 09:13 PM
Hehe, one last thing.

I just noticed on the cover of the Untitled single (http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?what=R&obid=916841) the large image in the center of the front cover says 'Chicago Recording...' backwards on the glass, presumably Chicago Recording Company in either the November 1998 - October 1999 machina sessions or the July 2000 post-machina 'clean up' sessions. Then again, like someone said on this board AOI was a new song in late '99 probably why it's not listed in spfc.org as being recorded during the year-long session at CRC between '98-99 and may have been exclusively recorded at either the Village Recorder (or, like anyone could know, Pumpkinland or Sadlands).

EDIT: Also, D'Arcy nor Melissa Auf der Maur appear in any of the 20 photos on the Untitled single's front or back cover. (http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?what=R&obid=916841)

Corganist
12-19-2007, 09:13 PM
Sorry to bump this, but I was wondering in addition to when AOI (EV) was recorded (Summer/early Fall 1999?)
AOI wasn't written until late Fall of 1999. Billy said it was "about a week old" when they debuted it at the 10/30/1999 Bridge School show.

Snooze
12-19-2007, 09:20 PM
Hehe, sorry to endure but that makes me wonder if they got the Early Version recorded at CRC in October '99 before they recorded the master at Village Recorder. Oh well, that's pretty specific enough for me :D

reprise85
12-19-2007, 10:03 PM
what's with your sig

TheMilstead
12-19-2007, 10:19 PM
what's with your sig
I'm gonna take a shot here and say line 1 is from Blissed and Gone, and line 2 is from Jesus Loves His Babies.

pumpkinxyu
12-20-2007, 02:00 AM
Hehe, one last thing.

I just noticed on the cover of the Untitled single (http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?what=R&obid=916841) the large image in the center of the front cover says 'Chicago Recording...' backwards on the glass, presumably Chicago Recording Company in either the November 1998 - October 1999 machina sessions or the July 2000 post-machina 'clean up' sessions.[/URL][/COLOR]

i can say with a good bit of confidence that the pictures on the "Untitled" single are from the "Untitled" session at Chicago Recording Company from November 2000. compare these shots with the "Untitled" video. as for "Age Of Innocence (Early Version)," i would also say with a fair amount of confidence that this is, as advertised, an early version of the song...the last song written for MACHINA, as introduced during its live debut at the Bridge School Benefit in October of 1999. the "Early Version" sounds like an in-studio demo, if you will. the drum track isn't the same as the final version, if i'm not mistaken, so it's not just different overdubs but a different working track altogether.

i'm a little drunk and way too lazy to actually reference any of the relevant material as i write this, but i'm pretty sure my memory is serving me correctly. if not, i blame my $4 bottle of wine and the cruel world which has driven me to it on a wednesday night.

Spaceboy88
12-20-2007, 02:06 AM
Can someone post an mp3 of the Early Version of AOI? I really don't feel like digging out the CD right now.

flyfire
12-20-2007, 02:25 AM
i can say with a good bit of confidence that

are you a lawyer? 'cause that such a lawyer thing to say

Snooze
12-20-2007, 02:32 AM
i'm a little drunk and way too lazy to actually reference any of the relevant material as i write this, but i'm pretty sure my memory is serving me correctly. if not, i blame my $4 bottle of wine and the cruel world which has driven me to it on a wednesday night.Wow! I think it's safe for me to tag this recorded 1999 then, thanks to your 4 dollars :)
It's probably safe to say the album art has little or no correlation with this version of AOI.

Spaceboy88: I could convert it to mp3 but I'm outta the loop and don't know any quick and easy file hosts. I'm sure I could find one after work today. As premasters go, it's a nice watered down version with a unique fuzzy guitar melody before the last chorus that slays me.

darcyismybass
12-20-2007, 03:51 AM
Hmmm...I read somewhere that James did the bass part for Untitled, is there any chance he might have also played it for AOI?

Deege
12-20-2007, 12:16 PM
I think Billy did the bass on Untitled. I think it shows him playing it in the video (but I could be way wrong - I haven't seen it in forever).

AOI was recorded a year before Untitled, so even if what you're saying is true, it'd be mere coincidence - just because they are on the same CD single it doesn't mean the same guys played the same parts.

Snooze
12-20-2007, 06:28 PM
MediaFire makes it almost too easy :warp:

CD > FLAC (1.1.4) -8 > WavPack (4.41) -h > LAME 3.97 -V1

Age of Innocence (Early Version) (http://www.mediafire.com/?2wg3zcntry1)

I also noticed it's much slower than the release, which is nice cause it gives more room for Jimmy to shine over the stripped down sound while washed out guitars add classic Pumpkins' tone.

SPkid
12-20-2007, 09:01 PM
is it possible they recorded any other songs during the untitled session? Would they really just record only "1 last song" ?

Oklahoma Sexual
12-20-2007, 09:05 PM
Age of Innocence (Early Version)

Is this the same version that's on the Untitled 3trk promo?

T&T
12-20-2007, 11:50 PM
[QUOTE=SPkidWould they really just record only "1 last song" ?[/QUOTE]
yeah it's very likely.

BlissedandGone2
12-21-2007, 02:01 AM
havent you guys watched the untitled video from the greatest hits dvd? it shows them recording it in crc and shows billy playing the bass, a bunch of guitars, the solos, and shows james tinkering some leads.

BlissedandGone2
12-21-2007, 02:01 AM
I think Billy did the bass on Untitled. I think it shows him playing it in the video (but I could be way wrong - I haven't seen it in forever).

AOI was recorded a year before Untitled, so even if what you're saying is true, it'd be mere coincidence - just because they are on the same CD single it doesn't mean the same guys played the same parts.

yea that

BlissedandGone2
12-21-2007, 02:02 AM
<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/f51D02g9fpg&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/f51D02g9fpg&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

srt4b
12-21-2007, 03:30 AM
Hmmm...I read somewhere that James did the bass part for Untitled, is there any chance he might have also played it for AOI?

97%

darcyismybass
12-21-2007, 03:57 AM
havent you guys watched the untitled video from the greatest hits dvd? it shows them recording it in crc and shows billy playing the bass, a bunch of guitars, the solos, and shows james tinkering some leads.

According to what I saw, it was just Billy "working it out" but it was actually James...it's hard to say though.

Mariner
12-21-2007, 04:16 AM
listening to that AOI (EV), thinking 'man, what the hell happened to billy's voice? it used to be so awesome'

watching the untitled video, thinking it would've almost been alright if james had come back and the three pumpkin dudes toured/carried as a trio

BlissedandGone2
12-21-2007, 05:55 AM
According to what I saw, it was just Billy "working it out" but it was actually James...it's hard to say though.


what? theres nothing in there of james on a bass at all. theres 3 or 4 clips of billy on bass in that video, so if james played bass on the track why wouldn't they show him doing so? it seems pretty easy to say that if billy is clearly writing out the bass line or "working it out" as you say, he would also be the one to record it.