A lot of bands that are labelled Goth or that have put out gothic albums are also Post-Punk bands. So what really is the difference?

Joy Division
The Cure
Echo and the Bunnymen
The Chameleons
Bauhaus
Siouxsie & the Banshees
Dead Can Dance

the shitty ones are goth

goth is a type of post punk like dance punk, noise rock, new wave, etc. post punk is the umbrella term for all music that came after '77 that was informed by punk but not stringently punk. goth is just a darker, usually more glammed up type of post punk.

catherine wheel makes me want to get off netphoria in order to get up early to go to metslawier to mix an album

Post Punk is one of those made up genres that really mean nothing.

it's not really a genre

all genres are made up and dont mean anything outside of there context... unfortunately we are stuck with the brains that we have and this inherent need to classify.

Dead Can Dance is now post-punk?

If it's kind of devil music it's post punk. If it's definitely devil music it's goth.

Punk -> Post-Punk -> After-Punk

goth is a type of post punk like dance punk, noise rock, new wave, etc. post punk is the umbrella term for all music that came after '77 that was informed by punk but not stringently punk. goth is just a darker, usually more glammed up type of post punk.

This is all that really needs to be said.

Goth is Bauhaus

Post-Punk is The Fall

that is all that really needs to be said.

lion is mammal

life is fish

why does redbreegull pretend to know anything at all?

A lot of bands that are labelled Goth or that have put out gothic albums are also Post-Punk bands. So what really is the difference?

Joy Division
The Cure
Echo and the Bunnymen
The Chameleons
Bauhaus
Siouxsie & the Banshees
Dead Can Dance

it is is fuckng heretic, evil and just plain WRONG to call Joy Division a goth band - not only do they predate the movement, the steely power of their music is the fucking anthithsis of the camp, purple scarfed melodrama that goth trades in. Goth wasn't really used as a label until the Sisters of Mercy in '82 (always the definitive goth band if that's anything to be proud of) even though, visually at least, it has its roots in the Banshees.

joy division is sort of a proto-goth band, why does that offend you so much

joy division is sort of a proto-goth band, why does that offend you so much

from bauhaus to manson to tim burton movies there's a central element of theatricality/dressing up and a kind of exaggerated, vampiric gloominess associated with goth as a subculture. there is nothing remotely like that in joy division - in fact they wore office worker style shirts and ties to shrug off any kind of defined image (and of course that became an image but thats another story). Curtis didn't need the props and costumes of goth to evoke darkness - he was living and breathing it which is why 30 years later no "goth" record can approach the austere power and restrained desperation of Unknown Pleasures.

you sound sort of like an indie version of isle

you sound sort of like an indie version of isle

i don't know what this means - i guess it's an insult.

no it's not, it's an accurate description of the way you just posted.

the difference between you and isle is, however, that i agree with most of what you said

'goth' was more of a sound than a visual style during said period

'goth' was more of a sound than a visual style during said period

the visual style definitely played a bigger role as time went on but the sisters of mercy never went anywhere without black clothes, hats and sunglasses and robert smith was wearing lipstick/doing his big hair thing from the early 80s, too. I guess what it comes down to is that - much as I love the song - when the cure play a forest live they kind of need the dry ice to create or at least complete the atmosphere. when joy division played she's lost control or dead souls they didn't need anything else - except curtis' weird dancing maybe - to mesmerize an audience.

I always found the Chameleons to be very depressing like Joy Division but I like them so much more. I can stand Joy Division in small doses but I love those first two Chameleon albums. I can kind of take or leave the Cure also.

I always found the Chameleons to be very depressing like Joy Division but I like them so much more. I can stand Joy Division in small doses but I love those first two Chameleon albums. I can kind of take or leave the Cure also.

script of the bridge is a brilliant record. when interpol first appeared everyone went on about the debt to joy division but they owe the chameleons as much.

Interpol and Joy Division are pretty dissimilar anyway

Interpol sound like Echo and the Bunnymen and The Chameleons especially "Heaven Up Here" era Bunnymen. I dont hear hardly any Joy Division in them. That choppy, chiming guitar. thats all Echo and the Bunnymen.

thats the first sensible post from you i have ever seen

oh ok

I dont really know how to respond to that so I said " oh ok "

oh, ok

the visual style definitely played a bigger role as time went on but the sisters of mercy never went anywhere without black clothes, hats and sunglasses and robert smith was wearing lipstick/doing his big hair thing from the early 80s, too. I guess what it comes down to is that - much as I love the song - when the cure play a forest live they kind of need the dry ice to create or at least complete the atmosphere. when joy division played she's lost control or dead souls they didn't need anything else - except curtis' weird dancing maybe - to mesmerize an audience.
the cure didn't dress goth back in those days

you sound sort of like an indie version of isle

you're so full of shit alex. i'm amazed at what a smug little prick you've become, man. if my opinions are so ridiculous to you, well thats probably a good thing, cause i don't remember the last time anyone gave a shit about any of yours. stop being such an arrogant little snob and maybe we can be friends again.

why does redbreegull pretend to know anything at all?

You are ridiculous. I didn't even present any original thought in this topic, all I did was agree with what someone else said, and I'm pretending to know shit? What the fuck is wrong with you? Are you really that fucking bored and without purpose in your life that you felt it necessary to take the time to assault me over a non issue? All I did was endorse an existing statement. Do you disagree with what was said? If so, why don't you fucking attack the guy who said instead of assaulting me? Fuck you. You guys saw it here: this is how negativity starts on Netphoria.

http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s39/cowmoos/sunday/6.gif

you're so full of shit alex. i'm amazed at what a smug little prick you've become, man. if my opinions are so ridiculous to you, well thats probably a good thing, cause i don't remember the last time anyone gave a shit about any of yours. stop being such an arrogant little snob and maybe we can be friends again.
it's not about opinions! it's about exaggerating personal taste semi-poetically ("no "goth" record can approach the austere power and restrained desperation of Unknown Pleasures.") and it's typical of you. i think it's funny.

it is typical of me to make passionate defences of billy corgan's less popular works, but thats because i know what makes them great and i generally offer an unusual viewpoint that perhaps not many would have considered in the first place. that alone is the underlying reason why i get harassed around here, and generally i don't mind, but i get a feeling of genuine nastiness when its from you and i don't appreciate it.

no it's ok. it's really about the words. you see i agree with what mojo said and you know i disagree with a lot of what you say. it's just this theatricality that defines you. i think a lot of people here know what i mean.

You are ridiculous. I didn't even present any original thought in this topic, all I did was agree with what someone else said, and I'm pretending to know shit? What the fuck is wrong with you? Are you really that fucking bored and without purpose in your life that you felt it necessary to take the time to assault me over a non issue? All I did was endorse an existing statement. Do you disagree with what was said? If so, why don't you fucking attack the guy who said instead of assaulting me? Fuck you. You guys saw it here: this is how negativity starts on Netphoria.

re-read what you post on the politics board, and we'll see how negativity starts on Netphoria

oh shit Isle is taking acid again.

re-read what you post on the politics board, and we'll see how negativity starts on Netphoria

You're going to have to be more specific than that, I hardly ever post there. I think last time was in the thread where ************* accused all liberals of being homosexual moral delinquents.

^true

You're going to have to be more specific than that

You are a tool. An American life is not more valuable than any other life. And it is KNOWN that torture does not produce accurate intelligence.


this is the post i was referring to, but you know what? fuck it. you're right. im fucked up. what the fuck is wrong with me?

What does that post prove? Someone suggested that torturing prisoners was perfectly ok if it would save American lives. That person was obviously a tool and I called him out on such. However, I didn't even say anything in this thread other than agreeing on the definition of a musical genre and....

you know what, nevermind. I am too tired and heartbroken to do this, whatever. It doesn't matter.

yeah there are better examples for bad redbreegull posts. i can't dislike the guy though

If you want to find some truly bad posts under my name you have to search back a few years.

If you want to find some truly bad posts under my name you have to search back a few years.

pushing your luck there son

I saw Interpol at the Virgin Fest in Baltimore. As they took the stage it started raining, as if they caused the heavens to weep. It was fucking amazing. Standing out there in the rain with all that dark music sweeping over me, it was crazy.

case in point

If it's kind of devil music it's post punk. If it's definitely devil music it's goth.
best answer

case in point

There is nothing wrong with that post. You obviously have never had any sort of transcendent concert experience if you don't understand.

l o l

dammit, i want a bobby peru avatar

you're next, fucker

its a dummy, DUMMY...

There is nothing wrong with that post. You obviously have never had any sort of transcendent concert experience if you don't understand.

he's serious, isnt he?

he's serious, isnt he?

Yes, I am. Well I was being a little bit silly actually when I posted that. But it was still a pretty awesome thing, seeing Interpol in the rain.